Tried Resizing 6.5 Creedmoor and Failed, Need Suggestions

[MNtadpole]

Hey All,

This is my first posting here, so there's that! Cutting to the chase, I just recently purchased a Daniel Defense DD5v5 chambered in 6.5 CM, and added what I thought tot be the appropriate equipment to go ahead and reload for this new to me caliber. Long story short, I just now tried to resize my 1.563" headspace (as measured with a Hornady headspace comparator) fire formed brass, but my dies were unable to adjust the headspace back. I was hoping to bump it back at least .003". I have successfully loaded many 5.56 for my AR-15, so I can't imagine making a huge fudging error to cause such a problem, but here I am.

Here's the following equipment that I was trying to resize my 6.5 CM brass with:
-Dillon 550C press
-Dillon 6.5CM caliber change set
-Lee Full-Length Sizing Die from their "Ultimate 4-Die 6.5 CM Kit" https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1011184659?pid=677881
-A batch of once fired mixed headstamped 6.5 CM brass.

Here's a picture of the specific die I was using:

Here's a picture where I stopped after bottoming out the die in my press with no luck. I even removed the lock rings:

Personally I feel like I must have made a mistake on the dies or something. This was my first time using a Lee brand dies. I only have experience with with .223 Dillon dies. Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

 

[JMGlasgow]

I personally like RCBS dies. Try a different brand and see if that works.

 

[TxWelder35]

I would try some better dies also

 

[MNtadpole]

I'll be honest, I was looking at some of the Redding dies, before I pulled the trigger on the Lee brand. I read that the Redding's were great with all the micrometer adjustments and such, but I figured that I wasn't quite there with my loading techniques yet. I'm still experimenting with a lot of the basic stuff. That's why I thought the Lee brand would fit the bill.

 

[mtnhunter22]

I’m not too familiar with lee dies but I use their decapping die and it looks just like this. Maybe you got just a decapping die?

 

[MNtadpole]

I would try some better dies also

Any recommendations ?

 

[MNtadpole]

I’m not too familiar with lee dies but I use their decapping die and it looks just like this. Maybe you got just a decapping die?

Here's what I'm working with:

 

[Deleted member 10043]

I use Lee dies. Which cartridge holder are you using? Also, how much of a turn on the die is the instructions calling for.

 

[MNtadpole]

I use Lee dies. Which cartridge holder are you using?

I'm using a Dillon 550C press, so I had to purchase a caliber conversion kit for 6.5 CM which includes a 4 station shell plate. IDK if that answers your question or not.

 

[isofahunter]

Lee dies call for touching the raised shell holder then 1/3 to a 1/2 more turn.

I put shell in place, raise ram, then screw die down till it stops, then lower ram and make a small turn in die, raise ram, repeat the die adjustment until you get the bump you want. Then lock in place.

 

[HemiPowrd]

Newb reloader here so take this for what it's worth. I went with the 6.5 CM Redding Type S Match Bushing full length die set. If you set the full length sizing die all the way down against the shell holder it puts the headspace at 1.560" as measured with the Hornady comparator. The bushings work very well to set the neck size where you want it.

 

[MNtadpole]

Lee dies call for touching the raised shell holder then 1/3 to a 1/2 more turn.

I put shell in place, raise ram, then screw die down till it stops, then lower ram and make a small turn in die, raise ram, repeat the die adjustment until you get the bump you want. Then lock in place.

I usually start with a 1/2 back-off. The headspace didn't move back much, until I bottomed out the die to the shell plate and ram.

 

[MNtadpole]

Newb reloader here so take this for what it's worth. I went with the 6.5 CM Redding Type S Match Bushing full length die set. If you set the full length sizing die all the way down against the shell holder it puts the headspace at 1.560" as measured with the Hornady comparator. The bushings work very well to set the neck size where you want it.

hmmm...I must be missing something here then. When I used my Hornady comparator against a mint box of Hornady 6.5CM Match @140gr their headspace was like 1.55 something inches. From my very limited, non-expert skill set, I should be able to return a piece of brass to a reasonable amount of headspace.

 

[918v]

So add a little turn in

 

[Boxerglocker]

Don't be afraid to give a little overcam on 550. If needed you can take a few thousands off the bottom of the die with a file or so as I have done with some dies and have a machinists buddy mill them.

