Telescoping ammunition

[Mugsy9010]

I'm getting involved in a project that's going to require manufacturing some "telescoping" ammunition based around a 44 magnum case, sleeved to accept a .30 cal bullet. Essentially I'm attempting to replicate the function of the Knights suppressed revolver rifle and I'm starting with the ammo as that presents the biggest challenge for me personally. Based on my research this has been done small scale commercial in the past but as far as I can find is not currently available and I can find very little on the specifics (tolerances, load data, fits, etc).

Commercial production was apparently done by a man named Charles "Bob" Olsen and sold under the name Invicta, I can't find any current information on the product or the man. The third picture below is apparently of Invicta cartridges, unfired on the left and the two rightmost are fired (note the sleeve has telescoped forward slightly.) The original purpose of Mr Olsen's design was to eliminate the cylinder-to-barrel gap in an effort to reduce gas loss and increase bullet velocity and Knights adapted that concept for the purpose of noise suppression.

Does anyone have any additional information or experience with cartridges of this type? If so, I'd appreciate any input or thoughts you may have, or if anyone is aware of this concept being available commercially (or as a custom) I'd like to know that as well.

TIA

U.S. Patent for Revolving firearms and ammunition therefor Patent (Patent # 4,393,782 issued July 19, 1983) - Justia Patents Search

This invention relates to a means for utilizing smaller-diameter bullets in larger-diameter cartridge cases, to achieve higher velocity without bottlenecking the cartridge case, and a firearm having a reduced bore adapted to that cartridge. Additionally, the invention provides a means of sealing...

patents.justia.com

U.S. Patent for Revolving firearms Patent (Patent # 4,457,093 issued July 3, 1984) - Justia Patents Search

This invention relates to a means for utilizing smaller-diameter bullets in larger-diameter cartridge cases, to achieve higher velocity without bottlenecking the cartridge case, and a firearm having a reduced bore adapted to that cartridge. Additionally, the invention provides a means of sealing...

patents.justia.com

 

[redbullitt]

Thats some neat stuff right there! I hope you can make progress on it.

 

[acudaowner]

still waiting for Elon Musk to make all that ammo , powder , and primers completely obsolete

come one Elon you can do it . send in the green chicks .

 

[B'N'F]

The Russians have various telescoping/internal piston ammunition - AFAIK the ATF considers each round an NFA item, you may want to check into that as well.

 

[MK20]

Of course the ATF would be that stupid.

 

[918v]

I'm getting involved in a project that's going to require manufacturing some "telescoping" ammunition based around a 44 magnum case, sleeved to accept a .30 cal bullet. Essentially I'm attempting to replicate the function of the Knights suppressed revolver rifle and I'm starting with the ammo as that presents the biggest challenge for me personally. Based on my research this has been done small scale commercial in the past but as far as I can find is not currently available and I can find very little on the specifics (tolerances, load data, fits, etc).

Commercial production was apparently done by a man named Charles "Bob" Olsen and sold under the name Invicta, I can't find any current information on the product or the man. The third picture below is apparently of Invicta cartridges, unfired on the left and the two rightmost are fired (note the sleeve has telescoped forward slightly.) The original purpose of Mr Olsen's design was to eliminate the cylinder-to-barrel gap in an effort to reduce gas loss and increase bullet velocity and Knights adapted that concept for the purpose of noise suppression.

Does anyone have any additional information or experience with cartridges of this type? If so, I'd appreciate any input or thoughts you may have, or if anyone is aware of this concept being available commercially (or as a custom) I'd like to know that as well.

TIA

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U.S. Patent for Revolving firearms and ammunition therefor Patent (Patent # 4,393,782 issued July 19, 1983) - Justia Patents Search

This invention relates to a means for utilizing smaller-diameter bullets in larger-diameter cartridge cases, to achieve higher velocity without bottlenecking the cartridge case, and a firearm having a reduced bore adapted to that cartridge. Additionally, the invention provides a means of sealing...

patents.justia.com

U.S. Patent for Revolving firearms Patent (Patent # 4,457,093 issued July 3, 1984) - Justia Patents Search

This invention relates to a means for utilizing smaller-diameter bullets in larger-diameter cartridge cases, to achieve higher velocity without bottlenecking the cartridge case, and a firearm having a reduced bore adapted to that cartridge. Additionally, the invention provides a means of sealing...

patents.justia.com

Isn’t that the rifle Smoking Man had when he was going to assasinate Moulder on the X Files?

 

[6.5SH]

Isn’t that the rifle Smoking Man had when he was going to assasinate Moulder on the X Files?

 

[Mr.BR]

Soviets played a lot with these silent cartridges , started with fully machined cartridges ultimately ended up with extremely simple solutions where the case seems to have neck formed after the round has been charged and primed.

Some more info

SILENT SOVIET PISTOL: THE PSS AND SP-4 CAPTIVE PISTON AMMUNITION - Small Arms Review

By Philip H. Dater, MD

smallarmsreview.com

Special bullets

Handbook of military small arms of Russia with the tactical, technical specifications, detailed descriptions and quality photos. Special captive-piston cartridges.

gunrf.ru