Night Vision J-FB Fusion Binocular Review

[zinny]

These Fusion binoculars have been mentioned last year and news/rumors have been in circulation since. I am excited to say Visir Inc. is now offering The J-FB (Jerry- Fusion Binoculars) for sale; the first commercially available Fusion binocular system.

LET THE RECORD SHOW, I GOT SOMETHING FIRST BEFORE HORTA. Man that felt nice to announce , now on to the review haha:

Housing came in a super nice box, not the plain cardboard anonomous like all others.

Custom cut foam, with textured top liner, for your pleasure.....Did I menttion nicest packaging I've seen from any NV related products ever (outside of RPNVGs, I've used/built them all). Oh and you get a nice soft case too.

Everything that comes in the box.

Glamor Shots of the Unit.

Due to the physical constraints with cramming thermal integration into a I2 unit, I was concerned with the length of the unit. Wearing something that feels like pinnocio's nose x2 would certainly feel awkward and probably not good for the neck.

The first thing you notice about the unit is it's the size and weight, it comes in under 21oz (with L3 tubes) and is actually shorter than a PVS-14; I was impressed. Compared side by side to a PVS-14 and PVS-23 (F5050)

Getting into the nuts of it, went out with family last night during the new moon. So there was no illumination except starlight. Side by side comparison of the J-FB and the PVS-14. Can you tell which is which?

The picture with pup was the J-FB. Thru the tube of the J-FB, thermal overlay pod. I got that first time looking thru NV "wow" feeling all over again the first time I look thru the J-FB. Warm fuzzies and tight pants all over again. Full thermal and outline modes

Video of pup and man at approximately 180yrds, outline mode.


Video Full thermal mode, at approximately 180yrds.


Wheres waldo?

Answers

The money shot, Raid-xe civ with illuminator opened up fully, treeline around 200 yrds.

Having used them for the last couple of weeks, I REALLY like them and think they are spectacular. Alot of small details went into this one that made if feel ever so slightly more like a premium product. The battery pack cable, as can be seen, is coiled so its self-retracting. The cable also came with caps that were tethered on to them, not seen as I removed them. A very nice presentation box and soft case. The unit has a bluetooth remote with velcro backing so you can attach it to anywhere. You can adjust the thermal overlay settings and NUC the sensor without having to constantly fiddle infont of your face; very convenient.

Now on to points I found a bit lacking. The image produced by the J-FB is competitive, as can be seen from the comparison photo; but the glass is definetly the main drawback. The glass was designed to make the unit extremely compact. But this also leads to a tighter eyebox and shorter eye relief. In order for me to observe the full 40 degree FOV of the tube, I set the bino about 1/2" away from my eyes. You still have a comfortable amount of peripheral fov, but its definetly not optimal. In highlight environments, objects around the edge of the FOV will exhibit what appears similar to chromatic aberation. This appears only in very high light, surburban-urban, situations and I wasnt able to pick up this affect properly on the camera. So its defiently not something thats glaring, but figured worth mentioning. Last there seems to be some artifacts/issues with the thermal overlay. Did you catch them within the videos? I knew what they were and could barely catch them, so more likely than not you didnt catch them lol. I've been told this was a software issue, and Infiray is sending me an update as we speak. So as long as Infiray's software fix works, I consider this a non issue and will edit this part of the review.

Despite the drawbacks listed, the unit works period. The fact that its not vaporware, will set you back well under 20k depending on tubes, and its performance; its pretty fantastic.

 

[TheHorta]

 

[Conqueror]

What we need is a head-to-head with an ECOTI.

 

[TheHorta]

What we need is a head-to-head with an ECOTI.

I’ve run the COTI, eCOTI, Jerry CE5, Jerry-F monocular, PSQ-20 (A and B), PSQ-36, and the latest ENVG-III.

Every integrated true fusion NOD beats the stuffing outta the COTI/eCOTI/CE5 slapped onto NV. My PVS-31A + O1 eCOTI isn’t even as good as my Jerry-F monocular.

COTIs are a compromise. Not bad, but not good either.

 

[zinny]

I'm too much of a poor to make thay happen lol. I'm sure horta can make thay work.

 

[TheHorta]

I assume the FB is virtually identical to the F (mono) but in bino form. Same eye relief issue on the monocular as well. Has to literally be touching your face to see the entire image circle. I have a >2800 FOM L3 tube in mind as well, so no gain control that you do get if you use Photonis toobs.

