Hypothetical machinegun/nfa thoughts

[sixpack340]

This is all hypothetical gents, as I feel the nfa will never be repealed since our government would hate to see us happy. But IF it was abolished, what would happen to the value of machineguns currently in circulation? That $50k browning m2 may not be worth that anymore if browning would fire up the 'ol ma deuce assembly line again. Or those $30k colt m16a1 wouldn't be worth dick because now spikes, aero, bcm, etc can all sell them to everyone and no one will give a damn about the m16 that someone paid a pile of cash for. Am I missing something in my thought process? Or would collectors of the cool guy nfa goodies be shit out of luck if this every actually came to fruition?

 

[pmclaine]

Yes.

Tough.

I want.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

Yep collectors would be fucked and I’m ok with that. They should be too since it’s unconstitutional to begin with.

 

[hlee]

Old will still be old. And repro won’t hold the same collector value. Original examples of vintage machine guns would probably hold much of their value, but yeah, anything built on a m16/ar15 would tank.

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

Hypothetically still waiting for someone to act upon the reality of NFA does not exist if it is purchased and used in same State it was manufactured since the NFA rides under the Interstate Commerce Act AND there has already been states sign legislation of such.
But NOBODY wants to be the first to "test" that legislation out in those States. IIRC it was Montana and Texas that passed such worded legislation but I could be mistaken.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[Romeo458]

An anderson manufacturing full auto...
If only we lived in one of those countries where a bunch of guys wrote down stuff that the government was not supposed to specifically limit or make laws about, oh what could we call those...

 

[2ndamendfan]

This is all hypothetical gents, as I feel the nfa will never be repealed since our government would hate to see us happy. But IF it was abolished, what would happen to the value of machineguns currently in circulation? That $50k browning m2 may not be worth that anymore if browning would fire up the 'ol ma deuce assembly line again. Or those $30k colt m16a1 wouldn't be worth dick because now spikes, aero, bcm, etc can all sell them to everyone and no one will give a damn about the m16 that someone paid a pile of cash for. Am I missing something in my thought process? Or would collectors of the cool guy nfa goodies be shit out of luck if this every actually came to fruition?

Right, so to me we now have collectors with money and a huge incentive for NFA to exist. Exactly what the Government wanted. Rich people with the toys hanging on walls.

On a side note I had a friend who passed away a couple years ago. I knew he had some wealth but I was surprised by what he had. His daughter found (all legal with paper work) an NEVER fired full Auto Tommy gun from the 1920's. I couldn't believe it, I actually handled it and I couldn't tell it had ever been fired. I ain't really into that stuff, but another friend offered $45,000 and she said NO. She had some expert look at it and he said it had never been fired, he found her a buyer and she took $65,000 for it.

 

[THEIS]

Hi,

Here is another hypothetical.....
ANY former or current NRA Board Member and/or Executive that has a NFA collection should be removed immediately from the NRA history books as they are the reason the NRA caved and refuses to go after repealing NFA.
They absolutely do not want to see their collection become essentially worthless overnight. They are the foundation of the Divide and Conquer concept of firearm owners.

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[Mike Casselton]

I'm gonna say it again.

@THEIS for president!!

 

[THEIS]

I'm gonna say it again.

@THEIS for president!!

Hi,

LOLOL....but that whole birthplace requirement thing.....

Sincerely,
Theis

 

[Charger442]

This is all hypothetical gents, as I feel the nfa will never be repealed since our government would hate to see us happy. But IF it was abolished, what would happen to the value of machineguns currently in circulation? That $50k browning m2 may not be worth that anymore if browning would fire up the 'ol ma deuce assembly line again. Or those $30k colt m16a1 wouldn't be worth dick because now spikes, aero, bcm, etc can all sell them to everyone and no one will give a damn about the m16 that someone paid a pile of cash for. Am I missing something in my thought process? Or would collectors of the cool guy nfa goodies be shit out of luck if this every actually came to fruition?

few people remember it was the MG collectors who were part of the screwing done with 41P that later turned to 41F.

 

[pmclaine]

Yep collectors would be fucked and I’m ok with that. They should be too since it’s unconstitutional to begin with.

There was a douche ex brit now citizen on here a couple minths ago asking what high end guns he should buy thinking more restrictions would be coming....