 

[MNtadpole]

Don't be afraid to give a little overcam on 550. If needed you can take a few thousands off the bottom of the die with a file or so as I have done with some dies and have a machinists buddy mill them.

I'm pretty sure I over-cammed to the point where the die not only touched the shell plate, but I continued until I nearly ran out of threads above the Dillon toolhead.

 

[nealm66]

Looks like the die is screwed in so far it Barely leaves enough threads for a locking ring? Or am I just tired and seeing things. I’ve filed a die a little shorter before so it would go down far enough to bump the shoulder how I wanted but yours looks like it might not leave much for the locking ring.

 

[Boxerglocker]

I'm pretty sure I over-cammed to the point where the die not only touched the shell plate, but I continued until I nearly ran out of threads above the Dillon toolhead.

Well if that is the case then they are indeed too short. I use Redding dies both Type S and Standard to size 308 and 6.5 creedmoor on my Dillon 650.

 

[Boxerglocker]

How many threads are exposed on the bottom? You could place the lock ring on the underside of the tool head if needed.

 

[MNtadpole]

Well if that is the case then they are indeed too short. I use Redding dies both Type S and Standard to size 308 and 6.5 creedmoor on my Dillon 650.

So I'm reloading for an AR-10 which warrants a full-length resize, which Redding die set would you recommend I look at? If I go with a bushing set, I will need to purchase bushings in conjunction with the die set, correct?

 

[Snuby642]

So I'm going to get kicked around but here goes anyway I have thick skin.

I have the same problem in reverse of the op's.

Trying to use a dillon sizing die on a lee press.

The dillon dies are to be set against a flat tool head nor a raised shell holder won't let me set it right.

His die is ment to be used on a raised shell holder and won't go down far enough in the dillon.

That's my thoughts I gave up with the dillon die and lee setup.

Edit: this is with 223.
I'm processing brass off dillon and was going to use the dillon die without the expander and set a mandrell in the dillon for running range brass.

 

[MNtadpole]

How many threads are exposed on the bottom? You could place the lock ring on the underside of the tool head if needed.

Well I kept adjusting the die until the threads nearly disappeared into the toolhead. That is why I removed the lock rings, for experiment purposes...

 

[Boxerglocker]

So I'm reloading for an AR-10 which warrants a full-length resize, which Redding die set would you recommend I look at? If I go with a bushing set, I will need to purchase bushings in conjunction with the die set, correct?

If Redding for an AR-10. I would go with the standard 2 die set. You could float the sizer on an oring as I do for 308. I remove the expander and follow up with a Sinclair mandrel die with 21 century mandrel. In all honesty though the standard Hornady custom grade die set would work too and you can add a micrometer seating stem to the sleeve seating die for cheap. (I've actually used the Hornady as well)

 

[AKMarty]

Is the decapping pin and neck sizing button bottoming out in the case?

 

[Rocketmandb]

For most dies, your shell holder should be touching the bottom of the die (or close to it) or you won't get any bump. I've never used a Dillon, but it seems odd to me that you are able to screw the die in that much and have the shell holder not touch. If that is indeed what's happening, you can get a shell holder extender.

Hornady Universal Extended Shell Holder

This innovative tool allows for additional length to accommodate shorter cartridges. Precision machined from solid steel, then heat treated to perform...

www.midwayusa.com

 

[biffj]

Dillon presses don't use shell holders. They use a shell plate. The plate rotates around to each station. The press and setup should be adjustable to fit just about any dies but I've found with my RL1000 that I have to put the lock ring on the bottom with a number of different dies. The top plate is too thick. I've not used a 550 but I do use the 650 and I've not had any issues with it. I don't generally use lee dies for stuff I care about so I don't know if you're situation is odd or normal.

Frank

 

[HemiPowrd]

hmmm...I must be missing something here then. When I used my Hornady comparator against a mint box of Hornady 6.5CM Match @140gr their headspace was like 1.55 something inches. From my very limited, non-expert skill set, I should be able to return a piece of brass to a reasonable amount of headspace.

Fired brass is at 1.566 so my desired set back is to around 1.560 - 1.561 for an AR-10.

 

[flyright]

A friend of mine went down this road when he bought a new 550 press and wanted to continue using his Lee dies. They are too short to use in the 550 or 650. I suppose one could put the lock ring on the underside of the shell plate but I'd just get a different set of dies. I've had some of my sizing dies shortened .002-.003 to avoid excessive cam over on my XL650. Although, Dillon says excessive cam won't hurt the press, it is not very smooth in my opinion. I know those that run their Dillons with a ton of cam over to achieve proper bump but I never liked it and the fix was easy.

