Need help deciding M40A1 build configurations

[USMCSGT0331]

This thread started out with some posts about various M40A1 parts that I had on hand to build a few clone rifles from. However, the thread has now morphed into a resource for all things M40A1 related. If you have any original USMC M40A1 parts or M40A1 clone builds, please post them in this thread!




I was going through my M40A1 parts today and I'm trying to decide which A1 configurations I want to build. I've been collecting M40's and original M40xx parts for about a decade now, but one rifle still eludes me -- the M40A1. I recently picked up a 221xxx receiver and I think it's finally time to get a few M40A1 builds completed. I currently have 3 receivers from donor rifles, so that constrains me to only 3 clone builds. However, I have a bunch of original USMC M40A1 parts and I need to carefully choose which parts will be used on each build.

There were actually a few different "types" or "configurations" of A1's built over the decades and I want my clone builds to reflect the changes that were made. There's quite a few ways to mix and match the parts, with some arrangements making more sense than others. For example, it's historically correct to use a Unertl 10x scope with a Redfield welded mount, but the Redfield greenie scopes were never used with the Unertl mounts. Some parts might also look better together based on when they were issued. For example, I personally think that the earlier Redfield greenie scopes look better when paired with an early wispy smear stock, as opposed to being paired with a much later woodland pattern stock.

With all that being said, I can finally get to the point of this thread. I'd like your help with deciding which parts should go together on each of the 3 M40A1 clone builds, and I'd like to share some photos/info of rare parts with everyone. I think that this could be an interesting conversation based on the numerous parts that were used on the A1's and when they came into service. If I like any of the M40A1 configurations that you guys come up with, I'll have my gunsmith build the rifles that way.

Even though I'll have to decide what the final A1 clone builds will look like, I still really want to hear what you guys think about which parts should be used on which builds, and how you settled on that exact specification. I bet that some of you will put together combinations of parts that I wouldn't think to use, and you might have a very rational explanation to back up your choices and parts selection.

So, what do you guys think? Is anyone interested in discussing rare M40A1 parts and how a few clones should be built? I numbered each item in the photos of the parts, so they should be easy to refer to. I also have more M40A1 parts that aren't in the photos, so if you think that I'm missing something like an unmarked Redfield 40X base/ring set, please say so. I forgot to add an unmarked 40X base to the photos below, but it might be the best option for a build that uses the unserialized Redfield greenie scope that I do have in the photos.

I hope the purpose of this post makes sense and I hope you guys will have fun mixing and matching M40A1 parts together in order to create the best clone builds possible! I'll break up the various parts into separate posts, so it will be easy to see things grouped together and I can always go back and add more photos/information to each post if need be. Who knows, maybe if this turns into a great discussion thread I might decide to give away a rare M40 part or 2.


I'll start things off with an early transitional M40A1 variation (the numbers are the choice from that item's group photo in the other posts):

Stock - #1, early wispy green smear
Scope - #1, 221xxx marked Redfield greenie with a 221xxx marked Redfield base
Mount - Not pictured in the mount's group photo, the 40X base is already on the scope
Barrel - #1, the earliest of the 3 barrels ans is dated 1978
Receiver - #1, early 221xxx serial number
Rational - I chose the earliest item from each of the 5 groups of parts in order to build the earliest issued transitional M40A1. Since I chose the 221xxx receiver, it makes sense to also choose the 221xxx marked scope and 221xxx marked 40X scope base. Although 700SA bases were also used on these early transitional A1's, I just prefer the 40X base (for aesthetics if the 40X base has square corners). I also chose to use the earliest barrel, which is also marked with a date and the caliber. These markings might have only been used on the earliest barrels, since later versions had different markings or no markings at all. So, it just makes sense to use the early barrel for the early transitional A1 build, especially when we can prove that it is indeed an early barrel.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

These are my original USMC used McMillan M40A1 smear stocks, but only 4 of the 5 are available for these clone builds (number 4 was recently sold to a close friend, I kept it in the photos because I like the camo pattern and it look good with the rest of the group). Below is a brief description of each stock and the visible characteristics that makes each type of smear stock unique. All of the stocks, except #4, have original USMC modified Winchester M70 bottom metal and trigger guard.

Some of these smear stocks actually have names given to them by collectors, these names are based on what the stocks look like. I didn't come up with any of these names, but I do like to use them when I'm talking to other collectors, since the other person will immediately know which "type" or pattern of smear stock I'm referring too.

#1 - The earliest of the 5 stocks, it's mostly green with some faint wisps of other colors, which is why collectors usually refer to this type as "wispy smears." This is a pretty rare smear pattern and a lot of collectors gravitate towards it because it looks so plain, which is quite a bit different than the other smear patterns. These stocks are also the "greenest" of the M40A1 stocks, with known examples having only a tiny amount of reddish paint or sometimes pretty much none at all. These early stocks also tend to have more of the woven fiberglass showing though the gel coat. This isn't caused by heavy wear to the stock, it's actually caused by a distinct lack of paint in the areas that the fiberglass is showing. Seeing the fiberglass weave isn't unique to this type of smear, but it is a more commonly seen feature on them.

#2 - Another early stock that is primarily green, but is starting to get some more color added in. Like the wispy smears, this one has more subdued colors, but it still has more color than the earlier stocks. It's a subtle difference between the types, but when you see them up close it's quite noticeable.

#3 - This is an extremely rare pattern that has a yellowish-green color running through it and the gel coat layer isn't shiny, it's actually a matte finish (which was apparently caused by an error in in the molding process). This type has been referred to as "marbleized smears," because of the paint streaks resemblance to marble.

#4 - This is one of the most common camo patterns that was used on M40A1 smear stocks, and it was also a common camo pattern that was used on military issued McMillan M14, M83, M86 and Silhouette stocks. Even though those other 4 rifles were made in both green and desert camouflage colors, the 3 point smear pattern design remains the same. If you look at the lighest color on this stock, you'll notice that it has a distinctive 3 point design. This 3 point design was probably developed around the same time as the "Kelly K smears," but it might be impossible to say if one pattern predates the other (all of these smears predate the semi-smears and woodland patterns).

Even though this stock has a common camo pattern, it is actually the one one of a certain type known to still exist. This is not a common smear stock, this stock is truly unique! Any guesses as to why this is? It's a discussion thread, let's discuss it, throw out some guesses as to why this stock is one of a kind (yes, all fingerpainted smear stocks are technically unique due to each one being handmade, but this stock has something else going for it).

#5 - The last stock in the group is a very nice "2 finger smear." This type of smear stock was named after the method of applying the red and light green paint to the stock mold. Using the index and middle fingers, one finger was dipped in the red paint and the other finger was dipped in the green paint. The two fingers had little to no gap between them and they were swiped together on the stocks in various areas. This is what gives this type of smear stock it's unique fingerpainted smear look. This is not to be confused with a semi-smear stock, which started to use defined patterns and eventually morphed into the semi-woodland and the woodland patterns. This type still has random swipes of smeared paint as opposed to a defined and repetitive pattern that is seen on later M40A1 stocks.

#6 - Not pictured, McMillan M40A1 woodland camo pattern stock

Some of you may have seen these different smear patterns and have heard them referred to by a specific name. Other people on here might think I'm just full of shit and that the naming smear patterns is ridiculous. Either way, I'm just the messenger, M40 collectors have been calling certain M40A1 stock patterns specific names for longer than I've been collecting them. I've heard of more than one name per pattern, but the names I provided above tend to be the most common ones for these types.

It's not necessary for everyone having to learn all of these names and characteristics, I just wanted to provide as much information as possible for the collectors who are interested in such things. Myself and others are drawn to the M40A1 rifles for many reasons, one of which is because we really like the unique camouflage patterns on these stocks. This makes every single stock unique and the transitions in the patterns help us understand the developmental history of these stocks.

Kelly McMillan said that they would come up with an idea for how the stocks should be painted, but after a certain number of stocks completed, they'd look at the pile and see changes between them. Sometimes the stocks got a lighter or darker based green background color. Sometimes they would run out of a color partway through the day and they'd have to quickly mix a new color (which didn't always match what they were shooting for, this is where the extremely rare cream and mustard colors come from). Sometimes Kelly got bored and painted the first letter of his name in the stock molds, these became the "Kelly K smears," since there's a distinctive "K" on the side of the stock. These variations should be celebrated and discussed, this is what makes the M40A1 stocks so interesting.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

The scope section is very interesting because it has the most variety of pie that were used on the original USMC M40A1's. All 6 of these scopes are original USMC items, but this still isn't the complete list of scopes that were used on the M40A1 rifles. A scope that I don't have is the Weaver T-10, which was used by the Recon Marines in extremely small quantities (something like half a dozen).