He was thinking the next step would "grandfather" his new possessions and they would be a great investment.

Apparently his freedom and personal defense has a price point at which it can be voluntarily surrendered..

Fuck him.

Not saying present Class III are that way.

I understand they would feel pain with the end of NFA but I think the good ones will see the greater good over the loss of "muh investment".

 

[Mike Casselton]

Hi,

LOLOL....but that whole birthplace requirement thing.....

Sincerely,
Theis

It didn't stop ol Barry.
Just sayin...

 

[pmclaine]

Hi,

LOLOL....but that whole birthplace requirement thing.....

Sincerely,
Theis

Kenyan?

 

[deersniper]

Old will still be old. And repro won’t hold the same collector value. Original examples of vintage machine guns would probably hold much of their value, but yeah, anything built on a m16/ar15 would tank.

This.

And most mg owners would be fine with the price drop of what they own if they could buy new. I know I would abs every other owner I have talked to said the same thing

 

[deersniper]

Hi,

Hypothetically still waiting for someone to act upon the reality of NFA does not exist if it is purchased and used in same State it was manufactured since the NFA rides under the Interstate Commerce Act AND there has already been states sign legislation of such.
But NOBODY wants to be the first to "test" that legislation out in those States. IIRC it was Montana and Texas that passed such worded legislation but I could be mistaken.

Sincerely,
Theis

People tried and were convicted

Commerce clause was gutted by the black robe liars a long time agk when they decided wheat grown on a farm and fed to that farms animals could be controlled by the feds because that wheat not being sold affected the national wheat market.

F statists

 

[DOA]

Hi,

Here is another hypothetical.....
ANY former or current NRA Board Member and/or Executive that has a NFA collection should be removed immediately from the NRA history books as they are the reason the NRA caved and refuses to go after repealing NFA.
They absolutely do not want to see their collection become essentially worthless overnight. They are the foundation of the Divide and Conquer concept of firearm owners.

Sincerely,
Theis

DealerNFA Ruben M. helped write the 1994 assault weapons ban and bragged about it back in the day to protect his investment.

 

[hafejd30]

The only way I could see the NFA getting repealed is if the left came up with their own idea to replace it.

Which would I’m sure be more $$$$, more paperwork etc. They’d make it a rich mans game. In which case those current items out there would probably increase in value

 

[pmclaine]

Hi,

Hypothetically still waiting for someone to act upon the reality of NFA does not exist if it is purchased and used in same State it was manufactured since the NFA rides under the Interstate Commerce Act AND there has already been states sign legislation of such.
But NOBODY wants to be the first to "test" that legislation out in those States. IIRC it was Montana and Texas that passed such worded legislation but I could be mistaken.

Sincerely,
Theis

I thought peeps were buying suppressors under that understanding - built in state, bought in state, stays in state - NFA eats a dick.

 

[deersniper]

few people remember it was the MG collectors who were part of the screwing done with 41P that later turned to 41F.

No it was a group of elitist dbags that did that. Not “the MG collectors”. Pretty sure atf and them were in on that together

 

[pmclaine]

Right, so to me we now have collectors with money and a huge incentive for NFA to exist. Exactly what the Government wanted. Rich people with the toys hanging on walls.

On a side note I had a friend who passed away a couple years ago. I knew he had some wealth but I was surprised by what he had. His daughter found (all legal with paper work) an NEVER fired full Auto Tommy gun from the 1920's. I couldn't believe it, I actually handled it and I couldn't tell it had ever been fired. I ain't really into that stuff, but another friend offered $45,000 and she said NO. She had some expert look at it and he said it had never been fired, he found her a buyer and she took $65,000 for it.

$200 was an insurmountable charge for the common man in 1934.

Talk about elitist.....

 

[vinniedelpino]

I'll tell you one thing. The Mac's/Ingrams in circulation sure as hell wouldn't be selling for $7-10k anymore. Probably more like $400 within a year.

It's fun to dream though, isn't it?

