I'm looking at the IRay USA RL25 to get into night hunting under 150 yards.
Am I correct in thinking this is a good deal? any reviews?
Thanks!
Am I correct in thinking this is a good deal? any reviews?
Thanks!
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Night Vision IRay USA Micro RL25
- Thread starter BLASERR8POLO
- Start date
I recently purchased one. I haven't shot with it yet but have used it as a handheld both in my neighborhood and in the woods scanning different animals at night. So far I think it is a good unit.
I'm no expert and only have my Pulsar Helion 2 XP50 to compare it to so these are simply my initial thoughts/opinions with a few weeks of use
Likes: I like the different crosshairs and the ability to change the brightness and color of the crosshairs
I really like the size. Walking around with it was very comfortable. So easy to stick it in my pocket. Very convenient.
I like that it uses 18650 batteries
Out in the open I was able to easily locate animals at night in various conditions.
I bought the ADM mount and plate because others recommended them above the standard mount that comes with it. They are nice but were not cheap.
Cons:
I dislike that it does not maintain my color selection setting. I always have to go in and change to red hot. I hope IRAY USA can update that quickly with the firmware or I can figure out where I am being stupid and get it to save my setting.
It struggled in the woods identifying things compared to the Pulsar. I know it probably isn't a fair comparison with different sensor sensitivities/resolutions/etc... but the Iray would not pick up things at first that the pulsar did easily. I could eventually detect the animal but had to continuously change all the settings to tweak them just right. I don't know if the pulsar algorithms are better or what, but the pulsar needed no tweaking. I was able to spot deer, possums, porcupines, and turkeys with the pulsar and still see the trees and background images more clearly. I don't know how to describe it other than to say the Iray "flared" a bunch. It worked and I could eventually spot a lot of the same animals, just not with the same ease of use. I had to constantly adjust settings which made it a hassle.
If you are out in the open and scanning then I think the RL25 works really well. If you are going into any wooded areas you will need to be more patient with the RL25. I didn't save any images of the issue I was facing in the woods because I was just trying to get it to work but the tree/rabbit image kind of shows what I am talking about with the "flaring" (my word simply b/c I lack another descriptor at this time.) You can see the rabbit and you can see the tree is all lit up. Now imagine you are in the woods and all the trees are lit up. That was making it difficult at times to find the rabbit in all the trees if that makes sense. When I turned down the sensitivity I couldn't see the rabbit. Just had to make constant tweaks where the pulsar didn't.
Here are some sample images all using it as a hand held:
Neighborhood cat roughly 20yds away at the various zoom levels of the device
Rabbit roughly 95 yards away
Possum roughly 55 yards away
I'm no expert and only have my Pulsar Helion 2 XP50 to compare it to so these are simply my initial thoughts/opinions with a few weeks of use
Likes: I like the different crosshairs and the ability to change the brightness and color of the crosshairs
I really like the size. Walking around with it was very comfortable. So easy to stick it in my pocket. Very convenient.
I like that it uses 18650 batteries
Out in the open I was able to easily locate animals at night in various conditions.
I bought the ADM mount and plate because others recommended them above the standard mount that comes with it. They are nice but were not cheap.
Cons:
I dislike that it does not maintain my color selection setting. I always have to go in and change to red hot. I hope IRAY USA can update that quickly with the firmware or I can figure out where I am being stupid and get it to save my setting.
It struggled in the woods identifying things compared to the Pulsar. I know it probably isn't a fair comparison with different sensor sensitivities/resolutions/etc... but the Iray would not pick up things at first that the pulsar did easily. I could eventually detect the animal but had to continuously change all the settings to tweak them just right. I don't know if the pulsar algorithms are better or what, but the pulsar needed no tweaking. I was able to spot deer, possums, porcupines, and turkeys with the pulsar and still see the trees and background images more clearly. I don't know how to describe it other than to say the Iray "flared" a bunch. It worked and I could eventually spot a lot of the same animals, just not with the same ease of use. I had to constantly adjust settings which made it a hassle.
If you are out in the open and scanning then I think the RL25 works really well. If you are going into any wooded areas you will need to be more patient with the RL25. I didn't save any images of the issue I was facing in the woods because I was just trying to get it to work but the tree/rabbit image kind of shows what I am talking about with the "flaring" (my word simply b/c I lack another descriptor at this time.) You can see the rabbit and you can see the tree is all lit up. Now imagine you are in the woods and all the trees are lit up. That was making it difficult at times to find the rabbit in all the trees if that makes sense. When I turned down the sensitivity I couldn't see the rabbit. Just had to make constant tweaks where the pulsar didn't.
