LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

Prairie Dog Dundee

Prairie Dog Dundee

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Oct 20, 2002
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Utah
#1
Gentlemen/Owners
I am interested in LMT MWS or the POF. I like the weight of the POF but the barrel change feature of the LMT seems worth the added weight. I realize that the rifles that LMT are currently shipping do no not have the barrel the Brits bought and better barrels are coming.

LMT owners, what accuracy are you getting with the chrome lined barrel? With what ammo?

POF owners, what accuracy are you getting? Please give barrel length. What is the ammo used?

I've located both and the prices are close enough to not be a factor. This choice is driving me nuts. Thanks for participating
 
#2
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

Ask the purveyor of this fine site about the POF's. If the 308's aren't sub moa with good ammo something's wrong. Even the 12" SBR POF's hang sub moa out to 500-600 yds.
 
#3
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sobrbiker883</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ask the purveyor of this fine site about the POF's. If the 308's aren't sub moa with good ammo something's wrong. Even the 12" SBR POF's hang sub moa out to 500-600 yds. </div></div>

I've seen some video of said purveyor using a POF. Impressive is an understatement. I'm aspiring to get half as good. I'll put you in the POF column. What is you barrel length, ammo and how did you do?
grin.gif
 
#5
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

just sold my 14.5" POF.....upgrading to 20". only reason.....can not use the thread on suppressor on the 14.5".....I was able to get 3/4MOA with some re-manufactured Match ammo....and it held MOA with some M80 I had......will be working loads to the 20" so expect 1/2 MOA atleast from the newest addition to the POF family.
 
#6
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

Both are fine rifles. Both use Rock barrels. POF hands down for supressor use due to piston.

I personaly dislike the appearance of the POF rail but understand its needed to allow for the piston.

I chose the LMT and with handloads I average .5" groups. My handloads are 175 smk's with 45gr of Var at 2650 FPS. Let my gunsmith buddy borrow it while I was out of town and he was getting .4" with his 168 smk handloads. What really shocked me was the groups shot with 147gr crap surplus delinked ammo that averaged just shy of 1.0" at 100yds.

Honestly cant justify the SS 5R barrel when the chrome lined is shooting this well. Current plan is to dimple the 16" and pssibly cut to 14.5 to lighten it up. Already talking with my smith about making a 18" 260 barrel for it.
 
#7
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

I have only shot them while I was working for POF. They shoot better than I can......
I'm no group shooter so I'm not noing to be quoting group sizes. I just know I can tell the difference in a moa+ gun and a sub-moa gun by where the rounds smack the steel at distance.
If they weren't running moa or better they'd go back to be worked on.

M118LR, M118SB and FGMM is what I'd shoot them with for accuracy, a mixed bag from crap to match-port right, port up, port left and port down-when testing for function.
 
#8
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Anchor Zero Six</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Both are fine rifles. Both use Rock barrels. POF hands down for supressor use due to piston.

I personaly dislike the appearance of the POF rail but understand its needed to allow for the piston.

I chose the LMT and with handloads I average .5" groups. My handloads are 175 smk's with 45gr of Var at 2650 FPS. Let my gunsmith buddy borrow it while I was out of town and he was getting .4" with his 168 smk handloads. What really shocked me was the groups shot with 147gr crap surplus delinked ammo that averaged just shy of 1.0" at 100yds.

Honestly cant justify the SS 5R barrel when the chrome lined is shooting this well. Current plan is to dimple the 16" and pssibly cut to 14.5 to lighten it up. Already talking with my smith about making a 18" 260 barrel for it. </div></div>

Wait what? Youre getting 2650 with 175 SMKs out of a 16" barrel? If so, thats awesome. I ordered an LMT and it should be in on monday. Lets hope it shoots as fast and tight as yours!
 
#9
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

The accuracy of the POF rifles straight out of the box is excellent thanks to the quality of craftsmanship, combined with the high-end components used on them, especially the Rock 5R barrels.

My 20" P-308 is consistently 3/4 MOA with factory match ammo, including 168gr, 175gr BH and FGMM. I am getting promising results with my handloads using a variety of loads, but I am working on a 155gr Scenar load lately that is showing a lot of promise. I have shot some groups closer to the 1/2MOA range, but can't seem to do it consistently (likely the shooter...not the rifle).

In addition to the accuracy, the rifle is just reliable as hell with Magpul LR20 PMAGs (not so much with C-Prod and DPMS mags).

There are numerous reviews/posts on both platforms here on the Hide. If you run a quick search, you'll find plenty of previously posted data on both that may help you in your decision making in addtn to this thread.

Good luck!!
 
#10
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Anchor Zero Six</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Both are fine rifles. Both use Rock barrels. POF hands down for supressor use due to piston.

I personaly dislike the appearance of the POF rail but understand its needed to allow for the piston.

