Tikka T3x or Ruger American action

[Minutemanqvs]

Hello all, I'm new here so I hope I'm in the right section for that question!

I'm currently looking at building a custom 6.5x47 Lapua precision rifle (we shoot mostly at 300m here in Switzerland) but I have a hard time deciding on what action to build it. I see 3 options from where I am:

1) Use an old 7.5x55 match rifle with a worn barrel (there are tons of them around) and put on a 6.5x47 Lapua barrel, the story ends there. It's cheap but ugly (around $1500)
2) Build a new rifle that looks more modern on a widely available action like a Tikka T3x or Ruger American (around $3000)
3) Build a new rifle on a custom action like a Defiance or a Remington 700 footprint (around $4000), for that there is all the export/import hassle involved but it's feasible

Looking at option 2) I wonder what action would be the best suited. I currently own a 222 Rem Tikka T3x Varmint on an MDT HS3 chassis and it's an absolute shooter, 0.5 MOA all day long with reloaded ammo (52gr SMK, Sako Brass, 22gr RS40 powder, 54.5mm COL), so I have a very positive experience with Tikka. On the other hand there are the cheap Ruger American rifles with a 3-lug bolt but I have absolutely no experience with them...

What do you think about that? Does a 2 vs 3 lug bolt make any difference after all? The barrell will be from Lothar Walther and I would build it on an MDT ACC chassis.

Thanks

 

[spife7980]

I love my Rugers but over there I would go tikka every day.

 

[Harveyn]

Tikka hands down. Much better action and more aftermarket support. If you've yet to purchase anything maybe consider a tikka ctr or varmint in 6.5 creedmoor to drop into your chassis.

I would favor the varmint for the heavier barrel if your intended purpose is target, however you might need to have the barrel threaded if you want a brake.

If 6.5x47 is a must have then find cheap donor action with .473 boltface and add barrel of your choice.

I would take 3 lug if i had a choice. I like the 60/70 degree bolt lift and there a negligible increase in cocking effort. The tikka is smooth already.

 

[Luke G]

The tikka will be a much better option. As the previous post mentioned it has was more aftermarket support and is a better built action all around.

I am assuming the tikka will also be much more available in Switzerland as well.

 

[bassmaster07]

Had Ruger American...sold it. bought a Tikka CTR. just start with the Tikka. Not even in the same field. Look at penned threads. there is a reason tikka is there.

 

[jcmullis2]

I can’t speak to the Ruger. Some love theirs and others don’t have anything good to say about them. I’m sure they’re like anything else and you get what you pay for. If money is tight go with the Tikka. If you have the money get a custom with a 700 footprint like Defiance. IMO they’re better quality than any factory action. I’m putting together a 300 yard rifle at present with a defiance and 6mm BR. They say they’re really accurate and .2moa isn’t uncommon. Lapua is one of the only factory ammo’s on the market for it so that’s a consideration for some.
Good luck with your new rifle.

 

[Minutemanqvs]

Thanks to all for your feedbacks!

So the Tikka really seems to be the way to go, a custom action would be nice but it's not really reasonable at that point

There is also another option for me as I'm mainly shooting with a Steyr SSG04 in 7.62x51, a superbly accurate rifle (with a heavy trigger but you get used to it and it makes no difference in precision). I could simply rebarrel it as the bolt/magazine is the same for 6.5x47. But I'm not really willing to alter this rifle as I would probably sell it if the "new" 6.5x47 works well. The whole goal of going from 7.62 to 6.5 is to reduce the recoil as we shoot 300m. When it's windy the .222 gets thrown around quite a bit but it should be OK with a 125-135gr 6.6 bullet.

 

[Minutemanqvs]

Tikka hands down. Much better action and more aftermarket support. If you've yet to purchase anything maybe consider a tikka ctr or varmint in 6.5 creedmoor to drop into your chassis.

I'm honestly hesitating between a 6.5 Creedmoor and the 6.5x47 Lapua. The thing is that some of my club mates are running PGM Ultima Ratios in 6.5x47 and it simply works. A PGM in this config is about $5000-5500 from the factory where they test the right bullets for you if you ask them to, it's a hell of a customer service. PGM is using Lothar Walther barrels too.

Nobody has a 6.5 Creedmoor at this time in my club, so I can't judge if it's better or worse. From what I read it's the same bullets anyway but with a larger case capacity which doesn't matter that much at 300m. Even if 6.5x47 is more confidential than 6.5 Creedmoor, it's well supported here in Switzerland as it was developed by Lapua and the Swiss company Grünig & Elmiger.

 

[Harveyn]

I would only go 6.5 creedmoor if you would be happy running the factory barrel. This would save you some cost. If you're going to go through the effort of getting a custom barrel then 6.5x47 is no extra effort.

There's the argument that 6.5x47 is more inherently accurate and easier to tune but individual experience may vary.

I've found that to be the case comparing my factory tikka 20" ctr in 6.5 creedmoor vs my AI AT with an aftermarket lothar walther 6.5x47 barrel. After load development with the creed i averaged .4 moa.

With the AI 6.5X47 i was already at .4 moa with a generic fireforming load. Both shooting lapua 123 scenar. Have yet do do load dev on the x47 barrel but it will only improve from there.

Having said this, the factory tikka ctr is no slouch. Question is weather you can shoot as well as the rifle.

Not a completely apples to apples comparison with factory vs custom barrel but it's quite similar situation to what your considering.

