Ghost Guns/3d printers.......

[fpgt72]

Not really a "ghost gun" and not really a 3D printer thread, but a little bit of both.

I live in the greater KC area, and just this week we had some shit bag kill a North Kansas City officer, and he actually did use a "ghost gun". This 30+ year old shit stain shot the cop because he did not want to be stopped for a minor traffic offense. The LEO community (that I am a member of) is currently in morning for a fallen brother.

This man child still lived at home with his mother, and had an pretty good 3D printer setup, the lower was 3D printed, so the news got this one correct. Even if they are asking how did he print an entire gun? A few months ago some kid in high school came in shot the SRO (school resource officer) a few others before he was stopped, the news reported him using a "ghost gun" but sorry news you got this wrong, it was a "normal" firearm with the SN# ground off, so just defaced.

At least they are batting 500 in the past few months.

Now we are seeing people raising questions of 3D printers, and wanting to restrict them. I hate to tell you idiots that people have been making guns out of what ever from the day after gun power was discovered, this is nothing new.

Personally I own a 3D printer and I have made some "gun" related thigs for it. A couple boxes to hold long cartridges for working up loads, signs for the range that gives the yardage....stuff along those lines.

I am really looking to flush out my ideas and views on this "ghost gun" thing. On one hand we have the right to keep and bear arms, and I read that just as the words are written, in that context I am very much in the camp that means KEEP AND BEAR ARMS....so there should be no issue with so called "ghost guns", or for that matter a gun with the SN# removed. On the other hand working where I work I know the law just a tad, and think well we do need some restrictions, felons should not have the ability to own arms, I think we can all agree on that, but it does not line up with the letter of the 2A, it says nothing about you being the next Charles Whitman.

So while I think the people looking to "outlaw" 3D printers has a snowballs chance, and I also think that having the "plans" that you can feed into your printer and make your "gun" is not quite right.......just starting to babble.

What are your thoughts and views, part of this is my thinking part of this is the devil's advocate.

It is so tough anymore, people wonder how someone can print a "gun". Well they are not really printing a gun, they are printing a lower.....what is that.....the bottom part of the rifle, so that was it, yup......what about the rest of it, well all the little parts inside and the barrel itself are all made from metal, that is not the gun, nope. Well that is stupid, yea it is thank your .gov for that one. I have another good one for you....see this credit card with little stamps on it.....yea, that is a machine gun.....what, that is just stupid.....I don't disagree, and see this trigger, yea....machine gun as well.....but that is not a gun.....welcome to the club.

I am so glad I am close to retirement, only a few years left. I hope I can make it that long, I really worry for our young guys.

 

[candyx]

You can make a gun from materials you buy in home depot , do we ban home depot ? The weapon regardless if its a rock or a gun doesn't make the person kill anybody. It's the person who has the drive to take someone's life which is always there, so if he can't 3D print a gun he'll just buy one on the street or make a shotgun out of home depot. Banning a perceived weapon doesn't save anyone's life it a political gimmick.
The problem lies in not enforcing the laws of society, I think if a perp takes a shot at the Police they should hunt him down and neutralized the threat before he can kill anybody else. Let the science guide us like Newton's 3rd Law .......

 

[fpgt72]

You can make a gun from materials you buy in home depot , do we ban home depot ? The weapon regardless if its a rock or a gun doesn't make the person kill anybody. It's the person who has the drive to take someone's life which is always there, so if he can't 3D print a gun he'll just buy one on the street or make a shotgun out of home depot. Banning a perceived weapon doesn't save anyone's life it a political gimmick.
The problem lies in not enforcing the laws of society, I think if a perp takes a shot at the Police they should hunt him down and neutralized the threat before he can kill anybody else. Let the science guide us like Newton's 3rd Law .......

I agree with you gun Jesus did a good video on this "home made" gun deal.

 

[candyx]

Small Artillery Piece , ever see what a 16 lb bowling ball can do to a two story colonial ......

 

[Boon20]

So if 3d printers get banned what next cnc machines? Or even files if we follow that logic long enough? There will always be a weapon that someone motivated enough will make.

 

[TonyTheTiger]

Making guns is legal. What's your point?

 

[buffalowinter]

You don't need anything sophisticated like 3d printers or cnc machines, not even ammunition or powder. "Gun" used to kill former Japan PM Shinzo Abe one month, ago. Match heads for powder, bolts for bullets, and hot wire from a battery to fire.

 

[MadDuner]

Knowledge is power.
Humans have been incredibly resourceful since the beginning of them.
Once they know how to "make" something they cannot buy - they will.
And people will go out of their way to make something - simply because they can.

