Suppressors SUPPRESSOR ALIGNMENT CHECK RODS - Overview & Tutorial

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

Hey everyone, we have a new product... kind of a no-brainer being as no other silencer manufacturer offers a tool like this (with the exception of one who is co-branding one of the only other products like this out there). Anyways, here it goes!

With the appropriate Griffin Armament Suppressor Alignment Check Rod, an end-user or gunsmith can verify alignment of the chosen suppressor and mount with the desired host. Installation and use of this tool is simple and should prevent baffle strikes or any unexpected issues once you get to the range.

Griffin Armament has gone to great lengths to accommodate a wide variety of thread pitch and caliber options across our silencer mount and adapter products. This gives practically every end-user who wishes to suppress their host the opportunity to do so! With this wide range of compatibility comes its own set of issues, the main one being silencer and mount alignment to the host firearm's bore.

Suppressor Alignment Check Rods are available in .22 Cal, 6.5mm, 6.8mm, .30 Cal, .338 Cal, 9mm, & .45 Cal

For pricing and availability, please visit our website linked here: CLICK THIS

 

[Lunchbox27]

These will sell, fo sho! I was looking for one not too long ago for my 9mm. Found a guy online that let me borrow his, but I would have paid for one, even for a 1 time use.

Smart move on your part! Also, good to see you actually showed a demonstration on the page of "Aligned and not aligned"

 

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

These will sell, fo sho! I was looking for one not too long ago for my 9mm. Found a guy online that let me borrow his, but I would have paid for one, even for a 1 time use.

Smart move on your part! Also, good to see you actually showed a demonstration on the page of "Aligned and not aligned"

Thanks @Lunchbox27!!

 

[Supersubes]

What’s the nominal size for each of your rods? Is there a straightness tolerance you’re sticking to?

I have some rods sold by another company and they’re far too undersized for my liking, and the finish isn’t very good.

 

[Huskydriver]

What’s the nominal size for each of your rods? Is there a straightness tolerance you’re sticking to?

I have some rods sold by another company and they’re far too undersized for my liking, and the finish isn’t very good.

Have you tried mcMaster Carr?

 

[Supersubes]

Have you tried mcMaster Carr?

I have but haven’t found what I’m looking for.

 

[Flying Dutchman]

"Have you tried mcMaster Carr?"

Received a rod from them for a .22LR a week or so ago, and it was all out of whack.

I've seen reports of this on Arfcom as well.

 

[Supersubes]

Surprised Griffin hasn’t been back to this thread.

McMaster has limited sizes, and the tighter tolerance rods are 4”. Maybe someone can link some better rods, but i’m pretty sure I’ll have to have mine made at a local grinding shop.

"Have you tried mcMaster Carr?"

Received a rod from them for a .22LR a week or so ago, and it was all out of whack.

I've seen reports of this on Arfcom as well.

 

[Flying Dutchman]

I've been trying to find one for .22lr as my 5.56 rods are too fat. No luck anywhere.
A web search turned up an old thread on another site regarding this - wish I could find the link.

A guy in the thread said he uses injector pins. This is what he uses for his .22lr.

Ordered one last night. For $4 I figured what the heck.

 

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

Received a rod from them for a .22LR a week or so ago, and it was all out of whack.

I've seen reports of this on Arfcom as well.

If you picked up one of the rods and it wasn't to your liking or there is an issue with it, please reach out to our Customer service Department for troubleshooting assistance and resolution. They're availble via phone Mon-Fri 9-5 Central and any time via email (slower responses outside business hours)

(262)200-0003 opt 1
[email protected]

 

[Flying Dutchman]

If you picked up one of the rods and it wasn't to your liking or there is an issue with it, please reach out to our Customer service Department for troubleshooting assistance and resolution. They're availble via phone Mon-Fri 9-5 Central and any time via email (slower responses outside business hours)

(262)200-0003 opt 1
[email protected]

Oh no...it wasn't one of yours. It was a rod from McMaster.

Sorry I wasn't more clear.

 

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

Oh no...it wasn't one of yours. It was a rod from McMaster.

Sorry I wasn't more clear.

Right on, its all good! I just want to make sure folks are taken care of.

 

[_Windrider_]

Can we call these Sac (as in sack) rods?
I actually like this but curious about overall length? Especially for the 338 rod. Those big cans can get pretty long and girthy and you’ll need a big sac rod to make it work.
??. I’m having some fun here but it’s a real question. Quarantine is getting to me.

 

[chrome]

@GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT

Curious how this will work with running a larger can (.308 can on a 6.5cm), will the rod stay still enough to see the symmetry/alignment?

