I'm so fracked!

[ReaperDriver]

I was just at my local funstore and they had a shiny new SCAR-17. After fondling it, it took every once of control I could muster to not pull out my credit card. Had it been FDE instead of black - I would have been a new SCAR owner tonight.

What I DID notice however was that it was INCREDIBLY light! It was about as light as an AR. I held it one hand and a SCAR-16 in the other and could not tell a noticable difference. The same store had an LMT MWS and I would guess the MWS was almost double what the SCAR weighed. I'll have to research to see what the actual weights are, but the SCAR-H was really well balanced and it just felt right. The MWS to me felt incredibly muzzle heavy.

Now, if I could get some good reports on the SCAR's accuracy compared to the MWS and the OBR - I would love to see how it stacks up.

Now if I could just figure out how to hide it from my wife - I'll be all set.

 

[Northland]

Re: I'm so fracked!

Been thinking of getting one too... But I have a work issued carbine that I use way more... but you can never have too much of a good thing!

 

[ReaperDriver]

Re: I'm so fracked!

Yeah, that's really been the main thing holding me back from getting the SCAR-17.... what would be its main purpose? I've gone back and forth on it and I keep settling on the fact that if I DID get a .308 or similar gas gun - I would probably use it in the precision role rather than as a CQB or "battle rifle". I mean let's be honest here.... it would be fun to blast away with it, but would I really use it much unless I could shoot it at longer ranges with a fair degree of precision? Probably not. And I don't know if the SCAR would approach the accuracy of an OBR or maybe an MWS with a SS barrel. I doubt it, but I don't know. Mmmmm, I wonder how well some good reloads would shoot in the SCAR???

Its actually why I've been semi-leaning toward the SCAR-16 over the 17, because I could actually see me shooting it more than the .308 SCAR. Cheaper ammo, more availability for mags, etc.

Oh, and I found some weights on the SCAR-H and MWS. Assuming they are correct, one source says the SCAR is 7.6-8.3 lbs depending on barrel length and the MWS is about 13 lbs. So I was right, its almost double the weight of the SCAR.

 

[jwsnydes]

Re: I'm so fracked!

This happened to me with my Scar-16. I went in, it was there. I went across the street to the bank and came back with cash. I love it. I would assume the 17 is equally lovable.

 

[dmg308]

Re: I'm so fracked!

The LMT is 9.7 lbs.

 

[sobrbiker883]

Re: I'm so fracked!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ReaperDriver</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Now if I could just figure out how to hide it from my wife - I'll be all set.

</div></div>

Order it on a new card she doesn't know you have, then have it shipped to my FFL and transferred to me. Just trying to help a brother out!

In all seriousness, I think I'm down with you-the purpose should pick the tool, and honestly I don't have a need for a 308 cqb type weapon. If I gotta bugout, I'd prefer lighter ammo and rifle. For precision there are better choices.....

 

[desertHK]

Re: I'm so fracked!

Agree that the 308 CQB is a bit overkill. However, it definitely has an advantage if you have the same ammo as your precision rifle. Also, 308 will certainly be more bountiful than any other exotic cartridges.

That's why I have my POF 308.LOL.

 

[battle-scarred]

Re: I'm so fracked!

The best feature of the scar 17 is the light weight imo, and i really like the iron sights when looking through them. The trigger sucks on the other hand. I have seen some reviews claiming decent accuracy, and im sure accuracy could be improved with a better trigger.

 

[Starvin]

Re: I'm so fracked!

The SCAR-17 is a very impressive rifle and I love the weight (a pound and a half less than the LMT) but I can't get over the stubby little handguard and bolt-on rail extentions aren't going to cut it for me.

If FN releases the MK-20 model I'll definately give it a second look.

 

[battle-scarred]

Re: I'm so fracked!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Starvin</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The SCAR-17 is a very impressive rifle and I love the weight (a pound and a half less than the LMT) but I can't get over the stubby little handguard and bolt-on rail extentions aren't going to cut it for me.

If FN releases the MK-20 model I'll definately give it a second look. </div></div>

The damn price tag is impressive as well.

 

[Bruiser_Joe]

Re: I'm so fracked!

The SCARH is a great gun, i do not like how short the handguard is either BUT with the 13.5" barrel its awesome and my prefered carry rifle at the moment. accuracy is good, i'm still waiting on the SSR"s to come out so i can really see what they are giving us.

 

[1stIDvet]

Re: I'm so fracked!

