I am wonder what other people thoughts are about Premier Reticle Scopes? Anyone have any bad or good stuff happen?
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Rifle Scopes Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
- Thread starter jdblackwell
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Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
Seriously man... Four different threads asking the same question. Use the search function and stop being lazy.
Seriously man... Four different threads asking the same question. Use the search function and stop being lazy.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JamesDale</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6" Orange Steal Square, on mountain side in LakeView, OR at 900 Yards
Surgeon Scalpe, AICS, Viperskin, Jewel, Kreiger SS 22", Harris, 308 Win, BH Red. PR 5-25x56 Tactical.
I give most of the credit to Heidi as she was calling the wind. </div></div>
Sounds like you already know whether its good or not.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JamesDale</div><div class="ubbcode-body">6" Orange Steal Square, on mountain side in LakeView, OR at 900 Yards
Surgeon Scalpe, AICS, Viperskin, Jewel, Kreiger SS 22", Harris, 308 Win, BH Red. PR 5-25x56 Tactical.
I give most of the credit to Heidi as she was calling the wind. </div></div>
Sounds like you already know whether its good or not.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
I talk with a respected long range shooter who told me that he had see situation where the knobs stopped working in cold weather. I have had a great experience so far with the PR 5-25 that I purchased a few months ago. But I know that I am new at shooting long and the scope is new so I do not have a firm opinion or much experience to base much on. I was hoping to hear from people with more experince and knowledge than myself.
I talk with a respected long range shooter who told me that he had see situation where the knobs stopped working in cold weather. I have had a great experience so far with the PR 5-25 that I purchased a few months ago. But I know that I am new at shooting long and the scope is new so I do not have a firm opinion or much experience to base much on. I was hoping to hear from people with more experince and knowledge than myself.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
Before this thread goes to trash ( as it probably should ) can some one tell ME about premier 3-15x's? God damn it if I don't want that 3-15x 34mm on top my riffle but I just don't have the coin. So I will be putting sub1k glass on it instead as this is my first optic ( you seen my posts right?) So is the premier worth holding out for? Or should I stick to my plan and get it a year or two down the road..........also to a new guy....will I really see a huge difference between the premier and the sub 1k options I have been asking about?
Before this thread goes to trash ( as it probably should ) can some one tell ME about premier 3-15x's? God damn it if I don't want that 3-15x 34mm on top my riffle but I just don't have the coin. So I will be putting sub1k glass on it instead as this is my first optic ( you seen my posts right?) So is the premier worth holding out for? Or should I stick to my plan and get it a year or two down the road..........also to a new guy....will I really see a huge difference between the premier and the sub 1k options I have been asking about?
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
Take a look at the new Bushy HDMR. It's new but, by the time you save up the $, there should be a decent track record on them.
I happened to see two Weaver Tacs shit the bed at the same match at TVP. Didn't leave a favorable impression in my mind. Maybe things have changed but, I don't want to try one out.
Take a look at the new Bushy HDMR. It's new but, by the time you save up the $, there should be a decent track record on them.
I happened to see two Weaver Tacs shit the bed at the same match at TVP. Didn't leave a favorable impression in my mind. Maybe things have changed but, I don't want to try one out.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Goin'Hot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Take a look at the new Bushy HDMR. It's new but, by the time you save up the $, there should be a decent track record on them.
I happened to see two Weaver Tacs shit the bed at the same match at TVP. Didn't leave a favorable impression in my mind. Maybe things have changed but, I don't want to try one out. </div></div>
+1 for that...
The big question is, are $2000 scopes better then $1000 scopes(criteria being glad, and function etc)... Then the next big question is, Those $3500 scopes, are they really so much better and is it worth the $2500 more..
Or do you buy these optics becuase its will save yrou life or other, or you want to buy the best and your willing to pay what ever or do you just want to buy it and say to other you own one....
Why pay $3500 when soemthign that cost $2000 can do it too..
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Goin'Hot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Take a look at the new Bushy HDMR. It's new but, by the time you save up the $, there should be a decent track record on them.
I happened to see two Weaver Tacs shit the bed at the same match at TVP. Didn't leave a favorable impression in my mind. Maybe things have changed but, I don't want to try one out. </div></div>
+1 for that...
The big question is, are $2000 scopes better then $1000 scopes(criteria being glad, and function etc)... Then the next big question is, Those $3500 scopes, are they really so much better and is it worth the $2500 more..
Or do you buy these optics becuase its will save yrou life or other, or you want to buy the best and your willing to pay what ever or do you just want to buy it and say to other you own one....
Why pay $3500 when soemthign that cost $2000 can do it too..
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
My only comment about Premier is that they decided to be totally evil to their loyal dealers and crazy nuts mad if anyone gave anyone discounts as they had some new markting genius company that said higher prices mean people think your scope is better.
I'd suggest for the same money get a S&B and it will not give you the same failures when the tough gets going that the Premier scopes have seen.
In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price.
