Rifle Scopes H-59 or G2dmr...?

***Ronin***

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Apr 15, 2008
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My plan was getting the G2dmr but when i see the H-59 then i can see that it might be easier to adjust the 2nd shot because it has more lines below...

Can somebody break down for me whats the pro and cons for both scopes compared to each other...

Thank you for your time and knowledge...
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bkster</div><div class="ubbcode-body">g2
my fav
h59 too busy for me
</div></div>

This..... I just picked up my second HDMR with a G2

Dustin
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

My firm has the latest 5-25x PMII CM MTC CCW LT in RAL8000 color (tan) utilizing the H-59 and we are extremely pleased with it.

We have evaluated a number of scopes and reticles and if you are going to be shooting a variety of ranges, this scope/reticle combination works very well. If I was going to sit on one target for long periods of time, I would probably just dial the dope. You'd have a much cleaner scope and could still make hold off corrections if you had movers. If you didn't know, there's a mover scale on the first line.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ***Ronin***</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My plan was getting the G2dmr but when i see the H-59 then i can see that it might be easier to adjust the 2nd shot because it has more lines below...</div></div>Are you saying that you always miss below the target?
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

I've never used a Horus reticle, but from what I have heard and read it does take time to get used to them. Personally, I think the reticle is a bit busy. I am leaning towards the G2DMR when I purchase my Bushnell.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Are you saying that you always miss below the target? </div></div>

No but if your zero is only 100 yd then all above yards will always be below center dot.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ***Ronin***</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Are you saying that you always miss below the target? </div></div>No but if your zero is only 100 yd then all above yards will always be below center dot. </div></div>But your misses won't be.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

After spending time with a Horus reticle, my next scope will have one. Once you learn it, holdovers are too easy....makes mil dots seem archaic. I'm interested in the new tremor and how that stacks up against the Horus.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

H59 bar far. The reticle takes very little time to figure out and once you have there is nothing you can't do. Many people say they are "busy" but that is because you are looking at the wrong part of the scope. Zero that bad boy in and why bother turn turrets when most of the time you can make a on the fly quick second shot.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ***Ronin***</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Are you saying that you always miss below the target? </div></div>

No but if your zero is only 100 yd then all above yards will always be below center dot.</div></div>

you only plan on using holdovers and never dial the scope?
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ***Ronin***</div><div class="ubbcode-body">No but if your zero is only 100 yd then all above yards will always be below center dot. </div></div>

Thanks for posting this - it made me check up on trajectory, zero etc.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

Ronin, what are you planning on doing with your reticle? To dial or to hold seems to be a hot debate around here and you will find a verity of opinions supporting the merits of both but I think you are going to find your choice of reticle is going to hinge on how you are planning to employ it and how comfortable your are with it.

If you are planing and are more comfortable with dialing rather than holding, you will probably find the H59 a bit over kill and unnecessary. That being said if you what to hold and or dial then I would highly recommend the H59.

Many folks who are use to shooting traditional reticles find the Horus reticle overwhelming. They often find the reticle distracting, busy and confusing. My first interaction with the Horus reticle was a little over a year and a half ago when shooting a XM2010 with the Leupold Mk 4 ER/T 6.5-20x50mm M5A FFP (H-58) at work. My reaction was "WTF is all that shit" But honestly in took me less than a day to fall completely in love with it. Unfortunately that XM2010 was only a demo gun so the following week my teammate and I both ordered our own Mk 4 ER/T's for our up coming deployment to Afghanistan. That optic has been on every sws we have from the mk12 to the m107.

If you need to engage non-static, man size targets in rapid sequence and at multiple ranges, I can say hands down that the H58/59 is the best Mil based reticle out there. Our last engagement with enemy forces resulted in 4 EKIA and 3 EWIA in less than 10 minutes, at ranges from 1590m to 2160m while utilizing the m107 and Mk 4 ER/T 6.5-20x50mm M5A FFP (H-58).

After reviewing the G2 I can say that it would not be adequate for utilizing pure holds. The reticle tree is not nearly wide enough to use at extended ranges in high winds. As a matter of personal preference I also find the .2 Mil subtensions of the H58/59 to be more useful than that .5 Mil's found in the G2.

Many folks have also state the fear of not being able to see the splash from missed rounds due to the "cluttering" of the H58/59. I supposes there might be some truth to this if using extremely light projectiles at extended ranges but under most normal circumstances I didn't find this to be the case. The lightest caliber rifle I have used my H58 with was the mk12. The impacts of the 5.56 projectiles could easily be seen out to 1500-1700m during the dusty summer, 1000-1300m was reasonable for the spring time before the ground dried out and about 700-900m with 2-3 ft. of snow on the ground during the winter.

Hopefully this gives you some insight. If you are willing to adapt and you have the time to invest in to learning how to use the H59 I would highly recommend.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RoBird</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ronin, what are you planning on doing with your reticle? To dial or to hold seems to be a hot debate around here and you will find a verity of opinions supporting the merits of both but I think you are going to find your choice of reticle is going to hinge on how you are planning to employ it and how comfortable your are with it.

If you are planing and are more comfortable with dialing rather than holding, you will probably find the H59 a bit over kill and unnecessary. That being said if you what to hold and or dial then I would highly recommend the H59.