Unfortunately, like all the other original USMC M40A1 parts, these scopes can be very expensive and out of reach for most collectors. This is the reason why the Weaver T-10 is so popular with M40A1 clone builders, since the T-10 is only a few hundred dollars. Interestingly, there's probably far more Weaver T-10's on civilian clone rifles than there were ever T-10's on the original military rifles! Even though only a handful of the T-10 scopes were ever issued, they remain a popular choice for cloner builders. Even though I don't own T-10 scope, feel free to use it when mixing and matching M40A1 parts for your recommendations on how I should build my clones.

#1 - This is a very interesting Redfield greenie scope, it's not only in mint condition, but it's also in an unusually high serial number range and it isn't marked with a rifle's serial number. This means that this scope was a replacement scope made for the Corps a later date. This scope was never paired with or serial number matched to a rifle. It's very rare to find greenies in this condition and don't have the rifle's serial number engraved on it. These blank scopes are prized by collectors because they can be matched up with an unmarked Redfield 40X base. This makes it a blank, unmarked scope/base set, which is almost as rare as finding a numbers matching scope/base set.

#2 - This is another interesting Redfield greenie, I've only seen one other greenie that has an "A" serial number suffix and US PROPERTY engraved on the main tube. This scope started out like all of the 550 other greenies that were originally mounted to an M40 rifle in 1966 (150 more rifles and scopes weren't put together). It's in the very common Redfield serial number range of F57xxx and the M40 serial number engraved on the side is matched to a 221xxx rifle. We have a lot of knowledge about the Redfield greenies, like the serial number ranges and serisl number markings, but the "A" suffix and the engraved US PROPERTY is something completely new. With only 2 scopes known to have these new features, it might take a while before we learn why these 2 greenies are different than the rest.

I mounted this scope in a close to matching 221xxx serial number marked Redfield 40X base/ring set. The 40X base is only 56 numbers away from the greenie scope. Collectors always look for parts with matching serial numbers, but finding exact matches is next to impossible for parts that are loose. I have owned some greenie scopes that were only off by 1 single digit from the serial number on the base, but those items are with my friends and no longer in my collection. I really regret not keeping some scope and base sets like those that are only a single digit away from matching.

#3 - This is a scope that most collectors don't realize was used on some of the early M40A1's. These matte black Redfield gen 2 scopes are most known for their use on the 6257xxx M40's that were made after the 1968 GCA. All of those later M40's can be documented to various military branches, except to the Marine Corps. To my knowledge, there has never been a 6257xxx M40 with USMC provenance discovered. The known M40 serial number list in DFA vol. 1 only goes up to 322xxx for USMC M40's. Even though we don't have proof of the Corps using these later M40's, we do have proof that the Corps did use the Redfield gen 2 matte black scopes on this M40A1's. This is an older M40 matte black scope with a period correct Redfield 700SA scope base. Its a great set that would be an interesting addition to any early M40A1 clone build. There are far less matte black scopes known than the greenies, but these black scopes cost a lot less than the green ones, which makes this a more cost effective option for a clone builder that is looking for any type of original Redfield USMC scope.

#4 - The Marines tested 2 different versions of the Redfield Widefield scope. This scope and the following scope are both examples of the 2 different Widefield scopes. This version of the Widefield has a unique coating on it, which is some kind of paint or similar coating. This is completely different than all the other Redfield scopes, which were all anodized. The Widefield gets it's name from it's wide lenses, which is very different than the regular circular lenses on the other Redfield scopes. This is a very rare type of scope, there's probably only 4 or 5 of these scopes known to exist.

#5 - This is another type of Redfield Widefield scope, but instead of having a painted finish, it has a sandblasted finish that was then anodized black. The sandblasted finish is completely unique to this type of Widefield scope, the other Redfield scopes have a matte appearance from being brushed. According to Colonel Norm Chandler, 100 of theze Widefields were ordered from Redfield, but only 2 of them were able to hold a zero. Chandler had his Marines return the 98 unserviceable scopes, gave 1 of the working scopes to a 2112 and he kept this second working scope for his personal collection. No one knows where the 2nd sandblasted Widefield scope is or what Redfield dis with the other 98 scopes, so this scope is the only known example.

#6 - Here is the scope that everyone thinks of when they think of an M40A1. This is an original Unertl MST-100 and is one of the first 25 prototype scopes that was sent to the Corps in 1980 for evaluation. These first 25 Unertl MST-100's were mounted in Redfield welded mounts that were made from Redfield medium rings that were attached to 40X bases and 700SA bases. This is the combination I recommend to clone builders who either can't find an original USMC Unertl mount or don't want to pay the exorbitantly high price for one. The Unertl mount was actually modeled from the Redfield welded base/rings sets, even copying the underscrew rings. The Marines started ordering more of these scopes from Unertl in 1982 and those subsequent scopes shipped with Unertl mounts.

#7 - Not pictured, Weaver T-10

Here's a very rare USMC photograph of a Scout Sniper using an M40A1 with a Widefield scope. Look very carefully at the objective lens and you'll see that it is oblong, not circular.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

The most difficult part of any M40A1 clone is the scope mount, this is where I get the most questions from people who are working on a build. Almost everyone wants to use a USMC Unertl scope mount, but they're extremely rare and currently cost $4,000+! Since this mount is out of reach for the vast majority of A1 cloners, I always recommend using a Redfield 700SA scope base and Redfield medium height 1" scope rings with 2 underscrews. This Redfield scope base/ring set is 100% correct for a USMC M40A1 build, and the parts are much cheaper and much easier to find (base and rings can be found on ebay for under $100 total!). Since there's a ton of information on this base/ring set I'm not going to put any of it in this thread. Instead, I'll be starting a new thread that specifically deals with just those parts. Please hold any questions you have about the Redfield 700SA base/rings for that thread, thanks!

#1 - Redfield 40X scope base with Redfield medium height 1" scope rings, serial number 322706 engraved on the left side. I included this base/ring set because of the serial number on the side of the base, I think that it would go well with either one of the rifle receivers, since two of them are also 322xxx serial numbers (322235 and 322693). The interesting part about these 322xxx scope bases is they're engraved with the serial number in the center of the left side, instead of in the front of the left side like the 221xxx and 224xxx scope bases from 1966. These later 322xxx rifles were made in the first few months of 1968, so different people were working on these rifles and they marked the bases differently (the handwriting is also different from the people who marked the previous 221xxx/224xxx scope bases). This set and the one below it aren't welded together.

#2 - Redfield 40X scope base with Redfield medium height 1" scope rings, serial number 322741 engraved on the left side. This set is almost the exact same as the previous set, it just has a different serial number and has more wear from field use. Just like the previous base/ring set, this set would go well with one of the two 322xxx receivers that I have for these A1 builds.

#3 - This is an extremely rare and interesting scope mount, it was made by welding a Redfield 40X base and rings together to create a homogeneous mount. The Marines had issues with their separate scope base/ring pieces during the Vietnam War, so after the war they decided to find a stronger mounting solution. The easiest route for them to go was to just weld their existing scope bases and rings together, which worked out very well. These welded mounts were so good that Unertl pretty much copied this exact setup and used it as the model for their scope mounts! Look at the similarities between this scope mount and the Unertl ones below it in the photos. You can see that they replicated the welded mount down to the underscrew rings and then added some other features. Please check out post #19 below, it has more information on this welded mount. This welded mount would be perfect for an early prototype Unertl MST-100.

#4 - This is a used USMC Unertl mount with some nice wear from field use. This Unertl mount is in original condition and has never been modified by the Marines. It was based on the Redfield welded mounts, but Unertl added some other features like the clip slot and bullet nose lugs on the bottom of the mount
Thr clip slot and bullet nose cuts were already on the M40 receivers, so Unertl decided to use those features to their advantage. The lugs are hand fit by the USMC 2112's and wedge the mount into the rifle's receiver. This creates a much stronger mount and the recoil forces are concentrated at the mount's lugs, instead of the mount's receiver screws (which are obviously much weaker than the lugs). As far as I can tell, these Unertl mounts werw only used with the Unertl scopes, so they wouldn't be correct for a build using a Redfield greenie or other scope.

