HVAC EXPERTS - HELP

[IowaPlinker]

I have a Trane. 3 ton, 18 years old.
Tried to start it up and it didn’t cool. Called the company that did the install and their service tech said it is the evaporator coil and it needs to be replaced. This will be the third one, first covered by warranty.

My question; is this normal? Do evaporator coils go bad that often? Is there something I should be doing to help them last longer?

Let me know what you think

 

[Dirty D]

Get someone else to install the next one, indoor coils should not go bad that often. Probably a shit install

 

[mahlv]

Sounds odd.... what is meant by "going bad"? In regards to just the coil, it either leaks or it doesn't. If it's just a txv, that's a different deal.

 

[AllenOne1]

18 years old and on the third evaporator coil, you may to think about replacing the entire system rather than invest more money into it.

 

[GreenGO Juan]

3rd one... in 18 years.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

Get a second opinion.
Biggest problem that I have found with older Trane equipment is bad txv, bad start capacitor, leaking indoor coils.
Did they replace the txv when they replaced the previous coils? Did they install a fresh filter drier when they replaced those coils?
Trash in the system will clog a txv and many techs would rather change the whole coil if they txv is included with the new coil.

 

[Sean the Nailer]

I too suggest getting a second opinion. At the same time, I've never been an advocate of "throw money/parts at it, see what happens".

Which seems to me, the situation here. I've been in this house since '05 and the same evaporator, condenser, compressor, and gas. (refrigerant). It was all used when I moved in. (3-5 yrs)

As has been said above, the coil works or it don't. It has a leak or it don't. The problem is elsewhere, or they're just throwing darts.

YMMV.

 

[missed]

I am assuming the evaporator is leaking right?
Is it pin hole leaking? The end tubes leaking?

If they didn't evacuate the system properly water internally will turn to acid and kill coils from the inside. I have seen a bunch where the AC techs have used cleaners and not rinsed off the cleaner completely which can eat coils. Also houses that have sulphur water will kill aluminum coils.

Could be something environmental causing the failures, could be air flow issues adding tubulence and vibration shortening life span. There have been batches of crappy coils, shouldn't be 3 in 18 years. Our last house when we sold it had a 12 year old system that never had anything beyond periodic maintenance performed in it. Coils should be lasting the useful life of the system.

Do you clean it, or have someone else clean it? Does the system run year round?

 

[NoDopes]

Also, many ac people won't flow nitrogen when brazing which causes black soot and will turn to acid. Double bad if they don't replace the filter/dryer. You can spray the coil with this to see if it's actually leaking at the coil.

 

[Mostshooter]

No expert , but is your outside unit fan running or humming. If humming check your run capacitor. then check for Freon loss. One time i had my unit go out when ants decided to make there path across a relay.

 

[ArTeeKay]

I could speculate, but others have already mentioned the points I'd pick first, with this limited amount of information. But no, 3 coils in 18 years is not appropriate.

"Bad evaporator coil" can mean a few things, and without test equipment and being able to see the thing operating, it's hard to say what's happening. Chances are, as has been said, it's not the coil itself, but another component that's the issue.

I'll be third or fourth or whatever, but yeah, get a second opinion. And whatever you do, don't replace the thing with a Daikin.

 

[TXAZ]

Ditto on get additional quotes, and Don’t buy cheap.
I learned to do my own install, then bought complete systems + install tools online from Florida AC companies and learned from online training courses.
As mentioned above flush and evacuated are important before adding refrigerant.
Cost was 1/2 to 1/3 if quotes from companies in AZ, Austin & Dallas. $10K saved in Austin and completed it before local installers could get to me.
Get quotes to purge & recharge locally.
No problems with any of the systems over 25 years.
YouTube is your friend.

 

[greg1147]

Bad evaporator coil is kind of generic, did it freeze up, coils rotted away, is it cap tube or TXV, pin hole leak ? 18 yrs old R22 system? Not that would have any bearing? As before get a second opinion.

 

[tomcatmv]

Get a second opinion.
Biggest problem that I have found with older Trane equipment is bad txv, bad start capacitor, leaking indoor coils.
Did they replace the txv when they replaced the previous coils? Did they install a fresh filter drier when they replaced those coils?
Trash in the system will clog a txv and many techs would rather change the whole coil if they txv is included with the new coil.

This^^^ is good advice. I am a retired commercial HVAC design/build contractor and have much experience with their chillers and large VAV rooftop equipment. I've never been impressed with their residential gear in the last few years. I've been to the mother ship in LaCrosse many times and other facilities like Clarksville, Lexington and Pueblo. their QC used to be very good, especially in Pueblo and LaCrosse where they build the big chillers.
A bad evap coil is either a leak from internal corrosion or some other system issue.
Bottom line, at 18 years I'd yard out the whole system and look at Carrier or Lennox.
Trane really started going downhill several years ago when they were taken over by Ingersoll-Rand.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

A couple years ago the local Trane distributor contacted me about changing to the brand. I installed a few and I think I lost money on them. Every one of them had to have a TXV replaced and a few other problems. I asked the salesman if I was getting Monday and Friday units.
The worst thing in this business is having to repair new equipment. The home owners never forget it. You may not have to go back for years but the first words out of their mouth... "That thing has been junk since you put it in"
And one unhappy customer tells twenty other people. One happy customer tells two.