Just watched the video on the website, answers my question.

 

[HenryTheAce]

@Supersubes

Every rod I have gotten from McMaster Carr has been great. Cheap, easy, and they ship FAST. I cut them 10-18in, grind and bevel one end, sand to smooth, oil, and paint the other end fluorescent orange to add a nice contrast. I use:

K191 (0.2120”) for 22lr
K193/K194 (0.2188”-0.2190”) for 223/556 *both can work but depending on barrel one may not fit or fit better then the other*
K204 (0.250”) for 6.5cm
K217 (0.2950”) for 300blk
K231 (0.3438”) for 9mm
K254 (0.4375”) for 450bm

No issues and nice to save money on just a quick check. I don’t feel much wiggle room in the barrel at all (if there even is any) but I’ve also never tried a $70-$80 Surefire, Griffin, or Geissele. I’ve gotten all those rods for less then the price of 1 of those. Maybe not as good as the main name brand ones but it’s better then the eyeball check. I’ve also never had a can out of whack where I would’ve gotten a baffle strike without doing this. Nice to have piece of mind though before shooting.

 

[SilencerShop]

Be careful with those McMaster Carr rods, lots of people on Reddit, etc., have been posting pictures of them not being completely straight. They seem to be pretty hit and miss.

 

[Ironcreek]

Just ordered 2 of these. Thanks for posting

 

[Supersubes]

@Supersubes

Every rod I have gotten from McMaster Carr has been great. Cheap, easy, and they ship FAST. I cut them 10-18in, grind and bevel one end, sand to smooth, oil, and paint the other end fluorescent orange to add a nice contrast. I use:

K191 (0.2120”) for 22lr
K193/K194 (0.2188”-0.2190”) for 223/556 *both can work but depending on barrel one may not fit or fit better then the other*
K204 (0.250”) for 6.5cm
K217 (0.2950”) for 300blk
K231 (0.3438”) for 9mm
K254 (0.4375”) for 450bm

No issues and nice to save money on just a quick check. I don’t feel much wiggle room in the barrel at all (if there even is any) but I’ve also never tried a $70-$80 Surefire, Griffin, or Geissele. I’ve gotten all those rods for less then the price of 1 of those. Maybe not as good as the main name brand ones but it’s better then the eyeball check. I’ve also never had a can out of whack where I would’ve gotten a baffle strike without doing this. Nice to have piece of mind though before shooting.

Thanks for the info. I’ve found those, but really would like much much tighter tolerances. That .2188-219 won’t fit in any 22cf barrel ive chambered, they’re all .218. The 6.5, that’s a lot of slop, same for the 30 cal. I do appreciate you taking the time to post those though.

 

[CaroleBaskin]

All murder aside, if you can get by with a close fitting rod, or need a longer rod.. take a look at K&s rods. They've been my cheap easy goto for a few different calibers that are close to fraction inches. They come in aluminum, brass or steel. Start about 12 bux and are 36" in length. Oh and you get like 5 at that.

K-S Round Aluminum Tube .014'' x 1/4'' x 36'' (5)

This Package includes Five 1/4 Round Aluminum Tubes by K&S Engineering.

www.hobbylinc.com

 

[HenryTheAce]

@CaroleBaskin wanna get weird with some sardine oil?

 

[CaroleBaskin]

@CaroleBaskin wanna get weird with some sardine oil?

The word "Premeditated" gets thrown around alot these days

 

[SilentStalkr]

Hey everyone, we have a new product... kind of a no-brainer being as no other silencer manufacturer offers a tool like this (with the exception of one who is co-branding one of the only other products like this out there). Anyways, here it goes!

With the appropriate Griffin Armament Suppressor Alignment Check Rod, an end-user or gunsmith can verify alignment of the chosen suppressor and mount with the desired host. Installation and use of this tool is simple and should prevent baffle strikes or any unexpected issues once you get to the range.

Griffin Armament has gone to great lengths to accommodate a wide variety of thread pitch and caliber options across our silencer mount and adapter products. This gives practically every end-user who wishes to suppress their host the opportunity to do so! With this wide range of compatibility comes its own set of issues, the main one being silencer and mount alignment to the host firearm's bore.

Suppressor Alignment Check Rods are available in .22 Cal, 6.5mm, 6.8mm, .30 Cal, .338 Cal, 9mm, & .45 Cal

For pricing and availability, please visit our website linked here: CLICK THIS

That’s fantastic! I need one for a 5.45!!!!

 

[SilentStalkr]

Bump!

 

[Spalding]

Does anyone make a .284/7mm?

 

[FuhQ]

$70 each? Ouch!