I chose the LMT and with handloads I average .5" groups. My handloads are 175 smk's with 45gr of Var at 2650 FPS. Let my gunsmith buddy borrow it while I was out of town and he was getting .4" with his 168 smk handloads. What really shocked me was the groups shot with 147gr crap surplus delinked ammo that averaged just shy of 1.0" at 100yds.

Honestly cant justify the SS 5R barrel when the chrome lined is shooting this well. Current plan is to dimple the 16" and pssibly cut to 14.5 to lighten it up. Already talking with my smith about making a 18" 260 barrel for it. </div></div>

I find no mention on the LMT web site of their currently issued barrels being 5R. They simply call them a 16" crome lined 1:10 barrel. Are you sure they are R5?
 
#11
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jpach</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Wait what? Youre getting 2650 with 175 SMKs out of a 16" barrel? If so, thats awesome. </div></div>

I don't believe that, I've seen that same load shoot 2700 out of a 24" remington. No way it's that fast out of a 16, maybe he meant 2550?
 
#13
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

I have been a user of the POF rifles for over 5 years now and couldnt be happier with how my 20inch .308 functions. Shoots great groups all day long as long as I do my part. I have kept the groups under 1 inch at a hundred yards no problem. I have taken it out to 600 yards a couple of times and it was still sub moa. On a good day I can get it under 1/2 moa at 100 but not in repeatable succession do to me trying to get my shooting skills down. I Have a few targets that were pretty much key hole accuracy.

The way I look at it is POF builds one hell of a rifle platform and for a decent price especially when about half of the competition is running a tad bit higher.

The 5R is the rifling on the POF rock creek barrels and they all have that rifling. I have always been a fan of odd number rifled barrels.

I usually run the 168gr. SMK FGMM BTHP for any shooting under 300 yards. If I can get a good price on Hornaday 168's I go that route as I can get same group consistancy a little easier with that round. Out beyond 300 I grab the 175gr SMK FGMM BTHP.
 
#15
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jpach</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Wait what? Youre getting 2650 with 175 SMKs out of a 16" barrel? If so, thats awesome. </div></div>

I don't believe that, I've seen that same load shoot 2700 out of a 24" remington. No way it's that fast out of a 16, maybe he meant 2550?

</div></div>

Anchor's trustworthyness is not up for review, and his claim isn't all that outlandish. Pretty spicy for a gas gun, but hardly unbelievable.

THat said the difference in accuracy between one unit and the next of both of these high caliber models is going to be primarily the shooter, and not necessarily the rifle.

I have not seen the LMT in the wild, but I've shot against the POF and it definitely outperformed me
smile.gif
 
#16
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

I can second 2650 with a POF over the chrono with M118LR, only difference is mine is 20" not 16". I am also pushing 155.5 Bergers so far to 2760 and it does not appear that I am near the limit yet. Both loads are sub moa with some groups that suprise the hell out of me at distance.
 
#17
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

POF 16" Recce, shooting SS109.

I don't have any experience with the 7.62 POF platform, but my 5.56 is fantastic. I suspect that it could easily be a MOA or sub MOA gun, but I run a Leupold CQ/t and it has a 2.5 or 3 MOA dot (does anyone know the exact size?) and it's always covering my groups at 100 yards. So it's sort of hard shrink group size when you can't see what's behind the dot. I have been able to hit golf balls at 100 yards, and Red Bull cans are easy targets. Either way it shoots consistently, accurately and reliably every time; I can't speak for LMT, but I hear they are fantastic too.

My only isue with POF is that you will occasionally encounter some inconsistencies. I got lucky with my 5.56 as it's been perfect. Last year I ordered a 20" 7.62 and the fit on the upper and lower was sloppy, I decided to save my money and passes on that, with some regret. I also ordered a 18" 5.56 upper and when it arrived there was no NP3 on the inside of the receiver.
 
#18
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prairie Dog Dundee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I find no mention on the LMT web site of their currently issued barrels being 5R. They simply call them a 16" crome lined 1:10 barrel. Are you sure they are R5? </div></div>

I didnt say it was a 5R I said they both have Rock barrels. The current crop thats on the streets is a 16" chrome lined polygonal 1:10. My reference to not being able to justify the 5R was to infer that the accuracy of the CL barrel is more than acceptable and the difference in cost seems a waste as they will have SS 5R 18" barrels by October available.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Jpach said:
I don't believe that, I've seen that same load shoot 2700 out of a 24" remington. No way it's that fast out of a 16, maybe he meant 2550?
</div></div>

My bad yes 2550 with 45gr of Var. I did have some loads at 2650 but they seemed a bit hairy for a gas gun. My average was 10 round strings for 5 strings (50 total through the chrono), 330' altitude at 56F. Max spread was -22 and +31 FPS using a Dillon RL 550 (500 rounds loaded at one sitting).
Click to expand...
 
