I just ordered an SSG this past Friday. I was wondering what everyone's opinion was on the rifle. What did you like? What did you hate? What have you changed? Any information is helpful. Hopefully it's good and I don't need to cancel my order
SIG SSG 3000 Questions
- Thread starter tag_heuer
- Start date
A friend has one. The older, more expensive, McMillan stock model.
Overall a well built rifle. Very accurate. Bolt runs a little stiff, but it is positive. Trigger is an excellent two stage - very TRGish. Barrel contour is a little odd to me, too fat down by the receiver and too skinny at the muzzle. The flash suppresser/brake doesn't do either well. Magazine release button is clumsy, and magazines are expensive, proprietary, and big considering their capacity (single stack). Bolt release/safety functionality is STRANGE, and cumbersome - especially because of interference with the adjustable cheekpiece.
Personally, I wouldn't buy one, but they are undoubtedly a well constructed, accurate rifle.
Other thing that pisses me off is Sigs and/or Sauers (never can keep track of their relationship) track record for not supporting some of their unique arms, ala the STR rifle and Trailside pistol.
Overall a well built rifle. Very accurate. Bolt runs a little stiff, but it is positive. Trigger is an excellent two stage - very TRGish. Barrel contour is a little odd to me, too fat down by the receiver and too skinny at the muzzle. The flash suppresser/brake doesn't do either well. Magazine release button is clumsy, and magazines are expensive, proprietary, and big considering their capacity (single stack). Bolt release/safety functionality is STRANGE, and cumbersome - especially because of interference with the adjustable cheekpiece.
Personally, I wouldn't buy one, but they are undoubtedly a well constructed, accurate rifle.
Other thing that pisses me off is Sigs and/or Sauers (never can keep track of their relationship) track record for not supporting some of their unique arms, ala the STR rifle and Trailside pistol.
We've had ours for a few weeks now and my comments are similar to those above. It shoots well but really in my opinion it's best suited for someone who already has a bunch of rifles, plenty of money and wants something a little different, or to the person who wants a decent LR rifle that never plans on modifying it. A couple things I'll mention is that I couldn't tune the trigger to be as good as a TRG but it's decent. I was especially sad to have paid (cost built into price of rifle) for that useless brake/hider and none of our 200 hex wrenches would fit it to take it off. In some ways it makes me think that Sig thought of the most difficult, awkward way of building an LR rifle and this is what came out. In other ways though some of the stuff is pretty clever.
Justin
Justin
The SSG3000 is a very misunderstood rifle in America. If you have only one top quality rifle and want to shoot a lot (15 - 20000 rounds a year) to be a good shooter no other rifle can be operational all the time unless you are a gunsmith. The SSG3000 is a "gunsmith free zone". Too bad SIG is ripping you off in the US. Mags and drop in barrels are the cheapest you can get in Scandinavia. Do you know of any other rifle were you can check the factory test target on a new spare barrel before you buy it?
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The TRG and AI usually go to the gunsmith for work. The shooter can do everything himself on the SSG3000.
A typical preparation for a season of shooting is "go to the shop and buy 2 new matchbarrels in 6.5x55 and 10000 rounds of ammo". You know you have a .40moa nobrainer. Start training and shoot matches.
A typical preparation for a season of shooting is "go to the shop and buy 2 new matchbarrels in 6.5x55 and 10000 rounds of ammo". You know you have a .40moa nobrainer. Start training and shoot matches.
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Here in the USA, we can order pre-fit match grade barrels for Savage, Remington, AI, Badger Ordinance and others, to be easily installed by the end user.
I'm not understanding why/how the SSG3K has the advantage in this regard....?
What he is reffering to , is the fact , you can buy spare barrels , bolts , triggers etc , and they all bolt on with only a allen key as a tool , the bolt locks into the barrel directly , the action is a non-stressed part , abit like a AR , except the barrel extension is not a seperate part .
To pull the barrel , just loosen 3 allen head bolts , and slip barrel out .
Later Chris
To pull the barrel , just loosen 3 allen head bolts , and slip barrel out .
Later Chris
Sounds like a DTA.
Nothing against the ssg3k, I just don't see that it's strangeness solves a problem other rifles have as was previously claimed.
I've had mine for a little while now. I don't mind the odd safety/bolt release thing because I rarely use the safety on the rifle - if I am not shooting then the bolt is open and there is no magazine in the rifle. If I am shooting the bolt is open unless I am about to fire. Having to move the cheekpiece to remove the bolt is not unique to the SSG 3000 - many stocks with adjustable cheekpieces require the same, although it is annoying. The stock flash hider doesn't do much, and it is a pain in the ass to remove. I replaced it with a TBAC brake for a 30BA and was surprised at how soft shooting it was afterwards. If I had to make a quick list of what I like and don't like:
Pro:
Accurate - this gun shoots!
60 degree bolt that locks up tight and runs smooth
Integral rail is one less thing to worry about. 0 moa is not ideal, but a mount can fix that
Easy swap barrels, user can do most of the work on the rifle
Trigger is pretty good out of the box
Cons:
The stock sucks. Shootable? Yes. But the cheekpiece doesn't hold up well, the LOP is stupid short, and the position of the cheekpiece combined with the LOP causes me to crunch my neck up even with the stock spacers in.
