Hi all,
Let me start off by letting you guys know that anything your about to read are only my personal impressions and opinions including likes and dislikes and personal preferences.I'm not LEO or MIL,just a gun enthusiast.You are welcome to give your opinion too just PLEASE don't trash the thread with endless arguments and disagreements.
Disclaimer.I don't know anybody that owns or is affiliated with either brand.Nor are paid or compensated in any way.But hey Sig and RA,I wouldn't be opposed to it
For the last couple years I've been wanting to try out all the new fancy 5.56 semi autos and to be honest I've been a little bored this winter too,with all the snow and with work being slow.So I decided to finally just buy a used Robinson Armament XCR-L and a new SIG556 Patrol carbine to test
Please go to http://www.robarm.com/# and http://www.sigsauer.com/ to compare particulars.Note that there are different variations of each brand.
I'll tell you right now though that they are nearly the same in size and weight and are both folding stocked,gas piston operated and chambered in 5.56 NATO
Sorry...I decided to do this little review in "segments" so you'll have to come back once in a while to read new comments I've added later.I'll try to finish in the next week or so.
Here goes...First impressions and pics
RobArms XCR-L
I was looking forward to the XCR because it is loosely based on the AK-47 operating system with a mix of out of the box thinking and AR-15ish cues here and there.I don't know about you guys but when I think AK-47 the first thing that comes to my mind is reliability.
As soon as I layed eyes on it I thought it was really cool! I'll start off with the +'s first and get to the -'s later.
Lots of picattiny rails extending top,bottom,left and right of the "integral receiver".The forend which is merely an extended part of the receiver is slimmer on the sides with slots cut for cooling the barrel and possibly accessory attachment points?.It makes for a better feel to me vs the squareish quadrails on most AR's...and yes I know that there are as many different AR handguards as there are drops of water in the ocean
Very light weight and compact at 7.5lbs and 36".One could almost shoot it as a pistol.It points very naturally!
Nice ergonomic rubber finger groove grip...I hate the standard "boring" AR grip...don't you?
It's got the coolest bolt release I've ever encountered!!! Ambidextrous and right there at your finger tip,installed at the front sides of the trigger guard.Just push down like on a 1911 and your GTG.I can't say enough about this feature!Me likey
Charging handle is on the left side of the XCR.I like holding the grip with my right hand to operate the handle with my left hand! I also like the fact that it does not move with the bolt carrier when the bolt carrier is going back while firing,it's non reciprocating!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Mag release button.Standard AR type on the right hand side and easy for me to reach with my short fingers.It's also protected by part of the lowers frame protruding out to help prevent accidental mag release.
The magwell is nicely beveled!The XCR takes any AR magazines.Mine came with a 30 round Pmag.
The folding stock... Good and bad here.The good is that it's there.Somehow many years ago I bought a M4 type case that has never fit my 15" barreled Armalite right.Too short.So for this and other reasons I like the folding stock.I think FS's appropriate for carbines.
<span style="font-size: 17pt">EDIT!!! "Disregard"</span> this whole stock discourse.I found out that the XCR has adjustment screws to tighten the stock up.I think they worked loose in shipping.It's perfect now thanks to Native!
Dislikes...There are two.It's wobbly extended or not and it does not lock into the folded position.You'd have to dream up a way to secure it when folded in
I did however find a way to totally eliminate the wobble when the stock is extended to it's normal position.I just put a big black rubber plumbing washer in the slot on the side of the pivot joint.It compresses in the joint and the wobble is all fixed.Cheap fix for my cheap ass self,LOL.The groups were better too.I'll get to that another day.
Take down field stripping...It don't get easier than this!
I won't even go into it but will post some pics.
Gas system seems very robust but how would I know anyways?It does have some adjustment if needed.A good thing on a gas operated weapon.It comes apart easy enough too.
Last but not least...modularity!!!
If you want to switch cartridges or barrel lengths/contours this is a good rifle to do it with.Go see how easy it is on RA's website.Just click on their videos link.It's almost too easy.
Positive observances...
