Target Size

[Jack Master]

I'm a new guy to the long range game and I'm setting up a steel target range. I can shoot out to 730yds off my back patio. What is an appropriate target size to mimic PRS or practical competition shooting? 1moa? 1.5?... Is there a particular size at a certain distance you often see?

I have a 60"x60"x 3/8" thick AR400 steel plate given to me that I plan to cut up. The targets will be hung on T posts.

Thanks

 

[Tnc]

1 moa is pretty normal for the matches I’ve shot in. Some of the longer range stuff will be 2 moa or larger. I’ve seen some .5 moa at 300 yards and shorter.
If you’re new to this make them generous or you will get frustrated easily.

 

[Snuby642]

If you have enough material, why not make a one moa and one mil target for each range.
Some of your friends may not have equipment to hit 1 moa.
The mil size could be usefull to work on ranging practice and wind holds.
Kind of like a calibrating system.

 

[Sig Marine]

I sometimes work with new shooters and have found that using a couple of targets at distance helps with their learning. 1 MOA is tough at longer distances or high, gusty winds and, as mentioned, can be frustrating. I try to gear shooting for others to promote success. To do this, I use a couple of targets at distance; 1 MOA and 2 MOA. Doing this gives them a larger target (2 MOA) to get onto, once on, they can give the 1 MOA a go.

 

[Jack Master]

1 MOA is tough at longer distances

Some of the longer range stuff will b

What is "longer distances"? is 700 still inside that phrase?
Thanks

 

[RTH1800]

If you will shoot paper you can get an exact zero with a near exact hold point. Not popular but it is the best solution for those who do not care to guess. Get a 36" paper and place a 2" dot on it. At 15 + power you will see it fine.

 

[MDT_Josh]

I just ran my first match here a few weeks ago and we only had 650 yards to play with, and a ton of new shooters. If you have the steel plate and a good way to cut it, try to stick around the 2 MOA target size. A 1 MOA target can be generally pretty easy to hit from prone, but remember that in most of these matches you will only shoot a maximum of 50% prone, with some matches (Punisher Positional) opting for no prone stages at all.

 

[Mooncake]

It's not the size of the target, bruh...it's how you use it.

 

[Tnc]

What is "longer distances"? is 700 still inside that phrase?
Thanks

700 you probably want a little larger. 1.5 to 2 moa

 

[ykrvak]

I think part of this depends on whether your range allows you to easily see splash from misses. If it doesn’t, then going a little large can be very helpful. You can easily put a smaller POA at the center and aim small. If you’re getting pushed around by the wind, or just struggling with some fundamentals having a slightly oversized target can make your life much easier. Just my .02

 

[Sig Marine]

What is "longer distances"? is 700 still inside that phrase?
Thanks

I have 3 ranges where I normally shoot. One range is 200-450 yards, another is 600-1100 yards and the third one is 1400-1800 yards. Again, target size depends on the range and ability of the shooter. On the short range, targets are between 2" and 8". Gusty winds do not have as much affect on this range because of a tree line so targets can be smaller but the 2" plate is very tough at 450 and certainly not a "gimme", even for a very good shooter. For the 600-1100 yard range, I use targets ranging in size from 6" up to 20" using the 1 MOA and 2 MOA formula. This range is notorious for high gusting/shifting winds in the 8-35 mph range (sometimes higher) and on those days the 1 MOA targets seldom get any action. On the longest range, I use a 20" and 30" plate.

 

[vinconco]

I like to have a "spotter" target to verify wind and sight settings. it helps a lot if you cannot spot misses easily.
Here is my setup from HANG FAST TARGETS. 10% discount on every order to Snipers Hide members code: SNIPERSHIDE10

All targets hang easily on a T Post, very reactive and LOUD

 

[Jackomason]

I went through this a while ago, I have a handful of smaller targets but it was tough to do my trueing on them at distance, so I got a package deal on Ebay for 2 66% ipsc silouhetts and I made a bracket to bolt them together when I need to but I did get good wind and elevation feed back and now I seperate them and smaller targets are easier to hit.

 

[spife7980]

Its always easy to aim at a smaller area on a big target than to see hits on an area bigger than a small target.

 

[spife7980]

With a 5x5 piece I would cut it up something like this excellent rendering.

Big target thats 3.5' square and then slice up the remaining in some squares and/or more elongated pieces. Gives you a piece of steel for 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 700 yards

 

[RyanM]

I think saying all targets should be MOA is pretty optimistic.