#19
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Anchor Zero Six</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prairie Dog Dundee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I find no mention on the LMT web site of their currently issued barrels being 5R. They simply call them a 16" crome lined 1:10 barrel. Are you sure they are R5? </div></div>

I didnt say it was a 5R I said they both have Rock barrels. The current crop thats on the streets is a 16" chrome lined polygonal 1:10. My reference to not being able to justify the 5R was to infer that the accuracy of the CL barrel is more than acceptable and the difference in cost seems a waste as they will have SS 5R 18" barrels by October available.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Jpach said:
I don't believe that, I've seen that same load shoot 2700 out of a 24" remington. No way it's that fast out of a 16, maybe he meant 2550?
</div></div>

My bad yes 2550 with 45gr of Var. I did have some loads at 2650 but they seemed a bit hairy for a gas gun. My average was 10 round strings for 5 strings (50 total through the chrono), 330' altitude at 56F. Max spread was -22 and +31 FPS using a Dillon RL 550 (500 rounds loaded at one sitting). </div></div>

Sorry Anchor brain fart on my part.
Click to expand...
 
#20
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: BCP</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jpach</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Wait what? Youre getting 2650 with 175 SMKs out of a 16" barrel? If so, thats awesome. </div></div>

I don't believe that, I've seen that same load shoot 2700 out of a 24" remington. No way it's that fast out of a 16, maybe he meant 2550?

</div></div>

Remington barrels aren't heat treated like POF barrels, I'm getting 2625 using 43.6gr of Varget out of my 20" POF.
 
#21
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

Here is a good load a I found with my POF. I have been working on it further playing with the seating depths and bringing the charge up to 41.4gr but the group below was with 41gr. I think I will be getting closer to 1/2 MOA when its done. I am still a bit inconsistent driving a semi-auto.

168gr Hornady Amax, 41gr RL-15, CCI BR2 primer, Win 308 case.

From what I have seen my particular POF prefers Hornady projectiles.


20" POF 308.

RL15.jpg
 
#22
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

LMT for me. I've compared them time and time again...
Anchors not exagerating at all on the group sizing, in fact I shot the first sub 1/2moa group on his rifle
smile.gif


-T
 
#23
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

Gentlemen:
Thank you for all the input. I just bought the LMT for $2,275.00 off Gunbroker. It should be here late next week.
I went for a heavier gun but that fast change barrel feature intrigues me. The POF is an outstanding rifle and if I like the 308 AR platform it may well be my next rifle.

Thanks
 
#24
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: westford86</div><div class="ubbcode-body">POF 16" Recce, shooting SS109.

I don't have any experience with the 7.62 POF platform, but my 5.56 is fantastic.
</div></div>

What accuracy should one expect from a 16.5" POF 5.56 1/8 twist barrel with quality off the shelf ammo?

Thanks
 
#25
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: H2O MAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: westford86</div><div class="ubbcode-body">POF 16" Recce, shooting SS109.

I don't have any experience with the 7.62 POF platform, but my 5.56 is fantastic.
</div></div>

What accuracy should one expect from a 16.5" POF 5.56 1/8 twist barrel with quality off the shelf ammo?

Thanks </div></div>

I honestly can't tell you from personal experience. I have only run ss109 through my gun. I would start using better ammo if I had a scope with a finer reticle that didn't entirely obscure my groups...

I did spent a lot of time debating which piston gun best suited me before I made my purchase. I went with POF after reading a lot of positive reviews about the accuracy of the 5R barrel, I remember seeing people shooting within MOA all day long. I wish I had links to reference from when I purchased back in 07...

Sorry I can't be of more help answering that. Maybe when I have time I'll pick up some match ammo and borrow a good scope just to find out.
 
#26
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

I havnt had the pleasure of shooting a POF yet but I did finally got out to the range this morning and shoot my LMT MWS for the first time. I was pretty happy with the rifle. It ran well with my can, didnt have any malf's, and it left my brass in decent shape. The only shells I had were all 168's (Hornady,Fed GM, and BH). The group shown is 10 rounds at 100 of the Federals and were the best grouping round this morning. There were actually 2 other 10 round groups of the Federals that didnt even have the flier like the one shown below but I didnt get a pic of them. I didnt measure them but I was pretty happy with it. The next best was the Hornady's that seemed to hover around 1 minute. For some reason the BH's shot pretty broad and seemed to have a little more buck to them (didnt have a chrony). All in all I am pretty happy so far and cant wait to shoot it some more. We are going to take her out for pigs tonight so wish me some luck.
LMTMWSgroup.jpg
 
#28
Re: LMT VS POF Accuracy Survey

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Prairie Dog Dundee</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Gentlemen:
Thank you for all the input. I just bought the LMT for $2,275.00 off Gunbroker. It should be here late next week.
I went for a heavier gun but that fast change barrel feature intrigues me. The POF is an outstanding rifle and if I like the 308 AR platform it may well be my next rifle.

Thanks </div></div>

2200 is a good deal, the ones I have been seeing are 2500+.
 
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