My only comment about Premier is that they decided to be totally evil to their loyal dealers and crazy nuts mad if anyone gave anyone discounts as they had some new markting genius company that said higher prices mean people think your scope is better.
I'd suggest for the same money get a S&B and it will not give you the same failures when the tough gets going that the Premier scopes have seen.
In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
I love my Premier Scopes! Here are some videos we did.
Premier Heritage 3-15x50 LIGHT Tactical
Premier Heritage 5-25x56mm Tactical Rifle Scope
Mike @ CST
I love my Premier Scopes! Here are some videos we did.
Premier Heritage 3-15x50 LIGHT Tactical
Premier Heritage 5-25x56mm Tactical Rifle Scope
Mike @ CST
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My only comment about Premier is that they decided to be totally evil to their loyal dealers and crazy nuts mad if anyone gave anyone discounts as they had some new markting genius company that said higher prices mean people think your scope is better.
I'd suggest for the same money get a S&B and it will not give you the same failures when the tough gets going that the Premier scopes have seen.
In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price. </div></div> ...................................................having fallen in love with the IDEA of owning a 34mm 3-15 premier heratige, it breaks my hart to hear that. So what you all are saying is that I should stick to my plan and buy one of my options under 1k and latet on when I get acustomed to scopes, if I feel I need or want more. I can chase the 3k uber optic? Sound like a good plan?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My only comment about Premier is that they decided to be totally evil to their loyal dealers and crazy nuts mad if anyone gave anyone discounts as they had some new markting genius company that said higher prices mean people think your scope is better.
I'd suggest for the same money get a S&B and it will not give you the same failures when the tough gets going that the Premier scopes have seen.
In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price. </div></div> ...................................................having fallen in love with the IDEA of owning a 34mm 3-15 premier heratige, it breaks my hart to hear that. So what you all are saying is that I should stick to my plan and buy one of my options under 1k and latet on when I get acustomed to scopes, if I feel I need or want more. I can chase the 3k uber optic? Sound like a good plan?
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
SHOT is just around the corner, all manner of new shit (hopefully) will be unveiled.
One of my personal wishes is that the 3-20 S&B is ready and that it doesn't have the tunneling of the 5-25 - plus in a MSR reticle.
bide your time, see what's available in a few months and then dive in to whatever depth your wallet can take you...
SHOT is just around the corner, all manner of new shit (hopefully) will be unveiled.
One of my personal wishes is that the 3-20 S&B is ready and that it doesn't have the tunneling of the 5-25 - plus in a MSR reticle.
bide your time, see what's available in a few months and then dive in to whatever depth your wallet can take you...
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
I'd argue that Premier is a first tier scope, I'm willing to bet by a long shot that I'm not the only one that thinks this way either. Personally, I traded a S&B 4-16x50 for my Premier. The customer service I've experienced with Plange was first rate, literally some of the best I've ever had with a company.
I'd argue that Premier is a first tier scope, I'm willing to bet by a long shot that I'm not the only one that thinks this way either. Personally, I traded a S&B 4-16x50 for my Premier. The customer service I've experienced with Plange was first rate, literally some of the best I've ever had with a company.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kenndapp</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My only comment about Premier is that they decided to be totally evil to their loyal dealers and crazy nuts mad if anyone gave anyone discounts as they had some new markting genius company that said higher prices mean people think your scope is better.
I'd suggest for the same money get a S&B and it will not give you the same failures when the tough gets going that the Premier scopes have seen.
In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price. </div></div> ...................................................having fallen in love with the IDEA of owning a 34mm 3-15 premier heratige, it breaks my hart to hear that. So what you all are saying is that I should stick to my plan and buy one of my options under 1k and latet on when I get acustomed to scopes, if I feel I need or want more. I can chase the 3k uber optic? Sound like a good plan? </div></div>. Can some one please tell me if I should go after the expensive dream optic and buy once cry once.....or get something in the mid range for starters and work up to the top tier suff? As a new guy am I really going to look through a 1k$ optic and think "man this is crap I should of spent more cash on a better scope!" If you had do it all over again what would you do on your first scope....given the two options?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kenndapp</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My only comment about Premier is that they decided to be totally evil to their loyal dealers and crazy nuts mad if anyone gave anyone discounts as they had some new markting genius company that said higher prices mean people think your scope is better.
I'd suggest for the same money get a S&B and it will not give you the same failures when the tough gets going that the Premier scopes have seen.
In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price. </div></div> ...................................................having fallen in love with the IDEA of owning a 34mm 3-15 premier heratige, it breaks my hart to hear that. So what you all are saying is that I should stick to my plan and buy one of my options under 1k and latet on when I get acustomed to scopes, if I feel I need or want more. I can chase the 3k uber optic? Sound like a good plan? </div></div>. Can some one please tell me if I should go after the expensive dream optic and buy once cry once.....or get something in the mid range for starters and work up to the top tier suff? As a new guy am I really going to look through a 1k$ optic and think "man this is crap I should of spent more cash on a better scope!" If you had do it all over again what would you do on your first scope....given the two options?
