Question for Vortex 4.5-27 owners

[alamo5000]

I will get my barrel and finish out my 6mm ARC build within the next few weeks/months.

The optic on my short list is the Vortex 4.5-27 GenII.

The question is for those that run these optics (preferably on a similar ish type of rifle, IE 6mm something) how much elevation do you have left after zeroing?

It doesn't need to be exact but giving me a rough idea would be helpful as I shop for mounting options.

 

[Dthomas3523]

20 ish with a 20moa rail. Could me more, could be less.

 

[alamo5000]

20 ish with a 20moa rail. Could me more, could be less.

20 ish MILs?

Roughly about 14ish MILs without a base...ok. Thanks. This helps.

I'm going to mount it on a flat top AR so I am looking for options to increase elevation. If I can get a grand total over 30mils including the 10 in the reticle that would be great.

 

[Dthomas3523]

20 ish MILs?

Roughly about 14ish MILs without a base...ok. Thanks. This helps.

I'm going to mount it on a flat top AR so I am looking for options to increase elevation. If I can get a grand total over 30mils including the 10 in the reticle that would be great.

What you shooting that you need 30mil with a 6arc?

 

[alamo5000]

What you shooting that you need 30mil with a 6arc?

LOL!

I was waiting for that question.

I've seen a number of YouTube people shoot out past a mile with it and I want to try it too. (I'm only half kidding)

My longest "regular" range (a friend's ranch) is 1400 and that shot needs around 18 to 19 mils. It would be nice to be able to dial it in. If I can just dial to 20mils that's good enough which should be more than doable with the right mount.

For my day to day stuff I can hold over but I kinda like dialing up better in a lot of situations.

On paper that little cartridge looks awesome and I like to push the envelope.

 

[Altoonabcm157]

Not sure if it helps but I have 24.4 useable with a 20moa base on a 6.5 creed which is more than enough unless you have access to huge expanses of land

 

[alamo5000]

Not sure if it helps but I have 24.4 useable with a 20moa base on a 6.5 creed which is more than enough unless you have access to huge expanses of land

Is that in the dial? You can dial up 24.4?

If so that's awesome.

 

[Altoonabcm157]

Is that in the dial? You can dial up 24.4?

If so that's awesome.

That’s right I can dial up 24.4 mils if I needed to, for reference when I was shooting just shy of 1500 yards I only had to dial about 15 or 16 mils for reference so needing over 30 plus holdovers would be deep into the subsonic zone of pretty much anything you can shoot.

 

[generalzip]

It’s listed as 28.5 mils of travel. So you should have around that after zero. I can not imagine needing more than that for any caliber other than 300 Norma, 7 magnums, ELR calibers etc or fat slow heavy stuff like heavy 308 rounds etc. on a 6 arc you’ll basically be wasting ammo at a mile. Can it be done? Sure. Does it serve any other practical purpose other than putting a smile on your face? Probably not. But hey that’s all that matters sometimes. I will say that the last 6 mils dialing vs holding won’t be the reason you’re missing at those ranges.

 

[Altoonabcm157]

It’s listed as 28.5 mils of travel. So you should have around that after zero. I can not imagine needing more than that for any caliber other than 300 Norma, 7 magnums, ELR calibers etc or fat slow heavy stuff like heavy 308 rounds etc. on a 6 arc you’ll basically be wasting ammo at a mile. Can it be done? Sure. Does it serve any other practical purpose other than putting a smile on your face? Probably not. But hey that’s all that matters sometimes. I will say that the last 6 mils dialing vs holding won’t be the reason you’re missing at those ranges.

They have more then what is listed, they used to list them as having 35 or 36 mils internally and there are threads on why they changed what they said they had in them. With a 20 moa base on there if I adjusted the turret down internally there is a lot more then 4 mils below my current zero, there are probably 10 or 12 mils if I felt the need to increase the cant in my rail.

 

[Altoonabcm157]

It’s listed as 28.5 mils of travel. So you should have around that after zero. I can not imagine needing more than that for any caliber other than 300 Norma, 7 magnums, ELR calibers etc or fat slow heavy stuff like heavy 308 rounds etc. on a 6 arc you’ll basically be wasting ammo at a mile. Can it be done? Sure. Does it serve any other practical purpose other than putting a smile on your face? Probably not. But hey that’s all that matters sometimes. I will say that the last 6 mils dialing vs holding won’t be the reason you’re missing at those ranges.