Here are some sample images all using it as a hand held:
Neighborhood cat roughly 20yds away at the various zoom levels of the device
Rabbit roughly 95 yards away
Possum roughly 55 yards away
Attachments
I am very frustrated with the RL25 at this point as a weapons sight. I have spent hours and hours with it and wasted hundreds of dollars in ammo and it will not hold zero. I've tried to take the mount issue out of the equation by leaving it on the rail. I have tried multiple guns. I've used both the standard mount that iray sent and the upgraded iRAY / ADM MQD Mount for RICO MICRO. I get it zeroed and it seems to shoot ok for a bit. I take the battery out. Wait some time, put the battery back in and it shoots everywhere. The settings (windage/elevation) corrections are held by the unit so it isn't like they are being wiped out with the removal of the battery. I had my son put it on one of his guns and he experienced the same frustrations. I've tried it on a 6.5CM and then on some softer shooting 22s. Same issue with every configuration.
Anyone else have issues with the RL25 or the RH25 holding zero?
I don't know what to do other than to contact IRAY USA.
Anyone else have issues with the RL25 or the RH25 holding zero?
I don't know what to do other than to contact IRAY USA.
Contacted IRAY USA. They were quick to respond initially. Shipped it back to them and they said they will take a look at the scope and repair the issue.
I really like the size, 18650 battery, and the weight of the unit. I hope they can get me a unit that holds zero. If future firmware updates can improve the "flaring" that would be great too.
I really like the size, 18650 battery, and the weight of the unit. I hope they can get me a unit that holds zero. If future firmware updates can improve the "flaring" that would be great too.
I have found in the field that some of the firmware setups in chinese made thermals SAY they kept your zero offsets....and they didn't. The numbers are there but the actual offset isn't. I have not seen this with the RH25 but have seen it with other brands.
The best way to check is to clamp the rifle solidly in a rest and leave it there and power the unit on/off and see if the sight picture moves.
The best way to check is to clamp the rifle solidly in a rest and leave it there and power the unit on/off and see if the sight picture moves.
IRAYUSA are true to their word about the 5 day warranty! I don't know if they are sending a new unit or if they repaired mine but I do have a UPS number for a package coming back to me within the guaranteed turnaround time. A+ for IRAY USA's customer service at this point.
New unit is a little better but still exhibits similar behavior as the first one I had when using it as a weapon sight. I don't know how anyone can use the RL25 at any distance reliably. I've been testing it at 50 yards to start with 22lr and the results are not good on two different rifles.
Right now I am at the point where I regret spending $3K on this. It struggles holding zero. Performance in anything other than ideal conditions is poor. When conditions are good the image looks good if you are in the wide open. If you have anything near you(wooded area, tree nearby) the algorithm or whatever determines what to display struggles.
I am very disappointed.
Right now I am at the point where I regret spending $3K on this. It struggles holding zero. Performance in anything other than ideal conditions is poor. When conditions are good the image looks good if you are in the wide open. If you have anything near you(wooded area, tree nearby) the algorithm or whatever determines what to display struggles.
I am very disappointed.
I've tried multiple rifles, multiple calibers, multiple shooters, multiple targets, and multiple mounts and this thing will simply not hold zero. I am so frustrated I have to send this back again but I have no other options. It isn't a zero issue with mounting and remounting. It is a zero issue when it is mounted and not turned off or taken off. I can shoot a 3 shot group and have impacts where I am generally aiming and then 30 seconds later later I have a shot 4 inches wide left and then the next 4 inches wide right or 4 inches down. I have tried a soft nuc before each shot and a hard nuc with each shot and there is no difference with that routine.
I've tried going with 22lr rifles to 50 yds and the results are everywhere. I popped up my iron backup sights and had tight groups so the rifles are not the issue. I put various scopes on the rifles and they shoot tight groups.
I know the weapons sight is not a glass scope, but is an 8 inch spread up/down/left right the best I can expect at 50 yards with 22lr on the RL25? I can't hit a squirrel with groups like that. What is a reasonable expectation with a thermal because this thing is very frustrating?
I've tried going with 22lr rifles to 50 yds and the results are everywhere. I popped up my iron backup sights and had tight groups so the rifles are not the issue. I put various scopes on the rifles and they shoot tight groups.
I know the weapons sight is not a glass scope, but is an 8 inch spread up/down/left right the best I can expect at 50 yards with 22lr on the RL25? I can't hit a squirrel with groups like that. What is a reasonable expectation with a thermal because this thing is very frustrating?
Finally got to test the RL25 as a clip on in front of a scope per a post by EchoFiveIndia (
https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/goto/post?id=10509477) that indicated a friend used it as such despite IRAY indicating it was not possible.
I stuck it on a Ruger M&P 15-22 in front of a Nikon P-22 rimfire scope and it held zero at 50 yards. As my earlier posts indicate, I've been extremely frustrated with the RL25 as a weapon sight. It simply would not hold zero with the built-in reticle.
My findings....