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
I sincerely sympathize with you; buying a good scope for long range shooting is frustrating enough without having so many choices, experts, and wannabes masquerading as such. I'm at the point where <span style="font-style: italic">I've reached a decision based on what I'm worth in</span> <span style="font-style: italic">this game</span>. And since I depend on rifles for meat and reasonably expect this to be my last scope of this type I'm shooting for the best. This three-part article is one of the most informative I've found; I hope it helps you too.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-optics/?p=7
I sincerely sympathize with you; buying a good scope for long range shooting is frustrating enough without having so many choices, experts, and wannabes masquerading as such. I'm at the point where <span style="font-style: italic">I've reached a decision based on what I'm worth in</span> <span style="font-style: italic">this game</span>. And since I depend on rifles for meat and reasonably expect this to be my last scope of this type I'm shooting for the best. This three-part article is one of the most informative I've found; I hope it helps you too.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-optics/?p=7
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 66Gary</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I sincerely sympathize with you; buying a good scope for long range shooting is frustrating enough without having so many choices, experts, and wannabes masquerading as such. I'm at the point where I've reached a decision based on what I'm worth in this game. And since I depend on rifles for meat and reasonably expect this to be my last scope of this type I'm shooting for the best. This three-part article is one of the most informative I've found; I hope it helps you too.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-optics/?p=7 </div></div>. You took the words out of my mouth. That is exactly where I'm at. So go big or go home, buy once cry once, huh? Well its going to take some time but I will make the full size premier heritage 3-15x mine. I think I would rather do that than buy something I'm not sure about only to deal with the hassle of selling it a few months/years down the road anyhow.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 66Gary</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I sincerely sympathize with you; buying a good scope for long range shooting is frustrating enough without having so many choices, experts, and wannabes masquerading as such. I'm at the point where I've reached a decision based on what I'm worth in this game. And since I depend on rifles for meat and reasonably expect this to be my last scope of this type I'm shooting for the best. This three-part article is one of the most informative I've found; I hope it helps you too.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-optics/?p=7 </div></div>. You took the words out of my mouth. That is exactly where I'm at. So go big or go home, buy once cry once, huh? Well its going to take some time but I will make the full size premier heritage 3-15x mine. I think I would rather do that than buy something I'm not sure about only to deal with the hassle of selling it a few months/years down the road anyhow.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kenndapp</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 66Gary</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I sincerely sympathize with you; buying a good scope for long range shooting is frustrating enough without having so many choices, experts, and wannabes masquerading as such. I'm at the point where I've reached a decision based on what I'm worth in this game. And since I depend on rifles for meat and reasonably expect this to be my last scope of this type I'm shooting for the best. This three-part article is one of the most informative I've found; I hope it helps you too.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-optics/?p=7 </div></div>. You took the words out of my mouth. That is exactly where I'm at. So go big or go home, buy once cry once, huh? Well its going to take some time but I will make the full size premier heritage 3-15x mine. I think I would rather do that than buy something I'm not sure about only to deal with the hassle of selling it a few months/years down the road anyhow. </div></div>
2cent suggestion..
do you think that a $3500 Premier or S&B will out perform say a Nightforce that costs $1900. Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... Remember you could almost buy (2) NF for the price of 1 S&B...
Also is this scope going to be used to protect yourself in combat or protect others??
Or do you just want to tell your friends you have one???
$3500 is a alot of money especially if you don't plan on shooting 5x a week with it... good luck with the search.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kenndapp</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 66Gary</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I sincerely sympathize with you; buying a good scope for long range shooting is frustrating enough without having so many choices, experts, and wannabes masquerading as such. I'm at the point where I've reached a decision based on what I'm worth in this game. And since I depend on rifles for meat and reasonably expect this to be my last scope of this type I'm shooting for the best. This three-part article is one of the most informative I've found; I hope it helps you too.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-optics/?p=7 </div></div>. You took the words out of my mouth. That is exactly where I'm at. So go big or go home, buy once cry once, huh? Well its going to take some time but I will make the full size premier heritage 3-15x mine. I think I would rather do that than buy something I'm not sure about only to deal with the hassle of selling it a few months/years down the road anyhow. </div></div>
2cent suggestion..
do you think that a $3500 Premier or S&B will out perform say a Nightforce that costs $1900. Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... Remember you could almost buy (2) NF for the price of 1 S&B...
Also is this scope going to be used to protect yourself in combat or protect others??
Or do you just want to tell your friends you have one???
$3500 is a alot of money especially if you don't plan on shooting 5x a week with it... good luck with the search.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matthewusmc8791</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kenndapp</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 66Gary</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I sincerely sympathize with you; buying a good scope for long range shooting is frustrating enough without having so many choices, experts, and wannabes masquerading as such. I'm at the point where I've reached a decision based on what I'm worth in this game. And since I depend on rifles for meat and reasonably expect this to be my last scope of this type I'm shooting for the best. This three-part article is one of the most informative I've found; I hope it helps you too.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-optics/?p=7 </div></div>. You took the words out of my mouth. That is exactly where I'm at. So go big or go home, buy once cry once, huh? Well its going to take some time but I will make the full size premier heritage 3-15x mine. I think I would rather do that than buy something I'm not sure about only to deal with the hassle of selling it a few months/years down the road anyhow. </div></div>
2cent suggestion..
do you think that a $3500 Premier or S&B will out perform say a Nightforce that costs $1900. Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... Remember you could almost buy (2) NF for the price of 1 S&B...
