Tikka 223 rifle build advice

[marauderx33]

I'm thinking of putting together a precision 223 rifle as follows:

* Find a cheap used Tikka T3 or T3x, right hand, stainless - will use the action only
* Have a gunsmith fit a Bartlein barrel, 223 Rem, 1:7 twist, Rem Varmint profile, 22" long, unfluted
* No muzzle brake
* Stock or chassis: undecided (see below)
* Magazines: MDT AICS 223 Rem magazine (10 round)
* Trigger: Tikka factory
* Scope Rail: Warne or EGW Picatinny rail for Tikka T3, 20 MOA, black
* Scope: Athlon Cronus BTR 4.5-29x56 FFP MRAD
* Sterk swept bolt handle
* Cerakote action, bolt, and barrel in graphite black

The rifle would be used for long range shooting practice, practical hunting rifle competition (shooting from a variety of positions in field conditions out to about 375m), and varminting. I'd like it to be heavy enough to be steady & stable shooting prone off a bipod or improvised rest (e.g. tree stump), but well balanced & light enough for the occasional unsupported shot (e.g. sitting, kneeling, or off-hand), and not overly long so it can be used effectively from a vehicle.

I'm keen on 223 calibre choice due to the low cost & availability of ammunition & components, good barrel life, and low recoil.

I'm located in Australia if that makes any difference.

Questions:

1) I'm quite undecided on the stock / chassis. I want something that supports AICS magazines and doesn't require bedding. I'm strongly considering a Manners stock with the Tikka mini chassis to support AICS magazines. Any advice on choosing between the T4A, T6A, and MCS-PRS1TK? What fill would you recommend?

2) Alternatively I'm considering a chassis such as a KRG Bravo, KRG X-Ray, or KRG Whiskey 3, which avoid the long lead times of a Manners stock. Any feedback on choosing between these is appreciated. Particularly interested in the Bravo vs the X-Ray, as I can't seem to find a compelling reason to choose one over the other.

3) I've chosen a 1:7 twist as I specifically want to run the Hornady 75gr ELD-M (or something similar) and don't really care about lighter projectiles. Sound ok?

4) I've chosen the MDT AICS 223 mags as I hear they allow a generous 2.55" max OAL, which should be enough to seat long heavy 70-80gr bullets reasonably far out?

5) Can anyone share feedback on combinations of stock/chassis, barrel length, and barrel profile, and how they balanced?

Any feedback or advice is appreciated.

 

[want2learn]

I'm quite new to all of this but i did find this article which might help a little bit with regards to reloading for the .223 as well as choosing twist rates and bullet weight: http://www.accurateshooter.com/cartridge-guides/223rem/

looking forward to following this post

 

[dino67]

Unless you're set on using an aftermarket barrel a standard tikka varmint in 223 with 1 in 8 twist will likely shoot as well and save you some money and gunsmith wait time. KRG Bravo is also a very comfortable chassis requiring no bedding or aftermarket DBM. I use MDT polymer mags in my 223 Tikka with nil issues. I'm shooting 80.5gr Berger Full Bore projectiles. I've shot it out to a 1200 yards but realistically it's at its best 600m and in.

 

[lou400a]

What Dino said. Just get the 1/8 Varmint and shorten the barrel if you want and shoot it. You’ll be pleasantly surprised
I’ve had mine in MDT ESS chassis, but switched to Manners T6a and use MDT mags

 

[260284]

I am getting 3025fps with the 75gr ELDM in my Varmint with the factory barrel. I am using the MDT magazines and loading them at 2.49" with H4895. You can modify the MDT mags and load longer for sure. My next barrel will be a 1-7" 223 AI so I can play with the 80 and 88 ELDMs, but if you are only using the 75, 1-8" will be fine. I had mine threaded and run it suppressed.

 

[MarinePMI]

Ditto here. Running a Varmint (had it threaded) with a brake and/or suppressor. Shoots 75gr ELDM fine...

I'm running an MPA chassis on it, though I have a Tikka Bravo as well for another rifle (6.5CM). I'd think a Varmint in a Bravo chassis would be pretty easy for a solid rifle system.

