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Rifle Scopes Need advice
- Thread starter s5traut
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Re: Need advice
I think for less money you can get as good if not better scope with an IOR Valdada 2-12x32, it's a great compact size with amazing range, 35mm tube and illuminated retical, and can compensate for both 308 and 223 or their newer one the 2-12x36 but you can get the outgoing floor model for model for i think $999 both valdada.com and SWFA have those at good prices and I've heard its the same glass as Swarovski.
I own 2 of their scopes and will likely by a 3rd.
I think for less money you can get as good if not better scope with an IOR Valdada 2-12x32, it's a great compact size with amazing range, 35mm tube and illuminated retical, and can compensate for both 308 and 223 or their newer one the 2-12x36 but you can get the outgoing floor model for model for i think $999 both valdada.com and SWFA have those at good prices and I've heard its the same glass as Swarovski.
I own 2 of their scopes and will likely by a 3rd.
Re: Need advice
I don't think you can go wrong with the nightforce or the swarovski. You should PM VeteranTactical on the Hide, he is very helpful when it comes to trying to pick out the right optic for you.
I don't think you can go wrong with the nightforce or the swarovski. You should PM VeteranTactical on the Hide, he is very helpful when it comes to trying to pick out the right optic for you.
Re: Need advice
We spend a lot of time evaluating glass here at TGR; that being said what kind of rifle is this going on, and what will you be using it for?
We spend a lot of time evaluating glass here at TGR; that being said what kind of rifle is this going on, and what will you be using it for?
Re: Need advice
The glass on the NF is very good. IMO, some folks get too hung up on glass quality. I'd rather have a bullet proof scope that is awesome mechanically with very good glass than a scope that gets fucked up the first time you bump it but has "super-amazing-stellar-crystallized-can see Mars from the head-razor surgical-birdwatching-bestest in the freakin' universe-glass". YMMV.
The glass on the NF is very good. IMO, some folks get too hung up on glass quality. I'd rather have a bullet proof scope that is awesome mechanically with very good glass than a scope that gets fucked up the first time you bump it but has "super-amazing-stellar-crystallized-can see Mars from the head-razor surgical-birdwatching-bestest in the freakin' universe-glass". YMMV.
Re: Need advice
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sawman556</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The glass on the NF is very good. IMO, some folks get too hung up on glass quality. I'd rather have a bullet proof scope that is awesome mechanically with very good glass than a scope that gets fucked up the first time you bump it but has "super-amazing-stellar-crystallized-can see Mars from the head-razor surgical-birdwatching-bestest in the freakin' universe-glass". YMMV. </div></div>
Lol... I agree, that is how I feel.
Btw, what other scopes are you considering?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sawman556</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The glass on the NF is very good. IMO, some folks get too hung up on glass quality. I'd rather have a bullet proof scope that is awesome mechanically with very good glass than a scope that gets fucked up the first time you bump it but has "super-amazing-stellar-crystallized-can see Mars from the head-razor surgical-birdwatching-bestest in the freakin' universe-glass". YMMV. </div></div>
Lol... I agree, that is how I feel.
Btw, what other scopes are you considering?
Re: Need advice
you can't go wrong with either, both are great scopes and great companies. that said, it's an apple and an orange
( the nightforce is a heavy tactical scope, 30mm tube, illumination, heavier, but mechanically consistent, where the swarovski is a hunting scope, 1 inch tube, no illumination, better optically, and much lighter)
what features do you want and what can you give up? personally, if i was looking swarovski, i'ed hop up to the z5, but do you want a hunting or tactical set up?
you can't go wrong with either, both are great scopes and great companies. that said, it's an apple and an orange
( the nightforce is a heavy tactical scope, 30mm tube, illumination, heavier, but mechanically consistent, where the swarovski is a hunting scope, 1 inch tube, no illumination, better optically, and much lighter)
what features do you want and what can you give up? personally, if i was looking swarovski, i'ed hop up to the z5, but do you want a hunting or tactical set up?