 

[zinny]

Can confirm, gain control only works on the 3 pin type tubes. My set with l3 tubes doesn't have it either. Yep glass is the least desirable part of the package.

Though looking at nick from therfirearmblogs post of the mono, hardware wise the binos look a bit different, perhaps updated. But yeah glass seems to be one area where they havent made an improvement.

 

[WhereNow&How]

COTIs are a compromise. Not bad, but not good either.

Maybe so, maybe not. Depends on how you look at it.

If you want a system that is not all tied together, such that if you have a device failure you lose the whole system, maybe the COTI iterations slapped on NV toobs are a better choice.

Two bridged PVS 14's with there own independent power systems with a clip on COTI with its own power system is about as redundant and boolit proof that you don't have a complete capability failure as it gets.

The biggest downside to that system is weight. Plus you can service and repair that system a lot easier & quicker than the fancy-complicated all in one devices.

Hecque, you can buy 2 Pas 29's (1 for a spare-redundancy) and 2 PVS 14's for substantially less dollars and have a system that you could for sure say "will not leave you blind at night." unless you are the unluckiest of the unlucky.

So in my mind the Pas 29 Clip On is definitely not a compromise. It is a bonus.

 

[Conqueror]

Yeah I’m with @WhereNow&How in many respects. These days you can run high-spec binos and an ECOTI for about 16-18oz depending on housing and the FOV (round) doesn’t seem THAT different from the FOV (rectangle) on these, and maybe the thermal overlay is better with the ECOTI than with the chinesium?

 

[WhereNow&How]

and maybe the thermal overlay is better with the ECOTI than with the chinesium?

For me the overlay is best when it is only in Outline Mode and only "pops" on living critters.

Point being that I like my NV- Thermal Fusion setup to only "pop" when there is something alive out there. The rest of the time I want NV only without any distractions.

A lot of these systems have thermal "screaming" into your NV scene and constantly cluttering it up which leads to complacency of what a thermal signature is and means.

The tried and proven thing about a Pas 29 COTI is that it is easy and simple to adjust its gain down or up depending on emissivity conditions such that the only time a Outline Signature "pops" is pretty much only on a live creature. Not sure a lot of these other new systems really have that capability yet nor understand its real importance.

 

[TheHorta]

I’m not saying COTIs are bad, but they are a compromise — make no mistake. NO eCOTI combination performs as well as a true fusion device. Also, the COTI system is inherently far more fragile than a true fusion device — just ask the Marines who foolishly bought 3,000 Elbit binos + Safran eCOTI units. Over 50% of them FAILED within the first 90 days of issue, with most of the failures happening during training.

Again, COTI is good, for a compromise, but my worst fusion (Jerry-F) beats my best COTI setup (31A + Optics1 eCOTI) hands down.

Also, the eCOTI crushes the PAS-29A COTI in every way, except for the control interface. But Uncle Sugar specifically requested Safran REMOVE the control wheel on the original COTI because it was too easy to accidentally bump it and change settings. So while the pushbuttons prevent that, it also makes it a pain to adjust.

 

[WhereNow&How]

just ask the Marines who foolishly bought 3,000 Elbit binos + Safran eCOTI units. Over 50% of them FAILED within the first 90 days of issue, with most of the failures happening during training.

What was the nature of the failures.

 

[TheHorta]

What was the nature of the failures.

Vast majority were breaking when in use or stowed. It was an idiotic purchase and they even admitted it — but they’re Marines, so…

 

[WhereNow&How]

What was breaking.

 

[TheHorta]

What was breaking.

They had a huge number of eCOTIs actually break in half. They asked O1 to redesign a better breakaway mount, as both the COTI and binos were breaking but the mount would survive. Lol.

Someone here has some photos of destroyed COTIs.

 

[WhereNow&How]

Wow, that is interesting. Glad I never bought into the eCOTI's. There controls suck anyway vs the older Pas 29 COTI.

The older PAS 29 COTI does exactly what I want, when I want it and have not had any go down or break so have not had a need to look elsewhere.

Strictly Offensive & Cory T's external plug and cable system was the final much needed creme - de- la - creme for that system IMHO.

 

[Conqueror]

Horta can you expand on what you mean by “outperforms?” I haven’t used a modern fusion system but to my eyes on video and photo, there’s not a whole lot to distinguish the image on a well-adjusted ecoti from a Jerry-F. The alignment, thermal performance, and image quality look much the same.