 

[Sowastrong Industries]

Just bought two T3’s in 223. A lefty and my right hand. Modified a W3 to accommodate the LH bolt, too easy. The factory bbls were cut down to 20” and with cans they are sweet shooters, 75gr eld at 2930fps are wicked accurate. KRG’s two stage Midas trigger is damn nice btw, very happy with mine. Accurate mags, modified them up front and they’ve been fine.

 

[260284]

Mine is in the GGS Ranger with Mountain Tactical AICS bottom metal.

 

[Codiekfx400]

Just go with the tikka varmint like others have said. If you want custom do a bighorn origin and do a custom.

 

[DarinC]

Another option that would save some money is grab a howa barreled action from Brownell a, throw it in a krg and be done. Those things really hit above their weight cost wise.

 

[lou400a]

Another option that would save some money is grab a howa barreled action from Brownell a, throw it in a krg and be done. Those things really hit above their weight cost wise.

I could be wrong, but I don't recall Howas with fast twist rates

 

[MarinePMI]

They're 1-8 for .223 now...

 

[marauderx33]

Thanks for all the replies!

It's great to hear that the factory barrels work so well. What kind of accuracy are you folks getting? I figured a custom barrel would be more consistent plus allow me to get the profile & length I want?

I used to have a factory T3 Super Varmint in 204 Ruger and it shot very well, but I didn't know what I was doing back then in terms of reloading etc.

A new T3X Varmint Stainless is about AUD $1750. I estimate I could get a used T3 right hand stainless for AUD $700 and have a gunsmith fit a custom barrel for AUD $1300-1400, so AUD $2100 total. So about $300-$400 more for the custom barrel route, maybe $300 more again if I get the action & barrel cerakoted. Considering the entire setup including stock/chassis, rail, scope, bipod, etc will be in the vicinity of $7000 - $8500, it's not a great difference. Going with a factory barrel does save time and hassle though.

Can someone clarify the difference between the Manners T4A and T6A? Why would I choose one over the other?

 

[DownhillFromHere]

Here is my Tikka T3X Varmint (.223) in an MDT LSS-XL Gen-2 chassis with MDT Skeleton stock, with MDT 20-MOA rail. (not shown: MDT polymer AICS-format mag) The 10-shot group is an early one (new barrel) with Defender 69-grain factory ammo (short COAL, fairly mild load) at 100 yards on a 3/4" dot.

The rifle is used as a trainer. I got a case lot of the Defender 69gr SMK ammo at a good price; this group is typical (I have reloaded bottleneck rounds in the past but prefer to use factory ammo now, if I can get 1/2-MOA accuracy, which I usually can). The rifle does not like 75-grain bullets of any flavor (reloads, factory) but a recent test of 77-grain rounds showed some promise - hope to expand on that in the next few days. It's important to note that the 1:8 twist is adequate for 75-77grain bullets; shooting buddies' rifles of different makes with 1:8 barrels produce bughole groups with the same rounds mine spreads out over an inch @ 100 yards.

Hope this helps in decision-making.

 

[JMcBurn]

My 223 varmint shoots the 75 ELD in the .1-.3 moa range repeatably. My barrel is in the 2950-3000 fps range with 8208 at 2.445" OAL.

 

[JMcBurn]

Here is my Tikka T3X Varmint (.223) in an MDT LSS-XL Gen-2 chassis with MDT Skeleton stock, with MDT 20-MOA rail. (not shown: MDT polymer AICS-format mag) The 10-shot group is an early one (new barrel) with Defender 69-grain factory ammo (short COAL, fairly mild load) at 100 yards on a 3/4" dot.

The rifle is used as a trainer. I got a case lot of the Defender 69gr SMK ammo at a good price; this group is typical (I have reloaded bottleneck rounds in the past but prefer to use factory ammo now, if I can get 1/2-MOA accuracy, which I usually can). The rifle does not like 75-grain bullets of any flavor (reloads, factory) but a recent test of 77-grain rounds showed some promise - hope to expand on that in the next few days. It's important to note that the 1:8 twist is adequate for 75-77grain bullets; shooting buddies' rifles of different makes with 1:8 barrels produce bughole groups with the same rounds mine spreads out over an inch @ 100 yards.

