Opened up my new "MADE IN USA" die set, tried one out, seemed way more difficult than any die I ever used, tried more cutting fluid, still hard. Took a closer look and well....it's going back. Below is a photo of a die I did not yet use.
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So much for made in USA quality...
- Thread starter KZP
- Start date
I have an old craftsman set that looks brand new I’ve never used but it’s the old USA made mid 60s early 70s(I think) grey box with red inserts hopefully they aren’t shit when I finally need to use one.
I have a ton of Hanson taps and dies, drill bits, etc, etc...
When I say a ton, I mean a metric shit ton, hundreds of taps and dies from maybe screw size 2 all the way up to 1 inch NPT in standard, metric, whitworth, NPT, and probably some stuff I don't even remember.
They are good to go and never had an issue.
Either that die was mis-packed (another brand), or it was a cull that somehow made it into packaging and got shipped out.
Hanson stuff does not look like that.
When I say a ton, I mean a metric shit ton, hundreds of taps and dies from maybe screw size 2 all the way up to 1 inch NPT in standard, metric, whitworth, NPT, and probably some stuff I don't even remember.
They are good to go and never had an issue.
Either that die was mis-packed (another brand), or it was a cull that somehow made it into packaging and got shipped out.
Hanson stuff does not look like that.
The entire set of dies between SAE and metric are mangled to some degree, about 24 dies. All the of them are laser engraved saying USA on them, so I don't think it's a mistaken die. Someone in QC took the day off during this run of dies.
That pretty much sums you up, doesn't it.
A guy posts photos of a Hanson die with poor QC, and you say Hanson stuff does not look like that.
Despite proof, your opinion trumps facts.
Going from memory here (I'd have to get it in-hand to verify) but I have a particular tap here (quality brand) that is physically a 3/8" UNF but is laser-marked 5/16" UNC.
Or something like that. Point being, I specifically hung on to it so that I can one-day have fun with an apprentice, or something along those lines.
But what you got there, OP, is a gong-show from the get-go.
Or something like that. Point being, I specifically hung on to it so that I can one-day have fun with an apprentice, or something along those lines.
But what you got there, OP, is a gong-show from the get-go.
When a hungry construction worker, on his lunch break, walks into a restaurant wanting a rib eye and all that is left is hamburger...... What does he do.?
I have commented many times here on lack of Quality, QC, craftsmanship.... One more hole in the lifeboat of America. To the young man, start collecting grand paw's old tools, scavenging estate sales and procuring anything tool related with Made in USA on it. A 50 year old tap or die with wear is better than a brand new tap or die..... Pick up broken drill bits and learn how to sharpen them... Priceless... My list is long.
It is not just tools.
www.foodbusinessnews.net
I have commented many times here on lack of Quality, QC, craftsmanship.... One more hole in the lifeboat of America. To the young man, start collecting grand paw's old tools, scavenging estate sales and procuring anything tool related with Made in USA on it. A 50 year old tap or die with wear is better than a brand new tap or die..... Pick up broken drill bits and learn how to sharpen them... Priceless... My list is long.
It is not just tools.
FTC and USDA aim to rein in false ‘Made in USA’ claims
The Federal Trade Commission has finalized a new rule that will crack down on marketers.
www.foodbusinessnews.net
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This shows some poor reviews... https://www.lowes.com/pd/IRWIN-12-Piece-Metric-Tap-and-Die-Set/5013305505
Also, Black and Decker bought Irwin tools in 2018 - Is this typical buy and bleed a name out with cheap product substitutes?
www2.canadianwoodworking.com
You can see "Black and Decker" responding to a couple of the poor reviews on lowes site.
Also, Black and Decker bought Irwin tools in 2018 - Is this typical buy and bleed a name out with cheap product substitutes?
Stanley Black & Decker Acquires IRWIN and LENOX Brands
Canadian Woodworking News
You can see "Black and Decker" responding to a couple of the poor reviews on lowes site.
Check out this Amazon review of IRWIN Tap And Die Set, Metric, 41-Piece (26317)
Chinese quality for a USA price
www.amazon.com
This shows some poor reviews... https://www.lowes.com/pd/IRWIN-12-Piece-Metric-Tap-and-Die-Set/5013305505
Also, Black and Decker bought Irwin tools in 2018 - Is this typical buy and bleed a name out with cheap product substitutes?