#5 - This Unertl mount is similar to the previous one, but it's in better condition, it's has the last 4 digits of the rifle's serial number stamped on the top of the base portion between the 2 rings and the mount has 4 tiny welds on it. This scope mount was modified by the USMC 2112's, which is a pretty rare thing to see with these mounts. The rings are set into the base and are brazed together using some solder inside the holes in the base where the scope rings are. I hope I'm using the correct terms for this process, but please help me out if I'm wrong on what I'm calling this. The Unertl mount isn't milled from one solid piece of steel, it's actually made from three pieces (base and 2 ring lowers). Sometimes this solder would break and fail to hold the ring lowers in place, so the Marines would have to weld the ring lowers to the base. You can barely see the tiny welds in the 2 photos below, the 2112's only made tiny welded pinpricks, unlike the giant nasty welds you see on a certain type of replica scope mount (those replica mounts need the large welds because they're garbage and have magnets in the ring lowers instead of being brazed into the base). This is one of the ways you can tell if a Unertl mount is real USMC, if it has massive welds it's not real. Not many Unertl mounts have this modification, so these mounts are a rare variation for collectors to find!

#6 - Not pictured, Redfield 700SA welded scope mount

 

[USMCSGT0331]

This section only has 3 original USMC M40A1 barrel choices for the the 3 clone builds, but I also have some new Schneider barrel blanks to use as well. If you don't think I should use any of these original A1 barrels on one or more of the clone builds, then say that I should use a new Schneider barrel (I have enough for each of the 3 clone builds, if need be). I'd prefer to use as many original USMC M40A1 parts as possible, but there are some situations where it might be better to use a new barrel. After all, I have no idea if any of the original barrels have any life in them or if all three are shot-out tomato stakes. I don't plan on shooting these clone rifles very much, so I'm not concerned with barrel performance. All 3 of these original USMC barrels came out of an old collection, where they were gathering dust for decades before I was able to acquire them. They're a very unique find and great pieces of history!

#1 - This is the earliest original USMC M40A1 barrel I've ever seen. It was made most likely made by Atkinson or HS Precision. IIRC, HS bought out Atkinson at some point in the late 1970's, but without that date to compare to the date on the A1 barrel, I can't be too sure which company made this barrel. The barrel is marked 7-78-308, wich stands for July 1978, .308 caliber. As far as I know, these exact markings are unique and have never been found on any other M40A1 barrels.

#2 - This is the next earliest barrel in my collection. Even though this barrel isn't dated and it doesn't have a caliber marked on it, this barrel is almost the exact same as the previous barrel. Markings aside, it's difficult to tell the 2 barrels apart, since they both have the same finish, wear pattern and crown cut. This could also be another early Atkinson or HS Precision barrel, which is an extremely rare piece of history.

#3 - This barrel was made at a much later date, compared to the previous 2 barrels. This is one of two Douglas M40A1 barrels that was used by the 2112 armorers for R&D testing. I was told that these barrels preformed great, but they were beaten out by the Schneider barrels for the next barrel contract. I'm not sure if thr other Douglas A1 R&D barrel still exists, but it's amazing that this barrel wasn't destroyed after testing and it's still around today! This would be a great candidate for a later M40A1 build with other later parts, like the Unertl scope.

#4 - Not pictured, a new Schneider barrel blank. It's not a USMC used piece, but it will definitely shoot better than the previous 3 worn out barrels.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

The heart of every rifle is the receiver, this is the absolute most important piece. After all, if you don't have a receiver, you don't have a firearm! There's a few main serial number ranges that are recorded in Colonel Norm Chandler's book, Death From Afar volume 1, and almost every clone builder tries to find a 6 digit receiver in or near these serial number ranges. There are a few 168xxx rifles that are known to be prototypes, so this is a serial number range that is seldom used by cloners. The largest serial number ranges are 221xxx, 224xxx and 322xxx, these are by far the most popular serial number ranges for cloners to use on their builds. There's 1 or 2 other 6 digit serial numbers that are known, but don't fall into these large ranges. These are anomalies and cloners don't pay too much attention to them though.

The most desirable receivers you can get are ones that fall into the 3 large serial number ranges (221xxx, 224xxx and 322xxx). However, it's very rare to find a donor rifle with one of these serial numbers, so clone builders are forced to use any 6 digit receiver that is close to these ranges (e.g. 251xxx, anything else that's not in the big 3 USMC ranges). When a donor rifle in 1 of the 3 big USMC serial number ranges does come up for auction on gunbroker, there's usually a large bidding war over it and the donor rifle can sometimes sell for $4,000+! That's how desirable donor rifles in these serial number ranges are!

I'm fortunate enough to have found 3 amazing donor rifles that are in 2 of the 3 big USMC serial number ranges. This is as close as I can get to the actual USMC issued rifle serial numbers. Remember, Chandler's serial number list is incomplete, so there's more rifles taking up serial numbers in these ranges. However, that also means that there's a few hundred civilian rifles inthese ranges as well. A few hundred civilian rifles seems like a lot, but unfortunately it isn't and donor rifles in these ranges very rarely come up for sale. The 3 donor receivers in this post are all that I could find in a decade of searching! This is only what I've been able to acquire, some of my friends have also found good donor rifles in these ranges too, but that's still only a small handful out of the potential hundreds of rifles that were sold to civilians.

All 3 of these receivers need to be modified for my M40A1 builds. They each need 4 specific cuts - clip slot, thumb cut, left rail cut and the bullet nose cut. Once those specific cuts are made, the receivers need to be US rollmarked and have the surface of the receiver shot peened. These are features that are exclusive to all of the original 6 digit USMC M40 receivers.

#1 - Serial number 221698 has a thin barrel on it, but I think it would look even better with a heavy profile barrel! I think this earlier receiver would pair up nicely with and earlier stock, scope and scope mount.

#2 - Serial number 322235, this rifle also originally has a thin profile barrel on it. This later receiver amd the one below it would probably look best with a later stock, scope and mount.

#3 - Serial number 322693, unlike the previous 2 receivers, this rifle has a Remington Varmint Special profile barrel on it. What's interesting about this barrel profile is that it's pretty much the exact same as the USMC M40 barrels. Remington offered this barrel profile to civilians in the mid 1960's (I need to check my notes, maybe started in 66 or 67?), but it wasn't offered to civilians in 7.62x51/.308 for another decade! For whatever reason Remington didn't want civilians to have the M40 barrel profile (Varmint Special barrel) in 7.62 like the issued guns. It took the company 10 years to finally offer this barrel profile with this caliber to civilian buyers!

 

[USMCSGT0331]

Just for fun I wanted to add another post about some of the other pieces of kit to go along with the M40A1. You guys obviously know what these MRT slings are, but some of you might not know what some of these other items are. The 3 Marbles cleaning kits on the left are dated 1914 and are pretty basic. The kits contain a 3 piece takedown cleaning rod, a bore brush and a jig for patches. The Marines had a bunch of these kits sitting in storage for decades, so it was a good opportunity to put these items to use.

The 3 blue logbooks in the center are very rare. They're original logbooks from the 1980's (according to Norm Chandler) and they've never been used. I actually have a handful of these logbooks, I was extremely lucky to find them, I've never seen any other original ones. I'm not sure what firearms they were used for, but I do have 2 of them that have stamps on the cover for 1911 pistols. So, we know that they were used with 1911's decades ago, but I'm not 100% sure if they were used with sniper rifles like the M40A1 or M70. I'm assuming they were used with these rifles and they would be correct for an M40A1 kit, but I'd like to verify this information with a snipwr who was using the A1 in the 1980's. If you're reading this post and have any information on these blue logbooks, please post your information about them (and anything else) in this thread.

Above these logbooks you'll see 2 rubber scope covers. These rubber scope covers were specifically made for the Unertl MST-100 and are also extremely rare. Besides these 2 scope covers, I think I've seen only 1 other one. These scope covers weren't very good, they tore easily and could become brittle as the aged. This is why they're so rare, they just flat out didn't survive being used by the Marines! One of these scope covers is new in it's original packaging, it's the only one I've ever seen that's new old stock in it's original bag!

The last 2 items in this photo is the Redfield rear sight, which I'll talk about in a post later in this thread, and a night vision adapter. Yep, you read that right, a night vision adapter! Unfortunately, I don't think it's correct for the M40A1, it might have been used with the early M40A3's with the Unertl MST-100 scopes. This aluminum cylinder was made from scratch by the USMC 2112's at the RTE/PWS shop, so it's not available to purchase anywhere (I only know of 1 other original that's in a friend's collection, but there's probably more of them out there in the wild).

