Maggie’s Memories of Carlos Hathcock

lockedandloaded

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Minuteman
Dec 17, 2004
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If anyone has personal memories of GSGT Carlos Hathcock, feel free to post them in here.

I met Gunny back on July 19th, 1992 at the Ohio Gun Collectors Association gunshow in Cleveland. I had just found and purchased an ART-IV sniper scope green fiberglass carry case from a dealer. He mentioned that Hathcock was at one of the vendor tables. I set out to locate the man. When I found him, he was in his wheelchair, shooting the shit with his friends that were manning the table. I introduced myself and Gunny reached out and offered me his handshake. His illness had started to get the better of him by then, but his was determined and direct, accompanied by a straight look into my eyes. The way a man shakes hands with another. Gunny asked me how I liked the show, and I held up my new purchase for his approval. Seated next to him was his lifelong companion, Marine Captain Edward J. Land. Land says "What the hell is that thing?". Hathcock looked at me again, and not wanting to embarass his buddy, gave me an all knowing wink and a smile. The Gunny had spoken without saying a word!

At the time, he was accepting donations to help afford his mounting medical bills. A discreet sum of cash changed hands, and he gave every effort available of himself to place his signature onto one of his business cards. We spoke for a few more minutes, and realising our time was done, I bid him farewell and best of luck.

His card is now mounted into my copy of Chandlers DFA, V1, pg100. Godspeed, Gunny.

P8250003.jpg
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

I was lucky enough to meet his son several years before Carlos passed away. His son took my copy of his first book and got it signed for me. I was waiting as soon as the second book came out and I got one of the first run that was autographed.

I spoke to him a couple of times on the phone. But it was difficult for him at that time. He passed shortly after.

We are diminished.

Rest easy Gunny.
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

I met Gunny Hathcock around the same time at a gun show in the Cleveland, Ohio area. It may have been the same show mentioned above, but for some reason I seem to remember the gun show that I met gunny at as being at the old Painesville National Guard Armory. I wish I would have dated the book I bought. Anyway At his table the Gunny and Captain Land were selling copies of his book Marine Sniper 93 confirmed kills, he signed the book I bought on the cover page.

To: Mark

Semper Fi


Carlos N. Hathcock II

I was able to talk to him for a couple of minutes and thank him for his service to our country; he responded that “he was only doing his job”. He was quite a man. A couple of years later while reviewing the results of a high power rifle match that I shot at Camp Perry I notice a Carlos N. Hathcok III listed as shooting on one of the Marine Corps. Rifle Teams; I guess it was in the genes.

If I can figure out how to scan and post a picture of the page I will.

But again a great guy.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Tactical</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I agree completely Nicely done</div></div>
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

I also met him at a gun show in Pittsburgh, Pa. about ,98, He was selling his first book,Which I got signed, I keep this in a special place.............miker
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

Had the honor & pleasure of accompanying him on a few fishing trips while stationed @ Camp Pendleton, Va. Beach between 1986 - 89. Truly the best time I spent catching nothing in my life!! Was a young NCO then and knew my place in the group... mouth shut, ears wide open, awestruck with the company I was among!! Wish I would have had a way to record the stories told!!!

RIP Gunny! You are honored & missed by many!

Semper Fi!
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

I was moving and going through some things that I forgot I had yesterday, found a 8 X 10 of Carlos personally signed a friend of mine got for me from Carlos years back at Shot Show, it was like a Christmas present.
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: The Rifleman</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I was moving and going through some things that I forgot I had yesterday, found a 8 X 10 of Carlos personally signed a friend of mine got for me from Carlos years back at Shot Show, it was like a Christmas present. </div></div>

Mine is framed on my gunroom wall. I like to thank God for letting us have him as long as we did. No telling how many men he saved while here. Gods speed Gunny.
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

Back in the late '80s maybe '90, had the honor and privilege of escorting and introducing Gunny around the SWAT Round-up before the events began. Of course he was a big hit with everyone, Sniper or not.

