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Real bad day for this Brigade Command!

Alaskaman11

Gunny Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Jan 21, 2009
1,562
32
Last Frontier
Unluckey or poor security?



A senior U.S. Army soldier was killed along with a couple of majors by a suicide bomber in Afghanistan, and three special forces soldiers were gunned down by an Afghan commander who had won their trust and invited them to dinner.
The suicide bomber struck Wednesday as a group of U.S. military and civilian officials from the 4th brigade, 4th Infantry Division were in Sarkowi in Kunar Province, which is located in eastern Afghanistan. The suicide attacker detonated an explosive vest near the group.
Killed in the attack were Command Sgt. Maj. Kevin J. Griffin, 45, of Laramie, Wyo., the brigade's senior enlisted soldier. As a command sergeant major, Griffin was one of the brigade's senior leaders and provided leadership and guidance to the 4,000 man brigade.
Also killed in the blast were Army Maj. Thomas E. Kennedy, 35, of West Point, N.Y., and Air Force Major Walter D. Gray, 38, of Conyers, Ga. Gray was an air liaison officer and flight commander attached to the brigade.
The brigade is tasked with providing security in three provinces that border Pakistan. Based in Fort Carson, Colo., the brigade arrived in Afghanistan this past April.
The explosion also killed American USAID Foreign Service Officer Ragaei Abdelfattah. Another American foreign service officer and an Afghan civilian were also injured in the attack.
In a statement released Thursday, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton praised Abdelfattah's work in eastern Afghanistan over the last year as "critical to our efforts to support Afghanistan's political, economic and security transitions and was an example of the highest standards of service." She said he was so committed to his mission that he had volunteered to serve a second year-long tour in Afghanistan.
The second incident was described by Afghan officials as a clear case of infiltration where a Taliban operative joined the Afghan army, climbed its ranks, and earned the trust of his U.S. counterparts – only to kill them when the opportunity arose.
Afghan sources say the three killed service members were U.S. special forces who had been invited to dinner today in a small village of Mosa Qala, in southern Afghanistan.
The troops had been in touch with a local Afghan commander named Asadullah, trusting him enough to accept the invitation. During the dinner, in which Afghan local police were present, Asadullah opened fire, killing three soldiers and injuring one. He then escaped and joined the Taliban, who quickly boasted of the mission's success.
NATO officials did not provide details on today's incident.
In an earlier version of this story, ABC News incorrectly reported that the commander of the 4th Brigade was seriously wounded in the suicide bombing.The commander was not injured.
 
Re: Real bad day for this Brigade Command!

I reslize (maybe) that we need to train these idiots, but there is a simple solution that would help stop these afgahns from turning their guns our our traiers.

The NRA and CMP requires the use of ECIs (Empty Chamber Indicatiors) in all guns until you're on the firing line ready to shoot.

Buy a bunch of them (about $3 per dozzen from CMP) and give one to every Afghan being trained. Allow the ECIs only to be removed when the guy is actually shooting under the watchful eye of the trainer.

Anyone not firing and doesn't have an ECI in his rifle if fair game.

You can't shoot anyone with an ECI in your chamber.
 
Re: Real bad day for this Brigade Command!

It's not bad luck. And it's not bad security. It's bad intelligence.

And this appears to have been an ambush, not a case of an ANP/ANA opening-up on friendlies during live fire training.

Sure, one can go in with a larger team and/or first disarm people, but that's not how one demonstrates trust. They took a risk. That's the job of SF. They were murdered.

This kind of thing doesn't stop unless and until the participants, conduits, support-people, planners and decision-makers are all held to account: Some immediately; the others eventually. Doing that also builds trust.
 
Re: Real bad day for this Brigade Command!

When are we going to learn from other people's mistakes and realize this is a war on ideology.

I understand why we are there but are we really going to change an ideology that has been ingrained for centuries?

It just rips at my conscience every time I read about another son or daughter dying half way around the world. Mind you I am not a liberal/progressive and I despise everything the Taliban/Sharia culture stands for. However, the Soviets spilled a lot of blood in this land and succeed in nothing.

Furthermore, with my daughter in Basic Training, this situation has the potential to get much closer to home. Not that my daughter is more valuable than any of the souls there right now, other than to me.
 
Re: Real bad day for this Brigade Command!

Damn. This sounds just like the assassination of the Majors behind a combination locked door right after the Quran burning. Sucks to have to trust people that can't be trusted.
 
Re: Real bad day for this Brigade Command!

I agree with Mr. Galt, war on terror, war on drugs, war on communism, you are never going to win because there is no enemy. You are fighting an ideal, not a person, place, or thing.
 
Re: Real bad day for this Brigade Command!

I disagree. It is bad security. When 'Leadership' goes to meet with local nationals, there is always supposed to be a squad, or more of security, both as PSD, and outer permiter security. Intel is part of that pre op preparation.

