Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

[timelinex]

I have been reloading my bolt action 308 and 338 for a bit of time now. I have just bought a daniel defense ar15 chambered in 5.56. I want to start reloading for this round, but I just wanted to get some insight on reloading for a semi-automatic.

From my understanding, the only real difference is that It is mandatory to full size every time and to use a bushing that gives atleast .003" neck tension. Is that correct?

My next question is what kind of dies to get. Currently for my other calibers, I have redding type s sizers and a Forster competition seating die. Is this overkill for a semi automatic? I don't expect .5 moa accuracy but I do expect <1moa.

Lastly, what kind of brass is recommended if my accuracy goal is < 1moa. I tried doing research on this, but its not very clear since there is a WIDE range of what kind of accuracy people expect from an ar15.

Thanks!

 

[boltgunluvr]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

Barrel length/twist considerations....and make sure you load hot enough to make sure the gun will cycle properly. However, I'm NOT recommending loading hot. Just hot enough. FL size only. I do know some that NS for ARs, but they have a malfunction every now and then. It's not worth the potential headaches. .003-.005 tension is good, can't even remember what mine are set at. If your bullet has a cannelure, consider a good old-fashioned roll crimp, unless you're really after target performance. I know a lot of folks consider that outdated, but it still has it's place. I NS only for bolts. I hate to see anyone spend $ for expensive brass for an AR because they can chew on brass pretty hard.

 

[Graham]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

I find precision loading for a factory AR15 to be a waste of time. Get resized once-fired military brass, add the powder charge of your choice and seat a bullet, then leave the empties at the range and go get some more. I can even shoot sub-MOA with 80VLDs using this method (whatever the primer, 24.5 RE15) and I don't worry about brass lots.

 

[timelinex]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

The twist rate is 1:7 and it is a 16" barrel. From my understanding, Daniel defense barrels are high quality an shouldn't have a problem shooting under 1 moa.... Not to say that I can keep up with it.... This weekend I found out real quick how much harder it is to shoot 1moa when the red dot is 1moa big and no magnification!

Ok, so LC brass is good enough for 1 moa then? I'm assuming your not even prepping the cases the same way you would for a bolt (primer informing, flag whole uniformity etc..)? So then are the higher quality dies even worth it?!

 

[PowderMeasure]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

I personally believe it will be a personal preferrence for you. I load the same for my AR's as I do for my bolt guns due to the fact I like to keep it all the same.(systematic) I also enjoy it. I buy the 55 grains and reload 68 BTHP's and get great groups!

 

[Graham]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok, so LC brass is good enough for 1 moa then? I'm assuming your not even prepping the cases the same way you would for a bolt (primer informing, flag whole uniformity etc..)? So then are the higher quality dies even worth it?! </div></div>I don't prep them at all, just load them. Here's a group using different lots of brass: Pulled the bullets, changed powder and seated 80JLKs on top. I don't even know what neck tension they were:

 

[MALLARD]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I find precision loading for a factory AR15 to be a waste of time. Get resized once-fired military brass, add the powder charge of your choice and seat a bullet, then leave the empties at the range and go get some more. I can even shoot sub-MOA with 80VLDs using this method (whatever the primer, 24.5 RE15) and I don't worry about brass lots.

</div></div> +1

 

[plant.one]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

this is my 223 load i shoot through my ar-15 - bone stuck bushmaster flat top m4 - 16" 1:9 twist

these are loaded in federal brass.


FL sized out of a lee breech lock with lee dies. I cut them to length, chamfer, debur and load to OAL all according to hornady's 8th. No crimp. Never found a need for one with performance like this.

YMMV

 

[Jimlaw83]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

I get 1 MOA out of my bone stock stag 8 piston upper with chrome lined barrel. Just pick up a lee pacesetter die set, load and add a light crimp with the included factory crimp die. I think it helps uniform neck tension and start pressure. I have also found that in an AR, the most accurate loads are close to case fill, generally towards the upper half of published load data.