 

[TheHorta]

Horta can you expand on what you mean by “outperforms?” I haven’t used a modern fusion system but to my eyes on video and photo, there’s not a whole lot to distinguish the image on a well-adjusted ecoti from a Jerry-F. The alignment, thermal performance, and image quality look much the same.

There’s a noticeable difference detecting and displaying critters at longer ranges. It’s very difficult to detect, or at least distinguish, things like yotes, etc beyond 200-300 yards with the COTIs (all versions — and I have them all). They’re fine for close-up stuff, and they’re designed for infantry and CQB types who generally fight things at short distances.

The dedicated thermal on the fusion units performs like any 640px dedicated thermal. It’s MUCH better at detecting and distinguishing things like yotes at longer ranges. Also, the ability to quickly swap to 100% thermal — something you can NOT do with a COTI — is a big advantage. You’re not depending upon a projector pumping an image through your tube. Another big benefit is tube burn. If you use a COTI enough it is well-documented that they can dramatically reduce tube life.

I don’t mean to sound all down on the COTI, but just saying it absolutely is a real compromise. Everything is going fusion now, so the COTI’s days are numbered, which is as it should be. Technology improves, and fusion NODs are a beneficiary of those improvements.

 

[WhereNow&How]

There is a huge operational disadvantage to the configuration of the thermal pod being mounted on the right side if you are a right handed shooter, unless it also transmits the thermal image over to the left side pod which I do not think it does.

The operational disadvantage for a right handed shooter is that you usually roll up your right pod if you are running a Thermal Weapon Sight. So when you do that, you are effectively losing thermal fusion in your NV.

It is best for a right handed shooter to run a COTI on the left pod such that when you roll up the right side to either go down on Thermal or use White Light and Day Optic you still are looking at NV/Thermal Fusion through your left eye which is very very important in some situations.

 

[WhereNow&How]

@zinny when you roll up the right pod does the thermal image transmit to the left NV pod?

 

[ARShooter91]

The Pas29 sucks. No experience with the Ecoti or jerry c5 but from what I hear it's a good improvement. I went dual band and imo it's a 1000 times better than a Pas29.

 

[TheHorta]

@zinny when you roll up the right pod does the thermal image transmit to the left NV pod?

No.

 

[WhereNow&How]

It’s very difficult to detect, or at least distinguish, things like yotes, etc beyond 200-300 yards with the COTIs (all versions — and I have them all). They’re fine for close-up stuff, and they’re designed for infantry and CQB types who generally fight things at short distances.

The dedicated thermal on the fusion units performs like any 640px dedicated thermal. It’s MUCH better at detecting and distinguishing things like yotes at longer ranges.

So you are telling me that at 1x your eyeballs can significantly distinguish critters beyond 300 yards just because a thermal unit is 640.

At 1x everything starts to get hard to PID at 300 yards at night regardless of resolution.

 

[TheHorta]

The Pas29 sucks. No experience with the Ecoti or jerry c5 but from what I hear it's a good improvement. I went dual band and imo it's a 1000 times better than a Pas29.

It was good when it was introduced 8 years ago.

No doubt the eCOTI is a major improvement across the board, save for the controls.

Jerry-CE5 sits in between COTI and eCOTI. I know some love the C, but it’s still a step behind the real deal eCOTI.

 

[TheHorta]

So you are telling me that at 1x your eyeballs can significantly distinguish critters beyond 300 yards just because a thermal unit is 640.

At 1x everything starts to get hard to PID at 300 yards at night regardless of resolution.

Oh yeah, with my dual Skeets I can easily spot yotes at 700-800 yards and actually tell that they’re dogs.

200-300 yards (maybe) with the eCOTI/CE5. Less with COTI.

 

[zinny]

Yep, right pod has the thermal overlay only.

 

[WhereNow&How]

No.

So my operational disadvantage scenario is valid for a right handed shooter using this unit whereas a Pas 29 COTI on the left pod would be a significant advantage.

Whenever I am out hunting hogs I roll my right pod up getting ready to use a Thermal Weapon Sight as I make my final approach to a sounder of hogs. So with the left side NV/COTI setup still working I am able to know exactly where them hogs are all the time and if they spook, I can instantly transition to Laser Pointer/ Illuminator if I want to or thermal and start popping hogs.

 

[TheHorta]

So my operational disadvantage scenario is valid for a right handed shooter using this unit whereas a Pas 29 COTI on the left pod would be a significant advantage.