This is a good review from someone on M4Carbine.net. He uses a couple different loads.

http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?p=804235

 

[ReaperDriver]

Re: I'm so fracked!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dmg308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The LMT is 9.7 lbs. </div></div>

Sorry, have to call BS on this. I picked it up and NO WAY it weighed under 10 lbs. Even LMT's own website has an article printed that lists the empty weight as 13.2 lbs.

Here: http://www.lewismachine.net/media/magazines/TW-LMT.pdf 3rd page under the pic with the tripod

Do you have a cite for 9.7lbs because the LMT felt like a brick compared to the SCAR?

 

[dmg308]

Re: I'm so fracked!

You can call BS all you want.I have one with a MK46x an American defense mount a DD 1 oclock mount and a T1.It weighs 12.8 lbs complete.

I was a couple tenths off.

http://www.defensereview.com/lmt-308-mod...r-riflecarbine/

 

[ReaperDriver]

Re: I'm so fracked!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dmg308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You can call BS all you want.I have one with a MK46x an American defense mount a DD 1 oclock mount and a T1.It weighs 12.8 lbs complete.

I was a couple tenths off.

http://www.defensereview.com/lmt-308-mod...r-riflecarbine/ </div></div>

OK, fair enough. I sure felt heavier than that, though.

I do notice the MRP platform with the monolithic rail really does add weight. I have an LMT Defender 2K with DD omega rails and a Sopmod... it is REALLY light compared to my MRP CQB piston. Noticeably so.

 

[trident1982]

Re: I'm so fracked!

You can buy the SCAR 17 and own one single gun or buy the MWS and open Pandora's box and have numerous guns running multiple calibers ranging from high volume CL barrels to some of the most accurate barrels made in the Rock SS models.

The MWS in its factory config. is a shade under 10lbs. Not exactly double

 

[ReaperDriver]

Re: I'm so fracked!

Mmmm, maybe I'll just go nutz and buy the SCAR 16 for a CQB rifle AND the LMT for a longer range precision gas gun. But an extra $700 bones for a SS barrel is putting it into OBR territory.

I DO like the interchangable barrel system in the LMT tho... I'm contemplating getting a 6.8 SPC for my MRP CQB piston gun. Or maybe the 12" SBR piston for my 5.56mm. So many choices.....

 

[Rovieairto]

Re: I'm so fracked!

Here is a descent video of it being fired offhand.

FN SCAR-H (Heavy) being fired
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FW6Bzud2W1o&feature=related

It does seem to have some recoil issues.
The man's technique isn't helping things either.

I think that this rifle has some military applications.
Would be a good choice if vehicles may need to be engaged like at a checkpoint etc.
As a civilian "toy" it would probably spend a lot of time in my safe though.
Should be popular with the "shoot for effect" crowd.

 

[Lowlight]

Re: I'm so fracked!

We had 2 SCARs in the class this last week and the accuracy was terrible, it could not hang with the Mk11 or Mk12 in terms of accuracy. They were brand new for the group and they were very disappointed in the accuracy.

it was barely a 2MOA rifle with M118LR

 

[Bruiser_Joe]

Re: I'm so fracked!

really LL, that bad?

 

[bmt]

Re: I'm so fracked!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

it was barely a 2MOA rifle with M118LR </div></div>

Thanks!

Another Credit Card Catastrophe averted . . . . . . .

BMT

 

[JerkeeJoe]

Re: I'm so fracked!

Reaper Driver: The MWS I have handled have felt great. I actually almost picked one up a few weeks ago, but I talked myself out of it. If i didn't have my OBR that I got for the introductory price and if the OBR wasn't such a great rifle, I'd have sprung for the MWS.

I don't think you can go wrong with it even with the extra couple pounds - Just think, semi auto .260 at 1500...

 

[Lowlight]

Re: I'm so fracked!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BigJoe</div><div class="ubbcode-body">really LL, that bad?</div></div>

Yes, in fact the one with the longer barrel experienced, not only a drop in accuracy with use, but also a drop in POI. The 6 holes in the AAC can make it really loud as well it throws a flame out each... not cool at all.

I dont' think they will use more of them... the Mk17 was not good.

 

[Bruiser_Joe]

Re: I'm so fracked!

hmmm.. strange. yeah i'm not a fan of the can either

 

[Mo_Zam_Beek]

Re: I'm so fracked!