This very rare adapter was used to attach the PVS-14 night vision monocular to the ocular housing of the Unertl MST-100 scopes! It's very basic and it only has 2 set screws (1 for the scope, 1 for the PVS-14). The adapter slides over the MST-100 ocular housing and a set screw is tightened down, which left very small circular marks on the scope. If any of you have an original MST-100, take a look at the ocular housing. If your scope shows small circular marks on it close to the end of the scope, that means one of these adapters was used on you scope at some point! One of the earliest serial number Unertl MST-100 scopes that was sold by the CMP has a ton of these circular marks on it, some sniper got a lot of use with the PVS-14 on his M40xx! I'll try to find a photo of that specific scope.

Once the adapter is on the scope, the front of the PVS-14 slides right into the other side of the adapter and has a set screw to hold it in place. The PVS-14 is only used in front of no magnification or very low magnification optics (red dot sight, reflex sight, Trijicon ACOG RCO, etc.) and is used behind optics with higher magnification (Unertl MST-100, S&B M8541 SSDS, etc.). I'm not aware of any photos showing Marines using this set-up. I also have no idea how many of these adapters were issued or if it was just a prototype thing. I'm also not sure if they were only used on the early M40A3's or if they might have been used on a few very late M40A1's. If any of you guys have information on this extremely rare piece of USMC sniping history, please post it in this thread, we'd love to hear more about this item!

Here's what this night vision adapter looks like mounted on an MST-100 with a PVS-14 (this is probably the only photo on the internet showing this set-up):

 

[Random Guy]

This detailed info and all these high quality color pictures belong in a book on the M40….I hope that comes to fruition at some point. Those will be impressive replicas for sure!

 

[Jrb572]

I can say I’m jealous of your collection. I really like stock #3 just because it’s different. But all of them are really nice.

Question on the accessories section. The tall tan looks like canvas cases on the left. Are they cleaning kits? If so would you mind showing what the rods look like or possible manufacturer of the kit.

Also what record books originally came with the M40A1. Was it just the record book in the accessories section.

 

[pmclaine]

Beautiful stuff Ryan.

Amazes me to think how little thought the guy handing over his weapon ID card gave to the rifle handed back through the cage.

Sure they may have obsessed with how clean and functional the rifle was but I doubt any thought "Oh man look the crowns on our rifle barrels don't match. You must have a Mk I Type 2 crown cut!"

I remember seeing these when they were in service and with their well worn, casual yet careful handling, thinking to myself "My God this is sad. We are supposed to be the worlds greatest but these Rifles are just plain, dirty, covered with tape, crap." While in my mind I had the image of how sleek and dangerous the Draganuv looked. How could these Fudd Rifles compare?

Yes youth is dumb.

It's too bad that we don't get in better physical condition as we age so that we could use wisdom along with a body better suited to life in the mil.

Love that crown on barrel number 2. Requested similar on my just built "Modern M40". Best description I got is to call it the "Wideband" crown or describe it to people I think may know what I'm talking about as an "Atkinson" crown.

I wonder how that barrel endeavor is making out? I thought someone bought all Bill Atkinson tools and were going to build barrels.

 

[pmclaine]

I can say I’m jealous of your collection. I really like stock #3 just because it’s different. But all of them are really nice.

Question on the accessories section. The tall tan looks like canvas cases on the left. Are they cleaning kits? If so would you mind showing what the rods look like or possible manufacturer of the kit.

Also what record books originally came with the M40A1. Was it just the record book in the accessories section.

Marbles cleaning kits.

I have a green canvas one missing some parts. Yes please show the contents.

I've been meaning to scan EBay and get the pieces I am missing.

Would love to come across a brass rod USMC Garand cleaning kit also.

Marines use to be so smart. While the army was contracting steel rods they specified brass guessing as much for environment as barrel wear.

Now they pay colleges to tell them not to say Sir and Ma'am.

 

[pmclaine]

The picture that includes the rear sight......is there any pictorial documentation of any M40 series having irons installed?

 

[Skunk]

The picture that includes the rear sight......is there any pictorial documentation of any M40 series having irons installed?

I’m guessing the sight mounting clearance in stock No.4 is the unique aspect 0331 hinted at…?

 

[pmclaine]

I’m guessing the sight mounting clearance in stock No.4 is the unique aspect 0331 hinted at…?

Ohhhhh My.

Nice catch.

 

[Jrb572]

I’m guessing the sight mounting clearance in stock No.4 is the unique aspect 0331 hinted at…?

Never spotted that until you mentioned it.

 

[Skunk]

In probably 2008, I sat down with Kelly McMillan at the SHOT show and talked to him about McMillan’s role in the development of the M40A1.

He explained that the very first A1’s were built at the McMillan shop and not in Quantico. He justified this by saying the Marines were not set up to inlet stocks, and in light of the fact Winchester bottom metal was to be used, McMillan did not have a standard inlet to cut. So, according to Kelly, a few guns were completely built at McMillan and later shipped to Quantico as models for the Marines to copy once their machining practices/procedures were developed.

I wonder if barrel No. 1 is one of those barrels done at McMillan, as evidenced by the “308” as opposed to the 762 that would be expected from the Marines.

Just a guess….

ETA - I have my notes from this interview somewhere.

 

[Skunk]

My vote:

Stock 2
Receiver 2
Barrel 2
Mount 3
Scope 6

I’d love to set my “early” rifle up like that, but I don’t have the mount.

 

[Jrb572]

Stock 3
scope 2w/mount
barrel 4
action 1

I just like something a little different

 

[USMCSGT0331]

My vote:

Stock 2
Receiver 2
Barrel 2
Mount 3
Scope 6

I’d love to set my “early” rifle up like that, but I don’t have the mount.

I really appreciate you and Jrb572 putting up your idea for builds, thank you for the ideas and keeping this thread going! That stock #2 would look awesome with the unmarked barrel and the Unertl scope in the welded Redfield mount! That's pretty much replicating what was on the cover of the April 1981 issue of Gung Ho magazine (I'll see if I can dig up that photo). The crazy thing is that the #3 mount I have is the exact mount from that photograph! It's extremely easy to verify, the welds on the mount are unique and they match up 100% with the one I own. I think it would be awesome to replicate that Marine's set-up!

What mount don't you have, one of the welded Redfields? I have a few of them, do you have anything interesting for trade? Maybe we can work out a deal and get a real welded mount on one of your awesome rifles! Shoot me a PM whenever you have time and we can chat.

Edit: I found the photo of the Marine using the set-up you described. Look carefully at the welds on the welded mount on the magazine cover and in my father's high resolution photograph of the mount. All I need to complete the package is that field expedient bipod made from sticks! What a great set-up, thank you for bringing this up, it alao gives me the opportunity to post these photos! I bet the sniper in this photo had no idea that 41 years later a bunch of gun nerds would be discussing the scope mount he's using, lol.

Stock 3
scope 2w/mount
barrel 4
action 1

I just like something a little different

Thanks again for putting up your idea for a build! This would be a killer set-up, stock #3 is my favorite one in the group and it would look great with the greenie! 221xxx receiver to go with the early optic and a new barrel so that it will actually shoot well. This is the kind of stuff I'm looking for, great ideas that's cohesive and usable. This set-up would be right at home at one of the PWS Heritage Matches they hold a few times a year. It fits in perfectly as a great vintage set-up and I might be a little competitive with a fresh barrel. I'd really like to do this build if I can make it out to one of those matches!

 

[Jrb572]

That’s badass that mount is on the cover of a magazine.

I hope this thread keeps going. Even though my build has been a nightmare and still rearing its ugly head I really like theses rifles. One day I hope my rifle is finally back in the safe because I really enjoy shooting it.

I am going to see if the smith that has it now can beef up my TMA scope mount so it’s not the next problem the rifle has And it would be nice to get rid of the ugly ass welds on it.

I would love to go to a PWS heritage match with mine. Is anyone allowed to attend?

 

[Skunk]

The rifle on that magazine cover is exactly what I was thinking about when I gave my vote. Just need to find that Unertl with the strange windage knob!

 

[Mister Ridge]

Did the stocks get slimmer as time went on?

 

[USMCSGT0331]

This detailed info and all these high quality color pictures belong in a book on the M40….I hope that comes to fruition at some point. Those will be impressive replicas for sure!