The brass does not get dinged or banged up,YAY!!!...I like this because I reload.It's got a soft plasic or hard rubber brass deflector that works great.Most of the brass lands about 20ft away strait to the side.
I only have 150 rounds through it but there were ZERO malfunctions even with 4 different types of ammo and using 4 different type of magazines.
I forgot how clean "uhh,more like shocked how clean" the bolts and inside of the receivers were on both of these gas piston guns.I'm used to DI AR's and the dirty carbon mess they produce.This alone has got to aid in reliability.
The -'s
It did not come with iron sights.I think any AR BUIS sight system will work fine.I was using a scope for testing.
Trigger...It's a 2 stage.The take up for the 1st stage is approx 16th" and the over travel is not noticeable.The 1st stage takes almost as much force to overcome as the 2cd stage!!!You know what comes next.Yep you guessed it/the gun goes off before you want it to sometimes
With my Lyman trigger gauge the trigger weight is 7lbs and 12oz average and I can't get it to distinguish the first stage at all.If I were to guess it would be 9-10oz difference between the 1st and 2cd stage.
Accuracy...so far I'd rate as average for this type of gun.1.5-2 MOA.Since the folding stock was loose and floppy when I did some group testing last week,at 100Y.I had a really hard time getting a good hold on the rifle.It was like trying to hold onto a floppy fish,LOL.I'd get 1MOA for three shots and then 2 big OH CRAPPERS opening up the group inevitably.
After I did the rubber washer fix on the FS I had a couple friends shoot it at white painted steel 300 yards away.It sure seems to shoot well!We were enlarging the same splat mark.It was about 3"s.So I'll retest at 100Y soon and let you know how it shot.
I went out once more at 100Y and the gun shoots around 1.5MOA on average.I bet with some load work up for the rifle I could get less but I'll let the next owner do that if they want.
In conclusion.
I had 3 friends shoot the XCR and Sig556 on 3 separate occasions.All 3 liked the XCR better than the Sig.However I hadn't had the trigger adjusted on the 556 for 2 of them yet.So I'm quite sure that their decision would have been affected had they tried it that way.
I like the XCR better as well.Mostly because of all innovative features.Not that it was any more reliable or more accurate than the 556.If it was an MOA gun and had a trigger job on it,I think it would be the perfect carbine!I'm not looking forward to selling it at all!
All done.
Steve
PICS of both rifles for comparison.
Let me start off by letting you guys know that anything your about to read are only my personal impressions and opinions including likes and dislikes and personal preferences.I'm not LEO or MIL,just a gun enthusiast.You are welcome to give your opinion too just PLEASE don't trash the thread with endless arguments and disagreements.
Disclaimer.I don't know anybody that owns or is affiliated with either brand.Nor are paid or compensated in any way.But hey Sig and RA,I wouldn't be opposed to it
For the last couple years I've been wanting to try out all the new fancy 5.56 semi autos and to be honest I've been a little bored this winter too,with all the snow and with work being slow.So I decided to finally just buy a used Robinson Armament XCR-L and a new SIG556 Patrol carbine to test
Please go to http://www.robarm.com/# and http://www.sigsauer.com/ to compare particulars.Note that there are different variations of each brand.
I'll tell you right now though that they are nearly the same in size and weight and are both folding stocked,gas piston operated and chambered in 5.56 NATO
Sorry...I decided to do this little review in "segments" so you'll have to come back once in a while to read new comments I've added later.I'll try to finish in the next week or so.
Here goes...First impressions and pics
RobArms XCR-L
I was looking forward to the XCR because it is loosely based on the AK-47 operating system with a mix of out of the box thinking and AR-15ish cues here and there.I don't know about you guys but when I think AK-47 the first thing that comes to my mind is reliability.
As soon as I layed eyes on it I thought it was really cool! I'll start off with the +'s first and get to the -'s later.
Lots of picattiny rails extending top,bottom,left and right of the "integral receiver".The forend which is merely an extended part of the receiver is slimmer on the sides with slots cut for cooling the barrel and possibly accessory attachment points?.It makes for a better feel to me vs the squareish quadrails on most AR's...and yes I know that there are as many different AR handguards as there are drops of water in the ocean
Very light weight and compact at 7.5lbs and 36".One could almost shoot it as a pistol.It points very naturally!