Hope this helps in decision-making.

View attachment 7011269View attachment 7011270

The factory 75 ammo you are shooting is probably not going fast enough to be in a node. My gun likes the 75s in either the 2750-2800 or 2950-3000 ranges.

 

[DownhillFromHere]

The factory 75 ammo you are shooting is probably not going fast enough to be in a node. My gun likes the 75s in either the 2750-2800 or 2950-3000 ranges.

I wholeheartedly agree that I simply have not put the "right" 75-grain round in my rifle. I've tried reloads that group very well in my buddies' rifles - but their rifles are not MY rifle. The only 75-grain factory round I tried was the worst of all at 1.5 - 2.0" @ 100 yards.

As my barrel broke in, the 69-grain SMK rounds performed well enough for my purposes - but almost certainly not up to the rifle's absolute potential. I did get a 1.5" 5-shot group at 300 yards once, but that was above my skill level.

A buddy of mine exclusively uses Federal 77-grain 5.56 ammo (MK 262) in his .223 bolt gun with absolutely no adverse pressure signs. He gave me a handful of them; the one group I fired was a bit tighter than my usual 69gr SMK groups. I have acquired a few boxes of the ammo for a more thorough test. Given that Tikkas typically have long throats, I'm hoping to get better performance overall without high pressure signs that COULD occur with 5.56-spec ammo in a standard .223 chamber.

 

[Codiekfx400]

Your Tikka will handle 5.56 ammo because it is certified cip instead of saami.

 

[Macca]

Mate if I were you,i’d hold off until the .223 CTR comes out,drop in to a chassis & see how it shoots.
At a later date you can change barrels if you feel the need & you may not.
If you do cerakote,you may be better off with midnight blue rather than graphite black as the finish is very flat & marks easily like a chalk board.
I like to micro slick the bolt too.

 

[DownhillFromHere]

Your Tikka will handle 5.56 ammo because it is certified cip instead of saami.

Thanks for this. I never considered that imported rifles would not use SAAMI specs.

I poked around for ten minutes and couldn't find any actual CIP spec for .223/5.56... but, from a practical viewpoint, high-performance handloads carefully developed for a specific modern rifle are likely to at least push the SAAMI envelope anyway. I got flamed once for committing what several "experts" called an "unsafe" practice (despite these experts' utter lack of interest in understanding the entire scenario), so I err on the side of caution in what I write here.

 

[Baron85]

I have a tikka varmint that had the factory barrel rechambered in 223ai. Rifle is a laser! Keeps up with my customs. I have it in a Krg bravo chassis with the trigger spring kit and sterk bolt handle. I am also running mdt magazines. One of my favorite rifles!!! Groups pictures is fireforming my brass with 69 tmk 5 shot groups at 100 yards. There is no reason to replace the factory tikka barrel until you shoot it out.

 

[JMcBurn]

Thanks for this. I never considered that imported rifles would not use SAAMI specs.

I poked around for ten minutes and couldn't find any actual CIP spec for .223/5.56... but, from a practical viewpoint, high-performance handloads carefully developed for a specific modern rifle are likely to at least push the SAAMI envelope anyway. I got flamed once for committing what several "experts" called an "unsafe" practice (despite these experts' utter lack of interest in understanding the entire scenario), so I err on the side of caution in what I write here.

By the numbers you can get 3k from a 24” barrel without going over pressure with a 75-77 at the OAL that you can run in a aics pattern mag.

Also we are talking about a 223 in a full sized action. The high node for my gun is like 3150 but it destroys primer pockets without any other pressure signs. It needs like 25.5+gr of my lot of 8208. Your mileage may very so use at your own risk and work up to it.

That 3150 load is in the 80ksi range, but showed no real signs of pressure except the lapua pockets on those rounds were pretty loose one the next loading and were unusable by the next firing using my standard 2950-3000 load.