Also is this scope going to be used to protect yourself in combat or protect others??
Or do you just want to tell your friends you have one???
$3500 is a alot of money especially if you don't plan on shooting 5x a week with it... good luck with the search.</div></div>
Well I agree with the spirit of your post, I believe your example is a bit off as the scopes you bring up are different.
I shoot about 100 rounds a week. My passion currently is tactical precision matches. I do want a PR, but don't need one. I was running a NF 5.5-22 and was happy as a clam. I started in tactical matches and it became immediately clear that my NF had all the functions I need except FFP. I sold that $1700 rig, and got a SS 5-20 which price wise is cheaper glass. It does everything that I NEED. Its FFP, precise, and just plain works. This will be my rig until I can afford to pony up for a PR which is what I WANT.
So for you, figure out the difference between want and need as far as features. Buy what you can afford, shoot as many rounds a week as you can afford. Then reassess your wants and needs. Scopes sell here on the hide for around $100-300 dollar loss of new prices.
Screw buy once cry once, shoot your ass off........unless you intend to own a safe queen.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matthewusmc8791</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kenndapp</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 66Gary</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I sincerely sympathize with you; buying a good scope for long range shooting is frustrating enough without having so many choices, experts, and wannabes masquerading as such. I'm at the point where I've reached a decision based on what I'm worth in this game. And since I depend on rifles for meat and reasonably expect this to be my last scope of this type I'm shooting for the best. This three-part article is one of the most informative I've found; I hope it helps you too.
http://demigodllc.com/articles/practical-long-range-rifle-shooting-optics/?p=7 </div></div>. You took the words out of my mouth. That is exactly where I'm at. So go big or go home, buy once cry once, huh? Well its going to take some time but I will make the full size premier heritage 3-15x mine. I think I would rather do that than buy something I'm not sure about only to deal with the hassle of selling it a few months/years down the road anyhow. </div></div>
2cent suggestion..
do you think that a $3500 Premier or S&B will out perform say a Nightforce that costs $1900. Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... Remember you could almost buy (2) NF for the price of 1 S&B...
Also is this scope going to be used to protect yourself in combat or protect others??
Or do you just want to tell your friends you have one???
$3500 is a alot of money especially if you don't plan on shooting 5x a week with it... good luck with the search.</div></div>
Well I agree with the spirit of your post, I believe your example is a bit off as the scopes you bring up are different.
I shoot about 100 rounds a week. My passion currently is tactical precision matches. I do want a PR, but don't need one. I was running a NF 5.5-22 and was happy as a clam. I started in tactical matches and it became immediately clear that my NF had all the functions I need except FFP. I sold that $1700 rig, and got a SS 5-20 which price wise is cheaper glass. It does everything that I NEED. Its FFP, precise, and just plain works. This will be my rig until I can afford to pony up for a PR which is what I WANT.
So for you, figure out the difference between want and need as far as features. Buy what you can afford, shoot as many rounds a week as you can afford. Then reassess your wants and needs. Scopes sell here on the hide for around $100-300 dollar loss of new prices.
Screw buy once cry once, shoot your ass off........unless you intend to own a safe queen.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My only comment about Premier is that they decided to be totally evil to their loyal dealers and crazy nuts mad if anyone gave anyone discounts as they had some new markting genius company that said higher prices mean people think your scope is better.
I'd suggest for the same money get a S&B and it will not give you the same failures when the tough gets going that the Premier scopes have seen.
In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price. </div></div>
One might also say that one dealer was undercutting the others by offering rock bottom prices. There should be a limit on how low the products are sold, I do not know that Premier has a reasonable limit or not. NF would have cut the dealer off much earlier, and no one is bitching about NF.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body">My only comment about Premier is that they decided to be totally evil to their loyal dealers and crazy nuts mad if anyone gave anyone discounts as they had some new markting genius company that said higher prices mean people think your scope is better.
I'd suggest for the same money get a S&B and it will not give you the same failures when the tough gets going that the Premier scopes have seen.
In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price. </div></div>
One might also say that one dealer was undercutting the others by offering rock bottom prices. There should be a limit on how low the products are sold, I do not know that Premier has a reasonable limit or not. NF would have cut the dealer off much earlier, and no one is bitching about NF.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price.</div></div>
What would make you think that they are second tier? Personal experience or are you just spewing BS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matthewusmc8791</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... </div></div>
I do, and I don't think I am alone.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price.</div></div>
What would make you think that they are second tier? Personal experience or are you just spewing BS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matthewusmc8791</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... </div></div>
I do, and I don't think I am alone.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matchking</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price.</div></div>
What would make you think that they are second tier? Personal experience or are you just spewing BS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matthewusmc8791</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... </div></div>
I do, and I don't think I am alone. </div></div> I agree.
