Rifle Scopes Stepping up to a higher level in scope

[SmartDonkey]

I am looking to get a little nicer scope and would like some advice. Most of my scopes are in what I would consider the mid range (Vortex Viper HSLR, Sig Tango 4, Leupold VX-3i and VX-5). I would like to get something the next level up from these- in MOA and ffp. Lower Power needs to be in the 3 to 4 range and around 20 on the high end.

Something with good glass, zero stop, and can handle quite a bit of dialing. It will mostly be for target practice and fun to 1400 yards- but could possibly end up on a hunting rifle. Some of the Bushnell high end scopes look good but I've only found them in mils, and I almost had a Tango 6 but the guy decided to keep it. What else should I be looking at? I'd like to keep the budget under $1500.

*Burris is a no go- didn't enjoy my experience with them.

 

[JC0352]

How long ago was your Burris experience? Companies can change and if it was a cheap scope to start with, then what can you expect?

I was going to say look at the Razor Gen 2 or XTR III.

 

[wade2big]

Pick up a Bushnell LRTSI 4.5-18x44 second hand here in the exchange. It is probably the best crossover hunting/target scope available today. If it will possibly end up on a hunting rifle like you stated, make sure what you get is illuminated and don’t pick a FFP scope with a super thin reticle.

Vortex Viper PST gen ii 3-15 is a good scope as well and costs a little less. The max mag comes up a little short though.

Edit: The Bushnell scope are mil only as they should be. I looked right past your moa requirement.

 

[stello1001]

The Tango 6 second gen scopes are actually really good and feature rich for their price point. I've seen a few reviews from people who have had that and a gen 2 razor but slightly favor the Sig. Whether it is actually better for one person or not, it is still up there in the gen 2 razor class.

A mark5 can also be had close to that in the PX if you shop around.

Athlon Cronus BTR is another that comes to mind but the low power is 4.5.

Good luck!!!

edit to add:

Bushnell XRS II
or
Bushnell DMR II Pro

 

[M8541Reaper]

Hit the PX and get the most out of your budget man. Making yourself out at the top of your $1500 will get you something better than you can get new at retail.

If you’re Mil/LE, hit up companies you’re interested in and see what their discount program looks like.

 

[SmartDonkey]

The problem I had with Burris was on a 3-15 XTRii. I'm sure they make some good scopes- but mine wasn't one of them and the customer rep I got was so smug.

I know I should make the step to mils, and it wouldn't be hard. But it would just be another step for me, I think in MOA as I shoot. I have seen some good deals in the PX but mostly mil.

 

[Steel head]

When I went from my vortex HS-T to my Cronus it was a nice step up.
A used Cronus or razor G2 is at 1500$ or under

 

[JC0352]

I see a lot of moa scopes for sale in that optics talk trade FB group. I see a lot of the scopes here in the px also listed there. That being said, I’m less nervous about getting scammed here.

 

[Steel head]

I see a lot of moa scopes for sale in that optics talk trade FB group. I see a lot of the scopes here in the px also listed there. That being said, I’m less nervous about getting scammed here.

Scammers here get outed quick.
big item sellers cane be checked on the good sellers thread.

 

[M8541Reaper]

I know I should make the step to mils, and it wouldn't be hard. But it would just be another step for me, I think in MOA as I shoot. I have seen some good deals in the PX but mostly mil.

Honestly it doesn’t matter if you think in stones, unicorns, or Weather’s Originals man, using an optic calibrated in Mils isn’t complex. Go check out the article on Mils vs MOA on the landing page and you’ll see why.

There are/were quite a few MOA optics for sale, just use the search feature to gather the ones that are MOA. Honestly though, you’ll find a better selection of quality optics in the PX for $1500 if you go Mil.

Don’t limit yourself because you don’t want to take all of three minutes to comprehend Mils. Worst case, give the articles/threads on Mils a quick read through and then see if it clicks to you.

Just my opinion but it’s your money and gear at the end of the day. You can definitely find what you’re looking for in the PX. Best of luck! ?

 

[wade2big]

Scammers here get outed quick.
big item sellers cane be checked on the good sellers thread.

The new feedback system has been running for several months az well. I don’t even bother with the old seller thread.

@SmartDonkey, click on a members name in their profile. Click on feedback stats and see their recent feedback if someone bothered to leave any. Search the seller thread in the exchange as well like @Steel head said too.

 

[wade2big]

The problem I had with Burris was on a 3-15 XTRii. I'm sure they make some good scopes- but mine wasn't one of them and the customer rep I got was so smug.

I know I should make the step to mils, and it wouldn't be hard. But it would just be another step for me, I think in MOA as I shoot. I have seen some good deals in the PX but mostly mil.

You shoot the numbers my friend. There is no thinking in mils or moa required. Dial or hold the correct number and shoot.