Stanley Black & Decker Acquires IRWIN and LENOX Brands
Canadian Woodworking News
You can see "Black and Decker" responding to a couple of the poor reviews on lowes site.
This is one of the problems I have with McMaster, you don't know the brand until it arrives. Normally I've gotten good stuff. This is all the listing shows.
EDIT: I do remember the box saying 2018, so that explains the QC.
McMaster-Carr
McMaster-Carr is the complete source for your plant with over 595,000 products. 98% of products ordered ship from stock and deliver same or next day.
Already taped up the box for UPS pickup. I'd be surprised if McMaster is drop shipping counterfeits. I assumed they inventory their own store front.
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Well, once upon a time...
On Friday, my Dispose-all went tits-up. Jammed solid. I figured I had jammed a bone or something.
Looked online and a similar unit was $300. Plus lead time. Plus it looked like it was made of plastic by people who use their feet as a fixturing tool. I figured it would last about a year. Same brand, too.
So all.... damned... day... on Sunday, I dismounted my old one, stripped it down. (I figured... 30 minute job... 5 hours later... ) But it's a InSinkErAtor from the late 1970's. And I have to say that after I stripped it and found a (decade-old) knife tip in it -- broken off no doubt by someone trying to unjam it or get something out, I was able to put it back together. Throw some lube in the bearings... it ran like a top. Better than in a decade, in fact. Apparently removing a rusty broken knife tip helps.
Anyway, I think I could take a Ford Pinto and put it down that sink and it would just grind it up. So once upon a time, we had The Right Stuff to make things that lasted. After the rebuild I am confident that unit will out live me. 45 years old... and better than anything out there today.
Sort of like those 1970's refrigerators that will never, ever quit. Or stoves.
Moden shit is built to a price to sell on Amazon or at big box ripoff stores. In China or Mexico or Leshotho... Fuck all them. Let's get America making things right again.
Cheers,
Sirhr.
PS. I will say that though I am pleased with the outcome. Some of the language I uttered on Sunday while holding tools covered in ancient bacon grease and nasty veggie paste probably left the cats scarred for life. Fuck me what a nasty job. But do it right once and then wait another 45 years. Or buy a POS from Home Best Mart and it will fail in 3 years and you'll be spending another %$#@ing Sunday up to your arms in grease and detritus. In retrospect... Happy. At the time.... fucking swearing up a storm! Esp. when I found the broken knife tip. %$#@ing %%$#iddy %$@#!!!!
On Friday, my Dispose-all went tits-up. Jammed solid. I figured I had jammed a bone or something.
Looked online and a similar unit was $300. Plus lead time. Plus it looked like it was made of plastic by people who use their feet as a fixturing tool. I figured it would last about a year. Same brand, too.
So all.... damned... day... on Sunday, I dismounted my old one, stripped it down. (I figured... 30 minute job... 5 hours later... ) But it's a InSinkErAtor from the late 1970's. And I have to say that after I stripped it and found a (decade-old) knife tip in it -- broken off no doubt by someone trying to unjam it or get something out, I was able to put it back together. Throw some lube in the bearings... it ran like a top. Better than in a decade, in fact. Apparently removing a rusty broken knife tip helps.
Anyway, I think I could take a Ford Pinto and put it down that sink and it would just grind it up. So once upon a time, we had The Right Stuff to make things that lasted. After the rebuild I am confident that unit will out live me. 45 years old... and better than anything out there today.
Sort of like those 1970's refrigerators that will never, ever quit. Or stoves.
Moden shit is built to a price to sell on Amazon or at big box ripoff stores. In China or Mexico or Leshotho... Fuck all them. Let's get America making things right again.
Cheers,
Sirhr.
PS. I will say that though I am pleased with the outcome. Some of the language I uttered on Sunday while holding tools covered in ancient bacon grease and nasty veggie paste probably left the cats scarred for life. Fuck me what a nasty job. But do it right once and then wait another 45 years. Or buy a POS from Home Best Mart and it will fail in 3 years and you'll be spending another %$#@ing Sunday up to your arms in grease and detritus. In retrospect... Happy. At the time.... fucking swearing up a storm! Esp. when I found the broken knife tip. %$#@ing %%$#iddy %$@#!!!!