My fellow sniper's hide members, let me share you a story about MY experience with Premier Reticles. It began with my initial usage at Rifles Only. Mr. Tony B thought it would be funny to watch me try and climb a rope with a pack... I failed miserably as time is of the essence when on the mousetrap. I fell off the rope and my right boot (to me unaware but others pointed it out afterwards) landed on my optic.... not my rifle... but my optic. Gotta love Murphy's law. Total weight on optic 200lbs falling roughly 3 feet / 2 (i have 2 feet) Optic functioned perfectly the rest of the week that i threw it around the mousetrap.
Now, having the 228th one made in 3.5-15 mime came with a few "kinks" these issues were to be addressed (mushy turrets, and some other turret problems) I called PR and they had Paul call me. I shipped it to HIS house over XMAS. He turned it around in 24 hrs. Another unforeseen issue arose. Paul had PR 1 day air next morning super fast as hell ship it back to HIS HOUSE (PR is closed during holidays) and turned it around and 1 day mach speed air'd back that same day. (over New Years mind you) less than 54hour turnaround. Now... being familiar with UPS's "value" I will attest that that shipping was over $350, covered by Premier Reticles.
Every company will have issues. How they handle them is key. I will by far say that I am amazed that I was able to get my optic back in time for my PCS move. Paul was kind enough to stay on the phone with me and explain the turrets, how they work, the inside of everything, and even trouble shoot every small piece instead of spending time with his family over the holidays. FOR ME a guy he doesn't know over a doorknob.
Price issue: I'd be hella pissed if I created a product, trusted others to sell my product, and they sold it for less. It would jeopardize more than just profit, but reputation, and not to mention government contracts worth... well oodles.
Think of this, POSSIBLY they sold their optic for a value initially, where their profit margin was so slim they were having difficulties keeping the cash flow to stay alive. They do this to promote their optic and get it out there. Now that the product is a confirmed hit, they raise the price not to gouge out your consumer eyes, but so they can stay in the business, alive, and pay off all their R&D, Employees, Facilities, etc.
My nickel and dimes worth of opinion. I love my optic, its currently spray painted and will not be likely sold anytime soon.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matchking</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price.</div></div>
What would make you think that they are second tier? Personal experience or are you just spewing BS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matthewusmc8791</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... </div></div>
I do, and I don't think I am alone. </div></div> I agree.
My fellow sniper's hide members, let me share you a story about MY experience with Premier Reticles. It began with my initial usage at Rifles Only. Mr. Tony B thought it would be funny to watch me try and climb a rope with a pack... I failed miserably as time is of the essence when on the mousetrap. I fell off the rope and my right boot (to me unaware but others pointed it out afterwards) landed on my optic.... not my rifle... but my optic. Gotta love Murphy's law. Total weight on optic 200lbs falling roughly 3 feet / 2 (i have 2 feet) Optic functioned perfectly the rest of the week that i threw it around the mousetrap.
Now, having the 228th one made in 3.5-15 mime came with a few "kinks" these issues were to be addressed (mushy turrets, and some other turret problems) I called PR and they had Paul call me. I shipped it to HIS house over XMAS. He turned it around in 24 hrs. Another unforeseen issue arose. Paul had PR 1 day air next morning super fast as hell ship it back to HIS HOUSE (PR is closed during holidays) and turned it around and 1 day mach speed air'd back that same day. (over New Years mind you) less than 54hour turnaround. Now... being familiar with UPS's "value" I will attest that that shipping was over $350, covered by Premier Reticles.
Every company will have issues. How they handle them is key. I will by far say that I am amazed that I was able to get my optic back in time for my PCS move. Paul was kind enough to stay on the phone with me and explain the turrets, how they work, the inside of everything, and even trouble shoot every small piece instead of spending time with his family over the holidays. FOR ME a guy he doesn't know over a doorknob.
Price issue: I'd be hella pissed if I created a product, trusted others to sell my product, and they sold it for less. It would jeopardize more than just profit, but reputation, and not to mention government contracts worth... well oodles.
Think of this, POSSIBLY they sold their optic for a value initially, where their profit margin was so slim they were having difficulties keeping the cash flow to stay alive. They do this to promote their optic and get it out there. Now that the product is a confirmed hit, they raise the price not to gouge out your consumer eyes, but so they can stay in the business, alive, and pay off all their R&D, Employees, Facilities, etc.
