Re: Larue Stealth snipers- any good?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Swamper</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
But I see nobody addressed the websites commentary about "...vital when utilizing lasers, optics and other hardware",and "our Free-float Rail system provides an excellent heat-sinking feature that pulls throat-damaging heat away from the chamber area. Another heat-sinking benefit is the elimination of pressure-spikes, which some feel is the cause of a large part of pre-mature bolt failures."
Is every "accurate rifle" a "sniper rifle"???
Is a 16" barreled M4 upper a "sniper rifle"???
Does a 1/2" group at 100yds fired with 52gr "match" ammunition means anything?
A 1/2" group with a .308 is 20% less than two bullet diameters.
A 1/2" group with a .224 is 10% more than two bullet diamters.
How well does that rifle group that ammunition at 300yds?
How well does that rifle group ammunition suitable for 500 yds?
The quad rail thing is not an accuracy aid.
A heat sink to remove heat from the chamber is not going to preserve the throat. The throat is burned up incrementally by the ignition process, not the residual heat it produces. Barrels are not case-hardened, or otherwise made by custom makers to be heat resistant. LaRue is just spinning BS with that crap.
If a LaRue Tactical Stealth Sniper upper is a "sniper" upper, then an Ingram Mac 11 full-auto fitted with suppressor and the brief case contained triggering mechanism is also a "sniper weapon". Sorry, just calling it such don't mean it is....
This week, a guy on this forum sent me a barrel that was questionable for accuracy. I mounted the barrel in an A2 upper receiver, put standard handguard set on and fired a couple of magazines of 75gr bthp ammunition to see if the barrel would group. Shooting off hand @ 25yds, unsupported by sling or any aid, the barrel groups show promise. I was shooting at a pie plate with orange aiming tab. The upper was not "sighted in".
I keep all my pie plate targets. Just kidding, but there was one group of 4 maybe but most likely 5rds that I measured. Pulled the plate outa the trash can just now, and that group measures .288 both dimensions on a mitutoyo dial micrometer, without subtracting bullet diameter.
No it ain't 100yds, and all I was doing was pressing the trigger whenever sights aligned, to see if maybe the barrel would be okay.
The pie plate group has no meaning, except the barrel might have promise. Maybe when the snow clears I will put it in a Badger Ord Stabilizer handguard, mount up a scope and see what it will do at 300yds or further? Supposedly this is a chrome-lined barrel, not bad considering.
About the LaRue product, I doubt any duty slotted sniper would choose one of their uppers for reasons cited. Just labeling a product with the words "tactical" and "sniper" doesn't make it so.
</div></div>
What SOTIC level are you or have you attended USMC scout/sniper? I know being a SOTIC-I is nothing like shooting pie plates but I can at least attest to a few things.
What is "your" definition of a sniper?
Mine is:
<span style="font-style: italic">From FM 3-05.222 <span style="font-weight: bold">The Special Forces Sniper</span>
The SF sniper is a selected volunteer specially trained in advanced
marksmanship and fieldcraft skills. He can support special operations
(SO) missions and is able to engage selected targets from concealed
positions at ranges and under conditions that are not possible for the
normal rifleman.</span>
Why use a railed hand guard? PVS9/PVS22, PEQ, bipod, etc.. In combat you may need to engage close targets as well as long range targets (PEQ).
The Mk12/SPR, SR25/M110, M21, M24, M107 (crap), M40, TRG42 are tools used by snipers. In my experience the Larue performs just as well if not better than the Mk12 and I've got lots of time behind the Mk12(SPR). So as a duty slotted, trained, and tested sniper, I would choose the Larue for some purposes - but not all. There's not one end all be all sniper weapon.
Trying to compare a Mac-11 with a Larue upper is asinine. I can at least see someone saying the 5.56 isn't a effective sniper round due to it's lack of distance capability (with killing effectiveness), but a Mac-11? yeah ok...
I'm sure you're a good shot. I'm sure you know guns, but that doesn't make you a sniper. Hunting hogs, coyote, varmint doesn't make you a sniper. There's lots more to it than just shooting. In an earlier post you talked of 90gr bullets. I have yet to see a 90gr 5.56 round that doesn't have to be single loaded. NO sniper would use a single shot 5.56. If you need the extra distance, you go up to the 7.62, 300WM, 338. In combat, you often have the need for rapid follow up shots, thus the SR25, M21, and SPR rifles were needed.
I have never seen or heard an insurgent look at the "groups" in his chest or head and tell you to try again, you're groups weren't good enough.
Larue has a lot of very seasoned personnel and a lot our SOF units use his equipment. There's more than a handful of people that will swear by his product. I can wear an 8" plate out at 500yds with the upper. Anything beyond that, I'll move to a 7.62 or larger.
). The huge advantage of an AR platform over a bolt action is how easy it is to get a good gun. With an AR, if you have a good barrel/chamber/bolt, then you have a good gun. Wish it were that simple with a bolt action....hah!
