Some pics for folks that are curious, haven't had a chance to play with them yet.
Neat idea...HEAVY
Neat idea...HEAVY
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Cowbiker, Quick history of the S-Lock.
Emilio Canavaca owns U.W.S. (Ultimate Weapon Systems) and bought the web domain name "Harrisbipods.com. Harris Engineering (the makers of Harris Bipods) has never had a website and in spite of UWS buying and reselling Harris Bipods, does not endorse or promote U.W.S. above any other dealer carrying their products. U.W.S. continues to sell products with most buyers thinking they are dealing with Harris.
Emilio purchased some KMW Pod-Loc kits in June of 2009. Shortly thereafter, the S-Lock was announced on their website. At the time the Pod-Loc was copied by them, the KMW Pod-Loc was a 2 piece kit so that is the way they tried to duplicate it. Since then, KMW has found a way to make the kit in one unitized assembly.
The S-Lock Lever assembly is made with imported parts. I know for a fact that there is no domestic maker of off the shelf injection molded levers in spite of one of them having USA molded in the plastic. I'm not sure where he sources the copy of the KMW dust cover.
Every component of the KMW kit is custom spec'd and made in the U.S. specifically for the Pod-Loc kit. Each kit is assembled, lubricated and packaged is the KMW shop. The tamper resistant assembly screw is made in Oregon and evolved from REAL MEN not reading instructions to understand that the lever can be pulled out/disengaged and relocated without changing tension........so they stick a screw driver or wrench in that screw to "adjust it" and break it off.
So if you think the two kits look and weigh very similar, you are correct and there is a reason for that.
I hope this helps somewhat with answering some of the questions you may have had when taking the above photos.
Be safe,
Terry
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Emilio Canavaca owns U.W.S. (Ultimate Weapon Systems) and bought the web domain name "Harrisbipods.com. Harris Engineering (the makers of Harris Bipods) has never had a website and in spite of UWS buying and reselling Harris Bipods, does not endorse or promote U.W.S. above any other dealer carrying their products. U.W.S. continues to sell products with most buyers thinking they are dealing with Harris.
Emilio purchased some KMW Pod-Loc kits in June of 2009. Shortly thereafter, the S-Lock was announced on their website. At the time the Pod-Loc was copied by them, the KMW Pod-Loc was a 2 piece kit so that is the way they tried to duplicate it. Since then, KMW has found a way to make the kit in one unitized assembly.
The S-Lock Lever assembly is made with imported parts. I know for a fact that there is no domestic maker of off the shelf injection molded levers in spite of one of them having USA molded in the plastic. I'm not sure where he sources the copy of the KMW dust cover.
Every component of the KMW kit is custom spec'd and made in the U.S. specifically for the Pod-Loc kit. Each kit is assembled, lubricated and packaged is the KMW shop. The tamper resistant assembly screw is made in Oregon and evolved from REAL MEN not reading instructions to understand that the lever can be pulled out/disengaged and relocated without changing tension........so they stick a screw driver or wrench in that screw to "adjust it" and break it off.
So if you think the two kits look and weigh very similar, you are correct and there is a reason for that.
I hope this helps somewhat with answering some of the questions you may have had when taking the above photos.
Be safe,
Terry
.
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MidWay USA actually beat them to the punch on copying products.......
To complete the correct history, Bob McNulty with MidWay USA asked for a sample kit and dealer pricing. This was sent to him at no charge on October 22, 2008.
No order was ever placed with KMW and within 3 months MidWay USA announced their revolutionary Alpha-Bravo bipod lock on their website and catalog!
Again, their kit is made with imported components. Like Harrisbipods.com, this allows them to sell their copies below the Pod-Loc street prices and still realize about 200% of the profit margin compared to a domestically manufactured and assembled product.
Out of coffee and break should have been over sooner. Back to the shop.
TC
To complete the correct history, Bob McNulty with MidWay USA asked for a sample kit and dealer pricing. This was sent to him at no charge on October 22, 2008.
No order was ever placed with KMW and within 3 months MidWay USA announced their revolutionary Alpha-Bravo bipod lock on their website and catalog!
Again, their kit is made with imported components. Like Harrisbipods.com, this allows them to sell their copies below the Pod-Loc street prices and still realize about 200% of the profit margin compared to a domestically manufactured and assembled product.
Out of coffee and break should have been over sooner. Back to the shop.
TC
It's bullshit Terry and I'm sorry people have screwed you like that. I can't imagine coming up with something like you have and then having people basically steal it from you. Your products are great and I will continue to use and recommend them, I will continue NOT ordering from Midway. I'll also make sure I nor anyone I know ever orders anything from Harrisbipods.com
The fact that they ordered some of yours or that you sent some for free, only to have them ripped off and copied is awful. Not sure how you get lower than a thief but I think they figured it out.
harrisbipods.com and midwayusa.com = stolen American ideas copied and made with non American parts
maybe that will show up in some people's web searches.
harrisbipods.com and midwayusa.com = stolen American ideas copied and made with non American parts
maybe that will show up in some people's web searches.
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Midway USA(sort of) for the Knock-Off WIN again! Wondered how long it would take for Terry to pop up.
What question?
Also, to be clear I am not trying to bash Cowbiker or any other consumer that chooses alternative hardware. I believe he is simply trying to review products and see what is out there.
Just trying to make everybody can make an informed purchase and/or do a review with full disclosure of the product history available.
Some may have very limited budgets and saving $8.00 on a kit can go toward bullets, etc....
.