Many folks who are use to shooting traditional reticles find the Horus reticle overwhelming. They often find the reticle distracting, busy and confusing. My first interaction with the Horus reticle was a little over a year and a half ago when shooting a XM2010 with the Leupold Mk 4 ER/T 6.5-20x50mm M5A FFP (H-58) at work. My reaction was "WTF is all that shit" But honestly in took me less than a day to fall completely in love with it. Unfortunately that XM2010 was only a demo gun so the following week my teammate and I both ordered our own Mk 4 ER/T's for our up coming deployment to Afghanistan. That optic has been on every sws we have from the mk12 to the m107.

If you need to engage non-static, man size targets in rapid sequence and at multiple ranges, I can say hands down that the H58/59 is the best Mil based reticle out there. Our last engagement with enemy forces resulted in 4 EKIA and 3 EWIA in less than 10 minutes, at ranges from 1590m to 2160m while utilizing the m107 and Mk 4 ER/T 6.5-20x50mm M5A FFP (H-58).

After reviewing the G2 I can say that it would not be adequate for utilizing pure holds. The reticle tree is not nearly wide enough to use at extended ranges in high winds. As a matter of personal preference I also find the .2 Mil subtensions of the H58/59 to be more useful than that .5 Mil's found in the G2.

Many folks have also state the fear of not being able to see the splash from missed rounds due to the "cluttering" of the H58/59. I supposes there might be some truth to this if using extremely light projectiles at extended ranges but under most normal circumstances I didn't find this to be the case. The lightest caliber rifle I have used my H58 with was the mk12. The impacts of the 5.56 projectiles could easily be seen out to 1500-1700m during the dusty summer, 1000-1300m was reasonable for the spring time before the ground dried out and about 700-900m with 2-3 ft. of snow on the ground during the winter.

Hopefully this gives you some insight. If you are willing to adapt and you have the time to invest in to learning how to use the H59 I would highly recommend.

</div></div>
+100%.
H-37-is my preference to be more generic.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

@RoBird...

We are on the same page...

The only reason I got unsure because everybody was so hyped about the G2 then I just want be sure, that I am not missing some advandtage with the new G2.

Imho I think the H58/59 has much more pros then the G2.

I have posted a wanted thread for the H59, now I sit and wait...

I thank u all for your inputs and time...
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: HeroFish</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Kristian55 - I would be interested to hear you thoughts on the H37 in comparison to the H59/H58, and if you have used the H37. </div></div>
Hi Hero.
H-27 - for standard 7.62NATO/.308Win., .223Rem.,etc. cal ..
H-58 and H-59 to the hotter calibers.
H-37-my priority to him as a more "universal reticle" which is convenient for both standard cal. and hot cal..
TReMoR-I had this reticle - but she apparently does not like me.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DaveD</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I wonder why Leupold wont use the H-59 in the Mk 4 ER/T 6.5-20x50mm.
I could be wrong but as of now I think it only comes with the H-58.

I use a H-58 in the HDMR and like it. </div></div>
YES,
(30mm.)-only H-58,H-27,H-37;
(34mm.)-H-58,H-27.
P.S.
H59 Recticle used in Bushnell HDMR Elite Tactical Rifle Scope.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

The lightest caliber rifle I have used my H58 with was the mk12. The impacts of the 5.56 projectiles could easily be seen out to 1500-1700m during the dusty summer, 1000-1300m was reasonable for the spring time before the ground dried out and about 700-900m with 2-3 ft. of snow on the ground during the winter.


[/quote]
Now 1500 meters is a good poke with the Mk 12. I thought I was something pounding on the e types at 900 with the little 77 grainers.

I do like the 58 in the big leupy on the 300, but find myself behind the 59 in the HDMR more often.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

Yes 1500m is indeed a long poke for the mk12 but doable under the right conditions. We also were able to take our m107 out to 2620mm while still saying in the scopes field of view, accuracy was pretty amazing. Usually only taking 2-3 rounds to get on target. After that we use the reticle to measure out terrain features as reference points for hold overs. Made it out to 3995m on 1 Mil x 1 Mil rock with a first round hit. Struck right at the base of the rock but that was mostly just luck. The next 14 rounds all missed left or right as we had 4 different crosswinds ranging from 14 to 22 mph and the occasional dust devil whipping though. All that was done using the H58 and a Atrag. My spotter was there watching with a Leupold mk4 but honestly the time of flight was more than enough time for me to come down and spot my own rounds. I wish we had better ammo the mk211 just doesn't have the QC need to be consistent at extended ranges, at least impacts are easy to spot.
 
Re: H-59 or G2dmr...?

Count me as a fan of the H59. I was among the "Horus reticles are too busy" crowd until I was afforded the opportunity to shoot behind one at a Magpul Dynamics class. I have an HDMR with the H59 reticle on my OBR, and couldn't be happier with it. To me the 0.2mil hash marks are infinitely superior to the 0.5mil marks found on some other reticles.

Now, take everything I've just stated and flush it, because for every guy like me, you're gonna find one with equal or greater experience/skill who will give you the exact opposite advice.

For my money, I'd go with the H59, but that's me. YMMV. My best advice to you is try to shoot behind both in the conditions that prevail where you typically shoot and then choose.