Thank you for the compliment, but these are just shitty cellphone photos, they don't compare at all to the photos my father takes. He's still working though all the M40 parts and helping me document all of these pieces of history. Eventually all of his M40xx photos will be available for everyone to see and enjoy, I'm just waiting for the right time to release them all.

I can say I’m jealous of your collection. I really like stock #3 just because it’s different. But all of them are really nice.

Question on the accessories section. The tall tan looks like canvas cases on the left. Are they cleaning kits? If so would you mind showing what the rods look like or possible manufacturer of the kit.

Also what record books originally came with the M40A1. Was it just the record book in the accessories section.

Stock #3 is awesome and it's my favorite too! Just something about the molded in paint and the fiberglass showing through the gel coat that makes the stock look amazing! It's an extremely rare variation and I never thought I'd have a chance to purchase one, so I'm extremely happy and fortunate to have found this one.

It was already answered, but the canvas kits are the old WWI cleaning kits that were repurposed for use with the M40A1's. I'll post a few photos of these kits later. I'm not sure what logbook was used with the issued A1's or if they used more than one type over the years. I actually have a few old logbooks that I purchased from Col. Chandler, maybe 3 or 4 different variations. I need to talk to some older 2112's and snipers at some point, maybe someone will have that specific information.

Or maybe someone currently reading this thread knows the answer. I just figured that the little blue logbooks were at least a few decades old and might be correct for a 1980's vintage sniper rifle. If these small blue logbooks aren't correct, I'll replace them with ones that are period correct.

I remember seeing these when they were in service and with their well worn, casual yet careful handling, thinking to myself "My God this is sad. We are supposed to be the worlds greatest but these Rifles are just plain, dirty, covered with tape, crap." While in my mind I had the image of how sleek and dangerous the Draganuv looked. How could these Fudd Rifles compare?

I remember the very first time I saw an M40A3, it was one of those life changing moments for me. I had just gotten to 1/4's STA platoon on March 5, 2007 and when I walked into the Hog's Den I was greeted by 7 stunning M40A3's! The first thing I did was walk up to them and I was almost tackled by one of the HOGs when I reached down to pick one up, lol. Apparently it was this platoon's tradition to earn the right to touch or handle one of the sniper rifles, and since I hadn't passed the Indoc yet, they were off limits to me. The Indoc lasted several weeks and I made the selection for the platoon. A few days later we took the rifles out of the armory and my team leader handed me his issued rifle for me to look at. I fell in love with the A3 rifles and I always looked forward to shooting them at the range and dragging them down the stalk lane. Since I never had a chance to go to the sniper school, I'm not a Scout Sniper and I was never issued an M40A3. But I was my team leader's spotter and I got to shoot his issued A3 as often as we could get range time.

Here I am shooting my team leader's M40A3:

I'm still close friends with my team leader, here his is with his issued A3:

I was in the Corps when we had A3's, so I missed out on the A1's, which is the rifle topic of this thread. The only time I ever saw a M40A1 was when we were in Iraq in 2008/09. It was in the armory at Camp Baharia (Fallujah, Iraq) and had escaped the A3 upgrade process. One of the old 8541 snipers used the rifle during this deployment, it might have been the last time or one of the last times an M40A1 was used by a Marine in a combat zone. The unit that replaced us didn't use the XM3's we left them, so I doubt they used the A1 we left them. I wish I had some photos of that rifle and I'm always wondering what happened to it after Camp Baharia was demilled.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

The rifle on that magazine cover is exactly what I was thinking about when I gave my vote. Just need to find that Unertl with the strange windage knob!

I knew right away which rifle you were describing in your post! Lol

 

[Average guy]

The rifle on that magazine cover is exactly what I was thinking about when I gave my vote. Just need to find that Unertl with the strange windage knob!

I totally agree with your build components. This is the iconic “ money shot “ for an A1

 

[gbernardski]

I have a strong love for the HTG M40A1 stock, all of them. It's what got me into the M40 game. It's a tough choice for me, but I'd choose 2 for this project.

For a Scope, most can admit the original green scopes are sex on a stick. However, I'd choose scope 3 for this. They are just a bit more robust than the green scopes and I like the black on that stock. Also, as a side note it'd be awesome if you could do a specific write up on that scope. I'd like to learn more about those. I've learned the difference between the green gen 1 and the commercial black gen 1. I'd like to see what the differences are in the one you have vs. a commercial gen 2.

The mount I would choose would be 3 even though the scope comes with its original one. I think by then they'd be using the bottom screw style more than the top screw and most would be welded that were using the bottom screw.

I'd use barrel 1, and action 3. Not sure if you covered this or not, but are you going to black oxide the action and barrel? I always love the look of fresh black oxide on a barreled action with issued parts.

However, I don't think you could go wrong with any combo!

 

[Chabrone]

My vote is

Receiver #1 in 221
Stock #2 (I just like a little more character but #1 might be a better green match)
Barrel #1
Scope #2 with 221 and matching 221 mount

I could be getting confused on which scope was 221, I think first post said #1 scope was 221 but post with scope descriptions said #2….so whichever one is 221 with mount, do that one.

Save the barrel blanks for a clone or your shooter so the only thing on this one that isn’t og is the receiver.

 

[BEJ762]

I would have to go with...

Stock 2
Scope 6
Mount 3
Barrel 2
Receiver 1

Honestly, I don't think a bad selection can be made out of your collection. Good luck and keep us posted as to the progress.

 

[D_TROS]

Cool post. I would also go early as the greenie is penciled 221xxx serial number.


Cool pic on the crowns. I remember 12 is yrs ago there was several pages arguing the crowns.


Cant let this thread die. would be cool if you posted in M40A1 thread...
and good job on the nomenclature. Everything you posted is accurate as far as I know.

Only thing I would add (im sure you know) is that around stock 5 they became known as semi-smears, which were the precursors to the woodland. There are also no less than 3 iterations of the semi-smears as well as iterations of the woodlands similar to the smears progression.

by my count 12 stocks in total to get them all...haha. Too bad they cost so much now such a collection will never be...Ive owned 20 different smears since 2008 but sold most to get other cool stuff. I didnt know the prices would skyrocket ugh lol. I believe the most I paid was 900 and I traded my last woodland for a mk13mod0 stock...my how the times have changed. I liked it better when us poors could play. I dont think I will ever get a matte redfield for my 6257xxx m40...


The semi smears have long been my favorite. Cool stocks regardless.


Are you making a book?
I know there has been lots of drama with various forums with diff people over the past 10 years and feelings getting hurt etc etc

BUT with several people threatening us with a good time of a book, I just wanted to say I hope you stay strong and do a book. And if you need more pics of more stocks I believe I have over 300 pics...If you dont do a book let me know I might. not sure how many would sell tho. would have to be pretty thorough...with all our spare time right?? ok im out lol.

I would have to look but I believe there are 3 stocks that are one of a kind. The "finger" smear, a blue one (yellow and grn mixed), and a gray one. so many cool designs over the years.

interesting stock #4 having the iron sight cut out or is it a bolt stop cut out? any documentation for this? I had a couple smears with the bipod stud in front of the sling swivel, but have never seen this cut out on stock 4. there have been dozens of stocks that were bought early because they were cheap and tons of modifications were done not limited to m5 bottom metal, different inlets etc... be cool to see some history for yours.









Regards
DT

 

[j-huskey]

The picture that includes the rear sight......is there any pictorial documentation of any M40 series having irons installed?

Once upon a time, the Army M24 kit came with the redfield rear sight and big bore front sight. The barrel was drilled and tapped for the base. I have personally seen m24's with the front base on them.
I have never seen a m40a1 with such, rear base or front base, much less any kit with a sight. And that means nothing in itself, bc I am no-one of what matters.

Conjecture on the sight with M40A1 would be something around the time of the M24 coming out with them and a "similar M40A1 package" created for r&d or beancounter purposes,

or maybe just a 2112 saw the m24 kit and thought they would do one, or a sniper who cross trained wanted it bc of the Redfield scope failures that were known at the time.
Conjecture..

At some point in my failing memory, the sights also disappeared from the m24 kits and every now and they you would find the black plastic box with sight stuff and the magnum bolt at gun shows. I had one once upon a time.
Not sure where it got off to.

Just a failing memory here for commentary on the sight deal, where I know they were used in sniper history.

Best to yall.