The serial number on a firearm does nothing to stop a crime.
The serial number on a stolen firearm does nothing to stop a crime.
Taking firearms away from legal firearm owners does nothing to stop crimes against them or anyone else.
The vicious circle of trying to control the tools used in a crime does nothing to stop the crimes.
We need to focus on controlling the criminals.
Take the criminals out of the public sphere - or gene pool - and we might get somewhere.

 

[W54/XM-388]

So while I think the people looking to "outlaw" 3D printers has a snowballs chance, and I also think that having the "plans" that you can feed into your printer and make your "gun" is not quite right.......just starting to babble.

You aren't going to get a whole lot of sympathy once you start parroting on that whole B.S. government line about how you shouldn't be allowed to have information and such.

Sorry but the rest of us go out and have to face the big bad world without a bunch of tactical gear and open carrying and backup at our beck and call.
We don't go around saying how much people's freedom needs to be restricted to make us feel safe.
We simply assume that everybody out freely walking around may be carrying a weapon (much like the constitution originally intended)
In addition to worrying about "criminals" harming us, we also have to be worried about ..... (intelligent folks can fill in the blanks)

If someone is that dangerous that they can't have a gun, why are they walking around in society? plenty of ways to kill folks (as we have been seeing in NYC and CA and all the liberal hell holes where the police do still happily enforce laws against gun ownership for the law abiding, but the justice system seems to not be all that concerned about violent street criminals and repeat violent attackers).

The ONLY reason the demonrats are beating the drums about "ghost guns" is because they want to mandate universal gun registration by one back door way or another (and anyone intelligent knows what the next step ALWAYS is).

Instead of being fixated on how can we restrict the law abiding folks' rights so that we can feel safer, in my opinion you should take a step back and ask, why is there such an uptick in the urge to make violence the first resort. It's not just the police that are in danger, all over, you are seeing brutal violence and deadly violence being openly used by criminals everywhere against everyone.

You should instead take a huge step back and stop getting blinded by the tree trunk in front of you and look at the whole forest.
The same politicians and rich folks and administrators and Democrats that so many police take orders from in one way or another, are the same ones who are fueling the hate for the police, for their own political and financial gain.

In my opinion, the police are so stuck on their "just enforcing the law," and "my retirement" that they don't see that they are being setup specifically to fail and be hated, by the very folks they take orders from. In addition to this, they are forgetting who their friends used to be and why their friends might be a bit on the cooler side these days.

Here is my opinion on the how things are being setup to go to more violence:

You can't hardly go a week without some big raging story in the media about the "evil police" getting away "murdering some innocent just turning their life around type". That plays well to amp up a certain segment of the community with extra hate, and enforce the idea that there is no justice but what you make on the streets and you might as well go 100% right then and there. The politicians and the news media then never fail to go all in on stoking the flames of hate and all but preaching openly that "the aggrieved" should jump right to violence and wanton destruction and "non traditional shopping" which then the Justice system enables by turning a blind eye to (so long as they are the right skin tone) because, well, it would be racist to hold people responsible to not be violent just because they are upset. How many folks got prosecuted and convicted or are still in jail for attacking police and burning down police stations and having pitched battles with the police back in 2020 when it was what the Democrats all but ordered?

Then there is the other segment of society, the ones who traditionally had respect for the police and generally liked to just mostly be peaceable and enjoy freedom and be generally law abiding. For those folks it's hard to go a month without hearing all over the media about some police no knock raid gone wrong or some police killing some unarmed innocent person in their home, or fabricating evidence or ruining people's lives or killing somebody for no good reason other than they were a bit scared for some reason, or you know stories of beating up old women and breaking their bones and laughing while watching the videos, falsely arresting people for DUI without any proof just to punish someone with the process because you know... You get the point. Then you add on all the absolute tyranny that went on in 2020 and 2021 with (technically only in some places but the media made it look like it was everywhere and everyone) the police enforcing draconian dictates of the bastard politicians to ruin folks lives even when the dictates made no logical or scientific sense. Then that formerly police friendly segment of the community starts to also get the point that there is no justice but what you make on the streets and the cop pulling you over for a traffic stop might just be about to plant drugs on you or falsely arrest for for DUI with no evidence or proof at all so they too start to think, "well do I let this person ruin my life or do we just say if we burn you burn with us"?

Again in the instances in both paragraphs, the actual statistical chances are vanishingly small.
Much I might add like the chance of being killed by some mass shooter.
But the constant drumbeat of this being shouted out at everyone and put in front of everyone's face all the time IS having the desired effect because it's very hard to ignore constant, relentless propaganda.

Things are NOT going to get any better, in fact I can almost say with certainty they are going to get worse.
The end goal is to make as much of society hate the local police with enough emotional anger that they will agree when the "solution" is presented which is to get rid of all the "out of control" local police and replace them with a "decent, professional, well trained" federally controlled police force. (which will of course be way worse).