On a side note it’s like the nightforce atacr 7-35. It’s well documented that they have a lot more internal travel then advertised. The 7-35’s have 32 or 35 mils (I forget what mine is total) internally but are advertised to have less. I’m sure there is a variance from scope to scope so the advertised number could just be what is guaranteed even though most examples have a fair amount more. For me if I have 20 mil of useable elevation I can shoot a mile with every caliber I have so beyond that it’s not really needed. Also when you have a scope zero’d unless you are shooting a dedicated elr rig you don’t want to be always looking through the top and bottom of the adjustment range. All scopes even high end ones have the best picture looking through the center of the glass. When you zero at the very bottom of the adjustment range you are essentially looking through the edge of the scope at zero which can degrade the picture you see. The effect of this is much more obvious on cheaper scopes as the image will get blurry when you are dialed all the way up or down. The goal would be to zero your scope around the 25% of the bottom range and then do your shooting between that and the where the top 25% is. This leave you looking through the middle 50% of the scope for all your shooting giving you the best picture all the time. Those percentages obviously don’t need to be exact but it’s less then ideal to be looking through the edge of the glass for most of the time. If that didn’t make sense I can try to explain that in a different way.

 

[Gleedus]

Typically if you take half of your total Elevation minus 4.5 mil + rail moa thats what you'll have on the safe side.
E.g. with my IOR on the Rimx 40 moa rail 6 mil mount.
(38 mil/2)+(11.6 mil+6 mil)-4.5 mil
(19 mil)+(17.6 mil)-4.5 mil
32.1 mil usable
I have 32.3 actual in this case. It seems this holds true with 22lr 50 yd zero and centerfire 100 yd zero from my observation. I have checked on numerous rifles. So with the Razor if you only get the advertised 28.5 mil of adjustment and a 20 moa rail you should have a minimum of 15.6 mil. If I remember the Razor I had was more like 35ish mil total but kinda forget. But that would make 18.9 mil

 

[Rob01]

On a 20 MOA base I have about 21 mils on the knob. If you needed more then get more cant in the base. You could go up to 40 MOA without an issue. On an AR set up you could always use a 20 MOA riser and a set of 20 MOA rings on it.

 

[AznTactical]

I don't shoot ARC but for my 6.5 creedmoor and a 100yd zero I have 22.9 mils left of usable elevation. My rifle came with a 20moa rail and I had an existing 20 moa MPA mount. I was not able to get a 100yd zero with 40moa so I sold the mount for a 0moa mount.

 

[Rob01]

Not sure why you couldn’t zero at 100 with a 40 moa base but scope has more than enough elevation to do it.

 

[Gleedus]

I don't shoot ARC but for my 6.5 creedmoor and a 100yd zero I have 22.9 mils left of usable elevation. My rifle came with a 20moa rail and I had an existing 20 moa MPA mount. I was not able to get a 100yd zero with 40moa so I sold the mount for a 0moa mount.

I can zero with a 40 moa rail plus a 30 moa mount. Are you sure that you dont have your windage against one side to get zeroed? This could be reducing your total available elevation.

 

[AznTactical]

Not sure why you couldn’t zero at 100 with a 40 moa base but scope has more than enough elevation to do it.

Why do you say that?
Razor 28.5 mils total elevation, shooting high approx 0.4 mils at 100yds with 40moa at the bottom of it's elevation, removed 20moa, re-check zero and now I have almost 22.9 mils left. I think my math makes sense or am I seeing this wrong? (genuinely asking a question incase I did something wrong).

 

[AznTactical]

I can zero with a 40 moa rail plus a 30 moa mount. Are you sure that you dont have your windage against one side to get zeroed? This could be reducing your total available elevation.

Just checked windage and I have 5.8 mils Left and 7.2 mils Right but yet my Razor's specs say 10 mils but my total is 13mils.

 

[Rob01]

Why do you say that?
Razor 28.5 mils total elevation, shooting high approx 0.4 mils at 100yds with 40moa at the bottom of it's elevation, removed 20moa, re-check zero and now I have almost 22.9 mils left. I think my math makes sense or am I seeing this wrong? (genuinely asking a question incase I did something wrong).

I say it as a lot of people have them on 40 moa bases and have no issues zeroing at 100. I had one on my .22 with a 40 moa base and zeroed at 50 yards no issue. Might be something going on with the mount you are using and making it more than 40 moa but 40 should work.

 

[Gleedus]

Just checked windage and I have 5.8 mils Left and 7.2 mils Right but yet my Razor's specs say 10 mils but my total is 13mils.