A small group of us took him out to dinner @ Outback (Gunny's suggestion) later that evening. I didn't say anything @ the time, but was nervous about the location. Gunny's shaking seemed to be getting pretty bad as the day worn on. It did kind of settle down after a <span style="font-weight: bold">few</span>
wink.gif
Jim Beams though. When the steaks arrived, we all kind of just kept talkin' 'n sippin' waiting for the guest of honor to start.

After a while someone else @ the table finally started on their steak. As I picked up my knife Gunny looked over @ me, pointed to the knife in my hand and asked "You any good with that?". Before I could say anything, he slid his plate over next to mine. I felt honored and sad all @ the same time. Here was a guy I'd only just read about before that morning, a real Warrior, an honest to God Hero, and I'm giving him a hand with his dinner. While I'm nervously trying to make sure nobody else notices, Gunny calls the waitress over and in the middle of ordering us a couple more tells me "Make 'em small, I don't want to choke!". I almost choked myself when he said that, he was just as matter of fact as could be. Right there ended any nervousness about being in his presence and we had a blast.

It was pretty late by the time we got back to the hotel and Gunny really did seem tired. I got him back to his room and told him I'd see him in the am. I didn't find out until the next am that after I'd dropped him off, he took an apparently short nap and then went downstairs to the lounge. Talk about resilient...But that's a story for...later...
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

During my time at Camp Pendleton CA,,,also been to the other VA Pendlton,,,was a tyro on a USMC shooting tm,,1985 ,
I got to see him.

SEMPER FI GUNNERY SARGENT.
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sub2.908cm/100m</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Back in the late '80s maybe '90, had the honor and privilege of escorting and introducing Gunny around the SWAT Round-up before the events began. Of course he was a big hit with everyone, Sniper or not.

A small group of us took him out to dinner @ Outback (Gunny's suggestion) later that evening. I didn't say anything @ the time, but was nervous about the location. Gunny's shaking seemed to be getting pretty bad as the day worn on. It did kind of settle down after a <span style="font-weight: bold">few</span>
wink.gif
Jim Beams though. When the steaks arrived, we all kind of just kept talkin' 'n sippin' waiting for the guest of honor to start.

After a while someone else @ the table finally started on their steak. As I picked up my knife Gunny looked over @ me, pointed to the knife in my hand and asked "You any good with that?". Before I could say anything, he slid his plate over next to mine. I felt honored and sad all @ the same time. Here was a guy I'd only just read about before that morning, a real Warrior, an honest to God Hero, and I'm giving him a hand with his dinner. While I'm nervously trying to make sure nobody else notices, Gunny calls the waitress over and in the middle of ordering us a couple more tells me "Make 'em small, I don't want to choke!". I almost choked myself when he said that, he was just as matter of fact as could be. Right there ended any nervousness about being in his presence and we had a blast.

It was pretty late by the time we got back to the hotel and Gunny really did seem tired. I got him back to his room and told him I'd see him in the am. I didn't find out until the next am that after I'd dropped him off, he took an apparently short nap and then went downstairs to the lounge. Talk about resilient...But that's a story for...later... </div></div>

That.....was fucken' awesome!
 
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Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

Early 80's when I talked to him over the phone while he resided in VA Beach. Used to ask questions like, what barrel,what length,Win or Remmy and so on. He was a very patient man to answer all those questions. According to him they were all good. Drove me crazy! Finally figured out not so much the weapon; as the shooter!
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