 

[E. Bryant]

Don't worry, California has this covered:

Criminals gonna criminal, regardless of what the law says. That's why they are criminals.

As far as I'm concerned, print away. If someone does a bad deed with a gun, it doesn't matter much whether they bought it as a stolen good from the local meth head or printed it at home.

The whole "felons shouldn't own guns" thing is BS, in my opinion. Either someone has been rehabilitated to the point where they are safe to re-enter society or they should still be in prison. It's impossible to ban an entire class of people from an entire class of commonplace things, not to mention morally reprehensible.

 

[fpgt72]

I think you folks misunderstand my point, and it is likely the way I am wording things.....I have issues with the written word.

As I said the topic I started is all over the road. I AM NOT suggesting any kind of ban of 3D printers, I am not even suggesting that "something has to be done".

To suggest otherwise is like the statement the kid in the last mall incident broke the law by bringing in a gun to that mall, no he did not.

Bad guys are always going to be there, we have never had a time in human history that there has not been crime, and no amount of law passed will stop it.

In my book nothing will stop gun crime, but a few things that will slow it down are giving these types of incidents zero press coverage, or if covered never giving the name of the shooter. The other would be set in stone severe punishments for any gun related crime, that can not be reduced by any judge, hard mandatory full time of 30 years minimum.

Some Juv killed another kid and he is getting out in 8 years......so 8 years for killing someone, ahh no we have not seen the last of this kid, he is going to be in the system again.

My deal with ghost guns and the other stuff I brought up at the start was to try to illustrate just how these things have always gone on and always will go on, the video from gun jesus I posted should prove that.

 

[D̷e̷v̷i̷l̷D̷o̷c̷A̷Z̷]

I think you folks misunderstand my point, and it is likely the way I am wording things.....

I AM NOT suggesting any kind of ban of 3D printers, I am not even suggesting that "something has to be done".

Meanwhile in circular logic land.

 

[MadDuner]

I think you folks misunderstand my point, and it is likely the way I am wording things.....I have issues with the written word.

As I said the topic I started is all over the road. I AM NOT suggesting any kind of ban of 3D printers, I am not even suggesting that "something has to be done".

To suggest otherwise is like the statement the kid in the last mall incident broke the law by bringing in a gun to that mall, no he did not.

Bad guys are always going to be there, we have never had a time in human history that there has not been crime, and no amount of law passed will stop it.

In my book nothing will stop gun crime, but a few things that will slow it down are giving these types of incidents zero press coverage, or if covered never giving the name of the shooter. The other would be set in stone severe punishments for any gun related crime, that can not be reduced by any judge, hard mandatory full time of 30 years minimum.

Some Juv killed another kid and he is getting out in 8 years......so 8 years for killing someone, ahh no we have not seen the last of this kid, he is going to be in the system again.

My deal with ghost guns and the other stuff I brought up at the start was to try to illustrate just how these things have always gone on and always will go on, the video from gun jesus I posted should prove that.

I think all "gun guys" agree that the problem lies with the criminals.

Our crime problems could be reduced if criminals were removed from contact with the public, and in some cases permanently.
But for some reason - the left doesn't want to do so.
Many on the left advocate out right killing people they disagree with politically - but don't want pedophiles or burglars or robbers or rapists or even murderers punished in such a fashion that protects the law-abiding citizens from these criminals. I do not understand that reasoning.

 

[AuNEagle]

Anybody remember the Liberator 3D printed handgun from about a decade ago? This design was 100% non-metal. However, IIRC, there is a hollow space in front of the trigger guard that will accommodate a 6 oz. block of steel that would then qualify it as detectable firearm. I remember seeing videos of the Liberator successfully firing.

 

[MrSmith]

The OP's query aside, Perhaps he, or others, will be able to answer a few questions I have that are loosely related to the original subject:

Of "ghost guns" confiscated due to crime, how many are defaced (SN# removed) compared to "home" printed or machined without markings?

How does a firearms trace actually help in finding the specific person that illegally used the traced firearm?

I have always thought the question of why needs to be removed from the equation. Did little Fred do the crime? Find him, arrest him and charge him per whatever law stipulates the consequences for that crime. I do not care why little Fred did it.

Thank you,
MrSmith

 

[W54/XM-388]

Bad guys are always going to be there, we have never had a time in human history that there has not been crime, and no amount of law passed will stop it.

Here might be the big difference:

Have you noticed that "popular culture", and "popular entertainment" and "popular politicians" all seem to be about worshiping and glorifying crime and criminals as a virtue and way of life?

