The prefect spotter. Is there a market?

[mrtoyz]

IMO the perfect spotter would have the following features:
12-60x (down to 12 to help fight mirage)
High end glass (Leica, Swaro, Kowa)
Binocular eyepiece
A lit tree reticle that can be turned off
I’d suggested this idea to an insider here on the Hide and he suggested that it would cost too much and market is too limited.
Do you agree?

 

[338LMAI]

IMO the perfect spotter would have the following features:
12-60x (down to 12 to help fight mirage)
High end glass (Leica, Swaro, Kowa)
Binocular eyepiece
A lit tree reticle that can be turned off
I’d suggested this idea to an insider here on the Hide and he suggested that it would cost too much and market is too limited.
Do you agree?

Why not just ask Kowa & Fujinon (Big Bino Mfgs.) to put a reticle in one lens in their Highlander & I-don't-know-the-name "big eye" binoculars and be, well, almost done with it. Because if that happens toss in a 1543nm laser rangefinder as well. And maybe a sales gimmick com'on sort of thing; throw in a free RRS heaviest duty carbon fiber 'pod & head to match... Yeah, you're right, I got too much time on my hands... And yes indeed--I did say 1543nm--did you hear that Zeiss & Henny?

 

[2aBaC̶a̶]

+LRF

 

[Lowlight]

Swaro covers most of that but at a very high price

the reticle is excellent just not a XMAS, but work very well. It's a rifle reticle vs some of the alternatives

But most of those features, sans the 12x for sure, is found in the Swaro

 

[Long Range 338]

We still can't convince Kowa to put a reticle in an eyepiece, let alone an illuminated one. But it would be very nice.

 

[mrtoyz]

Swaro covers most of that but at a very high price

the reticle is excellent just not a XMAS, but work very well. It's a rifle reticle vs some of the alternatives

But most of those features, sans the 12x for sure, is found in the Swaro

Yeah. I looked at the BTX and the STR. Honestly, anymore I’m to the point that if a spotter doesn’t have a reticle and isn’t bino it’s not for me. Which means I won’t be buying anything else...
@lowlight, do think there would be a market for such a beast?

 

[Steel head]

With a simple and low offset tree with usable tenths.

 

[Steel head]

We still can't convince Kowa to put a reticle in an eyepiece, let alone an illuminated one. But it would be very nice.

A prominar with this would wreck my credit card.

 

[mrtoyz]

A prominar with this would wreck my credit card.
View attachment 7243995

How important is a bino eyepiece to people?

 

[Steel head]

How important is a bino eyepiece to people?

not at all for me but extended viewing would make it nice.

 

[Mortalpawn]

Only problem with the Swaro is that it has no low magnification range, which makes it hard to spot unknown/camo targets at unknown range. Its also a bit large for field use. You really do need the 12x low end to search for targets and also make it easy to transition from binoculars.

Probably the closest we have today is the Leupold 12-40x60 with the TMR reticle which is a great field scope, and the choice of most military snipers. Good reticle, good magnification range and field tough.

If someone made the 12-60x with good glass and a fine gradient milrad reticle in a compact package that was field tough, I would probably scoop one up. Not sure I need the binoc eyepiece (would make it quite large). A LRF would be cool, but adding a good one would drive the price up pretty high.

 

[mrtoyz]

The Athlon 7-42 looks decent. Would love to compare the glass with some high end stuff.
I predict bino spotters will become
more of a thing as ELR becomes more and more popular and people get tired of spotting one eyed for long periods of time.

 

[Lowlight]

You can do a Hensoldt 15-45 with Horus in it ...

I have one, it's about as low as you want to go, any lower in magnification just use your rifle scope

 

[Diver160651]

A prominar with this would wreck my credit card.

How can you see through that paper?

 

[Diver160651]

Only problem with the Swaro is that it has no low magnification range, which makes it hard to spot unknown/camo targets at unknown range. Its also a bit large for field use. You really do need the 12x low end to search for targets and also make it easy to transition from binoculars.

Probably the closest we have today is the Leupold 12-40x60 with the TMR reticle which is a great field scope, and the choice of most military snipers. Good reticle, good magnification range and field tough.

If someone made the 12-60x with good glass and a fine gradient milrad reticle in a compact package that was field tough, I would probably scoop one up. Not sure I need the binoc eyepiece (would make it quite large). A LRF would be cool, but adding a good one would drive the price up pretty high.

Maybe not as wide a FOV difference as you think @ 500yard in realistic terms + really you should have binos for that primary search.

My old Leopold at 12x is about 84'​

My Swaro ATX @25x about 62'​

I think the STR @ 20x was about +1foot more than the ATX​

Yes, the 12x is slightly more than the Swaro at but not really earth shattering considering the benefit of higher magnification and better glass.

