Pakistan?

[Greg Langelius *]

I don't know how others feel about this, but I think it stinks to high heaven. For an 'ally', I don't think they behave very much like an ally.

IMHO, they are blackmailing us for their cooperation, are outright duplicitous in the process, and now, they are telling us to shut up and be good little boys and girls while they screw us right and left.

For the record, there is already an Islamic Nuke, and they have it. <span style="text-decoration: line-through">If</span> When Iran's Nuke comes to light, it will be a direct consequence of sloppy internal intelligence on, again, Pakistan's part.

Somebody 'on our side', isn't.

Greg

 

[KillShot]

Re: Pakistan?

I say fuck'em.

The government of Pakistan is made up of terrorist sympathizers who are masquerading as allies of America.

Pull our troops and embassies from Afghanistan, Iraq, and other hostile nations in the region and let the chips fall where they may.

Those hajjis have been warring nations for centuries and America is foolish to think we can or will ever stop what is ingrained in their culture.

 

[High Binder]

Re: Pakistan?

I think everyone knows they're not a friend but our government kisses their ass because we need access to their roads/air and they've got nukes. To that point, we wouldn't need/care about any of that if we weren't fighting a pointless 'war' in Afghanistan.

 

[Sean the Nailer]

Re: Pakistan?

Short version: Puppetstan

What more needs to be said?

 

[eracer]

Re: Pakistan?

We've been dicking around with that country for far too long.

Can anybody say, "Indiastan?"

 

[Mo_Zam_Beek]

Re: Pakistan?

Folks in TV land should stop and consider that we only get half the story. If you were native to parts elsewhere - I'm pretty certain the US and their corporate driven / FED Reserve + State Dept + MIL supported interests ain't exactly sunshine and roses.

We've reached a vortex - motivated by 'our' own interests we've meddled in the affairs of too many, for too long to merely back away from the helm. However we are well beyond the tack point, and in serious need of charting a new course of direction - as the beach is on the horizon.


Good luck

 

[Timo Turl]

Re: Pakistan?

It isn't that simple. There are positive elements in Pakistan but they won't be a puppet to the US and there are parties intent on destroying the US. Good and bad - how do you convert a nation that 10yrs ago the US didn't give two shits about. Foreign policy was hopelessly wrong and it hasn't progressed much.

 

[Queequeg]

Re: Pakistan?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: TJ.</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It isn't that simple. There are positive elements in Pakistan but they won't be a puppet to the US and there are parties intent on destroying the US. Good and bad - how do you convert a nation that 10yrs ago the US didn't give two shits about. Foreign policy was hopelessly wrong and it hasn't progressed much. </div></div>

I concur.

Like so many instances of our short memories colliding with people in countries who think in terms of millenia and often haven't changed a wit in centuries.

The idea of interceding in a kicked over Ant pile, or leaving after we have kicked it over, and expecting to go home and have nothing further to worry about other than our next scope purchase, our golf lesson, our kid's grades or other pressing 1st world problems, is far less than naive.

It's insipid.

Pakistan is a complex knot of conflicting ethnicities, cultures and religions, has historically been situated in the path of great strategic interest and is at the frontier of two massive emerging powers.

Pakistan is a hot rock we can't simply drop without expecting to continue to pay for in some dear way.

 

[MikeeBooshay]

Re: Pakistan?

I have spent a lot of time in this shithole. Do not like. Best thing I can report is that the day my visa ran out, I said I would never let anyone put another visa in my passport without my permission. And I have been good to that.

One of my guys (engineer) said " Mikee, you know what this place needs? Nuclear power..... delivered by fast air.... and none of that neutron bomb shit either, we don't even want the buildings!"

This a country filled with people that will lie to you when the truth would help them. Not all, there are a few good guys there.... but not enough.

 

[IronMaidenFan]

Re: Pakistan?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't know how others feel about this, but I think it stinks to high heaven. For an 'ally', I don't think they behave very much like an ally.</div></div>


Have you considered the possibility that the good doctor's trial and conviction were merely a stunt for public consumption and that he really is living somewhere in South Dakota under a new identity to protect him from the untold number of Bin Laden sympathizers gunning for him?