And a ps to DTros...
My current regret on the smear stocks is "once upon a time" I "had" AND went through my model 70 phase (that I'm still in) and got rid of ALL my 700 stuff, including a Remington M40 remake nib...

I wish I'd kept one. Just one.
Even though I love the M40A1 platform, as most of my 70's are in that vein, and the FBI Sniper rifles are in that vein with the HTG stocks,
if I had a M40A1 Remington, I'd have a newer scope on it because I hated those old Redfields with a passion. Bc of the melting range finder deal, their uselessness once I shot a mildot, followed by hating the 10x unertl bc setting it up was a pita compared to the 10X Ultra on the M24.

In a moment of what my friends thought was pure insanity, I started to open up a smear from usmc m40a1 to a short action 70.... my friends were pulling out Ben Franklin's and screaming NO NO NO NO NO....
Ben won...
Such are memories.. at a certain age, those memories are painful as f, because of all that is lost, all those old Sniper guys who mentored me are gone, and I'm at an age where I know where the train station is, and my ticket is in my pocket. Just sayin..
Best to yall.

 

[Average guy]

Cool post. I would also go early as the greenie is penciled 221xxx serial number.


Cool pic on the crowns. I remember 12 is yrs ago there was several pages arguing the crowns.


Cant let this thread die. would be cool if you posted in M40A1 thread...
and good job on the nomenclature. Everything you posted is accurate as far as I know.

Only thing I would add (im sure you know) is that around stock 5 they became known as semi-smears, which were the precursors to the woodland. There are also no less than 3 iterations of the semi-smears as well as iterations of the woodlands similar to the smears progression.

by my count 12 stocks in total to get them all...haha. Too bad they cost so much now such a collection will never be...Ive owned 20 different smears since 2008 but sold most to get other cool stuff. I didnt know the prices would skyrocket ugh lol. I believe the most I paid was 900 and I traded my last woodland for a mk13mod0 stock...my how the times have changed. I liked it better when us poors could play. I dont think I will ever get a matte redfield for my 6257xxx m40...


The semi smears have long been my favorite. Cool stocks regardless.


Are you making a book?
I know there has been lots of drama with various forums with diff people over the past 10 years and feelings getting hurt etc etc

BUT with several people threatening us with a good time of a book, I just wanted to say I hope you stay strong and do a book. And if you need more pics of more stocks I believe I have over 300 pics...If you dont do a book let me know I might. not sure how many would sell tho. would have to be pretty thorough...with all our spare time right?? ok im out lol.

I would have to look but I believe there are 3 stocks that are one of a kind. The "finger" smear, a blue one (yellow and grn mixed), and a gray one. so many cool designs over the years.

interesting stock #4 having the iron sight cut out or is it a bolt stop cut out? any documentation for this? I had a couple smears with the bipod stud in front of the sling swivel, but have never seen this cut out on stock 4. there have been dozens of stocks that were bought early because they were cheap and tons of modifications were done not limited to m5 bottom metal, different inlets etc... be cool to see some history for yours.









Regards
DT

Be very cool to be able to purchase a definitive history on aspects of these rifles.

 

[moosemeat]

Best thread ever. So much info here. Please continue.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

The picture that includes the rear sight......is there any pictorial documentation of any M40 series having irons installed?

I’m guessing the sight mounting clearance in stock No.4 is the unique aspect 0331 hinted at…?

Never spotted that until you mentioned it.

interesting stock #4 having the iron sight cut out or is it a bolt stop cut out? any documentation for this?

Regards
DT

Once upon a time, the Army M24 kit came with the redfield rear sight and big bore front sight. The barrel was drilled and tapped for the base. I have personally seen m24's with the front base on them.
I have never seen a m40a1 with such, rear base or front base, much less any kit with a sight. And that means nothing in itself, bc I am no-one of what matters.

Conjecture on the sight with M40A1 would be something around the time of the M24 coming out with them and a "similar M40A1 package" created for r&d or beancounter purposes,

or maybe just a 2112 saw the m24 kit and thought they would do one, or a sniper who cross trained wanted it bc of the Redfield scope failures that were known at the time.
Conjecture..

I was going to save this information for my book, but since you guys really like this thread with all the information/photos that I'm sharing, I've decided to reveal something very cool to you gentlemen.

As far as I can tell, there were only 3 types of M40 variants across 3 different military branches that might have had iron sights (I can only verify 1 of the 3 that actually used the iron sights). There's only 1 USMC M40xx variation that used iron sights, and it was an extraordinarily rare type of M40A1 that was used in 1977. I've seen a few Navy "M40" type rifles that had a similar cut-out in the wood stocks, but I have never been able to verify if they ever used iron sights or if the stock cut-out was done in preparation for it but never actually used. There was also around 36 Air Force M40's (6257xxx serial number range) that were converted to short action M24's by the AMU a while back. These short action M24's with M40 receivers were used in the All Army Matches or whatever (I honestly don't know much about them). These M40/M24's had the bases for iron sights installed, but I don't know if they ever used the iron sights. @sinister, if I recall, you might have had a hand in this stuff. If so, can you please provide us with some information and photos? We truly appreciate your help and your insanely deep knowledge on all sorts of rifles, I just hope you can help us out with this one too!

You guys have sharp eyes spotting the cut-out on the left side of that McMillan A1 stock! That cut-out was done by the USMC 2112's in 1977 and a Redfield rear sight was attached at that location to the receiver. The Redfield rear sight in one of my previous posts in this thread is actually the correct rear sight for this M40A1 variation! Only 6 of these iron sight M40A1's were used in the Romanian Cup match in 1977, which the USMC team won! There's only 2 photos from this match, the photos show the Marine Corps shooting team with a few of their iron sight M40A1's (I have the photos, but I've been told to not share them at this time).

Six M40A1's were modified to be used in this shooting match, and the smear stock in my previous post is the only one known to still exist. This stock came from Colonel Norm Chandler's personal collection and it's been owned by a few people over the past decade. I recently came into possession of it and had my father take some very nice photos of it. The stock is now with an advanced collector who plans on building it to the original Romanian Cup specs!

This is the best of the best when it comes to M40A1 stocks! In addition to the cut-out on the left side of the stock, someone long ago scratched "RC77" into the bedding of the stock. This was probably done to commemorate the Romanian Cup 1977 shooting match.

I have some great photos of this stock, but I'm saving them for my project. However, I will share 1 photo with you gentlemen:

 

[USMCSGT0331]

I just wanted to thank everyone who posted compliments about this thread and added their own build ideas using the M40A1 pieces that I show in various posts. This thread took a ton of time to set-up with photos and information, so it's nice to see that people actually enjoyed it! Thank you everyone who has commented and participated in the fantasy builds!

I finally got around to filling in a few of the posts I made about various parts (please go back and check out some of the previous posts in this thread) and I was finally able to respond to a few of the your posts. I really hope we can keep this thread going, I think it's a great resource for collectors and cloners. The original purpose was to have fun choosing out available parts for an M40A1 build, but I soon realized that this has become a data bank for almost all of the known parts that were used in the M40A1's across 4 decades! This is the only thread on the internet where you can find all of this information and photos, it's quite a value resource for those who are interested in this topic.

A few of you asked if I'm writing a book or working on anything right now. I am indeed working on a book and I've been collecting information/photos for a few years now. However, I'm probably still a few years away from completion, there's just so much more left to do. My friends have been sending me original USMC parts, such as smear stocks, to be photographed.

My goal is to photograph and catalog as many original USMC parts as I possibly can. That way I can have a massive sample size of just about everything, which will show every single variation or whatever known. This process takes a ton of time! My father is the person doing all the photography and it takes him a very long time to photograph each item. For example, it probably took him 9+ hours to photograph and post process just the RC77 smear stock! I then need to organize everything and do a writeup on each item. I'm not worried about the writing, you guys know how much boring and tedious detailed information I can fit into my posts! The bottleneck is the photography and I try to help with anything I can, but it's just a long process.

I'm also very reluctant to post many of the high quality photographs my father is currently working on. I know you guys want to see all of these rifles and parts in all their high resolution glory, but I want to save everything for the book. Sometimes I'll breakdown and post the really good photos, but most of the time I'm giving you guys the best I can do with my phone's camera. Please know that I'm not trying to be secretive with my photos/information because I want to keep everything all to myself, it's only because I want to properly publish everything in the absolute best reference book imaginable. Everything I know and all the photos I have and more will be published for everyone to see. It takes time, but in the end you guys will have all of it!