The stock flash hider sucks as well.
All in all, I do like this rifle. It has a lot of features that I wanted on a rifle that wasn't in the same price range as an AI. I was on the fence on whether or not to order the McMillan stock for this rifle, but after having an opportunity to get behind an A3 of another shooter I decided it was worth the money. I ordered a McMillan stock, so the money I "saved" by buying the SSG is false economy. With that said, with the McMillan stock installed (and the TBAC brake) every gripe I have with this rifle is pretty much taken care of. I sincerely hope that this action picks up in the US and we get a few gunsmiths willing to make barrels for it. The lack of aftermarket support here in the states is really my only last remaining concern with the rifle.
Pro:
Accurate - this gun shoots!
60 degree bolt that locks up tight and runs smooth
Integral rail is one less thing to worry about. 0 moa is not ideal, but a mount can fix that
Easy swap barrels, user can do most of the work on the rifle
Trigger is pretty good out of the box
Cons:
The stock sucks. Shootable? Yes. But the cheekpiece doesn't hold up well, the LOP is stupid short, and the position of the cheekpiece combined with the LOP causes me to crunch my neck up even with the stock spacers in.
The stock flash hider sucks as well.
All in all, I do like this rifle. It has a lot of features that I wanted on a rifle that wasn't in the same price range as an AI. I was on the fence on whether or not to order the McMillan stock for this rifle, but after having an opportunity to get behind an A3 of another shooter I decided it was worth the money. I ordered a McMillan stock, so the money I "saved" by buying the SSG is false economy. With that said, with the McMillan stock installed (and the TBAC brake) every gripe I have with this rifle is pretty much taken care of. I sincerely hope that this action picks up in the US and we get a few gunsmiths willing to make barrels for it. The lack of aftermarket support here in the states is really my only last remaining concern with the rifle.
I really appreciate the feedback. Would you recommend I keep my order for the gun or go with something else?
It is pretty easy to spend someone else's money, so I don't think its fair for me to say go ahead. I would ask yourself what you want from the rifle and if the ssg can provide it then keep the order. If there is something specific about the rifle you'd like to know I would be more than happy to try and help. I think most of the issues have been pretty well laid out here. If you were in the DC/NoVa area I would invite you to come shoot mine and see what you think - maybe there are some Hide members around your area that would letyou take it for a test drive? Or try and find a gun shop with one and get behind it first.
Firstly, thank you so much for the offer to shoot. Unfortunately, I'm in the SF Bay Area...wrong side of the country. The reason I've been drawn to the SSG is that it's not the Remington 700. Nothing against it. Just everyone has one. I'm looking for a unique experience. I'm a LE ofc and spend a lot of time shooting, but rarely go over distance of 100 yrd. I want to start shooting at long distances. What also has drawn me this rifle it has a lot of the features a super hi-end one has without breaking the bank. I just want to know it was a solid choice that you're happy with the rifle and it doesn't turn out to be a bad decision where it just sits in my safe.
I truly appreciate all the help and in put you've given.
I bought it for the same reasons you are looking at it. So far it meets my expectations for the rifle, and for the price I can't complain one bit about anything except the stock. I even think a lot of the stock problems could be solved with a little ingenuity. A block under the cheekpiece to hold it in place and an extended slip on buttpad for the LOP issues would be cheap and easy fixes to my issues. I called SIG and asked if I could install extra spacers to increase the LOP but they never got back to me - go figure.
Would I buy it again if I had a do-over? Probably. With the McMillan stock at $900 and the SSG3k at 1500 that brings the total price of the rifle to $2400, less if I can get some scratch back from selling the old stock (haha). For that price I am getting most of what I wanted in a rifle. When I compare that to the price of taking a Remington 700 ($400) and rebarelling/truing/threading ($800) and dropping it in a Manners stock with mini-chassis ($1000) with a Jewell ($200) it is the same price. When you compare these two rifles the SSG has the 3-lug 60 degree bolt with sako extractor, integral rail, large bolt knob, and totally modular design. The Remington gets a better trigger (the SSG is good, but it's not a Jewell) and AI mags.
If you can live with the stock, or make it work for you, then the SSG 3000 is a great rifle. If not, seriously consider your other options before buying.
Massoud - how does the SSG3000 / STR 200 action hold up in terms of the action being a good platform to work on? I read both of the write-ups on the KRG site about the Tikka T3 and Remington 700 actions and I am wondering - what your thoughts are about the action itself?
Would I buy it again if I had a do-over? Probably. With the McMillan stock at $900 and the SSG3k at 1500 that brings the total price of the rifle to $2400, less if I can get some scratch back from selling the old stock (haha). For that price I am getting most of what I wanted in a rifle. When I compare that to the price of taking a Remington 700 ($400) and rebarelling/truing/threading ($800) and dropping it in a Manners stock with mini-chassis ($1000) with a Jewell ($200) it is the same price. When you compare these two rifles the SSG has the 3-lug 60 degree bolt with sako extractor, integral rail, large bolt knob, and totally modular design. The Remington gets a better trigger (the SSG is good, but it's not a Jewell) and AI mags.