 

[deersniper]

While we are dreaming we could import all those “parts kits” from euro countries that are complete minus the barrel

 

[...]

so there are 2 things effecting the price of Machine guns.....Historical rarity, and artificial rarity.

i think the machine guns that can stand on their own will still command high price tags....items like the Maduce, maxim guns, vickers guns.......they are well made guns, and they dont make them any more.....so even if they do away with the NFA requirement, i dont think theyll plummet in price.

guns like the Mac 10 or UZI are going to drop like a stone......they really arent great guns, and people only want them because they are a machine gun.....

also, "modern pattern" machine guns are also going to plummet......any type of AR or AK variant.....and HK variant. Why pay $15-30K for one when i can buy a new manufacture for <$1K?

registered lightning links or autosears or auto trigger packs, you wont be able to give them away

 

[hlee]

To anyone that thinks that the bottom would just fall out of the machine gun market, remember that there are people that are still commanding/paying a premium for "pre-ban" ar15s...

 

[AManWearingAHat]

I thought peeps were buying suppressors under that understanding - built in state, bought in state, stays in state - NFA eats a dick.

Has that defense been challenged in court yet? Not being sarcastic, genuine interest.

 

[deersniper]

To anyone that thinks that the bottom would just fall out of the machine gun market, remember that there are people that are still commanding/paying a premium for "pre-ban" ar15s...

Due to state level bans though.

 

[johnnycat]

Let's start by repealing the Hughes amendment and go from there

 

[powdahound76]

While we are dreaming we could import all those “parts kits” from euro countries that are complete minus the barrel

And finish them out with those super crappy no good Green Mountain barrels that ShrimpandFooseball said suck.
must be a dang fact.

 

[deersniper]

Let's start by repealing the Hughes amendment and go from there

Good luck

Politicians are secretly adding to the machinegun registry, bypassing 922(o)?!?

Can anyone substantiate this?!? http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=161124&mesg_id=161463 The Hughes Amendment had an interesting side effect. If you read Chapter 18, 922 (o) it is not a ban per say but demands Government approval for...

www.thehighroad.org

 

[pmclaine]

Good luck

Politicians are secretly adding to the machinegun registry, bypassing 922(o)?!?

Can anyone substantiate this?!? http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=118&topic_id=161124&mesg_id=161463 The Hughes Amendment had an interesting side effect. If you read Chapter 18, 922 (o) it is not a ban per say but demands Government approval for...

www.thehighroad.org

Leland Yee?

 

[pmclaine]

Has that defense been challenged in court yet? Not being sarcastic, genuine interest.

Post above says it has in regards to firearms with bad outcomes.

Come to think of it though with all those peeps buying solvent traps and going through the ATF to complete them I see that as a good answer to my and your question.

 

[E. Bryant]

Boy, it should would have been nice to get legislation passed to modify or overturn the NFA when, Idunno, Republicans controlled the WH and both branches of Congress. But considering their inability to get any meaningful pro-2A legislation passed, why are we even kicking around this hypothetical?

Regardless, I'll play. Overturn the Hughes amendment and make full-auto a normal NFA item, and the historical stuff will still command a premium just like another other classic firearm, car, etc. If someone buys a home-built M1919 and swaps out the semi-auto side plate for a FA part, it won't be worth anywhere close to what an "authentic" piece fetches. I imagine that even things like authentic M16s will carry a premium even though it'd be trivial to make a clone. And heck, given the current levels of 80s nostalgia, authentic MAC-10s might even be worth substantial sums.

Basically, what I'm saying is that if it were legal for me to Form 1 some random AR lower and drill the 3rd hole using a 3D-printed jig, it would not automatically undercut the value of pre-86 stuff. Yeah, I'm sure some questionable pieces will drop in value, but a lot of Class III stuff is pretty interesting even if the total number of legal MGs was not artificially limited.

Hi,

LOLOL....but that whole birthplace requirement thing.....

Sincerely,
Theis

Guess you'll just need to stick to your foreign-actor disinformation campaigns.

 

[E. Bryant]

Has that defense been challenged in court yet? Not being sarcastic, genuine interest.

I was pretty sure that this "interstate commerce clause" defense died with the Gonzalez vs. Raich case (that one covered drugs, but there was an adjacent case having to do with a homemade machine gun, the name of which I cannot recall at the moment).

Here is a lengthy article that I believes comes to a different conclusion than my own:

https://scholarship.shu.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1047&context=circuit_review