Help me figure out this Dillon 650 toolhead setup with bulletfeeder

[TheGerman]

I remember messing around with this in the past and have pretty much forgotten what I started to do because its been that long.

I have the 650 with case feeder and MrBullet Feeder and am considering completely automating the press down the road, but its not a priority.

I remember I got hung up on figuring out how to get correct neck tension due to some of the parameters of whats needed to get the setup to work; primarily the need for the Lyman M die in the loading toolhead to get the bullets to not rock themselves off the case when the press indexes.

Looking at the 2 toolheads, here's what I remember:

Toolhead 1: Prep

Station 1 - Lee Universal decap
Station 2 - Empty
Station 3 - Empty
Station 4 - Dillon Trim die with trimmer (if I remember right, the trim die will FL size/bump the shoulder but doesn't do anything really for neck tension; or if it does, it has a 'generic' neck tension as it doesn't use a bushing or specifically sized mandrel)
Station 5 - Redding Type S neck die with correct bushing (I think this is where I started to get confused as to if this was needed because of the Lyman M die in the 2nd toolhead)

Toolhead 2: Load

Station 1 - Lyman M die
Station 2 - Powder die/powder dispenser
Station 3 - Mr Bullet Feeder bullet dropper
Station 4 - Dillon seater die
Station 5 - Dillon crimp die

The main thing I'm confused on is the neck die, the Lyman die and neck tension. I know the Lyman acts as a mandrel and also flares the case mouth a bit so that the bullets won't rock themselves off on indexing. In order to achieve proper neck tension, do I need the Redding S die with the bushing, or can I somehow get it from adjusting the mandrel on the Lyman and just trade off a bushing that squeezes, for a mandrel that pushes out? Or does the Lyman not work like that and its primarily for flaring the case mouth?

 

[spife7980]

Whether the Redding type S neck die is necessary depends on how much the dillon sizes the neck down. (I dont have any of this equipment or details on your components so its all theory for me)

Im guessing this is 223 so Ill steer my numbers towards that.

Lets say that the 223 has a brass neck thickness of .0125".
That would mean your loaded diameter is both sides neck thickness plus bullet so .0125+.0125+.224=.249"

Not really pertinent in all likelihood but lets say your fired diameter is .256"

So in an ideal world suppose your dillon trimmer sizes the neck down to .245", thats .004 less than your loaded round diameter, lots of tension. The lyman expanding M die will open that up to around .247 external diameter (internal of .002 less than bullet diameter) and will flare the top open even more for the bullet to sit in while it whirls around the turret (that top part will get closed back via your crimp die). In this scenario the redding type s neck die would just be redundant and do nothing for you.

A less than ideal world will have your dillon size the neck down to only .249. That means youll have virtually no interference fit between the bullet and the case and the lyman M dies lower step wont do anything and your only source of actual tension on the bullet will be the crimp. In this situation you would want the redding type s neck die with a .245 or .246 bushing so that the neck gets sized down enough to hold the bullet and for the lyman expanding die to work properly, a .247 bushing would mean the lyman lower level expander doesnt really expand much but the upper level would still flare.

Now, what you really need to do is to

• measure your loaded rounds neck diameter if you have an unfired one
• measure your fired rounds neck diameter
• run a piece up into the dillon trimmer to see how much it sizes down to
• run that now sized down piece over the lyman expander or measure its mandrel diameter
• measure the new loaded round diameter if you didnt have one avaliable above

Knowing those dimensions will allow you to see whether you need additional neck sizing or not.