For prone targets I would do about 1.5MOA (especially once you are 400-500 yards out) and for positional I would be doing 2.25+ MOA.

If you are new to the game hitting sub-moa at distance may be tough.

 

[Jack Master]

Okay. Thanks every one for the response.
I got my tape measure out last night and the plate is a little bigger than I thought. 5'-10"x 5'-0".
Here is what I decided to make: - see attachment.
12"x12" or 12"x16" The will be the easy larger targets for learning and for friends. (These will also work for my pistol range training in the summer months when the crops are in the fields.)
Then I will a big plate for the 700 yard as an easy plate.
lastly I might try to make a KYL tree for 300 yards with plates from 10" down to 3"
I figure if I cut the plate large now I can always trim them smaller later.

With a 5x5 piece I wold cut it up something like this

We're thinking alike. I was just sketching the same idea.
Thanks all

 

[Jack Master]

!

 

[spife7980]

Well yours is a bit more crude than my rendering but I think it will do.

As far as mounting holes I really like a single hole in the top middle. I run a carriage bolt through and hang it with some chain. The single hole allows it to pivot and if you ever shoot at distance with a 223 its hard to see impacts or sound even at times and the single hole allows it to spin on its axis for an easier visual clue that it was hit. Especially helpful when self spotting.

My targets at distance that mount with 2 chains, one on each corner, are a pain in the ass to see, they just slighty rock back and forth a bit directly in line with you and not offering up much of a visual clue.

The only downside is if you are trying to go for lots of fast follow up shots but seeing as this is distance and not three gun, hosing ammo on targets, the spinning shouldnt be a downside. If you are going to be trying to put a bullet per second into it then a more rigid 2 hole set up will be preferred.

 

[Fig]

You state this is for "practice". In practice, as in a match, a miss you don't see and don't know where it went is a completely wasted shot. You got zero from it. Unlike a miss that you tracked and which provided you with useful and valuable data. Large steel lets you see exactly where the miss went. I know of no better way to practice than shooting large pieces of steel (like full IPSCs) with small targets painted on them. Your "misses" are as important or more important than your hits.

If you're shooting 1 moa targets and not missing in practice then you're not challenging yourself nearly enough to significantly improve. Either by range and wind, or by positional shooting you should not be connecting every time no matter how satisfying you find that ring of steel. Seeing where and determining why you missed is THE key to not missing in the future. Like anything else you learn more from failure than from success.

A quick look at the scores demonstrates that even the top shooters would benefit from practicing on large enough steel to see every miss. When you miss the steel entirely you're making an additional guess as to by how much. When you miss a painted target but impact the steel you're not guessing. You can see the correction/how much you missed.

Don't let the fact that am impact is an impact in competition prevent you from practicing on targets large enough to see every hit. Especially when your starting out seeing every hit will help you learn to read the wind and judge environmentals faster and more accurately, and on positional shooting will let you see where you're breaking your shots and help you diagnose any fundamentals that need work.

This is just my opinion (I'm not one of the top shooters), but I have experienced massive gains in my scores by practicing this way. I went from a bottom quarter shooter to an upper half in a season, and I think seeing every miss by shooting larger targets at all ranges helped a lot...
Take that for what it's worth.

 

[vinconco]

Having good reactivity helps with spotting hits. Too often the spotter misses the "splash" especially with lighter bullets at longer ranges. A target plate that moves easily can be spotted by the shooter.

Check out this demo with our 12 inch plate.

 

[Jack Master]

Your "misses" are as important or more important than your hits.

Fig - is there a specific way to paint the targets to know what would have been a miss. should I paint the targets all white and put a small 1" aiming dot in the middle? I have heard Frank talk about using primer grey for some targets, in a 12x12 Should I paint a 4"x4" white square (or 1moa) in the middle to simulate a 4" plate and the rest of the target grey? Thoughts?

 

[spife7980]

I keep all my targets white, hard to see impacts when they are the same color as a clean/gray steel target.

The essence of what he is saying is that you can refine down your impacts on a big target, you cant do so on a small target where you cant see any impacts to refine off of.
A miss into the mud or grass that gives the shooter no feedback is just that, a worthless miss.