Ok years ago when I was a young lance corporal I was always snapping in with my rifle in the field by the armory.As an airwinger not much time spent shooting but somehow managed to be in the top shooters of my base.Well one day my Sgt Maj seen me and asked if I would be interested in being a Rifle Range coach.So never to turn down the group Sgt Maj I accepted and he told me to meet him at the rifle range to begin training with a friend of his.I would be required to learn as much as I could in the short amount of time and use my skills to help the other Marines in the group with bettering their marksmanship skills.Well I showed up and was introduced to a Gunny with white gloves wearing cammys and he was all business.He sized me up fast and with the other Marines we begain training I was learning positions breathing etc from scratch from him.Well to make this short I was shooting offhand and having a hell of a time out of my side vision I seen him steaming straight for me.I was thinking I'm in deep shit as he got up to me I slowed my loading and pretended not to notice him.He let me have a burst of quick attitude what are you doing,why are you all over the target is there a problem with the weapon.He then took the weapon from me fired a bulls eye and said no the weapon is good your all screwed up.I explained that I have a bad wobble and don't know when to pull the trigger.He explained as only he could by showing me and telling me again he was not going to leave untill I hit the bull and I followed his instruction and began hitting again and again.I felt him watching me all day he watched us all.Well after a few days of training and classroom instruction we shot accross the coarse my score 243.He walked up to me and said not bad but today was practice a prequal if you will lets see what you do tomorrow and he walked away.I have to admit I was full of myself and boasted to him I would shoot better but he grumbled will see.Next day the wind was kicking everyone struggled I shot a perfect score in offhand and sitting but 300 and six I dropped some points 237 at the end.He walked over to me but I knew he already knew my score he was watching.He said ok you made my cut 8 weeks rifle range instructor all summer we start at 0500 for instructors.It was a great 8 weeks after a few days the gunny was gone I looked for him but I did not see him again.I never knew who he was until many years later when I saw his picture.I will never forget his training his lessons are always with me I have passed it on to others RIP Gunny Semper FI
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

Here is Gunny at his 50th birthday party doing what he loved, teaching cops to be snipers. We were in Wayne County, MI doing his school at a local gun range. One of the student's wife made him a Marine b-day cake and we suprised him at lunch with a quick party. Took some doing to convince him to take an extended lunch break until he walked into the main dining hall and saw what was in store for him. We had a good time that day!
gunnyb-day-1.jpg
 
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Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

Not to steer the thread too far off, but for those that haven't seen it already, there are some short feeds on youtube.com of some interviews Gunny gave along with Plaster.

 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Jon Lester</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is This A Stickey yet? </div></div>

Second that motion
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

i am jealous of all of you! but at the same time, i am honored to even know who he is.... sadly, so many people don't even realize that such a man honored them with his existence...
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

New member here and just happened across this thread. I was USN, CVN-69 and then 2ndFlt from 80-86. There was a bait and tackle store just a couple of miles from my house, The Bait Barn. Got to hanging out there w/ owner Steve and a guy they called Gunny. Didn't have a clue who he was until probably 2-3 months after meeting him. Ended up fishing and hunting w/ him quite a lot. Never meet a nicer person. Have autographed copies of the first book and one of his original "sniper consultant/instructor" business cards.
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

When I was stationed at Quantico in the early 90's he attended the ceremony for our incoming CO. Gunny was in his wheelchair and in his leather jacket and usual red and gold Marine Corps hat, sitting to the right of the incoming Colonel, a longtime friend of his that he had served in Vietnam with. We all knew who he was, there was no need for an introduction, and nobody asked who he was.
There we all were, every Marine in the entire squadron, all standing at attention as the adjutant began the ceremony, Gunny reached under his wheelchair and picked up a Big Gulp from 7-11 and quite loudly slurped the last drops out of the bottom of the cup! We were in an Aircraft hangar and it was loud as hell , and he did it as the adjutant paused during the reading or the orders! He looks at the Colonel shrugs his shoulders and says "What? I'm thirsty"

It was VERY obvious he planned it that was and the Colonel and he
laughed and that lead to the squadron chuckling and laughing.

That was the only time I ever was a part of a ceremony where we were at attention, broke discipline and all chuckled at it seemed it was very acceptable.
Gunny waited around and stayed until anyone in the squadron who wanted to shake his hand got the chance.