As I get items photographed, I sometimes decide to sell them. My friends have benefitted from this over the past 2 years, they've been able to get some absolutely amazing pieces of history from me! I'm only going to hang onto the basic stuff I need for a collection. After everything is photographed and documented it will be passed on to other collectors to enjoy. I've even given away some parts to people, I've given away for free a beautiful greenie scope, several Redfield 40X bases and several Redfield welded mounts. When my book is finally released, I plan on doing a raffle for a few original USMC M40 parts (such as Redfield 40X bases). Everyone who buys a book will automatically be entered in and I'll draw a few winners. How does that sound to you guys? I think it's a pretty cool way to release a reference book!

I've also given away dozens of original Redfield 700SA base/ring sets that I acquired from Chandler long ago. He said they're M40A1 Transitional rifle take-offs from when the Unertl mounts replaced the Redfield stuff. There's no way to verify that they are 100% what he says they are, so I gave all of them away to people on the forums who needed a way to mount a scope on their M40A1 build. I never asked for a penny in return, not even to pay for shipping. I'll make a separate post about these Redfield 700SA base/ring sets sometime soon, so that you guys will have all the information on those.

I've been doing everything I can to help our community, whether it's providing pics/info on the forums, helping people with builds by answering questions and tracking down rare parts, giving away original USMC M40 takeoff parts for free, donating rifles to the Scout Sniper Association in order to raise money to support the organization's mission, volunteering a ton of time to work with the SSA on various projects, and trying to write a reference book on the entire M40 series of sniper rifles. I'm trying my best with everything, and some of this stuff takes time away from my research and writing. Just please give me some more time to work on the reference book, there's so much information that I have, it's almost overwhelming. There's so much information that's never been published before, it's a pretty large project. I just want the book to be perfect and do the best I can to document and preserve Marine Corps and M40 history for future generations, it just needs to be done correctly.

Not only will I do a drawing for original USMC 40X bases or whatever for the people who purchase my book, but I also have something extremely cool planned for the first 100 copies of the book! I'm not going to say anything about it, except that you guys will want to get one of those first hundred books, they will be special

 

[j-huskey]

@MarinePMI
Tim, will you please sticky this one ???
Please, please ?

 

[Belvedere]

As someone who has personally benefited from your generosity I can't thank you enough. I'd say everyone here is glad to have you sharing everything you know and your father's photography. Your book will be awesome to see. It's threads like these that remind me why I became a history major. Discovery and documentation of history. Never thought I'd own any of that history myself. It's interesting to me that I got out of the Marines in '99. Never really thought much about it until one day I started looking back at all the stuff I'd done and places I'd been. Lead me down the path of trying to piece one of these together and I was in 'tracks never in infantry myself. Good stuff.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

@MarinePMI
Tim, will you please sticky this one ???
Please, please ?

Thank you for asking a Mod to tack this thread up in the Vintage Section! I put a lot of work into this thread, and I'm happy that everyone is enjoying it and finding the pics/info to be useful!

As someone who has personally benefited from your generosity I can't thank you enough. I'd say everyone here is glad to have you sharing everything you know and your father's photography. Your book will be awesome to see. It's threads like these that remind me why I became a history major. Discovery and documentation of history. Never thought I'd own any of that history myself. It's interesting to me that I got out of the Marines in '99. Never really thought much about it until one day I started looking back at all the stuff I'd done and places I'd been. Lead me down the path of trying to piece one of these together and I was in 'tracks never in infantry myself. Good stuff.

I'm glad that I was able to help with your build! I can't remember, did you get a set of rings off ebay? Please let me know if there's anything else that I can help you with! Semper Fi, buddy!

 

[Belvedere]

Sure did. Nothing like the look of old steel and bluing. I think when I put it together I'll just leave it as is. I like the look of well worn items. Ones that look like they just came out of PWS are nice I just prefer the in the Fleet look. I remember seeing an A1 that someone had done the aging to it. Can't remember where. I'll have to start a folder of pics on the web.

 

[Belvedere]

Also found a nice "vintage" MRT '77 sling for it.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

Sure did. Nothing like the look of old steel and bluing. I think when I put it together I'll just leave it as is. I like the look of well worn items. Ones that look like they just came out of PWS are nice I just prefer the in the Fleet look. I remember seeing an A1 that someone had done the aging to it. Can't remember where. I'll have to start a folder of pics on the web.

Also found a nice "vintage" MRT '77 sling for it.

That's fantastic, congrats on getting all these parts for your build! I hope you and other guys who got the Redfield 700SA bases will post photos with them on the clone builds! I always like seeing people use the parts I send them!

 

[Average guy]

@MarinePMI
Tim, will you please sticky this one ???
Please, please ?

100 percent agree. This is an archive of knowledge

 

[Average guy]

I bought some AI mags you posted awhile back. I use and treasure the mags. It’s obvious from wear and remaining paint the could tell their own story. Super cool to have them.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

I was going to make a separate thread about the M40A1 Transitional rifles that used the Redfield 700SA base/ring set, but I decided to add all of that information to this thread. Like I said before, I originally started this M40A1 thread with the intention of just having a little bit of fun mixing and matching A1 parts for cool build ideas. I actually did need input from you guys, because I need to get my 3 M40A1's built. However, the purpose of this thread changed course when I kept adding more and more information about the M40A1 series, and now this thread has become a valuable resource for all sorts of M40A1 information.

If you guys don't mind, I'm just going to keep adding M40A1 information to this thread, instead of starting multiple other threads about A1 stuff. Since more information about A1's will be added to this thread, this will become a "one stop shop" for everything M40A1 related! No one will have to chase down random threads that may or may not have any useful information. Instead, people can just look through this thread to find the M40A1 information they need. I'm also inviting all of you guys to add your own photos and information to this thread as well! Let's make this thread a gold mine of M40A1 knowledge!

So, without further ado, here's the story about all of the Redfield 700SA bases and Redfield medium height rings that I gave away to fellow collectors:

Many years ago I purchased a few dozen sets of Redfield 700SA and 40X bases with Redfield medium rings from Colonel Norm Chandler. I bought both welded and not welded sets, but this post will specifically focus on the unwelded 700SA sets that I acquired from him. Also, I highly recommend that anyone interested in USMC M40's to pick up a copy of Chandler's first book, DFA Volume 1, which has a ton of legit information about very rare parts!

Chandler told me that these Redfield 700SA bases and Redfield medium height scope rings were all pulled off of the early M40A1 transitional rifles in 1982 (and the following few years) when the Marines began to receive their Unertl scopes and Unertl mounts. I have no idea if this story is true, but I trust him on being accurate with his information. I've purchased a ton of original M40 items from him over the past decade, so it made sense to pick up these 700SA sets when he offered them to me. And just in case anyone is wondering, Chandler has been sold out of original USMC M40 takeoff parts for many years, so don't try to call him asking for original parts, there aren't any left.

The first thing you guys need to know about the unwelded 700SA base/ring sets is that almost every single base is the exact same type of 700SA base (Redfield made many different types of 700SA bases). These bases also happen to be the exact same type of 700SA base that's on some of my original Redfield 700SA welded mounts (I actually have 2 different types of 700SA welded mounts) and all of the rings show the same wear patterns. This isn't just coincidence to have all of these be the correct parts with the same wear, so it lends credence to Chandler's story about the USMC provenance.

But..... it's still just a story that can't be 100% confirmed. I refuse to sell any of these sets since there isn't any 100% rock solid proof to back up the claim that these unwelded Redfield 700SA base/ring sets are legit USMC M40A1 takeoff parts. So, for the past few years I've been sending these Redfield 700SA base/ring sets out to guys from the forums who doing A1 builds. And all of these to everyone for free (I even covered all the shipping fees). Most collectors don't have the money to purchase an extremely expensive Unertl mount or have time to try to find one, so this is a great way to share some USMC heritage with my fellow collectors/historians while still remaining clone correct. These Redfield 700SA base/ring parts were used from the mid 1970's all the way past 1982, so they were in use for the better part of a decade and they're irrefutably clone correct.

Here's a few photos of the Redfield 700SA base/ring set I just grabbed from the group of them. It's definitely a used set and I love the wear the rings get on the left side. The rifle is almost always layed down on it's left side, so this side of the rifle gets more wear than the right side. I don't know anyone who lays a rifle on the ground with the bolt down (unless taking a few photos), so the right side of the rifle and it's parts typically show less wear. This is consistent with the vast majority of the scope rings I have. In the photos below you can see that the left side of the rings have much more wear than the right side.