My nickel and dimes worth of opinion. I love my optic, its currently spray painted and will not be likely sold anytime soon.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
kenndapp: Check out the LT versions of the Premier 3-15. I originally had the PH 3-15 Heritage and it was too heavy. Everything I really liked about it is in the LT version, which is to say incredible glass, great tracking, reliable function and a very usable reticle. The LT cuts out 12-13 oz. (depending on the version) and is, IMO, a fantastic scope for shooting out to 1200 yards on a .308.
kenndapp: Check out the LT versions of the Premier 3-15. I originally had the PH 3-15 Heritage and it was too heavy. Everything I really liked about it is in the LT version, which is to say incredible glass, great tracking, reliable function and a very usable reticle. The LT cuts out 12-13 oz. (depending on the version) and is, IMO, a fantastic scope for shooting out to 1200 yards on a .308.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Awesymoto</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matchking</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price.</div></div>
What would make you think that they are second tier? Personal experience or are you just spewing BS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matthewusmc8791</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... </div></div>
I do, and I don't think I am alone. </div></div> I agree.
My fellow sniper's hide members, let me share you a story about MY experience with Premier Reticles. It began with my initial usage at Rifles Only. Mr. Tony B thought it would be funny to watch me try and climb a rope with a pack... I failed miserably as time is of the essence when on the mousetrap. I fell off the rope and my right boot (to me unaware but others pointed it out afterwards) landed on my optic.... not my rifle... but my optic. Gotta love Murphy's law. Total weight on optic 200lbs falling roughly 3 feet / 2 (i have 2 feet) Optic functioned perfectly the rest of the week that i threw it around the mousetrap.
Now, having the 228th one made in 3.5-15 mime came with a few "kinks" these issues were to be addressed (mushy turrets, and some other turret problems) I called PR and they had Paul call me. I shipped it to HIS house over XMAS. He turned it around in 24 hrs. Another unforeseen issue arose. Paul had PR 1 day air next morning super fast as hell ship it back to HIS HOUSE (PR is closed during holidays) and turned it around and 1 day mach speed air'd back that same day. (over New Years mind you) less than 54hour turnaround. Now... being familiar with UPS's "value" I will attest that that shipping was over $350, covered by Premier Reticles.
Every company will have issues. How they handle them is key. I will by far say that I am amazed that I was able to get my optic back in time for my PCS move. Paul was kind enough to stay on the phone with me and explain the turrets, how they work, the inside of everything, and even trouble shoot every small piece instead of spending time with his family over the holidays. FOR ME a guy he doesn't know over a doorknob.
Price issue: I'd be hella pissed if I created a product, trusted others to sell my product, and they sold it for less. It would jeopardize more than just profit, but reputation, and not to mention government contracts worth... well oodles.
Think of this, POSSIBLY they sold their optic for a value initially, where their profit margin was so slim they were having difficulties keeping the cash flow to stay alive. They do this to promote their optic and get it out there. Now that the product is a confirmed hit, they raise the price not to gouge out your consumer eyes, but so they can stay in the business, alive, and pay off all their R&D, Employees, Facilities, etc.
My nickel and dimes worth of opinion. I love my optic, its currently spray painted and will not be likely sold anytime soon. </div></div>
No offense intended and I'm sure you love your Premier, but you haven't proven your original point. You can get both the level of performance and service that you described from both NF and Vortex (sans mushy turrets
) .
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Awesymoto</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matchking</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price.</div></div>
What would make you think that they are second tier? Personal experience or are you just spewing BS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matthewusmc8791</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... </div></div>
I do, and I don't think I am alone. </div></div> I agree.
My fellow sniper's hide members, let me share you a story about MY experience with Premier Reticles. It began with my initial usage at Rifles Only. Mr. Tony B thought it would be funny to watch me try and climb a rope with a pack... I failed miserably as time is of the essence when on the mousetrap. I fell off the rope and my right boot (to me unaware but others pointed it out afterwards) landed on my optic.... not my rifle... but my optic. Gotta love Murphy's law. Total weight on optic 200lbs falling roughly 3 feet / 2 (i have 2 feet) Optic functioned perfectly the rest of the week that i threw it around the mousetrap.
Now, having the 228th one made in 3.5-15 mime came with a few "kinks" these issues were to be addressed (mushy turrets, and some other turret problems) I called PR and they had Paul call me. I shipped it to HIS house over XMAS. He turned it around in 24 hrs. Another unforeseen issue arose. Paul had PR 1 day air next morning super fast as hell ship it back to HIS HOUSE (PR is closed during holidays) and turned it around and 1 day mach speed air'd back that same day. (over New Years mind you) less than 54hour turnaround. Now... being familiar with UPS's "value" I will attest that that shipping was over $350, covered by Premier Reticles.
Every company will have issues. How they handle them is key. I will by far say that I am amazed that I was able to get my optic back in time for my PCS move. Paul was kind enough to stay on the phone with me and explain the turrets, how they work, the inside of everything, and even trouble shoot every small piece instead of spending time with his family over the holidays. FOR ME a guy he doesn't know over a doorknob.
Price issue: I'd be hella pissed if I created a product, trusted others to sell my product, and they sold it for less. It would jeopardize more than just profit, but reputation, and not to mention government contracts worth... well oodles.
Think of this, POSSIBLY they sold their optic for a value initially, where their profit margin was so slim they were having difficulties keeping the cash flow to stay alive. They do this to promote their optic and get it out there. Now that the product is a confirmed hit, they raise the price not to gouge out your consumer eyes, but so they can stay in the business, alive, and pay off all their R&D, Employees, Facilities, etc.