If I didn’t shoot tac class I’d consider shooting a steady diet of the 3150 stuff, but I have other calibers for open.

 

[marauderx33]

Great info, thanks everyone. Looks like the factory Tikka barrels can really shoot!

 

[DarinC]

I’m really impressed with the speed you guys are getting out of the heavys. Really considering switching to a bolt from my ar

 

[_Raining]

Here is mine. Used Tikka T3, Used KRG X Ray, Criterion 30" Barrel 1:7 Twist. I will never be as good as @GGK but I am working on getting a load up for the 80 grain Berger VLD's.

 

[JMcBurn]

I’m really impressed with the speed you guys are getting out of the heavys. Really considering switching to a bolt from my ar

3k with a 75 eld is something you can even get out of a 20" barrel.

 

[marauderx33]

Here is mine. Used Tikka T3, Used KRG X Ray, Criterion 30" Barrel 1:7 Twist. I will never be as good as @GGK but I am working on getting a load up for the 80 grain Berger VLD's.

Pic is not working for me?

 

[marauderx33]

So I called around and ETA on a new T3X Varmint Stainless 223 1:8 is about mid April. However, a local gunsmith has a suitable barrel blank (Bartlein, 0.224”, 1:7.5, heavy Palma, SS) and could do the work reasonably soon.

Based on this, I might go the used T3 + custom barrel route.

I’ve also decided to change the scope to the Vortex Razor HD Gen 2 4.5-27x56, EBR-2C MRAD.

Still need to decide on a few things....

Barrel length. Somewhere in 22” to 24” range. Would a 24” heavy Palma be too front heavy?

Chassis. On my shortlist is the KRG Bravo and the KRG Whiskey 3. I know the Whiskey is more expensive, heavier, more adjustments, and has an aluminium forend. Anyone want to sway me one way or the other?

 

[jpspeeddemon]

when

Mate if I were you,i’d hold off until the .223 CTR comes out,drop in to a chassis & see how it shoots.
At a later date you can change barrels if you feel the need & you may not.
If you do cerakote,you may be better off with midnight blue rather than graphite black as the finish is very flat & marks easily like a chalk board.
I like to micro slick the bolt too.

I read on another thread that Tikka had this in the works. I didn't see anything announced at shot show last week. Any info? I want one!!

 

[Stooxie]

My Tikka T3 Scout is 1/3 MOA all day with factory barrel.

-Stooxie

 

[bgoda3]

Is there a particular primer that works best? And I’m assuming Lapua brass is what everyone is running? I’m going to be developing a load as I just purchased a Tikka T3 .223 recently. Seems like a lot of great resources and knowledge in this thread! Appreciate everyone’s input.

 

[marauderx33]

Just had a thought.... If I'm going buy a used Tikka T3 one and get it rebarrelled in 223, it will have to have the correct size bolt face. Anyone know which calibres (beside 223) would be suitable? I'm thinking 222 and 204 should also work? Would any adjustments or gunsmithing be needed?

 

[Macca]

Anything with the small bolt face 204–223 & you’re good to go.
Based on average gunsmith time frames,I wouldn’t expect your rifle to be ready by mid April even if you dropped the parts off tomorrow.
Do your math on the CTR & chassis option vs custom & see how it tally’s up for you.
The heavy palma will be a bit heavier than your original varmint contour,but having said that I wouldn’t bother to chop two inches off to bring it down to 22”.
Your call bra,but from your stated intentions a light to medium palma would be more than adequate to which the CTR would provide & balanced just right to drop into a Bravo.

 

[JMcBurn]

Is there a particular primer that works best? And I’m assuming Lapua brass is what everyone is running? I’m going to be developing a load as I just purchased a Tikka T3 .223 recently. Seems like a lot of great resources and knowledge in this thread! Appreciate everyone’s input.

I have run both LC and Lapua. Only running LC now but might move to star line. It pains me to lose lapua brass and I only really shoot matches so I lose a piece or 2 every time I go out.

I run the cheapest primers I can get (S&B). I haven't seen any differences in SD or Average velocity from the 205M.

