Stoners in Viet Nam and today

Maggot

"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood"
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  • Jul 27, 2007
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    [IMG2=JSON]{"data-align":"none","data-size":"full","height":"249","width":"476","src":"https:\/\/external.fric1-2.fna.fbcdn.net\/safe_image.php?d=AQBJ0fuPcn15O5YL&w=476&h=249&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wearethemighty.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2017%2F08%2FWIKI_seal-in-vietnam-with-stoner_cal0817.jpg&cfs=1&upscale=1&fallback=news_d_placeholder_publisher&_nc_hash=AQDQzxMqE2KLqpxS"}[/IMG2]
    This company is bringing back a weapon long favored by Navy SEALs
    An updated version of the iconic Stoner 63 beloved by Vietnam-era SEALs is making a comeback.
    WEARETHEMIGHTY.COM
     
    My local Honey Hole had an AR180 about a year ago.

    If I recall right the owner said something about being made in Ireland, does that sound right?
     
    ^^^ Yup, a lot of them were made by Sterling but I think in UK and not in Ireland. Others were made by, I think, Howa or Miroku in Japan.

    Mine is made by Sterling. They are supposed to be more desirable, but the Japanese ones I've handled have better fit and finish. Go figger!

    They are nice rifles! In a lot of ways superior to the AR platform, but tougher to produce.

    Cheers,

    Sirhr
     
    ^^^ Yup, a lot of them were made by Sterling but I think in UK and not in Ireland. Others were made by, I think, Howa or Miroku in Japan.

    Mine is made by Sterling. They are supposed to be more desirable, but the Japanese ones I've handled have better fit and finish. Go figger!

    They are nice rifles! In a lot of ways superior to the AR platform, but tougher to produce.

    Cheers,

    Sirhr

    Yes it was a Sterling. I knew it had something to do with "over there".

    Seemed like a "bony" rifle. Real "thin". Light with its stamped sheet metal build.

    How are they for accuracy?

    Id be thinking FN/FAL accuracy.
     
    Hell of a weapon right there....

    Another un-appreciated weapon was the AR180.....

    Eugene Stoner and Mikhail Kalashnikov were a couple of smart cookies...

    Thanks for posting... guess I need one of those, too!

    Cheers,

    Sirhr

    Xmas is right around the corner. Treat yourself.
     
    KAC still makes the Stoner LMG A1 --I think it's an improved version but thanks to fucking Reagan, they won't be for sale to everyone.

    Robinson Armament WAS making a Stoner rifle, but instead make some monstrosity that is reminiscent of one but not exactly one. Won't use hardly any of the Stoner parts. They never came out with all the shit they said would either, what a scam.

    Also, I've heard from people that used it that the Stoner LMG wasn't that great of a weapon, it was just what was available and it was quite modular for back then, even being able to flip the upper so it mag fed from the top like a Bren. Or use belts. Or mags. Long or short barrels. It had it's uses, but there's a reason it no longer is in the arsenal.

    FN sells a semi only SAW. Having been a SAW gunner, I see no use in it.

    I turned down countless AR180's, I wouldn't own one. It's a cheap and obsolete rifle. I saw a .45ACP SBR upper for one once, it was pretty cheap too.

    FAL's were made by so many nations for so long it's hard to compare them... A Steyr barreled STG58 can shoot 2MOA and is reliable as they get, not bad at all for a combat rifle never intended to be a precision rifle. It is prone to fliers if the handguard isn't tight and on just right though. The money necessary to convert an FAL into a bad motherfucker just isn't worth it though, trust me.
     
    FAL's were made by so many nations for so long it's hard to compare them... A Steyr barreled STG58 can shoot 2MOA and is reliable as they get, not bad at all for a combat rifle never intended to be a precision rifle. It is prone to fliers if the handguard isn't tight and on just right though. The money necessary to convert an FAL into a bad motherfucker just isn't worth it though, trust me.

    Any idea what flavor this dude is packing. He was making custom slings before it was trendy to do them in paracord.....

    image_78524.jpg



     
    I might guess an Israeli FN-FAL, with the short wooden hand guard and ventilated forend. Just a guess.
     

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    That definitely aint no G3!!!! Not even close.. Its some version of the FAL for sure and Im thinking Downtown is spot on IMO.

    Say Strykervet - overall, all things considered... which rifle would you personally choose between a high quality G3/HK91 vs equally high quality FAL? Are the DSA's any good?
     
    I might guess an Israeli FN-FAL, with the short wooden hand guard and ventilated forend. Just a guess.

    That would have been my next choice... And I almost posted that. But did not see a carry handle and the front guard looked off. But could easily be an inch pattern... or is it metric pattern FAL? I can never keep them straight.

    But that picture Downtown you posted is right on...

    Cheers,

    Sirhr
     
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    That definitely aint no G3!!!! Not even close.. Its some version of the FAL for sure and Im thinking Downtown is spot on IMO.