This is a fairly unique time in the cycle of our civilization where we have gone from society as a whole openly condemning and repudiating crime and criminals and treating violent criminals as the scum they are to glorifying them.

Wildly popular music openly worships the "thug life" and violence and killing
Popular movies all openly extol the "criminal life" and all it entails
Wildly popular video games all extol and reward wanton crime and violence in a virtual setting.

Then the courts seem to be happy to accept that violent criminals shouldn't be punished too hard because that is just who they are and should be let back out on the street as quickly as possible.

How many popular movies / music / computer games today have the heroes as the police and the law abiding, freedom loving citizens?
How many of those same things star violent criminals or violent actions in sympathetic or heroic terms?

Much like the modern obsession of Incels hanging out in their parent's basement and being coddled while spending all day chatting online with their fellow loser Incels about how the world is so unfair and how they should make the world pay.

Crime, criminals and violence are being celebrated, praised, admired, rewarded and held up as examples.

 

[acudaowner]

 

[308pirate]

Don't worry, California has this covered:

View attachment 7917219

Criminals gonna criminal, regardless of what the law says. That's why they are criminals.

As far as I'm concerned, print away. If someone does a bad deed with a gun, it doesn't matter much whether they bought it as a stolen good from the local meth head or printed it at home.

The whole "felons shouldn't own guns" thing is BS, in my opinion. Either someone has been rehabilitated to the point where they are safe to re-enter society or they should still be in prison. It's impossible to ban an entire class of people from an entire class of commonplace things, not to mention morally reprehensible.

LOL at that law

 

[308pirate]

felons should not have the ability to own arms, I think we can all agree on that

No. No we can't agree on that. Why should someone who served their sentence to the satisfaction of the courts not have all of his rights restored? If they are so dangerous, why were they set free?

So while I think the people looking to "outlaw" 3D printers has a snowballs chance, and I also think that having the "plans" that you can feed into your printer and make your "gun" is not quite right.....

Come again?

 

[TurboTrout]

Such a silly argument, I mean he could have just run the cop over with his car, stabbed him in the neck, etc etc.
Getting caught up on the instrument is dumb.

Is there something else to the story? Seems strange to throw ones life away killing a cop over just a traffic ticket.

 

[_Windrider_]

The former prime minister of Japan was just assassinated with a shotgun that was made with just bullshit parts

 

[MadDuner]

The former prime minister of Japan was just assassinated with a shotgun that was made with just bullshit parts

Humans.
They can really be crafty when they want to be.

 

[TurboTrout]

No. No we can't agree on that. Why should someone who served their sentence to the satisfaction of the courts not have all of his rights restored? If they are so dangerous, why were they set free?



Come again?

That, if you paid your toll to the state, you shouldn’t even have a record.

The felon scarlet letter shit is dumb, I mean once they get out of jail they are forever branded, only good paying jobs for them and theirs now are criminal ones. Now let’s act surprised when they break the law?

There’s a reason for that phrase “after the first felony the rest are free”.


But the legal system needs to keep the courts fed, the prison beds full, and police need to justify their fat paychecks, the spice must flow

 

[308pirate]

Pipe bombs, molotov cocktails, booby traps............

 

[308pirate]

You aren't going to get a whole lot of sympathy once you start parroting on that whole B.S. government line about how you shouldn't be allowed to have information and such.

Sorry but the rest of us go out and have to face the big bad world without a bunch of tactical gear and open carrying and backup at our beck and call.
We don't go around saying how much people's freedom needs to be restricted to make us feel safe.
We simply assume that everybody out freely walking around may be carrying a weapon (much like the constitution originally intended)
In addition to worrying about "criminals" harming us, we also have to be worried about ..... (intelligent folks can fill in the blanks)

If someone is that dangerous that they can't have a gun, why are they walking around in society? plenty of ways to kill folks (as we have been seeing in NYC and CA and all the liberal hell holes where the police do still happily enforce laws against gun ownership for the law abiding, but the justice system seems to not be all that concerned about violent street criminals and repeat violent attackers).

The ONLY reason the demonrats are beating the drums about "ghost guns" is because they want to mandate universal gun registration by one back door way or another (and anyone intelligent knows what the next step ALWAYS is).

Instead of being fixated on how can we restrict the law abiding folks' rights so that we can feel safer, in my opinion you should take a step back and ask, why is there such an uptick in the urge to make violence the first resort. It's not just the police that are in danger, all over, you are seeing brutal violence and deadly violence being openly used by criminals everywhere against everyone.

You should instead take a huge step back and stop getting blinded by the tree trunk in front of you and look at the whole forest.
The same politicians and rich folks and administrators and Democrats that so many police take orders from in one way or another, are the same ones who are fueling the hate for the police, for their own political and financial gain.

