Going short AND Carbon Fiber...is it worth it?

[dms416]

Would be for 308...so a longer life barrel...

Is there much point/difference in going M24 Carbon Fiber countour vs Med Palma if cutting short to 18-18.5"? Especially if host rifle is already an AI AX pig and the shortness is more for handling than weight-savings...

Thinking not but not sure of what the weight differences would be at that length.

 

[7WSMShooter]

I went short (18 in) and Proof CF on my shorty build, but I was going for weight and handling. So instead of using my AI, I’m having LRI install it on a MAC Bros TI EVO
With Manners CS2 stock. Short and light.

 

[SRPowah]

Remember short barrels are already rigid as hell, so extra material is minimal (and probably not needed after a certain point) compared to a 30" long shlong.

I love my Desert Tech with a 16" 6.5CM (steel) barrel, but it is still over 10lbs. Currently considering selling the DT and going AI AT with a 16" .308 carbon barrel.... I definitely prefer the handiness of short barrels, but I also know my shooting isn't hindered by the velocity loss.

 

[Krob95]

As pictured with a 16.5” Proof Carbon Fiber sendero 308 barrel, I want to say mine came in around 14.5-15.5lbs. If I was going with another carbon barrel though it would be the M24 Bartlein carbon wrapped barrel.

 

[dms416]

As pictured with a 16.5” Proof Carbon Fiber sendero 308 barrel, I want to say mine came in around 14.5-15.5lbs. If I was going with another carbon barrel though it would be the M24 Bartlein carbon wrapped barrel.

Why the different profile the next time?



In respect to the replies, I probably should have added that my only previous experience with CF (Proof) was AR15 barrels. For those, and the numbers, benefits steadily increased in terms of weight savings and balance as length increased.
For example, a 14.5" CF Proof vs. say a 14.5 Gov profile or even mid-weight, there was not a significant difference.
In the case of 18" SPR barrels, there was significant benefit.

I'm wondering if its the same or similar in that at the shorter (less overall material) has a point where minimal weight savings would not justify the cost over selecting a traditional barrel in a slightly more conservative profile.

 

[19Scout77]

Probably adds 1/4” to your dick but about zero handling/performance improvement. Weight comparable and your rig already weighs 13 lbs without a barrel.

 

[30cal user]

go MOD-BB and CF!!

 

[hereinaz]

A heavily fluted short steel barrel will be comparable. Not sure I would go CF on a barrel 18 or under.

 

[Jef-in-AZ]

My thought is that you still want to keep some weight out front just for balance and stability. You’re working with a Chassis that s you even described as a pig. Getting rid of weight is only part of equation. Personally I’d rather have something with some extra weight that balances well than light and off balance.

 

[SkyScrapin]

Not 18” but 11”. Same principles. Do it.

 

[Crews]

please tell me that's a 308?

 

[SkyScrapin]

please tell me that's a 308?

Oh yes, very much so.

I had a Bartlein 11" barrel on her originally. Switch over to this carbon barrel for no other reason but to try it out.

Original barrel got 2700+ FPS with 135g SMKs, but I prefer to shoot them around 2650fps. Subs in the original barrel literally stacked themselves, which I did not expect. Hoping this barrel does too.

My 100 yard zero with supers gives me a 3.5mil low zero when I switch to subs. Super easy to remember.

 

[SRPowah]

I had a Bartlein 11" barrel on her originally. Switch over to this carbon barrel for no other reason but to try it out.

Did you happen to record weights so we can put some data into the OP's question? Or even opinions: How does the balance feel?

 

[SkyScrapin]

@SRPowah

The weight difference is nominal to me since it's going into an AXSR AICS. I would say it's maybe a lb lighter, maybe?

It's already screwed onto the gun or I would weigh it up for you fellas.

 

[Huskydriver]

Not 18” but 11”. Same principles. Do it.

View attachment 7536476

Damn I need an SB US in ral....

 

[Crews]

Oh yes, very much so.

I had a Bartlein 11" barrel on her originally. Switch over to this carbon barrel for no other reason but to try it out.

Original barrel got 2700+ FPS with 135g SMKs

I have a pinned 14.5” 308 in a JTAC chassis, but this rifle has left a burning desire in my soul to go shorter. What a fine setup, 135’s at 2700 would kill anything I have ever hunted at reasonable ranges, with ease.

 

[Mute]

Shortening 6" in barrel length will definitely yield a noticeable change in balance, and thus, perceived weight. You should see if you can find someone with the barrel your interested in just to test out the change in balance and weight and see if you like it.

 

[Frank Green]

I like SkyScrapin's gun and I remember him giving me the order etc...

In my opinion if you want it.....will make it but in my opinion it's more of a personal thing than anything else.

Going shorty....I'd leave it all steel. Change the contour of the barrel and you can change the weight.