Whenever I am out hunting hogs I roll my right pod up getting ready to use a Thermal Weapon Sight as I make my final approach to a sounder of hogs. So with the left side NV/COTI setup still working I am able to know exactly where them hogs are all the time and if they spook, I can instantly transition to Laser Pointer/ Illuminator if I want to or thermal and start popping hogs.

I run my Jerry-F, PSQ-20B, and ENVG-III on my left eye for this very reason. I never liked the PSQ-36 because the fusion was on the right side. I like that the COTI is dealer’s choice.

But… performance-wise, the COTI system is still at a disadvantage.

To each their own.

 

[WhereNow&How]

Oh yeah, with my dual Skeets I can easily spot yotes at 700-800 yards and actually tell that they’re dogs.

200-300 yards (maybe) with the eCOTI/CE5. Less with COTI.

I suspect 700-800 yards is only in a really clean field.

In most scenarios with some vegetation, trees etc the constant breakup of an animals complete image requires some pretty strong thermal at magnification to PID

 

[zinny]

I think all the bino units are right eye for some reason, PSQ-36, PSQ-42 (both L3 and Elbit Versions), and theses J-FBs.

 

[WhereNow&How]

But… performance-wise, the COTI system is still at a disadvantage.

To each their own.

But my whole point is "performance wise" entails many other things than just image alone.

Durability, ease of use, ease of repair or replacement, ease of long term powering of thermal, total combined capability etc are all the 360 degree things I take into consideration. Image is about 40% of my total assessment.

 

[WhereNow&How]

I think all the bino units are right eye for some reason, PSQ-36, PSQ-42 (both L3 and Elbit Versions), and theses J-FBs.

Wonder what that reason is.

 

[WhereNow&How]

View attachment 8007736

She is a World Economic Council Klaus Schwab propaganda tool who is an idiot, but served their purpose well.

They are about done with her now thank the LORD.

 

[zinny]

Paid for mine, was told dealer pricing. I've shown interest in these, and made it known to them for awhile now.

 

[Conqueror]

I think all the bino units are right eye for some reason, PSQ-36, PSQ-42 (both L3 and Elbit Versions), and theses J-FBs.

I think most of them are designed for military users who aren’t going to be switching to a thermal optic before shooting. Makes sense for them to have the thermal fusion on their dominant eye, which is right side for most people. None of them pipe the thermal onlay to both NV pods sadly.

 

[WhereNow&How]

I think most of them are designed for military users who aren’t going to be switching to a thermal optic before shooting. Makes sense for them to have the thermal fusion on their dominant eye, which is right side for most people. None of them pipe the thermal onlay to both NV pods sadly.

That makes sense. But also means that the military must continue to plan to use IR Point/Illuminate for targeting for individual soldiers.

Guess the military does not put much stock in the "passive" shooting scenario like others believe is the current hot thing.

 

[SGT Fish @ChevTec Group]

That makes sense. But also means that the military must continue to plan to use IR Point/Illuminate for targeting for individual soldiers.

Guess the military does not put much stock in the "passive" shooting scenario like others believe is the current hot thing.

With the ENVG-B, they are designed with the thermal weapon sight being linked to the goggles, showing the crosshairs and thermal image wherever the gun is pointed. So no need to remove your pod as the sight's image is in the pod already

 

[rlsmith1]

I have a couple questions and thoughts...

Questions
1. Will this be available as the housing only? I have a couple PVS14's I've been running bridged with the intent to upgrade to a bino but have been patient as housing develop.
2. How hard is it to adjust the thermal settings? I assume settings are all saved when the unit is powered off?
3. How does the thermal image on the right eye impact passive shooting through a RDS? Seems like a metal gun / sight could throw off some of the thermal ROI settings...
4. How far can you detect a coyote in an open field with an eCOTI or Jerry C? Deer at 1k are no issue for me with a NOX18, so I can see how a full thermal image could be big advantage for a true fusion system. Everyone seems to get hung up on PID through the COTI type optics. I'm with @WhereNow&How that detection is the intended use and PID would happen on the gun or with a handheld unit that has more magnification / better resolution.

Thoughts
1. FINALLY A FUSION DEVICE SOLD TO CIVILIANS!!!
2. 21 oz is fantastic as is the form factor
3. I would love to see a comparison of this against the MH25 since that is a well known benchmark (and probably similar)
3. Subpar glass is a disappointment. Is there any plan to rectify that?
4. RAID X looks legit
5. Any whisperings of a fusion clip on device down the road?