In my opinion, the police are so stuck on their "just enforcing the law," and "my retirement" that they don't see that they are being setup specifically to fail and be hated, by the very folks they take orders from. In addition to this, they are forgetting who their friends used to be and why their friends might be a bit on the cooler side these days.

Here is my opinion on the how things are being setup to go to more violence:

You can't hardly go a week without some big raging story in the media about the "evil police" getting away "murdering some innocent just turning their life around type". That plays well to amp up a certain segment of the community with extra hate, and enforce the idea that there is no justice but what you make on the streets and you might as well go 100% right then and there. The politicians and the news media then never fail to go all in on stoking the flames of hate and all but preaching openly that "the aggrieved" should jump right to violence and wanton destruction and "non traditional shopping" which then the Justice system enables by turning a blind eye to (so long as they are the right skin tone) because, well, it would be racist to hold people responsible to not be violent just because they are upset. How many folks got prosecuted and convicted or are still in jail for attacking police and burning down police stations and having pitched battles with the police back in 2020 when it was what the Democrats all but ordered?

Then there is the other segment of society, the ones who traditionally had respect for the police and generally liked to just mostly be peaceable and enjoy freedom and be generally law abiding. For those folks it's hard to go a month without hearing all over the media about some police no knock raid gone wrong or some police killing some unarmed innocent person in their home, or fabricating evidence or ruining people's lives or killing somebody for no good reason other than they were a bit scared for some reason, or you know stories of beating up old women and breaking their bones and laughing while watching the videos, falsely arresting people for DUI without any proof just to punish someone with the process because you know... You get the point. Then you add on all the absolute tyranny that went on in 2020 and 2021 with (technically only in some places but the media made it look like it was everywhere and everyone) the police enforcing draconian dictates of the bastard politicians to ruin folks lives even when the dictates made no logical or scientific sense. Then that formerly police friendly segment of the community starts to also get the point that there is no justice but what you make on the streets and the cop pulling you over for a traffic stop might just be about to plant drugs on you or falsely arrest for for DUI with no evidence or proof at all so they too start to think, "well do I let this person ruin my life or do we just say if we burn you burn with us"?

Again in the instances in both paragraphs, the actual statistical chances are vanishingly small.
Much I might add like the chance of being killed by some mass shooter.
But the constant drumbeat of this being shouted out at everyone and put in front of everyone's face all the time IS having the desired effect because it's very hard to ignore constant, relentless propaganda.

Things are NOT going to get any better, in fact I can almost say with certainty they are going to get worse.
The end goal is to make as much of society hate the local police with enough emotional anger that they will agree when the "solution" is presented which is to get rid of all the "out of control" local police and replace them with a "decent, professional, well trained" federally controlled police force. (which will of course be way worse).

 

[fpgt72]

Meanwhile in circular logic land.

Sorry just the way my brain works.....one of these days I should start a what it is like living with ADHD and Dyslexia in your late 50's. One of the ways people like me think.

 

[fpgt72]

I think all "gun guys" agree that the problem lies with the criminals.

Our crime problems could be reduced if criminals were removed from contact with the public, and in some cases permanently.
But for some reason - the left doesn't want to do so.
Many on the left advocate out right killing people they disagree with politically - but don't want pedophiles or burglars or robbers or rapists or even murderers punished in such a fashion that protects the law-abiding citizens from these criminals. I do not understand that reasoning.

Personally I think it comes back to it does not effect THEM. The stories are just now starting on how illegals are starting to be an issue in New York....I read a few articles just over lunch on the subject. The same thing many have been saying for years. At the same time half a world away they find the young teen girl that had been raped, killed and dumped in a sewage treatment plant, and killed due to an open border policy and killed by someone from Syria.....only difference this time over the many times in the past is this was someone who is "connected" relation....when it happens to the common man, no big deal....when it hits them personally well now it is an issue.

 

[fpgt72]

Pipe bombs, molotov cocktails, booby traps............

One of the arguments I always loved is, and we read this and saw it quite often a few years ago, and I bet many of you guys remember it.

You are not going to stop an army with your sporting rifle, they have tanks airplanes artillery.......and you have one gun.....you have no chance. And yet we see time and time again how that resistance wears down one side. Oddly enough the same people saying you can't stop them with just a rifle are the same ones that did all they could to stop our troops in Vietnam, and oddly enough I don't remember the north vietnam army having that many aircraft, battle ships, artillery, people sniffing fake plant electronics, or any of that other stuff. And we are seeing it this very day.

Personally I hope I am dirt long before that happens here......I think I have the same feeling as that kid that fights in the MMA.

 

[camocorvette]

So....

You think we should limit knowledge??


I've got a couple 1969 special forces improvised explosive and booby trap books that disagree with you.