He was and still is a legend, and a great man.
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

many years ago i picked up a magazine, cant remember the name of it. any ways i went down to a small gun shop just down the road and showed it to the owner, maj. g. bartlett usmc ret. he said something like shit i know him, he was in my company for a while. he reported to me and i got him his own tent and told him to just check in once in a while. george asked me if i would like to talk to him and started dialing his number. shortley he gave me the phone and it was carlos, we talked for a while, i thanked him for taking the time to talk to me and then he gave me his phone number and said to call anytime, and to "keep my eyes on the major" i called him a couple of times before we met at a local gun show. what a wonderful man he i could go on and on but we all what i mean. some time later down the road i got a call abt 0400 with the bad news. he was a friend and he never new a stranger. rip gy sgt hathcock, and thank you
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

Here's what I now have hanging on my wall. I am proud to share with anyone who asks, who Carlos is, and what he's accomplished.

Cause almost everyone who's been to my home has seen the memorial on the wall, and gotten up to check it out.

Can one ask for more?

Items019.jpg


Respectfully, it's the least I can do.

What are you doing?
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Sean the Nailer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Here's what I now have hanging on my wall. I am proud to share with anyone who asks, who Carlos is, and what he's accomplished.

Cause almost everyone who's been to my home has seen the memorial on the wall, and gotten up to check it out.



Items019.jpg


</div></div>

Sean, any chance you could provide a closeup shot of that?
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

Washington Post
February 27, 1999

<span style="font-weight: bold">The Sniper With A Steadfast Aim</span>

By Stephen Hunter, Washington Post Staff Writer

The academics write their mighty histories. The politicians dictate their memoirs. The retired generals give their speeches. The intellectuals record their ironic epiphanies. And in all this hubbub attending wars either lost or won, the key man is forgotten -- the lonely figure crouched in the bushes, wishing he were somewhere else: the man with the rifle.

Such a man has just died, and his passing will be marked elsewhere only in small, specialized journals with names like Leatherneck and Tactical Shooter and in the Jesuitical culture of the Marine Corps, where he is still fiercely admired.

And in some quarters, even that small amount of respect will be observed with skepticism. After all, he was merely a grunt. He was a sergeant who made people do push-ups. He fought in a bad war. He was beyond irony, perspective or introspection. He made no policies, he commanded no battalions, he invented no colorful code names for operations. But worst of all, he was a sniper.

Gunnery Sgt. (Ret.) Carlos N. Hathcock II, USMC, died Monday at 57 in Virginia Beach, after a long decline in the grip of the only enemy he wasn't able to kill: multiple sclerosis. In the end, he didn't recognize his own friends. So it was a kind of mercy, one supposes. But he had quite a life. In two tours in the 1960s, he wandered through the big bad bush in the Republic of South Vietnam, and with a rifle made by Winchester, a heart made by God and a discipline made by the Marine Corps, he stalked and killed 93 of his country's enemies. And that was only the official count.

It's not merely that Vietnam was a war largely without heroes. It's also that the very nature of Hathcock's heroism was a problem for so many. He killed, nakedly and without warning. There is something in the mercilessness of the sniper that makes the heart recoil. He attracts vultures, not only to his carcasses but also to his psyche. Is he sick? Is he psycho? The line troops call him "Murder Inc." behind his back. They puzzle over what he does. When they kill, it's in hot blood, in a haze of smoke and adrenaline. And much of the other death they see is inflicted by industrial applications, such as air power or artillery, which almost seem beyond human agency.

But the sniper is different. He isn't at the point of the spear, he is the point of the spear. He reduces warfare to its purest element, the destruction of another human being. He's like a '50s mad scientist, who learns things no man can learn -- how it looks through an 8x scope when you center-punch an enemy at 200 yards, and how it feels -- but he learns them at the risk of his own possible exile from the community.

But maybe Hathcock never cared much for the larger community, but only the Marine Corps and its mission. "Vietnam," he told a reporter in 1987, "was just right for me." He even began sniping before the Corps had instituted an official policy.