Looks identical set here..
Amazon product ASIN B0000DD4KW
exact same issue here...
Amazon product ASIN B0000DD4KW
exact same issue here...
Amazon.com
www.amazon.com
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This all started because I wanted to do something similar. I have an old Sears table saw with a bunch of proprietary parts. Not perfect but gets the job done. The fence tension adjuster is a custom bent 5/16 steel rod with one end threaded. After decades of use the threads stripped. I've been needing a nice full thread / tap set as I sold my old harbor freight one years back.
Anyway I brazed some bronze onto the threads so I could restore the tension rod only to end up with junk dies when trying to re-thread. Turns out I should have gone on ebay and bought old dies and taps. Guessing the replacement set is going to be mangled based finding out it's post 2018 Irwin Hanson as @NoDopes noted has been poorly reviewed.
Most stuff now is built to last as long as the warranty period plus 2 days. LOL
Hard to find good tools today and most if not all of the stuff coming out of China is of poor quality although there are rare exceptions. Speaking of the old Craftsman tap & die sets, I bought a both the SAE and Metric set many years ago. Have used the heck out of them and still work as if they were new.
Not sure what you where working on.
I have an older set of Irwin Hanson tap and dies and we have several sets where I teach. I put them clearly in the only use to repair threads and defiantly not to be used to cut new threads group. Even when they look good the taps are brittle and break easy.
I have an older set of Irwin Hanson tap and dies and we have several sets where I teach. I put them clearly in the only use to repair threads and defiantly not to be used to cut new threads group. Even when they look good the taps are brittle and break easy.
Anyone remember that ad for the stupid "Smart Faucet" that you could voice command or send a text to so it filled your stupid dog bowl... like you were there to put the bowl under the faucet?
THAT is what sells today.
The POS replacement dispose-all that I looked at online has an "Air switch." Instead of activating when you put in the t-handle stopper and activator... it runs off a bluetooth button you stick on the edge of the sink. Does anyone really think that is going to last more than a couple of years? A %$#&ing AIR Switch?
Yes you suburban twat-waffles, this is what you crave. And what is being jammed down your throat. Garbage from China that won't last more than a few months.
Fuck them all. FUCK THEM ALL.
I will continue to search out and restore and employ old American goods... because if you can fix it to like new (and from the '50's to '80's you could). After that, Clinton gave away America to China and the Big Box revolution fucked the American Consumer... who gladly bent over to take it in the ass for "more cheap stuff" instead of 'some quality stuff.'
Fuck China and all those who gave our manufacturing capacity to those commies.
Sirhr
THAT is what sells today.
The POS replacement dispose-all that I looked at online has an "Air switch." Instead of activating when you put in the t-handle stopper and activator... it runs off a bluetooth button you stick on the edge of the sink. Does anyone really think that is going to last more than a couple of years? A %$#&ing AIR Switch?
Yes you suburban twat-waffles, this is what you crave. And what is being jammed down your throat. Garbage from China that won't last more than a few months.
Fuck them all. FUCK THEM ALL.
I will continue to search out and restore and employ old American goods... because if you can fix it to like new (and from the '50's to '80's you could). After that, Clinton gave away America to China and the Big Box revolution fucked the American Consumer... who gladly bent over to take it in the ass for "more cheap stuff" instead of 'some quality stuff.'
Fuck China and all those who gave our manufacturing capacity to those commies.
Sirhr
Fuck you are a clown. Where my comment came from is your posting history - you are all over the place like a mad woman's shit.
I'll tell you what doesn't come from New Zealand - whiny cunts like you.
Eta. I own a engineering firm, and we have a huge problem with rubbish tooling. The rule for us is nothing mmade in China - and it is hard to maintain. Cutting tools are mostly Swedish or Korean, and you still have to check where the stuff comes from irrespective of the company name - the Germans are the worst for this.
Stainless steel is getting more difficult, and with Taiwan in jeopardy it could get a lot harder.
Moving manufacturing to China was one of the stupidest moves in the last 100 years or so.
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Irwin quality has went straight into the shitter. Happened right after they bought out Vise Grip.