 

[Captain Moroni]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok, so LC brass is good enough for 1 moa then? I'm assuming your not even prepping the cases the same way you would for a bolt (primer informing, flag whole uniformity etc..)? So then are the higher quality dies even worth it?! </div></div>I don't prep them at all, just load them. Here's a group using different lots of brass: Pulled the bullets, changed powder and seated 80JLKs on top. I don't even know what neck tension they were:

</div></div>

Am I reading that right that you are getting 2875FPS from an 80gr bullet? What is your barrel length?

 

[Graham]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Captain Moroni</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Am I reading that right that you are getting 2875FPS from an 80gr bullet? What is your barrel length? </div></div>Yup. 22".

 

[Phil1]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I find precision loading for a factory AR15 to be a waste of time. Get resized once-fired military brass, add the powder charge of your choice and seat a bullet, then leave the empties at the range and go get some more. I can even shoot sub-MOA with 80VLDs using this method (whatever the primer, 24.5 RE15) and I don't worry about brass lots.

</div></div>

I agree but I would never leave any brass.

 

[timelinex]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Graham</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Ok, so LC brass is good enough for 1 moa then? I'm assuming your not even prepping the cases the same way you would for a bolt (primer informing, flag whole uniformity etc..)? So then are the higher quality dies even worth it?! </div></div>I don't prep them at all, just load them. Here's a group using different lots of brass: Pulled the bullets, changed powder and seated 80JLKs on top. I don't even know what neck tension they were:
</div></div>

JLK's are some pretty expensive bullets.. If your doing so little to ensure accuracy in all your other preparations, then why are you buying such expensive bullets? Did you just find that they did THAT much better then all the other choices?

Is RE15 something you would recommend for 5.56? I have read a lot of good things about AA2520

 

[PowderMeasure]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

I use Ramshot TAC w/ CCI primers. Been betting great results.

 

[Graham]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">JLK's are some pretty expensive bullets.. If your doing so little to ensure accuracy in all your other preparations, then why are you buying such expensive bullets?</div></div>For the same reason I don't do brass prep but shoot 180JLKs in .308: Highest BC with enough velocity at 1000 yards-plus.<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Did you just find that they did THAT much better then all the other choices?</div></div>Yes. Slightly worse than MOA at 1000.<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: timelinex</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Is RE15 something you would recommend for 5.56? I have read a lot of good things about AA2520 </div></div>Yes. My rifle likes H4895 a bit better, for about 20fps faster on an equivalent load, but RE15 works well for the 80s in all guns I have tried (with no exceptions).

 

[Greg Langelius *]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

I shoot a completely stock Stag 6 Super Varminter. It makes even bulk pack 55gr FMJ look good at 100yd. At 250yd, shooting FV250 Comp, it pays to do load development.

Starting with once fired Prvi-Partizan Match brass (69/75gr, and both do quite well it of this rifle), I ream flash holes, then load the ammo progressively.

The dies are RCBS F/L, and the powder is Varget, fed through the Dillon automatic measure. These dies are fine, better ones are not overkill as long as you already have them. They don't need to be replaced with something more mudane.

I don't expect BR accuracy, and I don't expect the brass to last especially long either.

Still developing the load, using SRA 69SMK and HDY 75HPBTM, Varget, and CCI 400, will try BR-4's once the ideal load is finalized.

So far, no loads are 'bad', some are better, and the ideal load is still out there somewhere; but it's not out of sight, either. Things move slow because I'm not getting out to the range very often.

Life is what happens when we're planning on doing all those other 'important' things.

Greg

 

[Graham]

Re: Reloading ar15 vs bolt rifle

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Greg Langelius *</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Life is what happens when we're planning on doing all those other 'important' things.</div></div>
<span style="font-style: italic">Chaos is the score upon which reality is written</span>. - Henry Miller