Nice ergonomic rubber finger groove grip...I hate the standard "boring" AR grip...don't you?
It's got the coolest bolt release I've ever encountered!!! Ambidextrous and right there at your finger tip,installed at the front sides of the trigger guard.Just push down like on a 1911 and your GTG.I can't say enough about this feature!Me likey
Charging handle is on the left side of the XCR.I like holding the grip with my right hand to operate the handle with my left hand! I also like the fact that it does not move with the bolt carrier when the bolt carrier is going back while firing,it's non reciprocating!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Mag release button.Standard AR type on the right hand side and easy for me to reach with my short fingers.It's also protected by part of the lowers frame protruding out to help prevent accidental mag release.
The magwell is nicely beveled!The XCR takes any AR magazines.Mine came with a 30 round Pmag.
The folding stock... Good and bad here.The good is that it's there.Somehow many years ago I bought a M4 type case that has never fit my 15" barreled Armalite right.Too short.So for this and other reasons I like the folding stock.I think FS's appropriate for carbines.
<span style="font-size: 17pt">EDIT!!! "Disregard"</span> this whole stock discourse.I found out that the XCR has adjustment screws to tighten the stock up.I think they worked loose in shipping.It's perfect now thanks to Native!
Dislikes...There are two.It's wobbly extended or not and it does not lock into the folded position.You'd have to dream up a way to secure it when folded in
Take down field stripping...It don't get easier than this!
I won't even go into it but will post some pics.
Gas system seems very robust but how would I know anyways?It does have some adjustment if needed.A good thing on a gas operated weapon.It comes apart easy enough too.
Last but not least...modularity!!!
If you want to switch cartridges or barrel lengths/contours this is a good rifle to do it with.Go see how easy it is on RA's website.Just click on their videos link.It's almost too easy.
Positive observances...
The brass does not get dinged or banged up,YAY!!!...I like this because I reload.It's got a soft plasic or hard rubber brass deflector that works great.Most of the brass lands about 20ft away strait to the side.
I only have 150 rounds through it but there were ZERO malfunctions even with 4 different types of ammo and using 4 different type of magazines.
I forgot how clean "uhh,more like shocked how clean" the bolts and inside of the receivers were on both of these gas piston guns.I'm used to DI AR's and the dirty carbon mess they produce.This alone has got to aid in reliability.
The -'s
It did not come with iron sights.I think any AR BUIS sight system will work fine.I was using a scope for testing.
Trigger...It's a 2 stage.The take up for the 1st stage is approx 16th" and the over travel is not noticeable.The 1st stage takes almost as much force to overcome as the 2cd stage!!!You know what comes next.Yep you guessed it/the gun goes off before you want it to sometimes
Accuracy...so far I'd rate as average for this type of gun.1.5-2 MOA.Since the folding stock was loose and floppy when I did some group testing last week,at 100Y.I had a really hard time getting a good hold on the rifle.It was like trying to hold onto a floppy fish,LOL.I'd get 1MOA for three shots and then 2 big OH CRAPPERS opening up the group inevitably.
After I did the rubber washer fix on the FS I had a couple friends shoot it at white painted steel 300 yards away.It sure seems to shoot well!We were enlarging the same splat mark.It was about 3"s.So I'll retest at 100Y soon and let you know how it shot.
I went out once more at 100Y and the gun shoots around 1.5MOA on average.I bet with some load work up for the rifle I could get less but I'll let the next owner do that if they want.
In conclusion.
I had 3 friends shoot the XCR and Sig556 on 3 separate occasions.All 3 liked the XCR better than the Sig.However I hadn't had the trigger adjusted on the 556 for 2 of them yet.So I'm quite sure that their decision would have been affected had they tried it that way.
I like the XCR better as well.Mostly because of all innovative features.Not that it was any more reliable or more accurate than the 556.If it was an MOA gun and had a trigger job on it,I think it would be the perfect carbine!I'm not looking forward to selling it at all!
All done.
Steve
PICS of both rifles for comparison.
