Need suggestion from an M1 Garand Pro on setting a scope...

[Samuel Whittemore]

So right up front.. sorry for my newbieness... Learning as I go trial and error...

This is not looking like it's possible: Made an impulse scope buy thinking I'd be able to put the Ares ETR 4.5-30x56 MIL scope on my M1 using the Ultimak scope mount -- However the feedback I'm getting from the Badger scope mounts chat rep said "I'd should be looking for a cantilever mount with 0 moa, and with a fairly extreme offset so I can mount it "backwards" to bring the scope rearward.scope mount"

And then from Athlon rep said "The ETR should work fine in the traditional mounting location, not as a scout set-up."

Should I continue hammering away at this to try and make it work? Is it even possible?

Or... I dunno... maybe sell the Garand and just buy another long range rifle to stick my new scope on... I love the Garand for the historical factor and the brilliant engineering but I never shoot it (maybe all of 100 rounds thru it). Iron sights and my eyes are not happy playing together. Plus I'm far more into trying to get to 1000 yards --the reson I started this whole journy was because I was told "M1 Garnd / 1000 yards? No problem!"

 

[Ledzep]

M1 Garand, 1000 yards, no problem...

mehhh... Not really. Truthfully the M1 is a bit of a bear to get to shoot well for precision work, and by shoot well I mean under 1.5 MOA consistently.

I'm not saying it can't be done. With enough knowledge and money you can do anything... But easily? no.

To your question, That mount is meant for extended eye relief scopes and red dots. I don't know of any extended eye relief scopes that are suitable for long-range use (large internal travel, or even turrets that allow for repeatable/easy use of said travel). To get a cantilever mount that puts a traditional scope in the right place is going to block the breech and require you to remove the scope every time you want to load an en-bloc clip. Likewise on the last round of the clip, it's going to eject the clip up into the scope or mount. Nevermind brass getting caught up in the works.

Long story short, not a viable long-range option. You could get better results, easier, and cheaper with other platforms.

Not sure why you don't do well with irons, but that's the best way to shoot an M1 in my opinion. Very viable to use iron sights on torso-sized steel plates to 600yd (or even a little further). If it's a skillset issue, there's no reason not to train (properly) to get better. If it's an eyesight thing, it is what it is.

I'd be looking at Tikka CTR, Bergara B14, or some sort of AR10 platform if you're stuck on Semi-auto.

 

[Samuel Whittemore]

I'd be looking at Tikka CTR, Bergara B14, or some sort of AR10 platform if you're stuck on Semi-auto.

Nope not stuck on semi auto. Bolt is fine Sir!

 

[hlee]

If you really want to scope an m1 garand, check here...

https://m1thumbsaver.com
http://www.m14.ca/M1_GARAND_CASM_Scope Mount.html

Holbrook device replaces the operating rod catch, preventing the clip from being automatically ejected on the last shot. The CASM mount replaces the rear sight, using the sight "ears" as a mounting surface for the scope.

Either way, I think you will kick yourself for selling it, even if you don't shoot it much. I know I would. Mine doesn't get shot much, but it is in the "WILL NEVER SELL" category in my collection.

 

[Ledzep]

Yeah I'm with hlee. I have a room full of old 1800's thru 1940's rifles that don't get shot much. Hard to bring myself to sell them. The U.S. stuff is the hardest.

 

[Samuel Whittemore]

If you really want to scope an m1 garand, check here...

https://m1thumbsaver.com
http://www.m14.ca/M1_GARAND_CASM_Scope Mount.html

Holbrook device replaces the operating rod catch, preventing the clip from being automatically ejected on the last shot. The CASM mount replaces the rear sight, using the sight "ears" as a mounting surface for the scope.

Either way, I think you will kick yourself for selling it, even if you don't shoot it much. I know I would. Mine doesn't get shot much, but it is in the "WILL NEVER SELL" category in my collection.

Ok. Yeah.. didn't want to sell it. So now I won't. Thanks. It came from CMP so it's top of the line certified. Plus I made it really nice too with super nice Turner historical leather sling, one of those corset style leather cheek pads.. a CMP bayonet. Etc.

Wow... ! I'm ordering the Holbrook! THANK YOU HLEEE!
Now I'm all excited.. gonna buy another rifle for my new scope. Mmm... things are getting cluttered here...