Knowledge is power

 

[MadDuner]

So....

You think we should limit knowledge??


I've got a couple 1969 special forces improvised explosive and booby trap books that disagree with you.

Knowledge is power

Exactly.
Knowledge is power.

Of course, some regimes that want to limit the power of others will recommend burning books.
Or Laptops.
Or files on the internet that contain machine code.

 

[camocorvette]

Well I also didn't elaborate.

You can't ban "intent".

I've got more then enough knowledge to make efp's and all sorts of other shit.
Doesn't mean I'm gonna.
I've got coat hangers and thin metal to make the 3rd pin hole unnecessary.
Doesn't mean I'm gonna make them.

But if I wanted to do immoral shit..

Your not going to stop me.

It's all about intent. When you get a population full of shitty people with low morals and no personal accountability. They will run amuck.

If we shot or hung every criminal that rapped, murdered or molested.
Crime rates would drop drastically in 3 months.

The best lessons are learned through pain and misery.

 

[TurboTrout]

So in this thread we have a government enforcer saying the citizens should not only be disarmed but also not allowed knowledge.

Huh

All for their safety, even though their job is like what 20th most dangerous job in the US?

It’s all so tiresome

 

[TurboTrout]

Well I also didn't elaborate.

You can't ban "intent".

I've got more then enough knowledge to make efp's and all sorts of other shit.
Doesn't mean I'm gonna.
I've got coat hangers and thin metal to make the 3rd pin hole unnecessary.
Doesn't mean I'm gonna make them.

But if I wanted to do immoral shit..

Your not going to stop me.

It's all about intent. When you get a population full of shitty people with low morals and no personal accountability. They will run amuck.

If we shot or hung every criminal that rapped, murdered or molested.
Crime rates would drop drastically in 3 months.

The best lessons are learned through pain and misery.

How would making your own gun auto be immoral?

Is against the rules the state made for you, but it’s far from unconstitutional or immoral.

The only thing immoral is the states unconstitutional actions against the people

 

[MadDuner]

So in this thread we have a government enforcer saying the citizens should not only be disarmed but also not allowed knowledge.

Huh

All for their safety, even though their job is like what 20th most dangerous job in the US?

It’s all so tiresome

Well, if they can manage to get rid of anybody with an IQ over about 70 - they won't have to outlaw knowledge.

 

[TurboTrout]

I think you folks misunderstand my point, and it is likely the way I am wording things.....I have issues with the written word.

As I said the topic I started is all over the road. I AM NOT suggesting any kind of ban of 3D printers, I am not even suggesting that "something has to be done".

To suggest otherwise is like the statement the kid in the last mall incident broke the law by bringing in a gun to that mall, no he did not.

Bad guys are always going to be there, we have never had a time in human history that there has not been crime, and no amount of law passed will stop it.

In my book nothing will stop gun crime, but a few things that will slow it down are giving these types of incidents zero press coverage, or if covered never giving the name of the shooter. The other would be set in stone severe punishments for any gun related crime, that can not be reduced by any judge, hard mandatory full time of 30 years minimum.

Some Juv killed another kid and he is getting out in 8 years......so 8 years for killing someone, ahh no we have not seen the last of this kid, he is going to be in the system again.

My deal with ghost guns and the other stuff I brought up at the start was to try to illustrate just how these things have always gone on and always will go on, the video from gun jesus I posted should prove that.

I believe there are plenty of studies and such showing not even the death penalty (which I am against due to how crooked and incompetent gov is) really detours crime.

You think the Hommies who are about to do a drive by are like, “yo G’dawg, let’s stop and think about the long term effects our actions will have on our futures”

The world is dangerous, always has been, always will be, no one is owed “fair” life’s a roll of the dice, be as prepared as you can be while still living your life fully.

 

[camocorvette]

How would making your own gun auto be immoral?

Is against the rules the state made for you, but it’s far from unconstitutional or immoral.

The only thing immoral is the states unconstitutional actions against the people

I guess I didn't explain my feeling well. I don't think having an auto rifle is immoral. Even if illegal.

I think shooting women and children is immoral. I think all the crazies and fuck heads that do all the terrible shit is immoral. Just because your capable of great violence, does not make you a bad or immoral person.

But when your intent is just to hurt people because your hurt, or just fucking crazy. That's not right.

But back to 3d printing. No matter what. You can't stop the signal. Books exist, the internet while censored somewhat still exists. Science class exists.

I think none of it should be censored. So let's ban some knowledge because .01 percent of the people that have that knowledge use it for evil.

Gtfo

 

[brianf]

I believe there are plenty of studies and such showing not even the death penalty (which I am against due to how crooked and incompetent gov is) really detours crime.