And one must give Hathcock credit for consistency: In all the endless revising done in the wake of our second-place finish in the Southeast Asia war games, he never reinvented himself or pretended to be something he wasn't. He remained a true believer to the end, not in his nation's glory or its policies, but in his narrower commitment to the Marine code of the rifle. He never euphemized, didn't call himself an "enemy troop-strength reduction technician" or "counter-morale specialist." He never walked away from who he'd been and what he'd done. He was salty, leathery and a tough Marine Corps professional NCO, even in a wheelchair. His license plate said it best: SNIPER.

"Hell," he once said, "anybody would be crazy to like to go out and kill folks. . . . I never did enjoy killing anybody. It's my job. If I don't get those bastards, then they're going to kill a lot of these kids. That's the way I look at it."

Though he was known for many years as the Marine Corps' leading sniper -- later, a researcher uncovered another sniper with a few more official kills -- he took no particular pleasure in the raw numbers.

"I'll never look at it like this was some sort of shooting match, where the man with the most kills wins the gold medal," he once said.

Ironically, the only decoration for valor that he won was for saving, not taking, lives. On his second tour in Vietnam, on Sept. 16, 1969, he was riding atop an armored personnel carrier when it struck a 500-pound mine and erupted into flames. Hathcock was knocked briefly unconscious, sprayed with flaming gasoline and thrown clear. Waking, he climbed back aboard the burning vehicle to drag seven other Marines out. Then, "with complete disregard for his own safety and while suffering an excruciating pain from his burns, he bravely ran back through the flames and exploding ammunition to ensure that no Marines had been left behind," according to the citation for the Silver Star he received in November 1996, after an extensive letter-writing campaign by fellow Marines had failed to win him the Medal of Honor for his exploits with a rifle.

But he was equally proud of the fact that as a sniper platoon sergeant on two tours, no man under his command was killed.

"I never lost a person over there," he told a visiting journalist in 1995. "Never lost nobody but me, and that wasn't my fault."

Hathcock was an Arkansan, from a dirt-poor broken home, who joined the Marine Corps at 17 and quickly understood that he had found his place in the world. He qualified as an expert rifleman in boot camp and began quickly to win competitive shooting events, specializing in service rifle competition. In 1965, he won the Wimbledon Cup, the premier American 1,000-yard shooting championship. Shortly after that he was in Vietnam, but it was six months before the Marines learned the value of dedicated sniper operations and a former commanding officer built a new unit around his talents. Hathcock gave himself to the war with such fury that he took no liberty, no days off and toward the end of his first tour was finally restricted to quarters to prevent him from going on further missions.

After the war, he suffered from the inevitable melancholy. Forced medical retirement from the Corps in 1979 -- he had served 19 years 10 months 5 days -- led to drinking problems and extended bitterness. The multiple sclerosis, discovered in 1975, certainly didn't help, and burns that covered 43 percent of his body made things even more painful, but what may have saved his life -- it certainly saved the quality of his life -- was the incremental recognition that came his way as more and more people discovered who he was and what he had done. Even in the atmosphere of moral recrimination in the aftermath of the war, enough people far from media centers and universities were still attracted to the spartan simplicity of his life and battles and to the integrity of his heroism.

His biography, "Marine Sniper," written by Charles Henderson, was published in 1985; it sold over half a million copies. In the brief blast of publicity that followed, he stood still for interviews with The Washington Post, the Chicago Tribune and others. The general population may have soon forgotten about him, but in the world of target shooters, hunters and police and military shooting, he was a revered figure. And particularly as shooters came to perceive themselves under attack from mainstream culture, he became a symbol of the heroic man with a gun. He connected, in some atavistic way, to other American heroes, like Audie Murphy or Sgt. Alvin York, perhaps even Davy Crockett and Daniel Boone. They were all men like Hathcock who grew up on hardscrabble farms far from the big cities and learned early to shoot, read sign and understand the terrain.