Also, to be clear I am not trying to bash Cowbiker or any other consumer that chooses alternative hardware. I believe he is simply trying to review products and see what is out there.
Just trying to make everybody can make an informed purchase and/or do a review with full disclosure of the product history available.
Some may have very limited budgets and saving $8.00 on a kit can go toward bullets, etc....
.
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Instructions are also copied from the KMW sheet.
Also pointed out by emails from others is that the S Lock instructions are shown in your above photos but the green Pod-Loc instruction sheet was not opened.
A side by side photo of front and back would be very interesting. I wrote the instruction sheet and have been using it in the same format since 2000 with edits only to reflect upgrades as the kit evolved. The S-Lock sheet not only copied the format of my instruction sheet but also copied my exact wording in all of its printed text!
I personally think it is funny that they claim to have all the innovations when in fact they are too lazy or too ill educated to write a good set of instructions for their product.
Cowbiker, I do appreciate you looking over the KMW kit and welcome whatever testing or abuse you want to throw at it during your review. Thank you for your business.
Also pointed out by emails from others is that the S Lock instructions are shown in your above photos but the green Pod-Loc instruction sheet was not opened.
A side by side photo of front and back would be very interesting. I wrote the instruction sheet and have been using it in the same format since 2000 with edits only to reflect upgrades as the kit evolved. The S-Lock sheet not only copied the format of my instruction sheet but also copied my exact wording in all of its printed text!
I personally think it is funny that they claim to have all the innovations when in fact they are too lazy or too ill educated to write a good set of instructions for their product.
Cowbiker, I do appreciate you looking over the KMW kit and welcome whatever testing or abuse you want to throw at it during your review. Thank you for your business.
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SUPPORT Terry and KMW.
I was the REAL MAN that broke the originals in the early days which lead to the instruction changes. (PROUD OF THAT) Also the USMC was buying and using these products from KMW prior to the copy cats coming out.
To me spending the extra dollar or two to support companies and their ideas instead of companies that want to steal people hard work and sell you crap is worth it.
I was the REAL MAN that broke the originals in the early days which lead to the instruction changes. (PROUD OF THAT) Also the USMC was buying and using these products from KMW prior to the copy cats coming out.
To me spending the extra dollar or two to support companies and their ideas instead of companies that want to steal people hard work and sell you crap is worth it.
I only have first hand experience with Terry's KMW Pod Locs and not the copies. They are on all my Harris bipods and they work well and have held up well. I have seen guys at the range have problems with the copies, while the problems may be "user error", I haven't seen this with the KMW products. That's my two cents FWIW.
cjgemm, I just now PM'd you a reply regarding your question about stocks.
Do not count on me reading and getting timely replies back from a PM on this or any other site. I apologize if you thought you were ignored.
Do not count on me reading and getting timely replies back from a PM on this or any other site. I apologize if you thought you were ignored.
Terry,
Sorry for having been away from the thread and the lack of anything other than pics and relative weights. I purchased both more out of curiosity and truth be told, on feel alone the KMW product has better ergonomics for my size mitts.
I appreciate the background and the information, of the two options yours won out for my Harris, now if the notched harris stays on when my Atlas PSR shows up, or stays in rotation...to be determined.
Respectfully;
Sean
Sorry for having been away from the thread and the lack of anything other than pics and relative weights. I purchased both more out of curiosity and truth be told, on feel alone the KMW product has better ergonomics for my size mitts.
I appreciate the background and the information, of the two options yours won out for my Harris, now if the notched harris stays on when my Atlas PSR shows up, or stays in rotation...to be determined.
Respectfully;
Sean
You have to appreciate Terry Cross' ingenuity and recognition of the ability to use this hardware to make the Harris more functional, but he didn't invent the hardware, he simply figured out how to adapt it to fit his needs, in this case tensioning the cant adjustment on the back of the bipod.
Adjustable levers are nothing new, and I've used many of them personally in other industry for years. I hadn't seen the newest iteration (the unitized kit) until this thread. Good for him for creating a product he can sell, but unless he has the ability to patent the procedure and use of already widely used hardware for this specific application, I'm not seeing how anyone can get pissed at other manufacturers. I don't think you can patent widely available hardware based on using it for the same application, just a different industry.
Maybe people on this site haven't even encountered these levers, but they're very common and have been used in various industries for many many years. Terry Cross did not invent the adjustable lever. He has done a great job in using them in an application that benefits us all, and he has done a good job with the evolution of the product, however I'm not sure there's anything here he can patent and defend, and I'm not sure you can blame another manufacturer for simply using the same existing technology and branding it for the same purpose.
Adjustable levers are nothing new, and I've used many of them personally in other industry for years. I hadn't seen the newest iteration (the unitized kit) until this thread. Good for him for creating a product he can sell, but unless he has the ability to patent the procedure and use of already widely used hardware for this specific application, I'm not seeing how anyone can get pissed at other manufacturers. I don't think you can patent widely available hardware based on using it for the same application, just a different industry.
Maybe people on this site haven't even encountered these levers, but they're very common and have been used in various industries for many many years. Terry Cross did not invent the adjustable lever. He has done a great job in using them in an application that benefits us all, and he has done a good job with the evolution of the product, however I'm not sure there's anything here he can patent and defend, and I'm not sure you can blame another manufacturer for simply using the same existing technology and branding it for the same purpose.
Well, finally got everything back from coating and back together, color on the pic came out messed up, much browner in person.
Whenever I get a Harris, I get the PODLOC at the same time. Been going here for about a dozen years:
triadtactical.com
Pod-Loc
triadtactical.com