If you can live with the stock, or make it work for you, then the SSG 3000 is a great rifle. If not, seriously consider your other options before buying.
Massoud - how does the SSG3000 / STR 200 action hold up in terms of the action being a good platform to work on? I read both of the write-ups on the KRG site about the Tikka T3 and Remington 700 actions and I am wondering - what your thoughts are about the action itself?
We had planned on doing a serious review like the T3 and 700 but honestly there's not much to review. The action is basically a fixturing device to hold the various components, none of which have any aftermarket support so far here (apart from the Mcmillan stock which is ~$900 as mentioned). There's not a lot to comment on unfortunately as the action really is not useable as a basis for a custom build. Overseas apparently there is a lot of support with barrels, cheap mags, and different stock options. With the way it's designed (huge action, angled action screw, odd "recoil lug" setup), it would be a stretch to get it into a chassis (yes Sig did it at SHOT but they could have cut on the action or ?).
I view it as a standalone rifle for now, like if you bought a TRG or AE, except for lesser/lower end in some respects and in this case you might never get a barrel in another caliber without difficulty. It's not something that you modify (in the US). In that regard, it would be a hard decision to get it or the T3 Sporter (comparing within price point). I think in the end the T3 Sporter would win precisely because of its upgrade-ability. Those are just my opinions being critical. All told it's a nice rifle for the price point. It's 3 lug and mag fed, has a decent 2 stage trigger, and shoots pretty well.
Justin
I view it as a standalone rifle for now, like if you bought a TRG or AE, except for lesser/lower end in some respects and in this case you might never get a barrel in another caliber without difficulty. It's not something that you modify (in the US). In that regard, it would be a hard decision to get it or the T3 Sporter (comparing within price point). I think in the end the T3 Sporter would win precisely because of its upgrade-ability. Those are just my opinions being critical. All told it's a nice rifle for the price point. It's 3 lug and mag fed, has a decent 2 stage trigger, and shoots pretty well.
Justin
Thanks guys, tons of good information. For those of you have the SSG 3000, can you check what is the twist rate of the barrel?
Some sources say 1:12, others say 1:11, kind of confusing.
Some sources say 1:12, others say 1:11, kind of confusing.
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The original SSG 3000 is a 1-12, the new US version i don't know.
As far as modifying these rifles it's very easy in Europe.
Sauer has a very good aftermarket support for these weapons here.
Everything that fits the 200 STR fits the SSG. There is options for triggers too.
And well here it's quite a no brainer if you want a quality rifle that shoots good, as a 200 STR retails for less then a 700 P, while being fully modular so one can do all the work one self.
And certainly the accuracy is usually better, maybe i was lucky with mine, but printing 5 cm groups at 500 m, is better then i've ever seen from a stock 700 rifle.
And 1/4-1/2 moa groups at 100 is normal results with a decent shooter.
I've seen better results with better shooters in other rifles too. Never shot the US versions though.
Fitting it in a chassis is fully possible, and the SIG chassis from Shot was made for this rifle, so they did not cut into the action in any way.
But it certainly is not as easy to make it fit as a standard cylindrical action like the Rem 700.
For the US market Kelby does now Import GRS stocks that can be ordered with inlet for these rifles, as a option to McM.
The bedding method usually used to make these rifles shoot the best is a bit special though.
Border does make barrels for this action, and the barrel extension mentioned too.
Except from that i don't know much about aftermarket parts for these in the US as i don't live there.
Massoud is probably right in most aspects, and modifying it will be more difficult then with more standard rifles.
As far as modifying these rifles it's very easy in Europe.
Sauer has a very good aftermarket support for these weapons here.
Everything that fits the 200 STR fits the SSG. There is options for triggers too.
And well here it's quite a no brainer if you want a quality rifle that shoots good, as a 200 STR retails for less then a 700 P, while being fully modular so one can do all the work one self.
And certainly the accuracy is usually better, maybe i was lucky with mine, but printing 5 cm groups at 500 m, is better then i've ever seen from a stock 700 rifle.
And 1/4-1/2 moa groups at 100 is normal results with a decent shooter.
I've seen better results with better shooters in other rifles too. Never shot the US versions though.
Fitting it in a chassis is fully possible, and the SIG chassis from Shot was made for this rifle, so they did not cut into the action in any way.
But it certainly is not as easy to make it fit as a standard cylindrical action like the Rem 700.
For the US market Kelby does now Import GRS stocks that can be ordered with inlet for these rifles, as a option to McM.
The bedding method usually used to make these rifles shoot the best is a bit special though.
Border does make barrels for this action, and the barrel extension mentioned too.
Except from that i don't know much about aftermarket parts for these in the US as i don't live there.
Massoud is probably right in most aspects, and modifying it will be more difficult then with more standard rifles.
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A high quality rifle that you can do all the work yourself. It sounds like Sig could have a real winner if they supported this rifle like it is in Europe. Sig USA though seems like it's run by a room full of monkeys slinging scat at each other. Right now they 25 different models of the 226 listed on their site.