My nickel and dimes worth of opinion. I love my optic, its currently spray painted and will not be likely sold anytime soon. </div></div>
No offense intended and I'm sure you love your Premier, but you haven't proven your original point. You can get both the level of performance and service that you described from both NF and Vortex (sans mushy turrets
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bearwalk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Awesymoto</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matchking</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price.</div></div>
What would make you think that they are second tier? Personal experience or are you just spewing BS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matthewusmc8791</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... </div></div>
I do, and I don't think I am alone. </div></div> I agree.
My fellow sniper's hide members, let me share you a story about MY experience with Premier Reticles. It began with my initial usage at Rifles Only. Mr. Tony B thought it would be funny to watch me try and climb a rope with a pack... I failed miserably as time is of the essence when on the mousetrap. I fell off the rope and my right boot (to me unaware but others pointed it out afterwards) landed on my optic.... not my rifle... but my optic. Gotta love Murphy's law. Total weight on optic 200lbs falling roughly 3 feet / 2 (i have 2 feet) Optic functioned perfectly the rest of the week that i threw it around the mousetrap.
Now, having the 228th one made in 3.5-15 mime came with a few "kinks" these issues were to be addressed (mushy turrets, and some other turret problems) I called PR and they had Paul call me. I shipped it to HIS house over XMAS. He turned it around in 24 hrs. Another unforeseen issue arose. Paul had PR 1 day air next morning super fast as hell ship it back to HIS HOUSE (PR is closed during holidays) and turned it around and 1 day mach speed air'd back that same day. (over New Years mind you) less than 54hour turnaround. Now... being familiar with UPS's "value" I will attest that that shipping was over $350, covered by Premier Reticles.
Every company will have issues. How they handle them is key. I will by far say that I am amazed that I was able to get my optic back in time for my PCS move. Paul was kind enough to stay on the phone with me and explain the turrets, how they work, the inside of everything, and even trouble shoot every small piece instead of spending time with his family over the holidays. FOR ME a guy he doesn't know over a doorknob.
Price issue: I'd be hella pissed if I created a product, trusted others to sell my product, and they sold it for less. It would jeopardize more than just profit, but reputation, and not to mention government contracts worth... well oodles.
Think of this, POSSIBLY they sold their optic for a value initially, where their profit margin was so slim they were having difficulties keeping the cash flow to stay alive. They do this to promote their optic and get it out there. Now that the product is a confirmed hit, they raise the price not to gouge out your consumer eyes, but so they can stay in the business, alive, and pay off all their R&D, Employees, Facilities, etc.
My nickel and dimes worth of opinion. I love my optic, its currently spray painted and will not be likely sold anytime soon. </div></div>
No offense intended and I'm sure you love your Premier, but you haven't proven your original point. You can get both the level of performance and service that you described from both NF and Vortex (sans mushy turrets
) . </div></div>
Not from what I've heard about NF you can't. A friend of mine switched out almost all but one optic from NF to Vortex because NF were close to indifferent to him with regards to his issues.
Paul is a first class guy and people like him, the folks at Optronika and others are what made Premier survive despite the technical challenges in the early days and bad corporate decisions. In fact, I would say there were technical challenges in the early days because of bad corporate policy rather than anything else. The management's changed and there's no reason to think the policies haven't also changed for the better.
I had a chance to get behind a NF 10x and to be honest, I really didn't like looking through the scope. I could still see the target and place a tidy grouping (was playing with a new rifle) but it wasn't what I'd call a well resolved image.
Premier's optical quality, FOV, DOV, lack of tunneling in the lower end and ruggeded performance makes it in my view the best value for money amongst the very high end scopes. I said and was quoted as much in Ilya's excellent review of high end tactical scopes (version 2 I believe).
The reference to the mushy clicks is disingenuous because firstly you can get them taken out (if you still have that issue) without any trouble and secondly, Vortex scopes take dumps (saw one have the turret freeze up without any duress of falling bodies) and occasionally come with issues.
If the size and weight of the Premier Heritage line doesn't impinge your style of hunting/shooting then it's not an optic that will disappoint you in the least.
Good luck with your purchase, whatever you decide, and may you enjoy it in good health.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bearwalk</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Awesymoto</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matchking</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: W54/XM-388</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> In my opinion Premier is a second tier scope trying to make you think they are a first tier scope by demanding a first tier scope price.</div></div>
What would make you think that they are second tier? Personal experience or are you just spewing BS?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: matthewusmc8791</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Do you think the features of the 1st two out do the features of the NF and warrant a increase by $1500... </div></div>
I do, and I don't think I am alone. </div></div> I agree.
My fellow sniper's hide members, let me share you a story about MY experience with Premier Reticles. It began with my initial usage at Rifles Only. Mr. Tony B thought it would be funny to watch me try and climb a rope with a pack... I failed miserably as time is of the essence when on the mousetrap. I fell off the rope and my right boot (to me unaware but others pointed it out afterwards) landed on my optic.... not my rifle... but my optic. Gotta love Murphy's law. Total weight on optic 200lbs falling roughly 3 feet / 2 (i have 2 feet) Optic functioned perfectly the rest of the week that i threw it around the mousetrap.