 

[JC0352]

You don’t really have to “think” in anything... You’ve got your ruler built into your reticle that you can use to adjust. Dope your gun out and you’re set. That’s simplifying things but that’s the basic idea.
Frank has a good rant about this in the latest podcast and Phil and Caylen have a good discussion about it in Modern Day Sniper podcast episode 5


The Everyday Sniper Episode 235 Match Tips, FB Rants, War Machine Leather
https://www.podbean.com/ei/pb-eneuq-d4e10d


Modern Day Sniper Podcast | The New Mk 13 Mod 7, Wind Constants and the T3 Reticle
https://www.podbean.com/ei/pb-jp46d-d42b48

 

[Steel head]

Mils are nice.
I’m happy I made the switch.

 

[SmartDonkey]

Thanks for the advice... and I do understand that mils and MOA work the same way, an angular measurement. I use the reticle for corrections all the time. If I was just starting shooting I would go with mils, but I have enough scopes in MOA that I'd take a beating trading them all out- And I'd like them to all use the same format.

Also- I have scopes on hunting rifles that just have a duplex or a wind-plex. No ruler to make my corrections. That was my first experience with a mil scope- a Leupold Mark AR with duplex. It messed me up a few times so I traded it out. I know that's not really a fair argument because whatever I got would have a sub-tension reticle.

Thanks for the recommendations... I have been a little nervous about buying a scope in the PX from some guy half way across the country that I've never met.

 

[EnXCess]

For $1,500 it is pretty easy to find a used NF NXS 5.5-22x50. They made several MOA reticles for them, and you would probably love any of them. If you buy from people who have been on a forum for years you will probably be okay. A lot of guys are moving to FFP and/or mils and selling their old NXS's. I have picked up several of them. Even when I buy an ATACR I still get MOA and SFP. It is just what I prefer.

 

[bfm1851]

Look into Athlon scopes. They have several that would fit your requirements. At your price point you should be able to fine what you want new, or save a few dollars for ammo and buy one used. They have a no question warranty but I have no personnel experience with it.

 

[phantomskittles]

I would not be afraid to check the PX. I have bought my last 3 scopes from there and had great experiences. You could probably find a Gen2 Razor in your price range. If you want a new scope, aren't married to MOA, and don't already have a wind meter I think you can still get that deal on a 3-21x50 DMRII with a Kestrel for $1050 which seems a great deal for a midrange scope. I just checked cameralandny and it looked like they had them in stock.

 

[SmartDonkey]

That does seem like a good bundle from cameraland. Anyone have any oppinions on the Kestrel CONX? I kind of threw my other parameters out and am thinking about a Leupold Mark 5 5-25. They are $2000 to $2200 depending on reticle and come with a Kestrel 5700 with Hornady 4DOF. (non- illuminated.... man- Leupold charges for their illumination)

That way I could get MOA and a higher level Kestrel..... but that's a big price difference. Is the Leupold package worth the additional cost or is the CONX everything you would need?

 

[chickon1]

Athlon Ares or a Tract. Probably best 2 scopes under 2k for tracking and glass quality. Tract is better imo but is currently only 4-20. May be challenging @1400 depending on the size of the target.

Both are in the $1200 range.

 

[patriot07]

PX is your best bet. Use paypal (not friends & family). Wanting MOA, you can get a great deal because it's in lower demand than mils. With paypal, you have buyer protection. It'll cost you or the seller an extra 3%, but well worth it if you're concerned.

I would like to write a paragraph or two about mils. It's just better. If you want to simplify wind calls, you're better off with mils. But if you don't want to consider that, I'd grab a Razor Gen 2 in mils if you don't care about weight (certainly less than $1500) or an old NF or one of the mid/upper end bushnell scopes. All would be good upgrades over your current setups.

 

[chickon1]

PX is your best bet. Use paypal (not friends & family). Wanting MOA, you can get a great deal because it's in lower demand than mils. With paypal, you have buyer protection. It'll cost you or the seller an extra 3%, but well worth it if you're concerned.

I would like to write a paragraph or two about mils. It's just better. If you want to simplify wind calls, you're better off with mils. But if you don't want to consider that, I'd grab a Razor Gen 2 in mils if you don't care about weight (certainly less than $1500) or an old NF or one of the mid/upper end bushnell scopes. All would be good upgrades over your current setups.

I totally disagree that Mils is better in general.

Plus side of MOA:
-Math is very easy, I can do it in my head all day.
-Direct relationship with inches and yards.
-1/4 MOA is a finer adjustment than .1mil.. not much but it is.

Benefits mil:
-It's easier from some people to say wind call of .1 mils vs 3/4 moa or up .5 mil vs 1/2 moa.
-I switched to mil because everyone around me is using it and I can dial 7.2 mils faster than 24 1/4 MOA, 72 clicks vs 96 clicks

For Hunting:
MOA all day.