I run the ATX in 65 ocular because of the form factor for hunting. The reticles are great for teaching, but really not as good for everything. Personally I switched out from reticles in my spotters because todays rifles scopes being so good like the ZCO with 27x giving me everything I need for corrections as long as I can spot on the rifle. If I really need something more than that is for glassing (hunting) or for watching trace as far as I can. Spotters with reticles, but lower quality glass and lower magnifications do not help in those specific uses..

Teaching get the STR
Hunting hands down get the best glass, no reticle and a form factor you can carry\

just my 2 cents.

 

[M8541Reaper]

IMO the perfect spotter would have the following features:
12-60x (down to 12 to help fight mirage)
High end glass (Leica, Swaro, Kowa)
Binocular eyepiece
A lit tree reticle that can be turned off
I’d suggested this idea to an insider here on the Hide and he suggested that it would cost too much and market is too limited.
Do you agree?

My idea of a perfect spotter would be someone who could read wind, catch trace, and give straight feedback without the filler comments.

Shit, I should of kept reading past the first line.

Ok so I agree and those features/specs would be nice to have.

 

[MACHTECH]

My idea of a perfect spotter would be someone who could read wind, catch trace, and give straight feedback without the filler comments.

I know him! We call him the wind wizard.

 

[M8541Reaper]

I know him! We call him the wind wizard.
View attachment 7247934

Cherish him, for you are lucky. ::wipes away tears of jealousy::

 

[MarshalC_SportOptics]

Honestly man, as many guys I've talked to about this, especially at competitions. The market for it would be so small. Granted Swarovski has the STR (milled reticle illuminated spotter) and the BTX (binocular spotting scope) but to combine the 2? Although I have had a couple of extreme long range shooters special make a mount to place 2 STRs side by side and it was a unicorn for sure. It was crazy to see one. But I think you would at least be at a 6-7k price point probably. Though I'm not bashing your idea, I would love to see that happen!

 

[Dthomas3523]

I think you’d have a better market for swaro quality binos with a reticle you could turn off and on.

As mentioned, all that in a spotter would have the hendsoldt effect (price most everyone out).

 

[Esoteric Junkie]

The Zeiss Harpia 95mm. 72 degree FOV, the ultimate in resolution and contrast. 23-70x.

EJ

 

[clcustom1911]

I gots my Leupold 12-40 with P4 reticle. If only I had a LRF that had MLok on it I could mount them together...

 

[Rocketmandb]

View attachment 7247910
How can you see through that paper?

The horizontal blue lines are a no-go for me

 

[Steel head]

I ended up cheaping out and getting a bushy T series.
It’s decent in the glass department but I do like the reticle, simple and thin.

 

[clcustom1911]

I ended up cheaping out and getting a bushy T series.
It’s decent in the glass department but I do like the reticle, simple and thin.
View attachment 7289082

I used that a couple years back and it was excellent. I got the reticle spotter bug and ended up scoring my Leupold from a member on here.

 

[Polizei45]

I have just started looking at spotting scopes myself. The Nikon Momarch 82ED-A W/FS- MRAD looks interesting. It's not cheap, buts not in the high end category. I think I read that Frank was using one at some of his classes. Any thoughts plus or minus on this spotter.

 

[ToddM]

That's a tough call, we do have a few options, but the long range shooting market is so tiny, and the benefits of dial elevation scopes and such are still very slow to trickle into the hunting world, and a reticle spotter is probably well behind that for the masses. I think that's the only hope aside military contract that would generate such items. I mean I'd love to have an STR body to replace my STS HD, but not enough to drop $3500 on one.

Seems like an easier more cost effective win would be to make eyepieces with reticles in them for spotters that use separate eyepieces. Though I'd guess the downside with those is they are going to be locked into one power, though that would improve optical quality some. I'd happily buy a $300-$500 eyepiece for my STS that was in the fixed 20x range with equivalent quality glass to my 20-50w eyepiece.

The other issue is that it seems like for reticle/tactical use, many times the glass quality is lower, and that might be fine for that use case, but for hunting you really want the absolutely best optical quality, so guys are not going to want to pay say $1500, for what is really a $750 spotter optically just because it has a reticle in it. We see it over and over on reticle spotter reviews that the glass is good enough for long range shooting, but not amazing.

 

[338LMAI]

Why not just ask Kowa & Fujinon (Big Bino Mfgs.) to put a reticle in one lens in their Highlander & I-don't-know-the-name "big eye" binoculars and be, well, almost done with it. Because if that happens toss in a 1543nm laser rangefinder as well. And maybe a sales gimmick com'on sort of thing; throw in a free RRS heaviest duty carbon fiber 'pod & head to match... Yeah, you're right, I got too much time on my hands... And yes indeed--I did say 1543nm--did you hear that Zeiss & Henny?

Oh yeah; a lot of people here and elsewhere wouldn't trash a 1064nm version either...