Gunsmithing Octagonal/octagon-to-round barrels on boltguns?

[Son of Dorn]

Hi all. Sooner or later (hopefully sooner), I'm going to start on a Mauser build, #1 part of which is going to be rebarreling it. At the moment I'm slated just to get a plain round barrel from Lothar-Walther, more or less matching the original, but I've had a thought. Seems like, once upon a time, octagonal or octagon-to-round barrels on boltguns were a thing and I'm thinking maybe I'd like to have one on my Mauser for some style points since otherwise it'll be a pretty plain rifle. Here's a couple pics of one in the film Public Enemies, handled by Christian Bale. Y'all can see that it starts out octagonal at the chamber and turns round just about at the nose of the stock.
Rifle:

Melvin Purvis (Bale) taking aim:

Does anyone know of a barrel-maker who can do me one like that, with or without the top rib, if I elect to have it? McGowen will do a full octagon (and blue it and everything) but their twist rate for 9.3x62mm is kinda tight at 1:12 (SAAMI says 1:14.2 and that's what Lothar-Walther uses). I can contact L-W and see if they can do me one, but anyone have other suggestions?

Thank y'all,
Son of Dorn

EDIT: I've added a poll! Vote if you'd like to help me decide and leave your reasons in the comments if you want.

 

[gnochi]

Check with Preferred Barrel Blanks - I know they do octagons for T/C Encore/Contender. LRI would also almost certainly be able to do that for you on a round blank. I’d recommend waiting for the barrel to be timed and such before setting up the octagon though.

 

[Ledzep]

Anyone that does fluting should be able to do that, also. Just use an end mill instead of a profiled cutter.

 

[Son of Dorn]

Check with Preferred Barrel Blanks - I know they do octagons for T/C Encore/Contender. LRI would also almost certainly be able to do that for you on a round blank. I’d recommend waiting for the barrel to be timed and such before setting up the octagon though.

LRI; that'd be LongRifles Inc.?

 

[gnochi]

LRI; that'd be LongRifles Inc.?

Correct

 

[Son of Dorn]

Correct

Cool. I'll check with them and see what they say; might even be a good idea to have them bed the rifle and redo the bolt a little at the same time, too, if not outright complete the build for me. I believe the owner has an account on here, doesn't he?

 

[gnochi]

Cool. I'll check with them and see what they say; might even be a good idea to have them bed the rifle and redo the bolt a little at the same time, too, if not outright complete the build for me. I believe the owner has an account on here, doesn't he?

That he does! @LongRifles Inc.

 

[LRI]

We can fit you up with the barrel you need. What I will require though is an original piece or a print of what your after. Just understand that you are providing the imperical data. There's so much of this "old gun stuff" around and I do not profess to have any intimate knowledge on what is "correct" or whatever.

Give me something to go off of or copy and were rock solid.

Fair enough?

C.

 

[Son of Dorn]

We can fit you up with the barrel you need. What I will require though is an original piece or a print of what your after. Just understand that you are providing the imperical data. There's so much of this "old gun stuff" around and I do not profess to have any intimate knowledge on what is "correct" or whatever.

Give me something to go off of or copy and were rock solid.

Fair enough?

C.

If I decide to go with that style of barrel from y'all, I'll certainly do my best to get you what you need to make it happen!

 

[Kbh]

LW sells, or did sell, tapered octagon blanks with a full length rib. They're pricey but they're nice.

 

[Son of Dorn]

LW sells, or did sell, tapered octagon blanks with a full length rib. They're pricey but they're nice.

Yeah I found the one with the rib after checking the website again. I expect they could be redone for octagon-to-round; gonna ask LW if they could do that for me plus how much it'd cost to have it chambered.

 

[Satterlee]

1/2 octagon to round, generally with a full length tapered rib with integral front sight ramp, sometimes you will see them made with an integral sling swivel as well.
When properly executed the contour will actually be swamped very slightly to where the center of the barrel is .015 smaller than the muzzle. In the Mauser circles that I travel in we call it the Schilling contour. Was cool to see that rifle pop up in that movie, seems it would have made more sense if Bale had used an '03 sprg. Or maybe a '17 Enfield. I was surprised and had to look twice, damn that was a Mauser, very distinct look.