<span style="font-weight: bold">The 6 holes in the AAC can make it really loud as well it throws a flame out each... not cool at all.</span>


The much touted (by AAC) can that was designed for the SCAR....


Color me surprised (not).



Good luck

 

[Lowlight]

Re: I'm so fracked!

from what I understand AAC didn't cut the holes, FN did... ?

 

[Mo_Zam_Beek]

Re: I'm so fracked!

I'm watching Crazy Heart right now.

You're probably right.


Good luck

 

[MidwestPX]

Re: I'm so fracked!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ReaperDriver</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dmg308</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The LMT is 9.7 lbs. </div></div>

Sorry, have to call BS on this. I picked it up and NO WAY it weighed under 10 lbs. Even LMT's own website has an article printed that lists the empty weight as 13.2 lbs.

Here: http://www.lewismachine.net/media/magazines/TW-LMT.pdf 3rd page under the pic with the tripod

Do you have a cite for 9.7lbs because the LMT felt like a brick compared to the SCAR? </div></div>

Mine with a TR24 in an ADM Scout mount, ACS stock and MIAD weighs 11 lbs 4 oz. according to my shipping scale which is accurate to within 0.2 oz.

 

[shane45]

Re: I'm so fracked!

Mine with an empty mag and an Elcan Specter DR is coming in at 12 on the nose.

 

[edward r homeyer]

Re: I'm so fracked!

The scar 17 was not even close to the accuracy of an OBR. I couldn't get under 1.25 MOA with 118LR. The reciprocating bolt get knocked out of battery when rubbed against your kit or vehicle. Also the reciprocating bolt hinders many alternate firing positions such as shooting in and around vehicles, side prone, and barricades to name a few. The trigger is horrible. And there aren't alot of aftermarket parts for it. The can for it isn't that great either.

 

[Rovieairto]

Re: I'm so fracked!

Yeah, but it looks cool and has a piston!

I'm not surprised at all about the wandering POI.
2 moa with M118-LR is better than I would have guessed.
Vertical stringing when heated is almost a certainty with this rifle, along with a large change in POI with a change in projectile weight.

I'd still like one because it's a gun.
For what it costs, one could get all sorts of more practical/entertaining gear IMO.

 

[Starvin]

Re: I'm so fracked!

I'm not sure how much to blame the wandering POI on the SCAR itself.

I remember some time back a member (his name was shawn but I don't remember his exact screen name) was using an AAC on his precision setup and he had the same complaint about wandering zero as the can heated up. IIRC the responce from AAC was that it was the nature of the beast.

I loath to bring this up because I know AAC fans can be rather... blindly devoted but it's what I thought of immedietly when this was mentioned.

 

[banks74]

Re: I'm so fracked!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Lowlight</div><div class="ubbcode-body">We had 2 SCARs in the class this last week and the accuracy was terrible, it could not hang with the Mk11 or Mk12 in terms of accuracy. They were brand new for the group and they were very disappointed in the accuracy.

it was barely a 2MOA rifle with M118LR </div></div>

Thats a bummer to hear. I picked one up last week hoping it would shoot really well.

Pro's for me so far,
I really like how light it is, recoil is surprising soft, ergonomics fit me well, and iron sights not too bad. Although they did come in no way shape or form zeroed.

Con's,
Triggers are Terrible! Miles of creep and the reset sucks. I have an AK with a better trigger (Seriously). Lack of anything out there for it. Extra mags are currently non existent.

Gonna throw an SN-3 on it and see how it does accuracy wise, although now after reading Lowlight's post, I have bleak optimism in that area.

 

[VKC]

Re: I'm so fracked!

I would not get a SCAR-17 for precision semi-auto. Trigger is mushy, and not crisp.

For short barrel CQC rifle, I would not pick 308win, but rather something like 7.62x39. I think this article explains it well. http://demigodllc.com/articles/7.62x39-improving-the-military-standard/

MWS and OBR have better accuracy than SCAR-17. LaRue has a less than 1 MOA 5-shot group claimed accuracy on their website.

Better yet, get a POF or LWRC REPR if looking for precision semi-auto.

If you want modular platform to switch calibers and barrel length, than consider Robinson XCR, but be aware that accuracy will suffer and there is point of aim shift with barrel changes.

Sounds like you want a "do everything rifle" in multiple calibers, but as far as I'm aware, there isn't one. I would decide what factors are most important to you and what is you intended use for rifle...then go from there. Every rifle or system has plus and minuses, compromises and strengths depending on intended use.