Position-wise, that is. If I lay down and get all comfortable and get the rifle in my shoulder pocket like it's supposed to be, hand positioned on the handguard where I get the proper sling-tension that's comfortable for me and then my natural point of aim is low or high on the target, what's the proper way for me to adjust? Work it out by moving my right elbow closer or further from me, or move my hand position on the handguard?
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Advanced Marksmanship Proper way to correct for elevation in prone?
- Thread starter NativeCraft
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Re: Proper way to correct for elevation in prone?
To move your natural point of aim up move your hips back. Move your hips forward to lower your NPOA.
Everything should be rotating around your support elbow.
To move your natural point of aim up move your hips back. Move your hips forward to lower your NPOA.
Everything should be rotating around your support elbow.
Re: Proper way to correct for elevation in prone?
Assuming you are talking about shooting an AR (since you said handguard) the way you do it is to move your support hand(the one on the handguard) forward for the elevation to lower and back for the elevation to rise. If you are shooting with bipods and a bag, squeeze or relax on the bag.
Assuming you are talking about shooting an AR (since you said handguard) the way you do it is to move your support hand(the one on the handguard) forward for the elevation to lower and back for the elevation to rise. If you are shooting with bipods and a bag, squeeze or relax on the bag.
Re: Proper way to correct for elevation in prone?
Begin the position laying on your side. Shoulder the rifle while on your side with non-firing hand on the hand guard wherever it seems to be appropriate/comfortable. There will be a place that seems just right. Then, before rolling over, pocket the butt into the shoulder, while adjusting stock-weld for a position that allows you to align sights-again before you roll over. By following this procedure the position will be the correct height for your build, no matter what artificial support. As you roll over let the elbow of the firing hand just relax, that's to say let it fall wherever it falls. Now, adjust NPA for the hold on target you're seeking by moving the belt buckle left, right, back or forward.
Begin the position laying on your side. Shoulder the rifle while on your side with non-firing hand on the hand guard wherever it seems to be appropriate/comfortable. There will be a place that seems just right. Then, before rolling over, pocket the butt into the shoulder, while adjusting stock-weld for a position that allows you to align sights-again before you roll over. By following this procedure the position will be the correct height for your build, no matter what artificial support. As you roll over let the elbow of the firing hand just relax, that's to say let it fall wherever it falls. Now, adjust NPA for the hold on target you're seeking by moving the belt buckle left, right, back or forward.
Re: Proper way to correct for elevation in prone?
The left to right position of the left elbow should not change in order to affect your elevation. It should be as close to directly under the handguard/barrel as you can make it without the magazine resting on your arm (illegal position). Your left elbow is the anchor point from which you build you entire position, and it must be as close to directly under the rifle as possible.
Assume for a moment you are keeping the barrel parallel to the ground. In order to raise the rifle up, you move your left hand back on the handguard and your right elbow in. The rifle will come up. Your chest and head follow it up. Also the front/back placement of your left elbow on the ground will raise and lower the muzzle. Your left shoulder goes up and down following it, even with the sling in the same adjustment and the hand the same place on the handguard.
With your left elbow as close to directly under the rifle as you can make it and the rifle up to give you a good head position, you will end up "short stocking" the rifle - that is, not having your hand out against the front swivel, something rarely done with the AR-15. The AR-15 is oft short stocked, the M-14 oft not, but if done so on the M-14 copious amounts of glue are required on the glove and stock to keep from having to grip the rifle with the left hand to stop it from slipping. The AR-15 can be short stocked without slippage.
In the process of setting the elbow under the rifle, short stocking and pulling the right elbow in to gain some height for a good head position, and adjusting the sling, you must also look at shoulder angle. Often times reaching the left hand way out to the front, having the left elbow out instead of under the rifle, and trying to achieve that misguided objective of "lower is better" position, shoulder and body angle greatly suffer. Your shoulders should be somewhere between 10 and 25 degrees off a line perpendicular to the line of fire. The trunk of your body then extends in a line perpendicular to your shoulders. Generally you'll see the left leg then extend back in a line parallel to the line of fire with the right knee "cocked" some amount, both toes pointing to the right.
Now, to adjust the muzzle height, you can do a few things. One, short stock the handguard more or less. Two, raise and lower the butt slightly in the shoulder. Three, adjust both.
Lastly, the right hand. The right hand is "along for the ride" when it comes to setting your windage and elevation NPA. If you are providing triangulated force from your right hand to establish your windage NPA and/or vertical force to establish your elevation NPA, quite simply YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG. Go back to the top of this and start over. You should be able to remove your right hand from the rifle and have your point of aim stay intact.
The left to right position of the left elbow should not change in order to affect your elevation. It should be as close to directly under the handguard/barrel as you can make it without the magazine resting on your arm (illegal position). Your left elbow is the anchor point from which you build you entire position, and it must be as close to directly under the rifle as possible.
Assume for a moment you are keeping the barrel parallel to the ground. In order to raise the rifle up, you move your left hand back on the handguard and your right elbow in. The rifle will come up. Your chest and head follow it up. Also the front/back placement of your left elbow on the ground will raise and lower the muzzle. Your left shoulder goes up and down following it, even with the sling in the same adjustment and the hand the same place on the handguard.
With your left elbow as close to directly under the rifle as you can make it and the rifle up to give you a good head position, you will end up "short stocking" the rifle - that is, not having your hand out against the front swivel, something rarely done with the AR-15. The AR-15 is oft short stocked, the M-14 oft not, but if done so on the M-14 copious amounts of glue are required on the glove and stock to keep from having to grip the rifle with the left hand to stop it from slipping. The AR-15 can be short stocked without slippage.
In the process of setting the elbow under the rifle, short stocking and pulling the right elbow in to gain some height for a good head position, and adjusting the sling, you must also look at shoulder angle. Often times reaching the left hand way out to the front, having the left elbow out instead of under the rifle, and trying to achieve that misguided objective of "lower is better" position, shoulder and body angle greatly suffer. Your shoulders should be somewhere between 10 and 25 degrees off a line perpendicular to the line of fire. The trunk of your body then extends in a line perpendicular to your shoulders. Generally you'll see the left leg then extend back in a line parallel to the line of fire with the right knee "cocked" some amount, both toes pointing to the right.
Now, to adjust the muzzle height, you can do a few things. One, short stock the handguard more or less. Two, raise and lower the butt slightly in the shoulder. Three, adjust both.
Lastly, the right hand. The right hand is "along for the ride" when it comes to setting your windage and elevation NPA. If you are providing triangulated force from your right hand to establish your windage NPA and/or vertical force to establish your elevation NPA, quite simply YOU ARE DOING IT WRONG. Go back to the top of this and start over. You should be able to remove your right hand from the rifle and have your point of aim stay intact.
Re: Proper way to correct for elevation in prone?
I've got long arms and I don't like to grab/hold the rifle stock with my support hand. I push myself forward (distance between my support elbow and belt/stomach area is reduced to decrease elevation) or pull myself rearward (distance between my support elbow and belt/stomach area is increased) by using my toes to push/pull and then relax again.
Works for me.
I've got long arms and I don't like to grab/hold the rifle stock with my support hand. I push myself forward (distance between my support elbow and belt/stomach area is reduced to decrease elevation) or pull myself rearward (distance between my support elbow and belt/stomach area is increased) by using my toes to push/pull and then relax again.
Works for me.
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