You think the Hommies who are about to do a drive by are like, “yo G’dawg, let’s stop and think about the long term effects our actions will have on our futures”

The world is dangerous, always has been, always will be, no one is owed “fair” life’s a roll of the dice, be as prepared as you can be while still living your life fully.

along those lines, even the moron politician know the crooks will be crooks

consequences are for the "regular" citizen to think twice before acting

 

[n2ishun]

If we shot or hung every criminal that rapped, murdered or molested.
Crime rates would drop drastically in DAYS

FIFY

 

[357Max]

One of the arguments I always loved is, and we read this and saw it quite often a few years ago, and I bet many of you guys remember it.

You are not going to stop an army with your sporting rifle, they have tanks airplanes artillery.......and you have one gun.....you have no chance. And yet we see time and time again how that resistance wears down one side. Oddly enough the same people saying you can't stop them with just a rifle are the same ones that did all they could to stop our troops in Vietnam, and oddly enough I don't remember the north vietnam army having that many aircraft, battle ships, artillery, people sniffing fake plant electronics, or any of that other stuff. And we are seeing it this very day.

Personally I hope I am dirt long before that happens here......I think I have the same feeling as that kid that fights in the MMA.

Hosts Krystal Ball and Saagar Enjeti.
Ball is a former MSNBC pundit who was too lefty for the network, while Enjeti is the populist Tucker Carlson protégé who was too anti-Trump for The Daily Caller.

A good start would be to seek more reputable sources for commentary & news.

 

[wade2big]

Not really a "ghost gun" and not really a 3D printer thread, but a little bit of both.

I live in the greater KC area, and just this week we had some shit bag kill a North Kansas City officer, and he actually did use a "ghost gun". This 30+ year old shit stain shot the cop because he did not want to be stopped for a minor traffic offense. The LEO community (that I am a member of) is currently in morning for a fallen brother.

This man child still lived at home with his mother, and had an pretty good 3D printer setup, the lower was 3D printed, so the news got this one correct. Even if they are asking how did he print an entire gun? A few months ago some kid in high school came in shot the SRO (school resource officer) a few others before he was stopped, the news reported him using a "ghost gun" but sorry news you got this wrong, it was a "normal" firearm with the SN# ground off, so just defaced.

At least they are batting 500 in the past few months.

Now we are seeing people raising questions of 3D printers, and wanting to restrict them. I hate to tell you idiots that people have been making guns out of what ever from the day after gun power was discovered, this is nothing new.

Personally I own a 3D printer and I have made some "gun" related thigs for it. A couple boxes to hold long cartridges for working up loads, signs for the range that gives the yardage....stuff along those lines.

I am really looking to flush out my ideas and views on this "ghost gun" thing. On one hand we have the right to keep and bear arms, and I read that just as the words are written, in that context I am very much in the camp that means KEEP AND BEAR ARMS....so there should be no issue with so called "ghost guns", or for that matter a gun with the SN# removed. On the other hand working where I work I know the law just a tad, and think well we do need some restrictions, felons should not have the ability to own arms, I think we can all agree on that, but it does not line up with the letter of the 2A, it says nothing about you being the next Charles Whitman.

So while I think the people looking to "outlaw" 3D printers has a snowballs chance, and I also think that having the "plans" that you can feed into your printer and make your "gun" is not quite right.......just starting to babble.

What are your thoughts and views, part of this is my thinking part of this is the devil's advocate.

It is so tough anymore, people wonder how someone can print a "gun". Well they are not really printing a gun, they are printing a lower.....what is that.....the bottom part of the rifle, so that was it, yup......what about the rest of it, well all the little parts inside and the barrel itself are all made from metal, that is not the gun, nope. Well that is stupid, yea it is thank your .gov for that one. I have another good one for you....see this credit card with little stamps on it.....yea, that is a machine gun.....what, that is just stupid.....I don't disagree, and see this trigger, yea....machine gun as well.....but that is not a gun.....welcome to the club.

I am so glad I am close to retirement, only a few years left. I hope I can make it that long, I really worry for our young guys.

Things will only get worse for ya’ll. People are understanding that the rule of law and justice is an illusion and you guys have no problem putting people in front of weaponized courts. Eventually and in time you will have far more than just the homies to worry about and rightfully so considering police are the violent institution that allows government its power over others.

 

[dustingaunder]

I believe there are plenty of studies and such showing not even the death penalty (which I am against due to how crooked and incompetent gov is) really detours crime.

You think the Hommies who are about to do a drive by are like, “yo G’dawg, let’s stop and think about the long term effects our actions will have on our futures”

The world is dangerous, always has been, always will be, no one is owed “fair” life’s a roll of the dice, be as prepared as you can be while still living your life fully.