 

[Timo Turl]

Re: Pakistan?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: IronMaidenFan</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't know how others feel about this, but I think it stinks to high heaven. For an 'ally', I don't think they behave very much like an ally.</div></div>


Have you considered the possibility that the good doctor's trial and conviction were merely a stunt for public consumption and that he really is living somewhere in South Dakota under a new identity to protect him from the untold number of Bin Laden sympathizers gunning for him? </div></div>

South Dakota......poor kid. He doesn't deserve that

 

[Jong]

Re: Pakistan?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Mikee Booshay</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have spent a lot of time in this shithole. Do not like. Best thing I can report is that the day my visa ran out, I said I would never let anyone put another visa in my passport without my permission. And I have been good to that.

One of my guys (engineer) said " Mikee, you know what this place needs? Nuclear power..... delivered by fast air.... and none of that neutron bomb shit either, we don't even want the buildings!"

This a country filled with people that will lie to you when the truth would help them. Not all, there are a few good guys there.... but not enough. </div></div>

Not just Pakistan but the entire Middle East needs that fix!!

 

[AIAWinAU]

Re: Pakistan?

Just goes to show, keep your enemies closer, & your friends even closer.

Pack of pricks.

 

[Country]

Re: Pakistan?

The world has to deal with Pakistan and countries like it because they are there. You just can't ignore them . The US knows that no single person or party has total control over what happens in Pakistan . It is a multi tribal country and split up into semi autonomous tribal areas that Islamabad has little control over . The reason they are always fighting each other is the resistance that the tribal areas put up to the recognised Governments ideas and laws that they wish to impose on them . However it is more stable than Afghanistan
However enter the foreigner and they stop fighting each other and all turn on you . The tribal ares are infiltrated by Government spies and the Government is infiltrated by tribal spies . Then you bring in religious difference's to complicate it even further .
The US Government needs to limit it's potential adversaries in the region at the moment so it puts up with Pakistan's crap but in the long run Pakistan will be in the cross hairs if it does not wipe out the fanatics and the terrorist training Saudi financed madrassas etc .
There is elements in Pakistan that do not want trouble with the west and assist the US to get rid of terrorists although money buys some of this assistance . I don't believe that the Pakistani Government knew nothing about the raid on Osama Bin Laden . I feel that is a cover story to reduce potential terrorist backlash against the Government for giving up Bin Laden or at least giving permission to take him .

 

[Numb_Skull]

Re: Pakistan?

Best solution would be for India to grow a set of balls, conscript her 1 billion military age males, put them all on line and push west until they reach the Mediterranean.

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Pakistan?

I understand the history of Pakistan to at least a small degree.

I would surmise that Middle East intervention is never simple, and probably also seldom very wise.

I also agree with the hot rock analogy, although I prefer the one about De Tar Baby.

Since the establishment of the United Nations, and the League of Nations before it; the international community has cultivated a habit of intervention in the affairs of sovereign states. While done in the interest and name of peace, these actions have nearly always precipitted bitter and protracted open warfare. I would go so far as to attribute the worst conflicts of the Twentieth Century, after establishment of the League of Nations following the First World War, to that habit. The Twenty First century would also appear to be on a similar track.

One would imagine the community would have learned some lasting lessons from this, or at least gotten passably better at the process; but sadly, this appears not to be the case.

Few things could be worse, IMHO; except maybe our own Nation adopting such policy on a start it alone, go it alone basis.

I will not presume to have a diagnosis, nor will I do the same in the form of a solution.

But as I said, I think the situation stinks, and wish we had no part in it.

If Pakistan is a treasured ally, I suspect its loyalty directly reflects the color of the money we pay them, and maybe has a similar appearance to The Emperor's New Clothes.

Unlike the rest of the Middle East, Pakistan has managed to blackmail the West for a second helping. I am tired of smiling 'Allies' offering a handshake with one hand, and rifling our pockets with the other.

Greg

 

[JelloStorm]

Re: Pakistan?

 

[KYpatriot]

Re: Pakistan?

If only. I might even volunteer to work the deep sea drill platforms.

I think if we spent as much money developing our own energy as we do securing access to middle east oil then we would be much better off.