Re: Need advice
I'm not so sure either that the NF is that much heavier than the swarovski.
But, the most important thing - when looking throgh a scope to me, just my opinion - is how the SYSTEM works together. Good glass is one thing, hell Nikon has UNBEATABLE glass for the money.
But how well does this translate into edge-to-edge clarity?
How much light is transmitted in? A 30mm tube puts more light in your eye - even if the glass is not as good.
Are you going to be walking on wet/mud-covered rocks and need a rifle that will still hold zero after you fall on your keister?
if so, you need to seriously consider something durable like the NF.
I'm not so sure either that the NF is that much heavier than the swarovski.
But, the most important thing - when looking throgh a scope to me, just my opinion - is how the SYSTEM works together. Good glass is one thing, hell Nikon has UNBEATABLE glass for the money.
But how well does this translate into edge-to-edge clarity?
How much light is transmitted in? A 30mm tube puts more light in your eye - even if the glass is not as good.
Are you going to be walking on wet/mud-covered rocks and need a rifle that will still hold zero after you fall on your keister?
if so, you need to seriously consider something durable like the NF.
Re: Need advice
For GLASS and weight the Swarovski, for durability the Nightforce. I really like the Swarovski Z3 3-10x42mm with the BRH RET, this is what I will be using this year for hunting.
We have the Nightforce C289 2.5-10x32mm 0-Stop 1/4 MOA WL NP-R2 and the Swarovski 59016 Z3 3-10x42mm BRH in stock.
If you would like to see a video we did on the Swarovski Z3 3-10x42mm BRH
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4DVrScm-AM
Mike @ CST
For GLASS and weight the Swarovski, for durability the Nightforce. I really like the Swarovski Z3 3-10x42mm with the BRH RET, this is what I will be using this year for hunting.
We have the Nightforce C289 2.5-10x32mm 0-Stop 1/4 MOA WL NP-R2 and the Swarovski 59016 Z3 3-10x42mm BRH in stock.
If you would like to see a video we did on the Swarovski Z3 3-10x42mm BRH
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4DVrScm-AM
Mike @ CST
Re: Need advice
I vote for the NF.If you have never used one go to a range and check one out. Most poeple will be glad to show you what they got.
I vote for the NF.If you have never used one go to a range and check one out. Most poeple will be glad to show you what they got.
Re: Need advice
Thanks for all the input. I didn't know there were this many responses since I thought I would be automatically subscribed (as the OP) and notified. Apparently all subscriptions are "manual"
I'll provide some more detail. It will be going on a light-weight .243 that will be used for deer and wolves inside 350yds and coyote/varmint out to 600 yards. I have a NF 5.5-22 so I'm familiar with their scopes and I love them. Since we all seem to be comparing to NF x32, I'll go with that.
1) My biggest concern (and mentioned by others) is that the NF will be a little short on power out to 500-600 for varmint. Hence why I consider the Swaro Z3 12x
2) While I appreciate the ruggedness of the NF, I think I'd be paying a premium for toughness that I may not need. I don't want anything fragile, but a standard hunting rig should suffice.
3) Weight. The heft of the NF isn't a deal breaker, but I want to keep it to minimum for our backpack deer/wolve hunts at 5-7K'.
4) I need something with good glass (the benfit of NFs lighted reticle is no-brainer benefit) since a fair amount of shooting will be in low-light. I know Swaro has excellent low-light glass also.
Those concerns made me consider something in the $600-800 range such as a Swaro z3 BRX/BRH (used?) or maybe Zeiss (but their lack of good customer service and good reticles scared me off).
BTW, does anyone have experience with Sightron? I've heard they are an "up and comer" with good values.
Again, I appreciate all the input.
Thanks for all the input. I didn't know there were this many responses since I thought I would be automatically subscribed (as the OP) and notified. Apparently all subscriptions are "manual"
I'll provide some more detail. It will be going on a light-weight .243 that will be used for deer and wolves inside 350yds and coyote/varmint out to 600 yards. I have a NF 5.5-22 so I'm familiar with their scopes and I love them. Since we all seem to be comparing to NF x32, I'll go with that.
