Just got a 700 5r in today and its advertised as 223/5.56. Noticed label on box says 223. Gun barrel stamped 223. Called Rem, lady checked serial number and said its 223 only. I see this same rifle #85504 advertized to shoot both at alot of dealer sites so WTF. If your thinkin bout one of these to burn up your 5.56 stockpiles ya might do a little more digging or plan on re barreling. Got this to make spare P dog gun so i will add it to the pile, no harm. Could probably get a pull string and test some hot 5.56,s but im gonna stick with dont shoot 5.56 out of a 223 only barrel rule lol. If anyone else had this problem i would be curious to know why these are being advertised like this.
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I think i got duped.
- Thread starter DannyBoy
- Start date
If the purchase invoice says 5.56 but the rifle can't shoot it, you didn't get what you paid for. Send it back.
I wouldn’t be concerned to test fit a 5.56 cartridge in that gun, and if it fit without jamb, fire the cartridge. If it’s like all the other Remington 700’s, it’s got a mile of throat anyway, so the number stamped in the barrel is meaningless with regard to 5.56/.223.
Technically it would have to be a true 5.56 or .223 Wylde to safely shoot 5.56. But I have shot plenty of 5.56 in a modern .223 "only" rifle and it's fine. My only .223 rifle that does not like 5.56 is a Ruger American. That chamber is really tight and only likes virgin .223
If you really need to shoot a lot of 5.56, and it bothers you, then get a Wylde barrel and sell the OEM one...
If you really need to shoot a lot of 5.56, and it bothers you, then get a Wylde barrel and sell the OEM one...
Biggest difference between 5.56 and 223 chambers is freebore which rem has natoriously long free bores... i bet if you measure it's likely beyond even 5.56 spec despite saying 223 on the barrel.
Pressure differences is nothing to worry about in a 700. It's steel not a thin sheet of aluminum.
Pressure differences is nothing to worry about in a 700. It's steel not a thin sheet of aluminum.
Normally i would but have a family prairie doggie trip coming up so needed an extra bang stick and i can press out plenty 223 loads so its not too big deal for me. I was more concerned someone not catching it and run some 5.56 rounds through it. Im sure it will run most just fine but ya never know and hate to see someone having an issue. And also keep someone from getting one thinking they will be able to run the 5.56 factory stuff in it. I would actually buy 5 more myself at that price and give em away as christmas presents. I know it will shoot fine, a new trigger, good glass-rings-base and box mag and poof!! Sweet varmit rifle
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You do know that 5.56 and 223 are completely interchangeable 99.9% of the time right?
According to Remingtons website, it should have a 1/9 twist barrel.
That means that in all probability, they throated it for heavier bullets than the usual 1/12 twist could handle...therefore, it will most probably shoot 5.56 without incident.
The Rem 700 will hold pressures well in excess of 70K psi, so I'm pretty positive you have more than enough margin for safety.
Edit to add:
Think about it, do you think a company would make a gun that was ONLY safe for 223 (especially a bolt action)?...When there is about a 100% chance that someone will put many 5.56 surplus rounds through it during it's life?
According to Remingtons website, it should have a 1/9 twist barrel.
That means that in all probability, they throated it for heavier bullets than the usual 1/12 twist could handle...therefore, it will most probably shoot 5.56 without incident.
The Rem 700 will hold pressures well in excess of 70K psi, so I'm pretty positive you have more than enough margin for safety.
Edit to add:
Think about it, do you think a company would make a gun that was ONLY safe for 223 (especially a bolt action)?...When there is about a 100% chance that someone will put many 5.56 surplus rounds through it during it's life?
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Quit fussing about and shoot it.
It’s a bolt action, it will easily handle the extra pressure that you’ll probably not see.
It’s a bolt action, it will easily handle the extra pressure that you’ll probably not see.
Great point and i will post what i find. I have time to work up the loads for it before vacation so hoping will have some good groups and data to share if anyone should have need.
It may as well be a sales or order error, You should give them a call.
But as @Steel head mentioned, Its a bolt action. You should be testing its limits and having fun. But its your money not mine.
But as @Steel head mentioned, Its a bolt action. You should be testing its limits and having fun. But its your money not mine.
Im not fussing by no means. I raised the point because its being sold as something its not. I reload plenty so i know the drill but someone may not and press up some bad stuff and have an issue. Just getting the info out was all.
I’d be surprised if you could even get a proper 223 chamber these days without having a custom barrel made in it.