Generally you have more then spec.

I expect your zero stop was set and it didnt let you go down all the way to the bottom. 20 moa is only 6 mil so if you have 23 left now you should beable to run another 20 moa no issue.

 

[alamo5000]

That’s right I can dial up 24.4 mils if I needed to, for reference when I was shooting just shy of 1500 yards I only had to dial about 15 or 16 mils for reference so needing over 30 plus holdovers would be deep into the subsonic zone of pretty much anything you can shoot.

This is awesome.

I can not imagine needing more than that for any caliber other than 300 Norma, 7 magnums, ELR calibers etc or fat slow heavy stuff like heavy 308 rounds etc. on a 6 arc you’ll basically be wasting ammo at a mile. Can it be done? Sure. Does it serve any other practical purpose other than putting a smile on your face? Probably not. But hey that’s all that matters sometimes.

Who said anything about being "practical"? The grin factor is enough for me. I was being partially facetious about the mile shot. Given I might do it just because I can.

That said I worded it that way (partially) for another reason...that being I didn't want 20 responses of 'why don't you just hold over?' which would be a completely useless response to my question about the ability to dial. I want to be able to dial at least 20mils, but I also don't want to go out buying a bunch of stuff just to experiment on then put it in a drawer to collect dust. Hence I am asking to learn as well as for pocketbook reasons. I personally would rather have more scope than not enough scope. 20mils will meet 98% of my needs because most of the time my limit is 1,400 yards because of real estate availability.

Practical or not I started shooting my 22LR out to 'not practical' distances and I am really liking it. I have 300 yards at the house but I can't wait to try the 400 and 500 yard plates. Hopefully the same thing rings true for the 6 ARC but to scale.

 

[alamo5000]

Based on the responses if I start shopping for a 20MOA base I will be well in the clear for what my needs are. Oh, and buy a scope eventually. I don't have my barrel yet (I am about the half way mark I think). I am not in a hurry but I am planning out my finances a bit. A $2K dent in the wallet is nothing to sneeze at.

 

[Gleedus]

You'll want 22-25 mil for 22lr at 400

 

[alamo5000]

You'll want 22-25 mil for 22lr at 400

I have just over 23 on the knob on my .22LR. I came up with a cheap but effective fix for that one, at least for now.

 

[Yerman]

Doesn’t matter how much elevation is in the turret if the image distorts so much that it becomes unusable at the extreme ends of travel .

Do yourself a favor and look into a NF.

 

[Jong]

Based on the responses if I start shopping for a 20MOA base I will be well in the clear for what my needs are. Oh, and buy a scope eventually. I don't have my barrel yet (I am about the half way mark I think). I am not in a hurry but I am planning out my finances a bit. A $2K dent in the wallet is nothing to sneeze at.

I got one for sale right now.

 

[Rob01]

Doesn’t matter how much elevation is in the turret if the image distorts so much that it becomes unusable at the extreme ends of travel .

Do yourself a favor and look into a NF.

He's in luck as the Razor doesn't do that.

 

[Gleedus]

Almost said something. I'm not a vortex fan boy but Razor doesn't fail at anything. They might not be the best at anything either but neither is......

 

[Rob01]

Also for my .22LR it's about 20.5 mils to 400 and 28.5 to 500.

 

[GrumpyOleFart]

Always a sneaky jab from the NightForce acolytes.
You just gotta love how they roll.

 

[Gleedus]

Also for my .22LR it's about 20.5 mils to 400 and 28.5 to 500.

Must be a lot warmer where you are right now lol!

 

[Rob01]

Must be a lot warmer where you are right now lol!

Those numbers work from about the 40's on up but any colder I am sure there would be more added.

 

[Gleedus]

Those numbers work from about the 40's on up but any colder I am sure there would be more added.

Your right. Yesterday i was out at 412 with some federal i was 23.5
I looked up my eley contact at 400 is 20.5

 

[308Gunner]

In mine I have 28.5 mils left from a 100 yard zero. Mine is mounted in a 591 with Seekins rings

 

[Inline6]

I say it as a lot of people have them on 40 moa bases and have no issues zeroing at 100. I had one on my .22 with a 40 moa base and zeroed at 50 yards no issue. Might be something going on with the mount you are using and making it more than 40 moa but 40 should work.

On my 338 AI 30moa base and another 20moa built into the mount. It's zeroed at 100. I wasn't sure it was going to work but it did.