Even as a lowly Staff Sergeant, when I went to meet with shop owners, outside venbdors and make an agreeable way for all to do business in the same area, I had two teams of security. My A Team Soldiers inside watching everyone, and my B Team pulling close perimeter. I was looked at earlier, given the exact words from 1SG Assclown,"Well SSG, you damn well better fix your AO!" Fine, my AO, no problem, I fuckin A fix shit.
I held the meeting, had my 'terp insure my words were clear, and when it was all done, each vendor would settle his days receipts, then give the shop rep 5%. The shop rep would then take that 5% to the shop that sold the same products(each shop had different stuff, but 'street' vendors had whatever they chose). Yes, it was as simple as a little bakshish which they all understood. We drank chai, had a few laughs, and I made visits each day for the next two weeks and saw no problems.

The clear issue for these deaths is this:
Upper level Leadership has no business moving around outside of their daily grid, ie, the damn BASOPS. There are lower level field commanders and SGM's and others to do those jobs. Security was PISS POOR and it cost lives
 
Re: Real bad day for this Brigade Command!

Call it bad luck, bad intel, call it bad security, but in truth it is really just a symptom of bad strategy.

We cannot and will not impose a democratic republic on the Afghani people. Period. Anything we do to that end will fail. Our combat forces in theater need to have one and only one mission focus at this point...force protection; because the primary mission as it is currently defined will fail. That is in no way the fault of our brave men and women who are faithfully executing what is a flawed strategy- a strategy that lacks understanding of the history of Afghanistan and the political situation on the ground there.

Afghanistan is not even a nation because it has no national identity...it is not a country just because of where the lines on a map were drawn by someone who has no understanding of a pashtun or uzbek or tajik. Karzai extends no influence beyond Kabul, and precious little there. A collection of loose ethnic associations, divided by tribal village elder/warlord allegiances, and now blanketed by a religious ideology totally unsuited for any free civil society, is a recipe for destruction and constant sectarian strife NOT a free democratic republic. We do not serve our national interests by spending our blood and treasure trying to change the fabric of that collection of societies by trying to convert them by force to a political system that <span style="font-style: italic">by definition</span> must be freely and willingly embraced for it to work.

The good news, if there is anyone in Washington with the common sense to grasp it, is that we don't NEED to change any of the existing conditions in Afghanistan to reduce the threat of non-state actors using that lawless place as a base of operations to attack us. We currently monitor sources of threats worldwide...in many places that do not have democracy, freedom, or even any form of stable government...should we drain the treasury and the blood of a generation trying to "fix" those places too? On the contrary...we now have the means to strike any target on Earth within hours. Our focus SHOULD be on developing the humint and special operations necessary to figure out when and where a political group poses a threat to us that we may <span style="font-style: italic">then</span> respond to in a forceful but limited way....we MONITOR then INTERVENE. I'm talking an airstrike that disrupts a cell <span style="font-style: italic">instead</span> of trying to re-write 2000 years of human history. I'm talking an assassination that sets back a cell for years, <span style="font-style: italic">rather than</span> trying to install democracy in a region that hasn't even graduated beyond barbarian warload stage to a simple monarchy, much less a constitutional monarchy, or a republic. Had the effort we have spent on Afghanistan been along these more realistic limited goals we would have more security at less cost.

In other words, we roll down the highway of life in our luxury A-Team SUV minding our own business and like good drivers we monitor theirs in the mirror. When they get out of their lane we punch them back in and go back to minding our business. I dont care if they are driving a nice car, a dented up Yugo, or beating a freakin donkey pullin a cart. It isn't our job as a nation to improve their mode of transportation, and for damn sure not our job to drive it for them. When we do, we inevitably run our own vehicle into the ditch.
 
Re: Real bad day for this Brigade Command!

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KYpatriot</div><div class="ubbcode-body">... a flawed strategy - a strategy that lacks understanding of the history of Afghanistan and the political situation on the ground there. </div></div>Well said.

It could also be said, in general, that most of our foreign policy failures have resulted from a lack of understanding of the particular local historical situation of the countries in which the wars were conducted.
 
Re: Real bad day for this Brigade Command!

KY - that's about the best < 1 page summary I have ever read on Afghanistan - very well said. As far as people in Washington getting it - well there was one person who ran for the Republican ticket this year who "got it" more than others and the troop support too from what I understand, but won't go farther than that because of the no-politics position of the forum.
I don't consider myself enlightened in foreign policy other than I try to read all views, including those that still think we should be sending out guys in there en masse. I will forever support our troops but wonder to what extent they are being used liked pawns in a chess game of TPTB with the "kings & queens" gaining more than ideology at the cost of the lives of some incredibly valiant souls.
Little extra prayers out tonight for wanyone in harms way.