 

[hlee]

Just bear in mind that, as designed, the leather cheek rest puts the shooter’s face off center from the rifle. The scopes on garands were mounted left of the bore to account for the loading and ejection of an enbloc clip. If historically accurate, I believe you will be hard pressed to get a good sight picture using that cheek rest and an over bore mounted scope.

 

[Samuel Whittemore]

Just bear in mind that, as designed, the leather cheek rest puts the shooter’s face off center from the rifle. The scopes on garands were mounted left of the bore to account for the loading and ejection of an enbloc clip. If historically accurate, I believe you will be hard pressed to get a good sight picture using that cheek rest and an over bore mounted scope.

Thanks for that. I think as it stands now --I'm leaving the Garand alone and instead.. because now that I have a great new scope --it gives me perfect excuse to buy another long range rifle. One can never have enough rifles...

or pistols...
or ammo...
or gear...
or...
BACON!

 

[kraigWY]

I'm with Ledzep regarding the M1:

I ran sniper schools for the NG using the M1C/Ds and M-84 scopes. The M-84 works good if one was to learn to use it properly. Many dont put in the effert.

This was the Alaska National Guard and I had a majority of Alaska Native Guardsman who simple by passed the scope. It was mounted yet they used the rifles iron sights. They were were constantly getting hits on pop up (E-Tgts) targets to 900 yards and beyond.

I couldnt complain, I was doing as well with my (non-sniper) Garand. My opinion is the sights on the M1/M14 are the best iron sights ever put on a military rifle.

Never felt the need for a scope on my Garands.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

While I'm not an expert on the M1 Garand, I am a student.

To see the most successful attempts to scope the Garand , research the M1C and M1D.

When upgraded to National Match Configuration, the M1 was only ever capable of 1-2MOA.

Garand, 1000yd, no problem may be a bit of a stretch. The standard 150gr M2 Ball cartridge is probably far from ideal for accurate shooting beyond 600yd.

It can be done, but Garand suited M-72 Match 173/175gr ammunition is a far cry from the M2 Ball stuff. First of all, its not very available nowadays, and second, the next best source is probably a handload, done by somebody who knows what they're doing and, has the Garand specifically in mind. The energy requirement for such a load are right bang up against the rifle's mechanical limits. It was never designed for such an application.

But it's a joy to shoot well using the iron sights out to 600yd, even using the M2 Ball ammunition. Mine is worked over as a shooter, is not a stock factory Garand, and is my favorite rifle to shoot.

I would not sell the Garand (it is an exquisite example of military history at its best), and I would not attempt to put an aftermarket scope on it either (I don't see any mount that would serve up the kind of accuracy I'd be wanting). Your best bet would be to get a decent factory bolt action Long Range Hunter, a Weaver V-16 Scope in decent shape, and .308 is not a bad chambering to use until your improving skills can support one that's more LR-specific.

The Garand is best at what it was designed to do; deliver combat effective performance at distances out to 500 or 600yd. Also, avoid using hunting ammunition in the Garand; it was developed to handle a specific military (M2 Ball ammunition) load that's significantly milder than Highpower Hunting loads, which can do permanent damage to the Garand's long and spindly operating rod.

Here is a selection of Garand-specific ammunition and other specialty items. The Hornady 168 gr Garand Vintage Match ammunition is better suited for 500-600yd than the M2 Ball. The Federal American Eagle 150gr is a very good equivalent to M2 Ball. Prvi-Partizan (PPU) also has a 150gr Garand load that's both good and economical, if you can find it around. I like its fired brass to reload for my Garand.

I knew Scott Duff professionally (tech writing) for some time and strongly recommend his book.

The reference to "Offset" has a different emphasis in relationship to the Garand and relates to the scope being mounted clear off to the left side of the receiver, as was the approach with the USGI M1C's and M1D's. If it's atop the receiver, the Garand Enbloc 8-Round Clip can not be inserted into the mag well, and the rifle will not function without one.

Also possibly suitable is a Long Eye Relief Scout Style scope mount that places the entire scope ahead of the receiver, and this may be related to what the badger guys was discussing with you. I don't like them myself.

I hope this helps.

Greg