 

[Son of Dorn]

1/2 octagon to round, generally with a full length tapered rib with integral front sight ramp, sometimes you will see them made with an integral sling swivel as well.
When properly executed the contour will actually be swamped very slightly to where the center of the barrel is .015 smaller than the muzzle. In the Mauser circles that I travel in we call it the Schilling contour. Was cool to see that rifle pop up in that movie, seems it would have made more sense if Bale had used an '03 sprg. Or maybe a '17 Enfield. I was surprised and had to look twice, damn that was a Mauser, very distinct look.

The screenplay reads "[Purvis] carries an 8mm Mauser sports rifle with a slim fore-stock and wrist and a turned-down bolt handle. It's the best rifle made in 1933." It was actually a 9.3x57, not 8mm, but I expect they wanted some classic purpose-built sporter for the movie and not a converted military rifle. Of course the entire scene is kinda removed from the truth but that's OK.

I'm certainly leaning towards the oct-to-round + rib, though. Makes it more expensive but the style is undeniable.

 

[Edds]

Are you familiar with Champlin Firearms? I don't know if they will have exactly what you want but I have seen some similar stuff that came from their shop.

 

[Satterlee]

This one is an M98 where I made the action from bar stock with extended upper and lower tangs and I'm also making the stock. For the Barrel we've gone with a CM K&P blank, contoured to the Schilling profile by Morris Melani of Alaska Arms. Caliber is 338 Win.Mag. Kaufmann will be doing the engraving. Cheers.

 

[Son of Dorn]

Are you familiar with Champlin Firearms? I don't know if they will have exactly what you want but I have seen some similar stuff that came from their shop.

I am not familiar with them but I'm always open to suggestions for someone to build my projects. I had a thread somewhere where I asked for suggestions for stockmakers; maybe I'll do one for riflesmiths too. Would prefer to not have to go out-of-state for the project...

 

[chevy_man]

McGowan is one of the few I've seen doing octagons (makes me wonder if they work with Shiloh sharps).
They were more than willing to talk to me on the phone when I was asking about barrels. Twist rates should be available but you may need to call. I was told they were setting up to do cut rifling and have any twist you wanted, but the standard options are mostly button right now.

Just got a new one from them screwed on yesterday and loads made up today. Range day tomorrow to make sure it shoots as well as their others I've shot.

 

[Son of Dorn]

McGowan is one of the few I've seen doing octagons (makes me wonder if they work with Shiloh sharps).
They were more than willing to talk to me on the phone when I was asking about barrels. Twist rates should be available but you may need to call. I was told they were setting up to do cut rifling and have any twist you wanted, but the standard options are mostly button right now.

Just got a new one from them screwed on yesterday and loads made up today. Range day tomorrow to make sure it shoots as well as their others I've shot.

#1 problem with a McGowen for me is their twist rate. If they can do a half-octagon barrel for me with the rate I need and set it up for a lower price than a LW, I'll gladly go their way. Probably even have them fit and time it, install the sights and sling swivel, since they can do that and I might as well have it done at once. Not to mention wanting to make sure the bluing all matches. After that I'd just need the stock done and I'd be good to go.

 

[want2learn]

Satterlee, that's beautiful...can't wait to see the final result

 

[RTH1800]

Champlain has not built rifles for decades. They do sell classic rifles.

 

[Satterlee]

Not quite the final result but getting there, working the oil finish.

 

[SharpsNitro]

Benchmark made me a half round, half octagon barrel for an 1885 restoration project I was working on several years ago. They made the contour to my specification.

 

[Son of Dorn]

Hi y'all. Well I think I'm actually gonna stick with a fully-octagonal barrel from Lothar-Walther, at least for the time being. Would lend a neat look to this rifle and I could probably have it turned half-round later if I wanted to.

 

[Satterlee]

1/2 round 1/2octagon wears better if you're going to use it. Less nicks and dings on the corners of the flats. Speaking from experience. On a full length those corners must be watched like a hawk. One ding leads to another.

 

[Son of Dorn]

1/2 round 1/2octagon wears better if you're going to use it. Less nicks and dings on the corners of the flats. Speaking from experience. On a full length those corners must be watched like a hawk. One ding leads to another.

A good point, but unless it'll affect anything more than aesthetics, nicks and dings are just something I'd have to live with and not really worry over. It's a hunting rifle for large and possibly dangerous game; nicks would be inevitable and one of my lesser concerns vs not getting trampled by an agitated buffalo.

That said, oct-to-round would be great if I could find one with a rib, and so far no luck.