 

[metroplex]

If someone has a griffin 22 cal alignment rod, would you mind measuring the outer diameter of the rod?

My Geissele 5.56 rod will not fit through my M&P 5.7 barrel, but fits fine in my PS90 16" and SBR barrels.

 

[chevy_man]

Be careful with those McMaster Carr rods, lots of people on Reddit, etc., have been posting pictures of them not being completely straight. They seem to be pretty hit and miss.

You'd think it's just common sense to roll it against a straight edge to verify.

But we have some let's say not so mechanically inclined running to the forums and complaining about things they don't understand.

Kinda like it's pretty obvious you should bevel the end, but I saw pictures on another forum where the guy ruined the crown trying to stuff a rough shear cut down the barrel by tapping it with a 16oz framing hammer...

 

[metroplex]

Those McMaster rods even the higher end tool steel ones, are not going to be completely flat. Which is fine as long as you understand that and just use it as a rough frame of reference. I did until I got the Geissele rods - but just ran into this issue with the 5.7 I posted above.

 

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

Those McMaster rods even the higher end tool steel ones, are not going to be completely flat. Which is fine as long as you understand that and just use it as a rough frame of reference. I did until I got the Geissele rods - but just ran into this issue with the 5.7 I posted above.

Our rods are swiss turned from ground and polished stock and then centerless ground to diameter, so they are straight below .005 tir over the length of the rods which is pretty long like ~16”. The handling of the rods is equally important to straightness after machining.

Drill rods don’t necessarily hold straightness through warehousing, shipping or saw cutting, so it is impossible to achieve similar quality by buying drill rod. Drill rod is rated .005 over a foot, but thats out of the mill before freight shipping, warehousing, shipping again to the buyer, saw cutting, etc.

 

[metroplex]

Our rods are swiss turned from ground and polished stock and then centerless ground to diameter, so they are straight below .005 tir over the length of the rods which is pretty long like ~16”. The handling of the rods is equally important to straightness after machining.

Drill rods don’t necessarily hold straightness through warehousing, shipping or saw cutting, so it is impossible to achieve similar quality by buying drill rod. Drill rod is rated .005 over a foot, but thats out of the mill before freight shipping, warehousing, shipping again to the buyer, saw cutting, etc.

I sent you an email inquiring about the OD of the 22 cal rods but never heard back. Someone on Reddit said their Griffin 22 cal rod fits through their M&P 5.7 (the pistol I have) but not a CZ 22 bore, and he measured it around 0.208". My McMaster rod was 0.211" and fits through the M&P 5.7 but the Geissele 5.56 rod was 0.2165"-0.2170" and just wouldn't fit through. In any case I placed an order for the Griffin 22 cal rod right from your website just before the 20% discount was announced! Just waiting for it to ship out.

 

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

I sent you an email inquiring about the OD of the 22 cal rods but never heard back. Someone on Reddit said their Griffin 22 cal rod fits through their M&P 5.7 (the pistol I have) but not a CZ 22 bore, and he measured it around 0.208". My McMaster rod was 0.211" and fits through the M&P 5.7 but the Geissele 5.56 rod was 0.2165"-0.2170" and just wouldn't fit through. In any case I placed an order for the Griffin 22 cal rod right from your website just before the 20% discount was announced! Just waiting for it to ship out.

The diameter of our .22 rod is .214" A .22lr barrel is ~.218, so that's .004 under that so that it fits the barrel without being snug, and about 11" of rod can go in the barrel, meaning it can show alignment to .004" accuracy over the typical length of a 5.56mm can when accounting both straightness and undersize condition. I believe the straightness is held to about 1/2 the max tolerance of .005 TIR over the length of the rod.

 

[FuhQ]

Does anybody make a .257 caliber alignment rod? Can't find one anywhere...

 

[metroplex]

The diameter of our .22 rod is .214" A .22lr barrel is ~.218, so that's .004 under that so that it fits the barrel without being snug, and about 11" of rod can go in the barrel, meaning it can show alignment to .004" accuracy over the typical length of a 5.56mm can when accounting both straightness and undersize condition. I believe the straightness is held to about 1/2 the max tolerance of .005 TIR over the length of the rod.

Well whenever Griffin decides to ship out the rod I’ll be able to test it with the M&P 5.7
I had placed the order on Christmas Day and used their 15% code the day before they made everything 20% off no code needed. Still hasn’t shipped and I haven’t heard back from CS on the diameter.

The facts I have are is the Geissele 5.56 Rod is .2165-.217 and WILL NOT fit through the bore. It will fit through my PS90 barrels but is a tight fit. No issues with AR/SCAR/MCX barrels.