I don’t think we can deter 1st time offenders. But we can dang sure deter repeat offenders with the death penalty.

 

[wade2big]

I believe there are plenty of studies and such showing not even the death penalty (which I am against due to how crooked and incompetent gov is) really detours crime.

You think the Hommies who are about to do a drive by are like, “yo G’dawg, let’s stop and think about the long term effects our actions will have on our futures”

The world is dangerous, always has been, always will be, no one is owed “fair” life’s a roll of the dice, be as prepared as you can be while still living your life fully.

I used to be in support of the death penalty until I realized how corrupt, crooked, and immoral government employees are. Now I’m completely against it in all circumstances considering the contempt I have for government. The marxist takeover should make all of you think similarly.

 

[UKDslayer]

NYPD Announces Crackdown on Bead Blasters in Wake of 18-Year-Old Man Shot and Killed After Squirting Water Gun at Off-Duty Corrections Officer | The Gateway Pundit | by Kristinn Taylor

The New York City Police Department announced a crackdown on bead blaster water guns this week after an 18-year-old man was shot and killed in the Bronx around 1:30 a.m.

www.thegatewaypundit.com

 

[ArTeeKay]

First, I read the OP, and I was mad. Then I read the replies, and felt a little better.

Two additions:

Fuck you.

Buy more Ammo.

 

[TurboTrout]

along those lines, even the moron politician know the crooks will be crooks

consequences are for the "regular" citizen to think twice before acting

The regular working guy ain’t the one doing all that stuff, but might be the guy getting caught up in BS if he can’t afford a premium lawyer

 

[fpgt72]

How would making your own gun auto be immoral?

Is against the rules the state made for you, but it’s far from unconstitutional or immoral.

The only thing immoral is the states unconstitutional actions against the people

Or what the human does with it. For an object can not be moral or immoral, it is just a thing, metal, wood, plastic.....whatever, it can't do a single thing.....it takes the human to make it immoral or moral.

 

[fpgt72]

I don’t think we can deter 1st time offenders. But we can dang sure deter repeat offenders with the death penalty.

Personally I think....well kinda sorta.

There are thing all of us do or have done that make us "offenders". Ever go 5 over knowingly, or not? That is however different from shooting up a mall.

If you gotta pee, or your 7yr old grand daughter is saying in the back seat pappi I gotta go, you are going to bend that speed limit even if you normally would not.

That does not mean some things should not carry the death end of story. The story I told out of Germany on the kid that got killed and dumped in a poo processing plant, yes, he needs a death fast hard and quickly. Not a quick death but a quick route to his final dirt nap.

 

[fpgt72]

First, I read the OP, and I was mad. Then I read the replies, and felt a little better.

Two additions:

Fuck you.

Buy more Ammo.

I really need to start a thread on just how screwed up my brain works. I know I am very hard to read, and the ideas I am trying to put across at times come out 180 from my intent.

To tell the truth I was a little bit of....what is everyone so ticked about.....but then I had the wife read this, and it was a you said what??? You don't think that at all. You need to stay off those forums.

Yea I know, the brain out runs the fingers many times, and stuff gets lost between the two.

 

[fpgt72]

I believe there are plenty of studies and such showing not even the death penalty (which I am against due to how crooked and incompetent gov is) really detours crime.

You think the Hommies who are about to do a drive by are like, “yo G’dawg, let’s stop and think about the long term effects our actions will have on our futures”

The world is dangerous, always has been, always will be, no one is owed “fair” life’s a roll of the dice, be as prepared as you can be while still living your life fully.

I personally hate absolutes. There should be a death penalty, but we should be real sure of what we are doing. The wacko that shot up the grocery store a month or so ago, you nail him on scene, you know it is him, you have video showing he did it, people he was shooting at can ID him......death for that dude, and make it hurt.

Now when there is not clear cut no doubt about it at all that this person did it, life is good enough....never to get out.

Here in Kansas City last week (I think) they had a 16yr old shoot and kill someone. No doubt it was him, video, other people saw him do it.....on and on.

8 years in Juv for killing someone. Nope not right.

 

[TurboTrout]

I personally hate absolutes. There should be a death penalty, but we should be real sure of what we are doing. The wacko that shot up the grocery store a month or so ago, you nail him on scene, you know it is him, you have video showing he did it, people he was shooting at can ID him......death for that dude, and make it hurt.

Now when there is not clear cut no doubt about it at all that this person did it, life is good enough....never to get out.

Here in Kansas City last week (I think) they had a 16yr old shoot and kill someone. No doubt it was him, video, other people saw him do it.....on and on.

8 years in Juv for killing someone. Nope not right.

So lock them up forever, or para drop them in china

Trusting the gov with killing their own citizens is historically problematic