Generic fireforming 6.5x47 loads (2 group of 5) vs 5 round tikka ctr after load dev. Both shot at 100m

 

[Minutemanqvs]

As I said, I have a Tikka T3X in .222 with the factory barrel and it shoots absolutely nice, but they have a very long throat. You may say that this doensn't matter as long as it shoots well but it's a bit frustrating

So tha plan now is to buy a Tikka T3x Varmint in 6.5 Creedmoor and sell off the factory barrel to a friend who is already interested. I already ordered some custom barrels from Lothar walther in the past and it's not that expensive.

As for the 6.5x47 bullets, I'm looking at Lapua Scenar-L 123 or 136 grains.

 

[jcmullis2]

At the distance the OP is shooting the 6mm BR is the way I would go. The others are good but they really shine at longer distances than he’s shooting. The 6mm BR out shines the others at the distance he’s shooting. He’s getting a barrel already so he might as well get it chambered for the most inherently accurate round at the distance he’s shooting. Just saying

 

[McMillan]

^ this. For 300m rifle 6br would be far superior. Better barrel life more accurate less recoil

 

[Minutemanqvs]

That is indeed also an option. I'm looking at the 6.5mm (123-136 gr) instead of the 6mm (105 gr) mainly because it should be a bit more immune to crosswinds. That's what made me switch from the 222 (52 gr) to the 308 (168 gr) for matches in the first place.

What are the bullet types people shoot the most in 6mm Norma BR? Never mind, Never mind, https://www.6mmbr.com/6mmbr.html has all the info. I'll look at some ballistic charts between the 2 calibers.

 

[McMillan]

That is indeed also an option. I'm looking at the 6.5mm (123-136 gr) instead of the 6mm (105 gr) mainly because it should be a bit more immune to crosswinds. That's what made me switch from the 222 (52 gr) to the 308 (168 gr) for matches in the first place.

What are the bullet types people shoot the most in 6mm Norma BR? Never mind, Never mind, https://www.6mmbr.com/6mmbr.html has all the info. I'll look at some ballistic charts between the 2 calibers.

Punch in the difference in a ballistics calculator. You will never see a 6.5 creedmoor at a bench rest match because it's not competitive. Same reason the br based cartridge has taken over the top end of the prs world. More accurate less recoil and at mid ranges ballistics are close enough not to matter.

 

[GrumpyOleFart]

I'd go Tikka, over the Ruger.
I am biased, I have a Tikka Super Varmint 6.5 Creedmoor.

 

[viking78]

Tikka, no question about that.

 

[BruceLeroy]

This is THE thread where the Tikka fanboys are absolutely right. Ruger is cool for a cheap gun but no way it compares to a Tikka. This is also the only thread where Tikka has more support than all the other options.

 

[hwy1strat]

If you even have the thought of going with a custom action then that's what you should do. Down the road you will continue to want one until you get it. It will be cheaper in the long run to just penny up and get what you ultimately want.

But, if you were going to use a factory action, I'd go Tikka. They are awesome

 

[GrumpyOleFart]

If you even have the thought of going with a custom action then that's what you should do. Down the road you will continue to want one until you get it. It will be cheaper in the long run to just penny up and get what you ultimately want.

But, if you were going to use a factory action, I'd go Tikka. They are awesome

Without a doubt, the Tikka is a great option.
Would I put my Tikka action up against my Sako TRG, or my AI?
Nup.
Horses for courses, but my Tikka is the one rifle I use most.
And it's the one that infuriates the "glamour boys" with their custom builds.
Shoots very well for at least 1/4 of what their builds cost.

 

[Minutemanqvs]

Punch in the difference in a ballistics calculator. You will never see a 6.5 creedmoor at a bench rest match because it's not competitive. Same reason the br based cartridge has taken over the top end of the prs world. More accurate less recoil and at mid ranges ballistics are close enough not to matter.

After a day reading articles, talking on the phone with friends having booth 6BR and 6.5x47 and even shooting a 6.5x47 this morning (a simple TC Contender) I have to agree with the last posts, 6BR makes more sense. Reloading components are cheaper too.

And again I shot my Tikka 222 with reloads this morning: 10 shots in a 1.7 cm circle at 100m, so the new rifle will be built on a Tikka action. A custom action is simply too much money at the time.

Now for the barrel, if I look at the Lothar Walther configurator I'm probably going with a 26" 1/8 twist. Two contours seem to match my needs: "Heavy Match Target" or "Bench Rest Light Varmint" which have a muzzle brake option and seem to be pretty much similar except the slight difference in taper.

Now a question for you reloaders: the barrels are offered in "Standard" and "Minimal" chamber dimensions. Minimal corresponds to the CIP minimum specs (https://bobp.cip-bobp.org/uploads/tdcc/tab-i/tabical-en-page12.pdf) which means tight everything and potentiel problems. Two of my friends strongly suggest taking the standard chamber to avoid any issues with reloading dies that may not adhere to the CIP minimal spec...so I wonder if someone could tell me what neck dimension they have with Lapua brass and a 105 Scenar in them, and what FL reloading die is used? (I will probably ask this question in the reloading section, but maybe McMillan has already an answer

Thanks

 

[Crang]

Tikkas dont need to be trued when using for a custom build. Tells you as lot.

 

[McMillan]

I use a .273 neck. .105 free bore. Redding type s full length bushing die

 

[Minutemanqvs]

I use a .273 neck. .105 free bore. Redding type s full length bushing die

Which makes 6.93 mm, and the CIP chamber mini is 6.91 mm. So your reload typically wouldn’t fit. Yeah, I’m going with a standard chamber Thanks for the info!

 

[McMillan]

The only reason I run that big is because shooting prs we shoot in some terrible conditions and the chamber need to run with dirt in it. If I was shooting on golf course ranges I would be running a tighter chamber. From memory my loaded rounds measure .268 so I have 5 thou clearance. Most people like less