1) My biggest concern (and mentioned by others) is that the NF will be a little short on power out to 500-600 for varmint. Hence why I consider the Swaro Z3 12x
2) While I appreciate the ruggedness of the NF, I think I'd be paying a premium for toughness that I may not need. I don't want anything fragile, but a standard hunting rig should suffice.
3) Weight. The heft of the NF isn't a deal breaker, but I want to keep it to minimum for our backpack deer/wolve hunts at 5-7K'.
4) I need something with good glass (the benfit of NFs lighted reticle is no-brainer benefit) since a fair amount of shooting will be in low-light. I know Swaro has excellent low-light glass also.
Those concerns made me consider something in the $600-800 range such as a Swaro z3 BRX/BRH (used?) or maybe Zeiss (but their lack of good customer service and good reticles scared me off).
BTW, does anyone have experience with Sightron? I've heard they are an "up and comer" with good values.
Again, I appreciate all the input.
Re: Need advice
I have a NF 3.5 X 15 I bought around '98. Light gathering on the scope is nutz early morning and late evening, and clear as a bell. I have not used a Swaro scope but binos I had of theirs were clear and had great color.
good luck and give Jay or Chris a call over at sport optics, great customer service and tell them your a member of the hide.
I have a NF 3.5 X 15 I bought around '98. Light gathering on the scope is nutz early morning and late evening, and clear as a bell. I have not used a Swaro scope but binos I had of theirs were clear and had great color.
good luck and give Jay or Chris a call over at sport optics, great customer service and tell them your a member of the hide.
Re: Need advice
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ivan R</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think for less money you can get as good if not better scope with an IOR Valdada 2-12x32, it's a great compact size with amazing range, <span style="color: #FF0000">35mm tube</span> and illuminated retical, and can <span style="color: #FF0000">compensate for both 308 and 223</span> or their newer one the 2-12x36 but you can get the outgoing floor model for model for i think $999 both valdada.com and SWFA have those at good prices and I've heard its the same glass as Swarovski.</div></div>
The 35mm tube is not important as IOR's 2-12x32 has 70moa of travel vs. the 30mm NF tube with 100moa of travel. Really either will get you to 400yds easily, but the 35mm tube is no advantage.
I have no faith in BDC reticles/turrets. While it might be good for a single bullet flying at a single velocity in a single set of conditions, I think you'd be better served getting a versatile reticle and figuring your own dope card.
As for the NF vs. Swaro debate, I'd go with NF. I have two and played with a few others as well as a few Swarovskis. My eyes can't tell a noticeable difference between the glass quality of the two. Also, the NF turrets feel better (more distinct) to me.
So the NF has more elevation, better turrets, better reticles, more compact, AND equivalent glass. That makes it a simple decision to me.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ivan R</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I think for less money you can get as good if not better scope with an IOR Valdada 2-12x32, it's a great compact size with amazing range, <span style="color: #FF0000">35mm tube</span> and illuminated retical, and can <span style="color: #FF0000">compensate for both 308 and 223</span> or their newer one the 2-12x36 but you can get the outgoing floor model for model for i think $999 both valdada.com and SWFA have those at good prices and I've heard its the same glass as Swarovski.</div></div>
The 35mm tube is not important as IOR's 2-12x32 has 70moa of travel vs. the 30mm NF tube with 100moa of travel. Really either will get you to 400yds easily, but the 35mm tube is no advantage.
I have no faith in BDC reticles/turrets. While it might be good for a single bullet flying at a single velocity in a single set of conditions, I think you'd be better served getting a versatile reticle and figuring your own dope card.
As for the NF vs. Swaro debate, I'd go with NF. I have two and played with a few others as well as a few Swarovskis. My eyes can't tell a noticeable difference between the glass quality of the two. Also, the NF turrets feel better (more distinct) to me.
So the NF has more elevation, better turrets, better reticles, more compact, AND equivalent glass. That makes it a simple decision to me.
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