The good: I was able to zoom the unit fully and adjust my scope to get the unit to hold zero. I peppered a "hot hands" target out at 50 yards so I was very happy. I took the unit off, put it back on, and it held the same zero. I took the batteries out, waited an hour, and put them back in and it held zero. I had another shooter do the same thing and the RL25 with a different scope on a different rifle held zero as a clip-on. This confirms to me that the initial problem was not with the mounts or the rifles or the shooters but with the internal IRAY reticle software. I hope they have a future fix.
I found the target with everything at base mag, then hit the RL25 zoom button twice, fired, and hit the target. It works!!! Takes time but I got quicker with it as I practiced with the workaround.
The bad: It required a lot of Nikon scope adjustment. Hit the limits of the scope's elevation and had to use the max zoom which pixelated things badly.
Adjusting zoom changes POI
If you adjust the focus the POI changes too so I had to just focus on one distance and get that solid first and not move it. That stinks but usable.
The zero of the Nikon scope with the thermal removed is way off. I can live with it as I planned to use the Ruger to shoot at night anyway.
Everything is not zeroed at base magnification or the first zoom click but I probably could have tried to zoom the Nikon reticle at either of those points with ring adjustments and more work.
I cannot see the menus at the bottom so have to go by button memory. I just left it at the defaults. I can see the shutdown image when I long press the shutdown button so that is good
Field of view is really bad at that zoomed level so better hit your target on the first shot if it moves.
I ran out of time but walked away with mixed feelings. Relieved I can use it but frustrated that it is a makeshift work-around. I would have gone with a dedicated scope if I knew the RL25 wouldn't hold zero as a weapon sight alone. I will test it more in the weeks ahead.
I am also frustrated that nobody from Iray has responded to my repeated requests for help. I emailed the person who initially was very responsive and helped with the first return and received no response. I asked for help with a software fix or any suggestions and got ghosted. I also filled out the contact us form and Iray never responded. So I give IRAY USA an A+ for customer service on the first return and then very poor customer service on the second inquiry despite including all the initial RMA information and multiple attempts to contact them.
I know it isn't designed to be a clip-on but I was desperate for a solution because I purchased it to be a lightweight weapon sight. Many thanks to EchoFiveIndia for passing on that info!!!
https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/goto/post?id=10509477) that indicated a friend used it as such despite IRAY indicating it was not possible.
I stuck it on a Ruger M&P 15-22 in front of a Nikon P-22 rimfire scope and it held zero at 50 yards. As my earlier posts indicate, I've been extremely frustrated with the RL25 as a weapon sight. It simply would not hold zero with the built-in reticle.
My findings....
The good: I was able to zoom the unit fully and adjust my scope to get the unit to hold zero. I peppered a "hot hands" target out at 50 yards so I was very happy. I took the unit off, put it back on, and it held the same zero. I took the batteries out, waited an hour, and put them back in and it held zero. I had another shooter do the same thing and the RL25 with a different scope on a different rifle held zero as a clip-on. This confirms to me that the initial problem was not with the mounts or the rifles or the shooters but with the internal IRAY reticle software. I hope they have a future fix.
I found the target with everything at base mag, then hit the RL25 zoom button twice, fired, and hit the target. It works!!! Takes time but I got quicker with it as I practiced with the workaround.
The bad: It required a lot of Nikon scope adjustment. Hit the limits of the scope's elevation and had to use the max zoom which pixelated things badly.
Adjusting zoom changes POI
If you adjust the focus the POI changes too so I had to just focus on one distance and get that solid first and not move it. That stinks but usable.
The zero of the Nikon scope with the thermal removed is way off. I can live with it as I planned to use the Ruger to shoot at night anyway.
Everything is not zeroed at base magnification or the first zoom click but I probably could have tried to zoom the Nikon reticle at either of those points with ring adjustments and more work.
I cannot see the menus at the bottom so have to go by button memory. I just left it at the defaults. I can see the shutdown image when I long press the shutdown button so that is good
Field of view is really bad at that zoomed level so better hit your target on the first shot if it moves.
I ran out of time but walked away with mixed feelings. Relieved I can use it but frustrated that it is a makeshift work-around. I would have gone with a dedicated scope if I knew the RL25 wouldn't hold zero as a weapon sight alone. I will test it more in the weeks ahead.
I am also frustrated that nobody from Iray has responded to my repeated requests for help. I emailed the person who initially was very responsive and helped with the first return and received no response. I asked for help with a software fix or any suggestions and got ghosted. I also filled out the contact us form and Iray never responded. So I give IRAY USA an A+ for customer service on the first return and then very poor customer service on the second inquiry despite including all the initial RMA information and multiple attempts to contact them.
I know it isn't designed to be a clip-on but I was desperate for a solution because I purchased it to be a lightweight weapon sight. Many thanks to EchoFiveIndia for passing on that info!!!