    Say Strykervet - overall, all things considered... which rifle would you personally choose between a high quality G3/HK91 vs equally high quality FAL? Are the DSA's any good?

    No, not a G3. Was this picture from Rhodesia?

    FAL's in Africa came from all over. Lots were mashups. When Rhodesian surplus was available, you never knew what you were gonna get but you knew it was gonna be abused. But yeah, it does look like a lot like the Israeli style handguard, and later the 5.56 versions looked just like that too but the big ass mag says it's not a CAL. What makes ID'ing FAL's hard is that they were licensed by any NATO nation after WW2 and then to basically any nation that was cool with NATO. Each nation had their own version more or less cosmetically, but that was liquid too, especially regarding surplus and overseas sales. The most valuable ones IIRC are the Dutch ones and the original 1st model Belgian rifles. If you see one, it'll be nice and blued with nice wood. The (T48?) if you can find a REAL one is probably worth it's weight in gold. It was SUPPOSED to be the rifle we adopted vs. the M14.

    High quality HK's... They make those? Seriously, the best ones are REAL HK's, any of the knockoffs tend to be junk. ESPECIALLY the POS ones with aluminum receivers! IF I were to buy one, it'd be a PTR --I think they bought out the HK tooling and so those should be higher quality if I'm right. The FAL is almost exclusively a DSA offering now that the weapon is considered obsolete. It's obsolete in that it's not as accurate and it's heavier than modern rifles, but it's pretty damn reliable and tough. DSA makes some nice stuff, if you want a good receiver it'll have to be one of theirs. And then they make most of the parts.

    As for barrels, unless you get one cut, I understand the Steyr barrel was the BEST ever produced, better than the new DSA barrels. But if you got X barrel maker to cut one, well, I suppose that'd be better. But then you have the action to contend with, and without going into detail, the action and design itself doesn't lend well to an accurate platform.

    Triggers on FALs are notoriously shit. Jard made the only 2 stage, they used to suck but sent one I have back and they sent me a new one --they obviously have new processes because the new trigger is just like a Geissele 3 gun. In a fucking FAL.

    G3's are light, FAL's are heavy, neither is all that accurate and both tend to have punishing recoil. I wouldn't buy either, but I got my Steyr cheap; should have left it be instead of trying to make it better. If you really want an FAL, look for an older DSA STG58, then look at the barrel for the markings. Those are the best shooters around. For HK, I'd want a real HK but I'd settle for a PTR if I really, really wanted one. IMO, saving for a KAC SR25 or OBR or whatever is money much better spent.

     
    That would have been my next choice... And I almost posted that. But did not see a carry handle and the front guard looked off. But could easily be an inch pattern... or is it metric pattern FAL? I can never keep them straight.

    But that picture Downtown you posted is right on...

    Cheers,

    Sirhr

    Mashups. Some have carry handles, some don't, but no, don't think it's inch. There are less inch patterns, far more metrics and that one screams metric. Carry handles? It was the first thing I took off mine.
     
    No, not a G3. Was this picture from Rhodesia?

    Liberia 1990.

    He was a Doe regime soldier.

    The govt Doe soldiers were armed with FAL variants, M16s, lots of Garands, M1 carbines, Uzi.

    The rebels were armed with what the govt soldiers dropped when running and whatever Taylor bought from whatever shit stirrer decided to sell him. The were PPsh 41 and MP40 sighted in the hands of the malarial insane.

    I dont recall seeing any bolt guns save the M40A1s packed by US Marines.
     
    Liberia 1990.

    He was a Doe regime soldier.

    The govt Doe soldiers were armed with FAL variants, M16s, lots of Garands, M1 carbines, Uzi.

    The rebels were armed with what the govt soldiers dropped when running and whatever Taylor bought from whatever shit stirrer decided to sell him. The were PPsh 41 and MP40 sighted in the hands of the malarial insane.

    I dont recall seeing any bolt guns save the M40A1s packed by US Marines.

    That's a crying shame those WW2 SMG's didn't make it to the US market. The 7.62 Tok round could make for a great PCC cartridge to this day with a modern load IMO..
     
    That's a crying shame those WW2 SMG's didn't make it to the US market. The 7.62 Tok round could make for a great PCC cartridge to this day with a modern load IMO..

    One Garand was repatriated by a DAO Chief Petty Officer.

    He also bought a shovel head police patrol FLH cheap. One of the nice ones with a pogo seat frame, not transitional Evolution rubber mount.

    The Liberians had a bunch of them that were "broke down".

    He took the one he bought back to the Embassy compound, performed a little maintenance and in short order was rumbling around the Embassy compound.

    Like all my gear that bike was probably boxed up by TMO, loaded on a CH53 and transported to Sierra Leone for return to the US.

    PB077712.JPG
     
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