Now, having the 228th one made in 3.5-15 mime came with a few "kinks" these issues were to be addressed (mushy turrets, and some other turret problems) I called PR and they had Paul call me. I shipped it to HIS house over XMAS. He turned it around in 24 hrs. Another unforeseen issue arose. Paul had PR 1 day air next morning super fast as hell ship it back to HIS HOUSE (PR is closed during holidays) and turned it around and 1 day mach speed air'd back that same day. (over New Years mind you) less than 54hour turnaround. Now... being familiar with UPS's "value" I will attest that that shipping was over $350, covered by Premier Reticles.
Every company will have issues. How they handle them is key. I will by far say that I am amazed that I was able to get my optic back in time for my PCS move. Paul was kind enough to stay on the phone with me and explain the turrets, how they work, the inside of everything, and even trouble shoot every small piece instead of spending time with his family over the holidays. FOR ME a guy he doesn't know over a doorknob.
Price issue: I'd be hella pissed if I created a product, trusted others to sell my product, and they sold it for less. It would jeopardize more than just profit, but reputation, and not to mention government contracts worth... well oodles.
Think of this, POSSIBLY they sold their optic for a value initially, where their profit margin was so slim they were having difficulties keeping the cash flow to stay alive. They do this to promote their optic and get it out there. Now that the product is a confirmed hit, they raise the price not to gouge out your consumer eyes, but so they can stay in the business, alive, and pay off all their R&D, Employees, Facilities, etc.
My nickel and dimes worth of opinion. I love my optic, its currently spray painted and will not be likely sold anytime soon. </div></div>
No offense intended and I'm sure you love your Premier, but you haven't proven your original point. You can get both the level of performance and service that you described from both NF and Vortex (sans mushy turrets
Not from what I've heard about NF you can't. A friend of mine switched out almost all but one optic from NF to Vortex because NF were close to indifferent to him with regards to his issues.
Paul is a first class guy and people like him, the folks at Optronika and others are what made Premier survive despite the technical challenges in the early days and bad corporate decisions. In fact, I would say there were technical challenges in the early days because of bad corporate policy rather than anything else. The management's changed and there's no reason to think the policies haven't also changed for the better.
I had a chance to get behind a NF 10x and to be honest, I really didn't like looking through the scope. I could still see the target and place a tidy grouping (was playing with a new rifle) but it wasn't what I'd call a well resolved image.
Premier's optical quality, FOV, DOV, lack of tunneling in the lower end and ruggeded performance makes it in my view the best value for money amongst the very high end scopes. I said and was quoted as much in Ilya's excellent review of high end tactical scopes (version 2 I believe).
The reference to the mushy clicks is disingenuous because firstly you can get them taken out (if you still have that issue) without any trouble and secondly, Vortex scopes take dumps (saw one have the turret freeze up without any duress of falling bodies) and occasionally come with issues.
If the size and weight of the Premier Heritage line doesn't impinge your style of hunting/shooting then it's not an optic that will disappoint you in the least.
Good luck with your purchase, whatever you decide, and may you enjoy it in good health.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
I am not sure if the "original point" you mention was referred to me or not, but I personally don't believe the level of performance can be obtained with a NF. I have no experience with the higher end Vortex, so I can't comment on them.
Someone was referring to NXS being half the cost of the Premier (which it is not) and asked if the PH or SB was worth $1500 more. They are IMHO, but to be fair, the closest "comparible" NF isn't $1500 less than a PH or SB.
I am not sure if the "original point" you mention was referred to me or not, but I personally don't believe the level of performance can be obtained with a NF. I have no experience with the higher end Vortex, so I can't comment on them.
Someone was referring to NXS being half the cost of the Premier (which it is not) and asked if the PH or SB was worth $1500 more. They are IMHO, but to be fair, the closest "comparible" NF isn't $1500 less than a PH or SB.
Re: Premier Reticle Scopes, Good or Bad
@ Matchking and Event:
I'm actually going to concede here a bit not give you guys a big argument on NF. While I have been very happy with my NF1s, I could see where someone with the means - sponsored, pro shooter, nice disposable income, etc could make the argument to step up into the tier 1 scopes. You always pay 50-100% more for the last 5% of performance, after all.
Regarding the Razors, the differences aren't so distinct, IMO...but I don't want to derail the thread, so I'll leave it at that.
@ Matchking and Event:
I'm actually going to concede here a bit not give you guys a big argument on NF. While I have been very happy with my NF1s, I could see where someone with the means - sponsored, pro shooter, nice disposable income, etc could make the argument to step up into the tier 1 scopes. You always pay 50-100% more for the last 5% of performance, after all.
Regarding the Razors, the differences aren't so distinct, IMO...but I don't want to derail the thread, so I'll leave it at that.
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