Help getting squared away for ELR

[LawnMM]

I'm the proud new owner of a 338LM MRAD and I'm trying to get some gear lined up. I'm going to do initial load development at 100/300/600yds. I read Frank's recap from their tests at gunsite. Seems like the Hornady 285s are a good round to work up. I'm playing catchup on powder choices. Seems like Retumbo and H1000 are the favorites with H1000 producing better speed. Any thoughts on that?

Is there a point to saving on brass or will it cost you in the long run when it wears out quicker? Just go Lapua from the get go or are guys getting decent life from Winchester and Hornady?

I've ranged out to 1400 with my Bushy Elite 1600 but I'm thinking of trading up for a set of Fusion 1 Mile binos for more reliable ranging at ELR distances. I feel sort of obligated to join the mile club now that I have a caliber suited to the distance.

Scope choices... I'm leaning towards the new Bushnell Tactical scopes, particularly the XRS? 4.5-30x is a nice magnification range. Any other choices in the 2-2.5k range I should consider? I prefer to use FFP scopes to keep things simple in tactical matches. Might a Vortex Razor be a better choice? How important is the extra magnification for you guys shooting ELR? Are you left wanting more at 20x or 25x or is that plenty? I'm planning on shooting full size ipsc steel outside of about 1200yds.

I'd like to get my hands on a Trimble and FFS but I can't help but think there is an impending technology leap coming with those and I'd prefer to drop the coin on one afterwards. How long are they realistically planning to stick with windows mobile 6?

Thanks in advance guys,

Rich

 

[Enough Said]

H1000 or Vv N570
Lapua Brass ONLY
Vectronix Terrapin
Razor tracks with scopes that are 2X Price
HP Ipaq + FFS

Just a humble opinion

 

[LawnMM]

Thanks for the input bro

 

[Armored Transport]

Sightron S-III 10-50X60 2nd FP LRMOA reticle. 2nd FP ( I think ) is better for LR target shooting at known distances ( when using a range finder ). You can save a lot of coin for ammo by getting a 1000. scope that will do it all and track perfectly. I have the Bushy Fusion 12x50's and like them alot. Ranged a black cow at over 1600 on 3rd try.

 

[LawnMM]

I think I'm leaning towards a 5-20x Razor or maybe a 4.5-30x Bushnell, heard good things about both and I waffle back and forth between which features seem more useful

 

[CoryT]

Front focal, Mil/Mil or MOA/MOA, preferably a reticle like the Gen 2 XR for example. 25x is plenty, you'll want at least 25 mil of travel after zero. Lapua brass, Retumbo (temp stability). Vectronix rangefinder, FFS needs a Windows PDA anyway, the new Juno is pretty nice but I use the Nomad.

 

[LawnMM]

Front focal, Mil/Mil or MOA/MOA, preferably a reticle like the Gen 2 XR for example. 25x is plenty, you'll want at least 25 mil of travel after zero. Lapua brass, Retumbo (temp stability). Vectronix rangefinder, FFS needs a Windows PDA anyway, the new Juno is pretty nice but I use the Nomad.

Thanks for the input! Always nice to have an authority weigh in on the subject. You have introduced a helpful requirement, namely a scope with 25+ mils of internal travel. That helps narrow the field considerably. I will look into the Juno. Are you running the 5-25 Premiere?

 

[CoryT]

I've got 5-25 S&B's with the Gen 2 XR or P4 Fine, Premier 5-25's and Leupold 6.5-20's with TMR's on the ELR rigs. What you need is high quality glass, plenty of reliable travel, a FFP graduated reticle and solid construction. The new Nightforce BEAST looks to be about perfect, except of course you can't get one yet.

 

[pyrofx]

Retumbo powder ! 215 magnum primers. Lapua , or RUAG brass only . I tried Hornaday . IT SUCKS !!. Shoot it at low vel you are ok . If you even start to get warm , it sticks in the gun it is so soft . Horny 285 bullet are money ! So much so that I now have 3500 of them . They can't be beat.
Nomad with FFS is the way to go . Have tried them all , and FFS is my go to .
What Cory said on scopes , and to add .... US Optics . They are putting out a great product again , and have the elevation to get there . 1k plus rounds on the Cheytac and still tickin.