This^^^ is good advice. I am a retired commercial HVAC design/build contractor and have much experience with their chillers and large VAV rooftop equipment. I've never been impressed with their residential gear in the last few years. I've been to the mother ship in LaCrosse many times and other facilities like Clarksville, Lexington and Pueblo. their QC used to be very good, especially in Pueblo and LaCrosse where they build the big chillers.
A bad evap coil is either a leak from internal corrosion or some other system issue.
Bottom line, at 18 years I'd yard out the whole system and look at Carrier or Lennox.
Trane really started going downhill several years ago when they were taken over by Ingersoll-Rand.

As for the op.
It's 18 years old. Several years beyond their life expectancy. Take the money for the repair and put it towards a new system that is going to be more efficient and have a warranty.
Pay back on utilities will probably be in the seven year area, plus or minus, for a 14 to 16 seer unit.
Avoid a ten year labor warranty if it's not directly from the manufacturer. I have seen several of the warranty companies go out of business and then you get the bill for the repair.

 

[Stevo86]

Leaking evap coils has been a major issue ever since they switch to r410a , 99 for carrier and 02 for Trane. With the higher pressure and the tubing getting thinner in coils in the name of “efficiency”. Every brand out there has been suffering from it, just look up the class action lawsuits against Lennox and other brands, it isn’t just one company. I met with a Trane engineer one time and we was looking at some coils that were leaking, after examining them he told me that high sulfur content in the sheet rock was causing all the failures.

As mentioned above, since ingersoll rand purchased them they turned to pieces of shit. After 30 years we finally said enough is enough and switched to Carrier.

Darnyankee, If I remember correctly Trane was blaming Copeland for their TXV failures. Claiming they added some kind of rust inhibitor to the oil in the compressors and that caused the txv’s to fail. I call bullshit. Just cheap ass parts and yes prolly a few with installers not floating nitrogen or getting them to hot.

Get a second opinion, but 18 years is a good run for a system. Put the money towards a new 16 seer system.

 

[Ravenworks]

At 18 years you can't ask much more.
I have a Rudd that turns 22 years old this year.
I thought it was going to bite it last season but it didn't.
I'm all set up when it does, the unit will be moved to a new pad, electrical conduit is already in place with wire pulled.
The change over will be minimal as I prepared for it.
99.9% that isn't the case.

 

[Maggot]

Get a second opinion.
Biggest problem that I have found with older Trane equipment is bad txv, bad start capacitor, leaking indoor coils.
Did they replace the txv when they replaced the previous coils? Did they install a fresh filter drier when they replaced those coils?
Trash in the system will clog a txv and many techs would rather change the whole coil if they txv is included with the new coil.

After it cost me $150 to have one changed, I went on line and bought 5 of them for about $40. They tend to go bad as a unit ages and creates more resistance. Turn the unit off, look under the hood, remove cap, get new one, instal turn unit on. save $150 and deep a few in reserve.

 

[missed]

it cost me $150 to have one changed, I went on line and bought 5 of them for about $40. They tend to go bad as a unit ages and creates more resistance. Turn the unit off, look under the hood, remove cap, get new one, instal turn unit on. save $150 and deep a few in reserve.

If you have the made in Mexico General electric capacitors they have a very short life span. The USA made Titan caps have been awesome.

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

I have a Trane. 3 ton, 18 years old.
Tried to start it up and it didn’t cool. Called the company that did the install and their service tech said it is the evaporator coil and it needs to be replaced. This will be the third one, first covered by warranty.

My question; is this normal? Do evaporator coils go bad that often? Is there something I should be doing to help them last longer?

Let me know what you think

sounds fishy. What exactly is wrong with your evap coil? other than manufacturer defect it's usually the last thing that needs to be replaced. 3 in 18yrs is bullshit.

 

[Maggot]

If you have the made in Mexico General electric capacitors they have a very short life span. The USA made Titan caps have been awesome.

I was getting about a year. Tend to get what you pay for.

 

[DarnYankeeUSMC]

The illegitimate alphabet banned the chemical in capacitors. The new stuff doesn't deal with heat like the old stuff. So once again Ron Reagan was right about the nine words. A couple weeks ago I replaced a system that was almost forty years old. It had the original capacitor in it. For shits and grins I tested it and it was still good.

 

[NoDopes]

Made in USA, 5 year warranty, universal usage.
Turbo 200 Motor Run Capacitor Amazon product ASIN B007IKYT1GI keep a couple on hand.
(Not sure why Amazon links don't seem to work for me.)