I don’t care if their shit is American made, I’m not touching it with a ten foot pole.
I agree with the issue. They need to post the brand and where it’s made right on their website.This is one of the problems I have with McMaster, you don't know the brand until it arrives. Normally I've gotten good stuff. This is all the listing shows.
EDIT: I do remember the box saying 2018, so that explains the QC.
McMaster-Carr
McMaster-Carr is the complete source for your plant with over 595,000 products. 98% of products ordered ship from stock and deliver same or next day.www.mcmaster.com
Already taped up the box for UPS pickup. I'd be surprised if McMaster is drop shipping counterfeits. I assumed they inventory their own store front.
I’ve had luck calling them to determine a brand and country of origin.
Not exactly efficient, but it got results.
You're from New Zealand, your opinion doesn't mean a whole lot in a thread about made in the US stuff.
You don't see me posting about made in NZ things, do you ?
Oh wait, the only thing that comes from NZ is wool and other sheep related products.
So how's your girl doing anyway, since we are on that subject ?
What was her name....Nanny or something like that ?
BTW, who the fuck cares about stainless ?
Taps and dies *should* be made from M2 tool steel with some older ones being made from O1 and possibly 1095.
Other than a pocket knife, I've never seen a real cutting tool made from stainless.
I was wrong about being purchased by Irwin. Irwin is a brand held by Peterson, who invented Vise Grip.
VISE GRIP Locking Pliers - History of VISE GRIP Locking Pliers American Tool Companies - IRWIN Industrial Tool Company - asktooltalk.com
VISE GRIP locking pliers were invented by a blacksmith and patented in 1924. Originally manufactured by Peterson Manufacturing Company, VISE GRIP pliers are now an essential tool in construction and maintenance.
www.asktooltalk.com
I probably shouldn't, but what the hell.
American made tools and engineered products used to be a good export industry for the US - and I'm still buying rolled acme bar stock and some extrusions from the States, so I guess there are still some companies who have a different view to yours.
I'm not a fan of the current NZ Govt, but that is as good a simile as suggesting you are to be judged on yours - seems fair, no? The rest of your first paragraph bears out my first comment in the previous post. Keep it up sport, you are doing great.
Who cares about stainless - seriously? On a gun forum? Try holding more than one thought in your head at once. My stainless steel example followed on from comments about difficulties sourcing non China made products. There are a bunch of industries learning what I saw in the late 70's living in Singapore - the Chinese regard business as a situation where trust is non-existent, and everyone is trying to rip you off. As long as everyone plays by those rules, then OK. When people deal with them expecting the moral code the West used to have, then shit like the die set that started this post is going to happen.
The world is full of stainless tool steels, but I'll refer you to the Uddeholm catalogue as an example and leave it at that. There is some awesome stuff in there.
Finally, sorry to the OP for the deviation.
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No doubt about that, but I think he is special among cunts.
Better quality dies are adjustable.
USA vise grip pliers are available from https://www.eaglegripusa.com/
or rebadged on the snap-on truck
Go cut your throat with this
USA vise grip pliers are available from https://www.eaglegripusa.com/
or rebadged on the snap-on truck
Go cut your throat with this
Irwin taps get dull faster than any other I've tried, and if they manage to hold an edge they break off.
To be fair Snap On taps and dies aren't much better, but they are also outsourced. Rumor has it Snap On is building their own manufacturing plant to make their own drills, taps, and dies here in the USA.
To be fair Snap On taps and dies aren't much better, but they are also outsourced. Rumor has it Snap On is building their own manufacturing plant to make their own drills, taps, and dies here in the USA.
All standard sizes? That is one of the issues with older sets, hard to use on modern stuff which is mostly metric.
Pretty sure but I’d have to double check. It was $3.00 so knowing it was the old quality craftsman stuff I snagged it and put it on a shelf in the garage for whenever I may need it.
Got a riv-nut set like that too($8.00), it’s came in handy a few time and was only missing 4 riv-nuts.
2017, And yes it seems to be inline with the general Stanley Black & Decker philosophy. The issue people face with hand tools is there are big companies like Stanley B&D and Apex tool group that buy smaller quality companies and turn their products to shit, banking on the old name to sell shit or at the very least removing competition.
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