Get a kestrel and Teripin. Accurate ranging is paramount !!!

Last , but most important , do the ELR course with Cory . His teaching cannot be beat . I learn more every time I go back .

Greg

 

[bodywerks]

Penny for penny, maybe the 285 Hornadys can't be beat, but Berger 300 otm have the BC (.818 vs .7= no contest)to say you're wrong. And at only about a penny more per bullet (if that), I'll take the Bergers any day and twice on Sunday.
To the OP. Retumbo has a clear velocity edge over retumbo according to the load chart and personal experiences. But good luck finding retumbo these days. I have both and will work up loads for each just in case although i prefer retumbo for the velocity.

 

[LawnMM]

Thanks for the input guys. I'm going to try and get all the gear together for the ELR class in November. I'm already on vacation that week so its just a matter of getting the gear together and money set aside for the class and hotel. I've got time and I'm already keeping an eye peeled for powder, primers, brass, etc. Should have enough time to get it all set up.

 

[Dogtown]

Just try not to skimp on gear - the further out you shoot, the quality of your gear will become more and more important. ELR shooting requires a larger investment than most folks are prepared to commit to and if I had a dollar for every time I came across someone who tried to jump from shooting 300m to 1300m....

Your long term costs will be in consumables like powder, primers and bullets. Training is easily the best investment that pays the biggest dividends yet usually is the one people skimp on the most (next to optics). A lot of the gear you'll need for ELR should fall into the "buy once, cry once" category. For example, I spent about 4 years climbing the cost ladder on rangefinders, thinking that it was silly to spend $2k on a mil-grade LRF. If I knew then what I know now, I would have just saved up and bought the damned thing from the start instead of wasting lots of time and money, starting with an average LRF, getting frustrated and moving up to the next best one.

Load development is a big one too - you'll want to spend a reasonable amount of time working up a load that's solid and not try to take short cuts. I've seen guys play musical chairs with bullets and powder, and while that can be part of the fun, I think it's wiser to try and narrow your focus a bit and spend more time finessing a single load and shooting it as often as you can. Become intimate with how it performs at distance, in different environmental conditions, etc.

And one of the best ways to get started in this niche field is to team up with a buddy. Split the costs - you buy ammo components, he buys a mil-grade LRF, you guys split a good spotting scope, etc. Take turns spotting and work up your accuracy and consistency as you push the distances out.

 

[bodywerks]

Very, very good advice right there! Man, it was just a few years ago when i couldn't justify more than a few hundred for a rifle scope. And $1k on a rifle? Forget about it! I just couldn't see the cost/benefit ratio. With time that has changed. Quality glass, a straight shooting rifle, sound reloading technique, quality gear, etc. - it really does make a difference.

 

[LawnMM]

Yeah, I'm hearing you guys loud and clear on the LRF, lining up a Terrapin for that. Getting the scope choice narrowed down. Then I just need to grab reloading components and get a good load worked up. I typically just hit single digits for ES and stop. For this I think I'll even play with seating depth to get it as tight as possible.

 

[bodywerks]

Yeah, couldn't justify $1k for a complete rifle a couple years ago and now i have almost twice that in just the chassis!

 

[bogeybrown]

Can't offer any help on the loads, but look into the Kestrel 4500 with the Horus ATRAG ballistics softwear. I'm only CONUS a few weeks per year and the integrated Kestrel (plus my PLRF15C) allows me to go out and shoot productively without the need to keep massive info on DOPE. I bought the Kestrel and a brand new log book while I was having my latest rifle built, and I usually forget to use the log book. No ballistics program is "perfect", but with the truing function and built in atmospherics if you have a deviation it is very easily correctable. It has saved me well more than the cost of the unit in ammo savings alone (not to mention the all too precious TIME involved in long range doping).