Paint them however you want, I use a quick sprits of red spray paint as my aim point for my big steel. I can see where Im off when I miss it because the target is big enough to catch the would-be-misses and work it into that red point. Im not satisfied just hitting a big target, I still want to hit that red aim point, but its nice having the big target to catch the impacts on, much less frustrating. If you want that to be a 4x4 so be it, if you want it to be one of those hostage flipper targets thats fine too.

 

[vinconco]

Im not satisfied just hitting a big target, I still want to hit that red aim point, but its nice having the big target to catch the impacts on,

Great for shooting groups and checking zeros too. I love my 24" round @ 450
I have a 8" round under it for when I verify POI on the 24"

 

[Snuby642]

I think good use made of it except none are based in mrad / mil.
Make at least 1 target mil x mil for a given range.
It will be useful eventualy.

 

[Sheldon N]

What is an appropriate target size to mimic PRS or practical competition shooting?

My 0.02, assuming this is geared towards true practice making you better at PRS.

Smaller is better than larger. Larger is for "feel good", smaller will hold you accountable to make good shots. Positional practice for me is on a 1 to 1.5MOA target. 2 MOA would be the biggest I'd want to go, out at the farther ranges due to the added effects of wind. I'd rather have a 1 MOA target at 300 or 400 yards with dirt behind it and shoot 50 or 60% hit ratio on a windy day than a 2 MOA target and get more hits. Better practice to spot impacts/misses and keep a close eye on wind.

I'd focus on setting targets where you have a view of dirt splash behind them to the left and right, whether that's open field or a dirt berm. Use the dirt as your guide on misses, since that's exactly what you'll encounter in a match. I would not rely on a big target with fresh paint to see your hits, almost always the target is going to be shot to hell by the time you see it in a match.

I like central single point T-post hook hangers for targets. Watch the plate twist left/right as part of your guide to bringing impacts back to center. The style that DM Targets or JC Steel offers is good.

Final suggestion I'd offer is to spread targets out across a wider field of fire so you can practice target acquisition, shooting across the wind at different angles, and approaching props from different angles.

 

[vinconco]

I had a guy that wanted a 1 moa target for his 300 yard rifle range so I designed this single plate reactive target that mounts on a T Post without tools.

Fully armored w/ 3/8" AR500. NO WELDS on the AR500

Plate sizes available 3, 4, 6 and 8 inch 3/8" AR500. Plates change in seconds without tools.

SINGLE PLATE SWINGER 10% OFF TO SNIPERSHIDE MEMBERS code: SNIPERSHIDE10

use with our T Post Base or just pound the post in the ground

 

[TheGerman]

It's not the size of the target, bruh...it's how you use it.

Wait, what? lol

 

[Fig]

Fig - is there a specific way to paint the targets to know what would have been a miss. should I paint the targets all white and put a small 1" aiming dot in the middle? I have heard Frank talk about using primer grey for some targets, in a 12x12 Should I paint a 4"x4" white square (or 1moa) in the middle to simulate a 4" plate and the rest of the target grey? Thoughts?

I usually paint a 1 MOA target on the IPSC. 1” per 100 yds. QED. I shoot a heavy rifle with extremely low recoil, so I spot pretty good. Still, it’s nice to have an impact miss. Very easy to correct and get better at wind.

 

[Bradu]

I shoot mostly at 600 yards and set up a 12, 10, 8, 6 and a 3" target. Some days the 3" gets a lot of action and some days 1 moa is the best you can do consistently. The layout of the range makes reading wind pretty challenging. Timber on one side and a tall bank on the other but the berm has flat fields on both sides. Mirage may be showing left to right wind and you have to dial right.

 

[withoutwarning]

I’m starting out and building my own range too. I’ve got nine 300mmx300mm square plates that I’m placing between 25-650m. When I get better I’ll add some 200x200mm plates for the longer distances.

Mines all in mills to practice ranging from whatever distance and position I want to shoot from.

 

[vinconco]

I like my "Target Tree" from Hang Fast Targets
Here it is set up with a 24" round, 10 inch round a silhouette and an 8 inch round. The plates are easily changed without tools.
All mounted on a single T Post.
When the condition is right I like to take head shots on the silhouette.

 

[steve123]

At a friends property where we shoot at a lot we hang small steel in front of large steel. We paint the small steel black and the big steel in the back white. The big steel doesn't move when hit but the small steel flops around nicely. Some are hung from chains and some from conveyor straps or are spinners.

They all sound different and the misses on the white are easy to see making corrections a breeze. It's a great system.