The cf isn't going to do anything for barrel life per say. Maybe the barrel might cool a little quicker per say but it heats up faster as well. The same barrel contour in all steel is going to be more of a heat sink and take longer to heat up. So what are you gaining.

What most guys don't think about is every time you pull the trigger and light that round off the flame temperature at the throat depending on caliber and powder etc...is like 2200 to 4000 degrees F. Yes it's only milliseconds but again every time you pull the trigger your lighting the blow torch effect to the barrel. So caliber, powder and rate of fire is going to effect you more in terms of barrel life then if it's cf or not. My .02.

A better grade of steel is going to help barrel life. Which I think we are on to.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels

 

[Frank Green]

Not 18” but 11”. Same principles. Do it.

View attachment 7536476

Gotta say it again with the pic attached.....cool looking rig!

 

[dms416]

I like SkyScrapin's gun and I remember him giving me the order etc...

In my opinion if you want it.....will make it but in my opinion it's more of a personal thing than anything else.

Going shorty....I'd leave it all steel. Change the contour of the barrel and you can change the weight.

The cf isn't going to do anything for barrel life per say. Maybe the barrel might cool a little quicker per say but it heats up faster as well. The same barrel contour in all steel is going to be more of a heat sink and take longer to heat up. So what are you gaining.

What most guys don't think about is every time you pull the trigger and light that round off the flame temperature at the throat depending on caliber and powder etc...is like 2200 to 4000 degrees F. Yes it's only milliseconds but again every time you pull the trigger your lighting the blow torch effect to the barrel. So caliber, powder and rate of fire is going to effect you more in terms of barrel life then if it's cf or not. My .02.

A better grade of steel is going to help barrel life. Which I think we are on to.

Later, Frank
Bartlein Barrels

Thanks for chiming in, Frank

I was not expecting any life from the wrapping, rather weighing the cost/benefit in terms of the chambering's longevity. For example, I'd be fine with a regular CF in 308 shooting factory ammo where as if I were spinning it up for 6.5CM handloads, I'd probably spring for the Mod400BB.

 

[SRPowah]

Thanks for chiming in, Frank

I was not expecting any life from the wrapping, rather weighing the cost/benefit in terms of the chambering's longevity. For example, I'd be fine with a regular CF in 308 shooting factory ammo where as if I were spinning it up for 6.5CM handloads, I'd probably spring for the Mod400BB.

I am chasing the same thing as you, except I finally decided to go 6.5CM....but Frank of all people saying go steel and use contour to control weight would save me some money...

This is where I wish more people had posted weights of their barrels for these applications. Ounces equal pounds, pounds equal pain. Sounds stupid when its going on an AI, but I would rather not make it any more miserable than it needs to be.

 

[LeftyJason]

Another option is going short and fluted but not normal fluted. I'm talking @LongRifles Inc. fluted. They do some cool looking patterns.

Beehive

Progressive

Type x

 

[7WSMShooter]

LRI did some of the x pattern fluting on this AR barrel where they could to drop some of the weight for me. It had already been profiled here for my OTB reflex style can.

 

[Frank Green]

I am chasing the same thing as you, except I finally decided to go 6.5CM....but Frank of all people saying go steel and use contour to control weight would save me some money...

This is where I wish more people had posted weights of their barrels for these applications. Ounces equal pounds, pounds equal pain. Sounds stupid when its going on an AI, but I would rather not make it any more miserable than it needs to be.

 

[Frank Green]

See the above attachment. Gives weights and corresponding contours in CF.

 

[LRI]

Thanks for the kind words gents. I can tell you all this:

If your wanting a "large" (lets say Rem Varmint or bigger) contour barrel and don't want the weight associated with hanging a tractor axle off the end of your receiver, we can help.

Our "Pattern X" can put stuff on a diet. The case study we did involved a 16" Proof Research Sendero contour carbon wrapped barrel. We used this as our baseline. The first test piece in PX we ever ran was a 19" long Sendero made by K/P. One thing to note is that I order these blanks with an extra inch of cylinder on them because the same blank gets turned into our RPR barrels. It just simplifies the inventory for us.

(Make it a point to keep track of the numbers with what I'm about to say below.)

We fluted the K/P and it weighed in 3 oz heavier than the Proof. Now, keep in mind that we were 3 inches longer in overall length and the cylinder portion of the K/P barrel is a good inch or more longer than the PR piece.

In closing the point here is we can flute a barrel and match/beat the weight of the carbon piece.

The usual suspect line of questions that follows is the "H" word and heating/cooling characteristics. Harmonic's definition to me probably means something radically different from most others. I have no conclusive data to support anything other than the scale that I used to weigh stuff on. Heat, cold, etc... is outside of what I can comment on.

Hope this helps.