 

[zinny]

1) I got mine as a housing, all you'd need since you have 14s is a competent builder to make the swap.

2)The knob on the front of the bridge rotates and is a push button. Push to switch between settings, and rotate to adjust hi-lo. So it's fairly easy to go from max thermal overlay to barely/not visible.

3) I haven't tried a hot gun yet, so not sure if that'd affect the ROI. But it's a non-issue for affecting passive aiming due to image offset. With the overlay set to infinity and the RDS so close, the thermal image is offset to the right enough that the window of the RDS is not obscured by the thermal.

4) I've dwelved fairly deep into I2, but am greener than an army private with a pvs-14 when it comes to thermal. So that's a question for them deeper pocket folk.

Yeah the Raid Xe Civ works well, don't have a mawl on hand to compare sadly.

 

[WhereNow&How]

4) I've dwelved fairly deep into I2, but am greener than an army private with a pvs-14 when it comes to thermal. So that's a question for them deeper pocket folk.

Well I am not one of them deeper pocket folks by any means but I do know this.

For a tactical situation where Thermal is being combined with a NV scene on a helmet mounted rig, it is critical that the thermal algorithms be written pretty precisely so you have the ability to easily adjust the thermal so it only alerts you to living critters as best as possible given changing emissivity conditions and disregards everything else.

 

[rlsmith1]

1) I got mine as a housing, all you'd need since you have 14s is a competent builder to make the swap.

2)The knob on the front of the bridge rotates and is a push button. Push to switch between settings, and rotate to adjust hi-lo. So it's fairly easy to go from max thermal overlay to barely/not visible.

3) I haven't tried a hot gun yet, so not sure if that'd affect the ROI. But it's a non-issue for affecting passive aiming due to image offset. With the overlay set to infinity and the RDS so close, the thermal image is offset to the right enough that the window of the RDS is not obscured by the thermal.

4) I've dwelved fairly deep into I2, but am greener than an army private with a pvs-14 when it comes to thermal. So that's a question for them deeper pocket folk.

Yeah the Raid Xe Civ works well, don't have a mawl on hand to compare sadly.

I appreciate the writeup and feedback. I take it you got the housing alone for $10k to $12k?

Well I am not one of them deeper pocket folks by any means but I do know this.

For a tactical situation where Thermal is being combined with a NV scene on a helmet mounted rig, it is critical that the thermal algorithms be written pretty precisely so you have the ability to easily adjust the thermal so it only alerts you to living critters as best as possible given changing emissivity conditions and disregards everything else.

I'd say more than just in tactical situations... Over the weekend I was coyote hunting and was walking and scanning and shot a skunk on the way in to my set. An early warning would have been great had I run my I2 that night. However, in a field with black dirt clods, there are times the larger clods hold more heat and can throw off a full thermal image

 

[WhereNow&How]

I appreciate the writeup and feedback. I take it you got the housing alone for $10k to $12k?



I'd say more than just in tactical situations... Over the weekend I was coyote hunting and was walking and scanning and shot a skunk on the way in to my set. An early warning would have been great had I run my I2 that night. However, in a field with black dirt clods, there are times the larger clods hold more heat and can throw off a full thermal image

You are correct.

What I meant to say was, Especially in a Tactical Situation

 

[rlsmith1]

You are correct.

What I meant to say was, Especially in a Tactical Situation

You've probably spent more time under nods this year than I have my whole life so glad we're on the same page!

 

[WhereNow&How]

They had a huge number of eCOTIs actually break in half. They asked O1 to redesign a better breakaway mount, as both the COTI and binos were breaking but the mount would survive. Lol.

Someone here has some photos of destroyed COTIs.

Horta, when will EuroOptics be buying out the entire stock of eCOTI's from Optics 1 and putting them on firesale.

 

[Conqueror]

Anyone else got these yet?

 

[Conqueror]

Bueller?

 

[zinny]

These are sold as housings only, to which you then have to get a builder to complete with your own tubes.
The monos were built up by agm and or the dealer with the contract w/ infiray, so guess that's a hurdle l and why it's not as prolific.

 

[rlsmith1]

How much for the housing? I have a couple elbit PVS14's looking for an upgrade and have been debating bino + coti or waiting for fusion

 

[Conqueror]

Will they work with any 11769 tubes?

 

[TheHorta]

Will they work with any 11769 tubes?

Yes, but you won’t have manual gain control unless they’re 3-lead Photonis toobies.