My McMaster rod is 0.211 and fits through the M&P. I’m just waiting on a Griffin 22 cal Rod so I have something that is actually straight and hopefully fits through the bore.

 

[FuhQ]

Well whenever Griffin decides to ship out the rod I’ll be able to test it with the M&P 5.7
I had placed the order on Christmas Day and used their 15% code the day before they made everything 20% off no code needed. Still hasn’t shipped and I haven’t heard back from CS on the diameter.

The facts I have are is the Geissele 5.56 Rod is .2165-.217 and WILL NOT fit through the bore. It will fit through my PS90 barrels but is a tight fit. No issues with AR/SCAR/MCX barrels.

My McMaster rod is 0.211 and fits through the M&P. I’m just waiting on a Griffin 22 cal Rod so I have something that is actually straight and hopefully fits through the bore.

Geissele builds the Surefire rods, and I have a Surefire/Geissele 5.56 rod, and it will NOT fit in a .22LR bore.

 

[metroplex]

Geissele builds the Surefire rods, and I have a Surefire/Geissele 5.56 rod, and it will NOT fit in a .22LR bore.

How about a 5.7x28 bore which is what my issue is in the first place with the Geissele 5.56 rod? 5.7 uses the same 0.224" bullets as 5.56/223, but some speculate the sizing of the lands/grooves is slightly different.

Just to recap - the Geissele works in my PS90 original barrel as well as the CMMG branded SBR barrel (made by FN) but it has always been very snug. I never thought twice about it.

Until the S&W M&P 5.7 barrel which won't even take more than 1-2 inches of the Geissele rod. I don't have a 22LR/rimfire rod to test other than my cheap McMaster rod which is 0.211" in OD, which fits through the M&P 5.7 bore

 

[FuhQ]

How about a 5.7x28 bore which is what my issue is in the first place with the Geissele 5.56 rod? 5.7 uses the same 0.224" bullets as 5.56/223, but some speculate the sizing of the lands/grooves is slightly different.

Just to recap - the Geissele works in my PS90 original barrel as well as the CMMG branded SBR barrel (made by FN) but it has always been very snug. I never thought twice about it.

Until the S&W M&P 5.7 barrel which won't even take more than 1-2 inches of the Geissele rod. I don't have a 22LR/rimfire rod to test other than my cheap McMaster rod which is 0.211" in OD, which fits through the M&P 5.7 bore

I don't own any 5.7x28, so don't know about that one... If the 5.7x28 uses a 5.56 bore diameter or larger, then the Surefire/Geissele rod should work. But like you said, might have different depth lands?

 

[metroplex]

I don't own any 5.7x28, so don't know about that one... If the 5.7x28 uses a 5.56 bore diameter or larger, then the Surefire/Geissele rod will work.

Apparently it doesn't have the same bore diameter as I've found out. But 5.7x28 uses the same bullet size as 5.56/223 Remington. (5.56 is really 5.7mm). Only thing I can think of trying is a 22LR alignment rod like the Griffin, but I am still waiting for them to ship it out.

 

[metroplex]

I just got an email from S&W unveiling their new M&P 22 Magnum, which fires 22WMR and uses the same TEMPO system found on the M&P 5.7 (which is a gas operated barrel for the pistol). That got me thinking more about S&W possibly using the same tooling for their barrels, like 22LR bores for the 5.7 etc.

Wikipedia entries for land diameters of:
22LR 0.212"
5.7x28 0.218"
22WMR 0.219"
5.56/223 0.219"

It seems like either FN makes their 5.7x28 bore sizing a bit larger, or S&W made the M&P 5.7 bore really tight maybe even the same as 22LR to save on tooling costs.

The fact is my crappy McMaster rod at 0.211" fits the M&P 5.7 but not the Geissele 5.56 rod that measured 0.2165"-0.2170"

Here's a photo of my PS90 with B&T can and B&T Flash Hider using a Geissele 5.56 rod for attention only. I do plan to try the Griffin 22 cal rod through the M&P 5.7

 

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

I grabbed a .214 pin and checked some .22lr guns, and these would go the .214 pin:
Ruger 22/45, Beretta 92 .22lr, High desert Dog 10/22 barrel, Mitchell Arms High std, Walther PPKS .22lr, Tippman .22, Bergara 10/22.

The High STD HDM did not go, nor did a Beretta from Israel Mossad surplus, or a Sig P210 .22lr conversion. So I guess .214 doesn't fit them all, and we probably shouldn't go any lower.