Other gun culture enterprises kept him visible in a specialized universe unmonitored by the media, and put some money on the table. He authorized a poster that showed him in full combat regalia, crouched over his Model 70 Winchester, his face blackened, his boonie cap scrunched close to his head, the only identifier being a small sprig of feather in its band. In fact, a long-range .308-caliber ammunition was sold as "White Feather," from the Vietnamese Long Tra'ng, his nickname. He consulted on law enforcement sharpshooting, a growth area in the '80s and '90s as nearly every police department in America appointed a designated marksman to its de rigueur SWAT team. He appeared in several videos, where he revealed himself to be a practically oriented man of few but decisive words, with a sense of humor dry as a stick. He inspired several novels and at least two nonfiction books, and his exploits made it onto TV, where a "JAG" episode featured a tough old Marine sniper, and even into the movies, even if he was never credited.

In both 1994's "Sniper" and, more recently, "Saving Private Ryan," heroic riflemen dispatch enemy counter-snipers with rounds so perfectly placed they travel the tube of the enemy's scope before hitting him in the eye. In both cases, the shooters are tough Southerners (played by Tom Berenger and Barry Pepper), very much in the Hathcock mold. According to "Marine Sniper," Hathcock made such a shot, dispatching a Viet Cong sniper sent to target him specifically.

Also according to that book, he ambushed a female enemy interrogator, a North Vietnamese general and a VC platoon that he took down, a man at a time, over a 24-hour engagement.

Finally, and perhaps best of all, he ascended to a special kind of Marine celebrity. The Corps named the annual Carlos Hathcock Award after him for its best marksman. A Marine library in Washington has been named after him and a Virginia Civil Air Patrol unit named itself after him. In 1990 a Marine unit raised $5,000 in donations to fight multiple sclerosis and presented it to him at his home. They brought it to him the old-fashioned way, the Marine way: They ran 216 miles from Camp Lejeune, N.C., to Virginia Beach.

It was a tribute to his toughness that Carlos Hathcock understood.

According to the account in the Norfolk Virginian-Pilot, the old sniper told the men, "I am so touched, I can hardly talk."

In the end, he could not escape the terrible disease that had afflicted him since 1975. But death, with whom he had an intimate relationship, at least came to him quietly -- as if out of respect.

 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

I met Carlos several years ago at a gunshow in Richmond,Va. We talked about all sorts of stuff, Well after the show His buisness partner Richard was unable to take Carlos home,and he asked me if I wouls be able to drop him off at his house,Since I was going to Va.Beach anyway I did hesitate to have gunny ride with me.After the show was over I pulled my car up and wheeled Gunny out to my car hepled him in an put his wheelchair in the trunk and when I closed it 2 Very Large Va.State Troopers asked if that was Carlos in my car, I told them yes. Well I had a Police Escort for a few Miles down the road. It was a fantastic ride to his house in Va. Bch. Something I will never forget. My son found a Birthday card that Carlos gave him on his 7th. birthday,He did not really understand at that time who Carlos was,But now it is his most prized possession. Godspeed Gunny we miss you.
 
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Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

lockedandloaded, sir this is the first time i have read your post and to be honest i had to read some and walk away several times for my eyes would water up and i get a lump in my throat. i have no pictures of gunny in my house , only the fond memories of our conversations on the phone and when we would meet up at shows. they are in my head and i can visit them any time i wish to, i am sure others do the same it's a private thing.
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

Saw this thread go BTT. Thought I'd post some references to magazine articles worth researching on Gunny.

Precision Shooting, May 1996 Pg. 62
Precision Shooting, March 1996 Pg. 30
Soldier Of Fortune, Feb. 1987 Pg. 64

Feel free to add any others you can find.
 
Re: Memories of Carlos Hathcock

I've never met gunny but I remember when I went to go get a sniper book from the book store, little did I know I would get much more than just a book. He was inspiring, the way he carried himself. He was also an American hero that I will never forget. God's bless him and his family RIP gunny