Manufacturers know the plethora of 5.56 ammunition and are going to hedge their bets and play it safe with a wylde chamber or long throat.
Don't mean to sidetrack the OP but since it's related, I'll ask.
So you guys are saying that I could 5.56 in my old m70 with a factory 223 9 twist? LOL
Oh boy, I guess this rifle has become even more fun. Wish me luck!!!
So you guys are saying that I could 5.56 in my old m70 with a factory 223 9 twist? LOL
Oh boy, I guess this rifle has become even more fun. Wish me luck!!!
How old?
9 twist seems pretty odd in a real 223.
The original short throat 223 was a slow twist for 50gn and lighter bullets.
Why was it labeled advertised as being able to shoot 5.56? Because morons are allowed to run businesses too! As soon as I read the first sentences of your post I was scratching my head. I’ve never seen a 700 5r or any other 700 listed as being chambered for 5.56. I’ve also never seen someone purchase a bolt action to go through surplus 5.56. Usually they have an AR for that.... Hopefully it’s some good 69gr ammo and not bulk 55/62gr fodder.
The safety aspects have already been addressed by others.
The safety aspects have already been addressed by others.
Don’t shoot it!!!
Buy my barrel in the accessories listing... bahahahahahahaha
I don’t think you’ll have a problem especially given the fact that it’s a 1:9 twist! It will easily stabilize heavy rounds and that means it’s not a 2 to 3 which is generally 55 grains or lighter...
Buy my barrel in the accessories listing... bahahahahahahaha
I don’t think you’ll have a problem especially given the fact that it’s a 1:9 twist! It will easily stabilize heavy rounds and that means it’s not a 2 to 3 which is generally 55 grains or lighter...
I've been able to date it back to 92, 93, or possibly 94 but not entirely sure.
I was just kidding about trying 5.56 ammo through it though as I'm not getting any shooting done these days.
I suppose it would be good to know for future!
Thats exacting why i bought it, because it was advertised as 5.56 bolt gun, and it got my brain in gear, seeing how i have thousands of surplus 5.56 brass and a primer pocket swadger set up already, so lots of quick p dog rounds. I have several AR,s but just for the family to have fun out back. Never put a penny in them and none of them will flip a doggie in the air at 600 yd reliably
But i will do the work to make sure everythings sized correctly and safe to shoot so will be a fun family vacation and thats all that really matters.60 TMK, 65 SGK, 69 TMK should be just perfect for that.Thats exacting why i bought it, because it was advertised as 5.56 bolt gun, and it got my brain in gear, seeing how i have thousands of surplus 5.56 brass and a primer pocket swadger set up already, so lots of quick p dog rounds. I have several AR,s but just for the family to have fun out back. Never put a penny in them and none of them will flip a doggie in the air at 600 yd reliably
55 PSP, HP, Vmax, Zmax or similar would do nicely but not carry to 600 as well as the 65 SGK / 69 TMK.
If you have Hornady COAL gauge in 223 just pick a bullet 60 grains or over and measure the freebore in the throat.
Like has been mentioned several times allready Rem is notorious for having excessive freebore lengths.
You might find that the bullet will damn near fall out of the case mouth before making contact.
That's what I found on the last rem 700 I owned but it shot extremely well regardless.
Like has been mentioned several times allready Rem is notorious for having excessive freebore lengths.
You might find that the bullet will damn near fall out of the case mouth before making contact.
That's what I found on the last rem 700 I owned but it shot extremely well regardless.
I love the 65sgk and even more the 69 smk,s. Thats great recommendation
Rem 700 5R I have is more Wylde like for freebore.
69 TMK would be “best” fit if OPs rifle has same chamber.
Might need to take block out of magazine so able to run a slightly longer OAL than factory mag box supports but that’s easy peasy.
69 TMK would be “best” fit if OPs rifle has same chamber.
Might need to take block out of magazine so able to run a slightly longer OAL than factory mag box supports but that’s easy peasy.
Chamber a 5.56 round. Eject it. If there are markings on the bullet from the rifling, don't shoot it. If there aren't, shoot a few rounds. Check for typical pressure signs and if you don't see any I'd rock and roll.
Ned Christiansen makes a reamer to specifically take a .223 chamber to a 5.56mm while mounted in the rifle . The base reamer is for an AR, but he also has adapters for the R700 action. My AR gunsmith used this on an old .223 bushmaster I had , I was surprised at the amount of chips that came out from that cutting operation. I'd look for a local gunsmith who has one. Think I paid around $35 for that procedure IIRC.