 

[metroplex]

I grabbed a .214 pin and checked some .22lr guns, and these would go the .214 pin:
Ruger 22/45, Beretta 92 .22lr, High desert Dog 10/22 barrel, Mitchell Arms High std, Walther PPKS .22lr, Tippman .22, Bergara 10/22.

The High STD HDM did not go, nor did a Beretta from Israel Mossad surplus, or a Sig P210 .22lr conversion. So I guess .214 doesn't fit them all, and we probably shouldn't go any lower.

Playing devil's advocate, would there really be no value in going to a smaller alignment rod like 0.208"-0.211"? for 22 cal? As long as your rods are true/straight and shipped properly, I think there's value in making the rods err on the side of being smaller than most bores. I never liked how snug the Geissele 5.56 rods fit through my PS90 barrels. Worst case scenario I can see with say a 0.208" rod in my 5.56 barrels is that they're a bit loose but shouldn't cause a big issue for false readings for bore concentricity. Most of the time I found if a bore wasn't aligned properly, you could easily tell.

 

[jzerfoss]

Playing devil's advocate, would there really be no value in going to a smaller alignment rod like 0.208"-0.211"? for 22 cal? As long as your rods are true/straight and shipped properly, I think there's value in making the rods err on the side of being smaller than most bores. I never liked how snug the Geissele 5.56 rods fit through my PS90 barrels. Worst case scenario I can see with say a 0.208" rod in my 5.56 barrels is that they're a bit loose but shouldn't cause a big issue for false readings for bore concentricity. Most of the time I found if a bore wasn't aligned properly, you could easily tell.

Loose rods cant towards gravity. Makes it appear to have slight misalignment where there might not be any. My .22 Griffin rod also has a very slight bend in it to where it gives me 2 different indications of alignment depending on which side is in the bore. It still usable but I wouldn't trust it for a tight bored suppressor alignment. I like my geissele rod for .224 bores because it's tight and gives me same indication regardless of which end is in the bore.

 

[metroplex]

Loose rods cant towards gravity. Makes it appear to have slight misalignment where there might not be any. My .22 Griffin rod also has a very slight bend in it to where it gives me 2 different indications of alignment depending on which side is in the bore. It still usable but I wouldn't trust it for a tight bored suppressor alignment. I like my geissele rod for .224 bores because it's tight and gives me same indication regardless of which end is in the bore.

I get all of that, the problem is when the 0.2165-0.2170 Geissele rod won't fit through a 5.7x28 bore which is supposed to be a 0.218" land diameter similar to 5.56/.224" which is 0.219". It's so snug it won't even go through which makes it worthless for that application. But it fits fine in other 5.7x28 barrels albeit very snug.

And as Griffin mentioned, some 22LR bores won't even fit their .214 gage. So what do we use for alignment rods in that situation?

 

[Baron23]

@GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT - I have one of your 6.5mm rods and have been quite happy with it.

And, unlike the fella who posted above, my rod is straight and indicates the same no matter which end of the rod is inserted into the bore.

I note that earlier in this thread people were commenting on the price...I see that they are now $56 each and while this isn't pocket change its far, far cheaper than a baffle strike (and many of us have been there or seen that).

So, I like the product and I'm a happy customer as is my friend @GBMaryland

 

[metroplex]

@GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT - I have one of your 6.5mm rods and have been quite happy with it.

And, unlike the fella who posted above, my rod is straight and indicates the same no matter which end of the rod is inserted into the bore.

I note that earlier in this thread people were commenting on the price...I see that they are now $56 each and while this isn't pocket change its far, far cheaper than a baffle strike (and many of us have been there or seen that).

So, I like the product and I'm a happy customer as is my friend @GBMaryland

You would not believe some of the crazy stuff on Reddit. People balking at the idea of paying $60+ for an alignment rod in the NFA community, but have no issues spending $20k+ for tax stamps and other NFA items! I check all of my stuff with alignment rods before even shooting. I often have to switch muzzle devices to find the best alignment.

 

[metroplex]

Finally got my Griffin 22 cal rod. Measured 0.214" in diameter and fits perfectly through the M&P 5.7 bore. Not too tight, not too lose. Perfectly straight as well. I could spin the rod and not see any bends to it. Very nice quality and packaging.

 

[GRIFFIN_ARMAMENT]

Finally got my Griffin 22 cal rod. Measured 0.214" in diameter and fits perfectly through the M&P 5.7 bore. Not too tight, not too lose. Perfectly straight as well. I could spin the rod and not see any bends to it. Very nice quality and packaging.

Thanks for the feedback. I'm glad it worked out for you. I know they are a bit of a risk to ship. Definitely be careful to store it like flat in a drawer to maintain straightness over time.