Some of these Redfield 700SA base/ring sets were left alone, like the one above, but others were welded together to create a stronger mounting system. Here's a few photos showing an original USMC M40A1 Redfield 700SA welded mount (top) with a Redfield 700SA base/ring set that I got from Chandler and gave to a cloner on the M14 Forum (bottom). This allows you to see the similarities between these mounts and how they're welded.

The 2112 armorers had to cut a channel in the front ring in order to access the mount's front receiver screw. Normally, the base would be screwed to the receiver, then the rings were attached. However, this obviously wasn't possible to do with everything welded together, so this is an absolutely necessary modification when using a 700SA base on a welded mount. The cut in the front ring was done before the ring was welded to the base. Here's a photo of this modification done to the original USMC Redfield 700SA welded mount, but not on the Redfield 700SA base/ring set. If someone plans on welding the 700SA base/ring set together, then thry would need to make this cut. Otherwise, is someone wanted to leave the Redfield 700SA base/ring set as is, they don't need to make this cut, since the front scope ring can be twisted off and exposes the front receiver screw in the scope base.

And the last piece of information I have is that the windage screws on the Redfield 700SA and 40X bases are not welded, only the rings are welded:

I included some information on the welded mounts at the end of this post, but I'll make a separate post that specifically discusses the welded mounts.

 

[Skunk]

This is an example of a welded original mount.

Sorry, DW..this one’s not available either.

 

[CUTRIGHT]

Did any variant of the M40 use a 45° or 60° chamfer for the crown?
I’m thinking I saw somewhere that at one time the muzzle was left flat faced with a deeply cut chamfer being the only recess of the crown.

 

[Belvedere]

Did any variant of the M40 use a 45° or 60° chamfer for the crown?
I’m thinking I saw somewhere that at one time the muzzle was left flat faced with a deeply cut chamfer being the only recess of the crown.

I'd look at Ryan's barrels above as examples. From what I've read they varied over the years as different 2112s would cut them. When I had my M40ish cut years ago I used this cut '45 degree .090" deep' Always liked that look.

 

[Skunk]

These are all either actual USMC sniper rifles or guns I’ve had built at PWS.

 

[USMCSGT0331]

In post #43 I discussed the Redfield 700SA base and medium ring sets that I was giving away to people doing M40A1 Transitional builds. This post is going to take the Redfield base/ring sets a step further and I'm going to show you guys the USMC 2112 modified Redfield 40X and 700SA welded mounts.

After the Vietnam War, the USMC analyzed the M40's performance in the field and they identified areas of improvement for the weapons system. One of the upgrades that was requested was a more solid scope mount, so the early transitional M40A1's had welded Redfield scope mounts.

The M40 used a Redfield 40X scope base and Redfield low rings (with 4 top screws), whereas the Transitional A1's used either a Redfield 40X or 700SA scope base and Redfield medium rings (with 2 bottom screws). Even though the scope remained the same (matte green Redfield), they increased the barrel diameter and needed the medium height rights to ensure clearance of the objective lens housing. The Corps also purchased more Redfield scope bases with the new medium height rings, these were the 700SA bases (the original USMC M40's only used the Redfield 40X base).

The first few welded Redfield bases/ring sets were very poorly done, and the early welded mounts had random sloppy welds, pinned rings and epoxy filling in gaps. The welded mounts were soon standardized and had 4 welds per scope ring (the scope base's windage screws weren't welded). The 700SA mounts needed a channel milled into the front side of the front ring, which allowed access to the front receiver screw hole. All of these modifications were done by the 2112 armorers at the RTE shop in Quantico. These welded Redfield mounts were used from the mid 1970's to about 1982, when the Corps started receiving their new Unertl scopes and mounts. However, the welded mounts could have been used after 1982 since it took a while to get the scopes and mounts from Unertl, and orders were being placed with them throughout the 1980's.

In 1980, the Corps received 25 Unertl mounts for testing, but Unertl mounts didn't exist yet. So, these first 25 Unertl scopes were used with the welded Redfield mounts. The Unertl mounts were actually based on these welded Redfield mounts, but with added features like the integral clip slot and bullet nose lugs. As a note to collectors and rifle builders/cloners, if you can't find a Unertl mount for your early A1 rifle, weld the correct Redfield base/rings into a mount and use that instead. Quite a few of these welded Redfield mounts were used for the better part of a decade (with both the Redfield and Unertl scopes), so there's plenty of historical precedence and your clone A1 will still be correct.

I have about 2 dozen original USMC welded Redfield mounts, the vast majority have 40X bases, only 5 of them have 700SA bases. The earliest welded mounts have sloppy welds and other unique characteristics (drilled and pinned front ring, epoxy filled front ring dovetail, welded rear windage screws), whereas the rest of the mounts are very standardized in the way they're made. One of the best known photographs of a welded Redfield mount being used by Corps was featured on the cover of Gung-Ho magazine in April 1981. In this photo a Scout Sniper is using an M40A1 with a very early welded Redfield mount (we know it's an early mount because of the sloppy welds) and a prototype Unertl scope.

I actually have this exact welded mount in my collection! If you compare the welds on the front right side of the mount (where the front ring attaches to the base), you can see that the magazine cover mount and the mount in my collection are the same one. I acquired this welded mount from Colonel Chandler about a decade ago, so it's provenance is solid.

Here's another very early welded mount with early features such as the hole drilled into the base (for pinning the front ring in place) and the epoxy filling the bottom of the base where the fromt ring dovetail twists on. This mount is unique because it's the only one I've ever seen that has 3 welds (instead of 4 welds) on the rear scope ring. Look closely at the front side of the rear scope ring, you'll see a weld going across the front base of the scope ring. The Marines welded this scope ring in this location because there wasn't a receiver screw hole near it. Compare this location with the other sides of the front and rear scope ring and you'll see that the other areas have receiver screw holes that prevent them from being welded like this. Since the Corps demands uniformity, they stopped welding the front of the rear scope ring and decided to do 4 welds per scope ring instead.

I like this close-up photo, so I'm including it in this post, this is the same mount as the previous photo:

Here's one of the welded mounts when they became standardized with the 4 welds per scope ring, this one has a 40X mount (notice how the front receiver screw hole isn't obstructed by the front ring):

Here's one of the 700SA welded mounts (notice how the front receiver screw hole is partially obstructed by the front ring):

The 2112 armorers had to cut a channel in the front ring in order to access the mount's front receiver screw. Normally, the base would be screwed to the receiver, then the rings were attached. However, this obviously wasn't possible to do with everything welded together, so this is an absolutely necessary modification when using a 700SA base on a welded mount. The cut in the front ring was done before the ring was welded to the base, here's a photo of this modification:

And the last piece of information I have is that the windage screws on the Redfield 700SA and 40X bases are not welded, only the rings are welded:

I'm hesitant to include this last welded mount in this post because I haven't been able to verify it's authenticity. I don't trust the person I got it from and I've never seen anything like it before. So, please take this welded mount with a massive grain of salt! It has high rings with 2 top screws, which were never used in anything else. It also has welds that are completely unlike the rest of the USMC welded mounts, even the sloppy early ones. It's almost like someone heard about the USMC welded mounts and tried to reproduce one, but without ever seeing a welded mount in person or in a photo. My guess is that it's fake, which is extremely unfortunate because someone wasted an original Redfield 40X base on it! BTW, a loose 40X base will sell for around $2,000, so if you have one, don't fuck with it!

 

[USMCSGT0331]

The M40A1 Unertl scope mounts were based on the Redfield welded mounts in my previous post. They are also created in a similar fashion by attaching 2 scope rings to a base, instead of milling everything from one piece of metal like companies currently do. Unertl even copied the 2 underscrew design that the Redfield medium height rings used.

Here's a new in box USMC Unertl scope mount that I had photographed. There's only 2 or 3 of these new in box Unertl mounts in private collections and they're just about priceless! The underside of the mount has blue discoloration from the base being heated up when the rings were attached. Each mount came with 4 screws to attach it to a Remington 700 short action receiver and a hex wrench to tighten the screws.

Some of the Unertl scope mounts in my collection. Sometimes the rings would become loose and the USMC 2112 armorers would have to add tiny spot welds to the area the rings and base meet. These welds area extremely small and are barely visible in photos. Check out the mount that's 3 down from the top, it has welds on it.

 

[macethetemplar]

Post #50!

Time for a new page!