My two most recent examples are short chambered. No “famous long throat”. Of the 4 examples I have had no 69TMK would be a fit.
1.900” BTO With my tools, or 2.224” OAL at -.025 for a 52SMK.
These two shoot amazingly well. All four were great rifles. 69 SMK at 3000 - 3100 is a good prospect.
1.900” BTO With my tools, or 2.224” OAL at -.025 for a 52SMK.
These two shoot amazingly well. All four were great rifles. 69 SMK at 3000 - 3100 is a good prospect.
5.56 vs .223 - What You Know May Be Wrong - LuckyGunner.com Labs
Andrew of Lucky Gunner Labs explores the differences between .223 Remington and 5.56mm NATO ammunition - and the results may surprise you!
www.luckygunner.com
What does that mean? Does the 69TMK touch the lands at 2.224” COAL? And the 52SMK at 2.249” COAL?
I think it is long for the 9 twist, not sure what I saw. I’m probably wrong. I looked at it and decided to keep the SMK 69. They do work just fine to 600.
I have had several VS in 223. 12 twist for sure. These 5R are 9. All mine are/were 24”. Love these because you can shoot 52’s and 69 both.
Oh I believe they made them, but it would be kinda silly to pair that with the original tight and short throat of origin 223’s.
My guess is the throat on those is a bit longer.
Before i get hammered,im talking about my AR,s wont shoot 600yrd. Seen plenty built ones that shoot like lazers
Cool, so we ain't gotta go down that road.
Originally 5.56 came out when most barrels were pencil barrels and steel wasn't what it is today. They also had to do all pressure testing the old fashioned way, ie, without piezo devices. SAAMI specs are a safety margin and based on those pressure testings which also include a safety margin. Army wanted AR and it had to meet a list of criteria but instead of just going .280 to get the performance they increased the pressure instead, hence the 5.56.
Fast forward and today most barrels are designed to at least digest 5.56. For certain the strength of the barrel is sufficient.
Not 100% on chamber geometry between the three, I know someone will chime in on this, can he ream the .223 chamber to Wylde and just be done with it? If nothing but for peace of mind?
Except that once a week someone comes up with nonsensical coal measurements using that tool.
That's an excellent point.Just like using micrometers and calipers it's an aquired skill that takes practice for repeatable accurate results.
Well, the difference between 223 and 5.56 is in the throat length, and pretty much everyone agrees to that. So long as your not jamming the longer COAL 5.56 bullet into the lands of a short throated 223 chamber, there is no problem. Treat the chamber like a flat rate box from the post office. "If it fits, it ships..."
In theory.
In practice there is so much variance in chambers from one manufacturer to the next that all you can say is 556 chambers tend to have longer throats. I think the best thing to do is to take a 62gr green tip, pull the bullet, and find the lands. Then you’ll know for sure.
Being scared to shoot 556 in a R700 with half an inch of steel surrounding the round is comical. At worst you’ll loosen primer pockets prematurely.
In practice there is so much variance in chambers from one manufacturer to the next that all you can say is 556 chambers tend to have longer throats. I think the best thing to do is to take a 62gr green tip, pull the bullet, and find the lands. Then you’ll know for sure.
Being scared to shoot 556 in a R700 with half an inch of steel surrounding the round is comical. At worst you’ll loosen primer pockets prematurely.
A few hammer strikes away from having a 5.56 marked chamber!
So why would you rebarrel? It's cheaper to rent a reamer and gauges and throat it out. Also looking on Remingtons website and it clearly says 223 and nothing about 5.56. Don't think you did your research, as remington doesn't make a 5.56 rifle right now according to their website.
Ream-rebarrel all the same to me, in the end its a different barrel. I simply posted to let people know about the typo as many distributers on line are running the same add for this rifle that it will shoot 223/5.56 and i hate to see this happen as some may consider (including remington) that you could have a problem shooting the 5.56, regardless what census is whether you can or cant, I dont ever like seeing something sold as its not, so yes going to Remington site would have been prudent for research but when i see 10 pickups go by with a chevy emblem i tend to think they have a chevy engine pushing them along. But on the upside my good buddy happens to own a kickass gun shop and were gonna ream that puppy out just for shits and giggles so i will be the first kid on my block the have a 700 5r bolt gun in 223/5.56
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