In general I would say make sure you are sizing the brass to just fit the chamber and close without tension. Just saying that because otherwise you can see false pressure from the ejector to even case head separations. How I do that is I pull the firing pin and the ejector and then continue to bump the shoulder back. When I was bumping the shoulder 0.003" I was seeing some weird stuff on brass and since switching methods it went away and case life improved significantly.

 

[marauderx33]

Anything with the small bolt face 204–223 & you’re good to go.
Based on average gunsmith time frames,I wouldn’t expect your rifle to be ready by mid April even if you dropped the parts off tomorrow.
Do your math on the CTR & chassis option vs custom & see how it tally’s up for you.
The heavy palma will be a bit heavier than your original varmint contour,but having said that I wouldn’t bother to chop two inches off to bring it down to 22”.
Your call bra,but from your stated intentions a light to medium palma would be more than adequate to which the CTR would provide & balanced just right to drop into a Bravo.

Thanks for the advice. I think I want a heavier/longer barrel than the T3X CTR 223, which is only available in 20". Also, with the recent increase in Tikka pricing, new T3X CTRs in 223 are expensive at ~AU$2095 , and I will be losing the CTR bottom metal and picatinny rail anyway, which largely negates the advantages of the CTR.

By my calcs, compared to buying a new CTR, it's only a little more expensive to buy a cheap used T3 and get it rebarreled, and then I can get it setup exactly the way I want.

 

[marauderx33]

I've made up my mind.... I've purchased a new Tikka T3 Lite Stainless in 204 Ruger from interstate for a reasonable price. It should arrive at my gunsmith by end of next week. Hopefully I can sell off the unfired factory barrel to recoup a bit of money.

For the record, I think if I had been able to get my hands on a new T3x Varmint Stainless in 223 with 24" barrel in 1:8 twist for a decent price, I might've just gone that way instead.

The gunsmith has quoted a lead time of few weeks to do the rebarrel, provided I go with a barrel he already has in stock, which I am - Bartlein, 0.224”, 1:7.5, heavy Palma, SS.

I'm very excited - thanks for all the help everyone!

I still need to decide on the barrel length, and the chassis (KRG Bravo or KRG Whiskey 3). The Whiskey 3 does not seem to be available anywhere though? If anyone knows an Australian vendor that sells them, or a US vendor that would ship to Australia, please let me know.

 

[SlimySquirrel]

Hey man, I have a superlight in the MDT - ESS Chassis. It's a really nice fitting chassis and allows for plenty of adjustment.

Should be a vendor in Aus (Cleaver?) that sells what ever you want and that barrel should run really well wit the heavier projectiles too.

 

[Simia Dei]

I've made up my mind.... I've purchased a new Tikka T3 Lite Stainless in 204 Ruger from interstate for a reasonable price. It should arrive at my gunsmith by end of next week. Hopefully I can sell off the unfired factory barrel to recoup a bit of money.

For the record, I think if I had been able to get my hands on a new T3x Varmint Stainless in 223 with 24" barrel in 1:8 twist for a decent price, I might've just gone that way instead.

The gunsmith has quoted a lead time of few weeks to do the rebarrel, provided I go with a barrel he already has in stock, which I am - Bartlein, 0.224”, 1:7.5, heavy Palma, SS.

I'm very excited - thanks for all the help everyone!

I still need to decide on the barrel length, and the chassis (KRG Bravo or KRG Whiskey 3). The Whiskey 3 does not seem to be available anywhere though? If anyone knows an Australian vendor that sells them, or a US vendor that would ship to Australia, please let me know.

Delta brings in most of KRG’s stuff I believe.

Which smith did you go with mate?

 

[SlimySquirrel]

Some options here
https://www.cleaverfirearms.com/Products.aspx?Category=Rifles&Brand=10

 

[ratton]

I have an old Tikka T3 tactical that I put into a KRG Xray chassis. It shoots awesome and I run AI mags. It's laser. The Xray chassis is 3.1lbs and the Bravo is 2.9lbs. The Whiskey is much more expensive and heavier 3.8lbs fixed stock, and 4.1lbs folder.