 

[MNtadpole]

Fired brass is at 1.566 so my desired set back is to around 1.560 - 1.561 for an AR-10.

That's about where mine was at. I was aiming to do a 1.559-1.560 bump. LOL stupid Lee die.

 

[MNtadpole]

A friend of mine went down this road when he bought a new 550 press and wanted to continue using his Lee dies. They are too short to use in the 550 or 650. I suppose one could put the lock ring on the underside of the shell plate but I'd just get a different set of dies. I've had some of my sizing dies shortened .002-.003 to avoid excessive cam over on my XL650. Although, Dillon says excessive cam won't hurt the press, it is not very smooth in my opinion. I know those that run their Dillons with a ton of cam over to achieve proper bump but I never liked it and the fix was easy.

That's really interesting that you pointed that out. I think Boxerglocker had suggested that same idea of putting the locking ring under the toolhead. Since the Lee die purchase was brand-new, I went ahead and processed the return. I think I'm going to figuratively bite the bullet and go with the Redding National Match (NM-C) Die Set. https://www.natchezss.com/redding-national-match-nm-c-die-set-6-5mm-creedmoor.html. I realized that Dillon sells Redding Dies for the calibers that they don't currently manufacture themselves. I would assume that Redding would therefore be the best bet for Dillon press compatibility. Thank you everyone for your input! I'm liking this forum community already!

 

[HemiPowrd]

That's really interesting that you pointed that out. I think Boxerglocker had suggested that same idea of putting the locking ring under the toolhead. Since the Lee die purchase was brand-new, I went ahead and processed the return. I think I'm going to figuratively bite the bullet and go with the Redding National Match (NM-C) Die Set. https://www.natchezss.com/redding-national-match-nm-c-die-set-6-5mm-creedmoor.html. I realized that Dillon sells Redding Dies for the calibers that they don't currently manufacture themselves. I would assume that Redding would therefore be the best bet for Dillon press compatibility. Thank you everyone for your input! I'm liking this forum community already!

Be careful ordering from Natchez. They seem to have a long lead time on shipping (or at least did). I also had an issue where something I ordered was in stock, but since they also do wholesale any wholesale order takes precedence and your "in stock" order can go out of stock depending on who is also buying the same item. Additionally if an item is back ordered a wholesale order will still take precedence and could make your order take even longer. Buyer beware!

 

[K31Scout]

Forster will make you a die that works for your brass if you send them a few samples of fired cases. I had the problem you are having with Lee and Hornady 8mm Mauser full length dies.

 

[MNtadpole]

Be careful ordering from Natchez. They seem to have a long lead time on shipping (or at least did). I also had an issue where something I ordered was in stock, but since they also do wholesale any wholesale order takes precedence and your "in stock" order can go out of stock depending on who is also buying the same item. Additionally if an item is back ordered a wholesale order will still take precedence and could make your order take even longer. Buyer beware!

When did this happen to you? I have ordered a crap ton of firearm stuff since roughly the beginning of the COVID-19 pandemic. I have ordered from MidwayUSA, Natchez, OpticsPlanet, and Brownells. OpticsPlanet was by far the worse purchasing experience I had with all those retailers. Granted, my business with OpticsPlanet was during the large initial shutdowns of COVID-19. I placed an order with OpticsPlanet, all of which were in-stock, but it took about 2.5 weeks for them to locate the items in their warehouses and ship them out. LOL they're based out of my state and it still took forever. I made the personal decision to take my business elsewhere after that experience.

 

[HemiPowrd]

When did this happen to you? I have ordered a crap ton of firearm stuff since roughly the beginning of the COVID-19 pandemic. I have ordered from MidwayUSA, Natchez, OpticsPlanet, and Brownells. OpticsPlanet was by far the worse purchasing experience I had with all those retailers. Granted, my business with OpticsPlanet was during the large initial shutdowns of COVID-19. I placed an order with OpticsPlanet, all of which were in-stock, but it took about 2.5 weeks for them to locate the items in their warehouses and ship them out. LOL they're based out of my state and it still took forever. I made the personal decision to take my business elsewhere after that experience.

I ordered an RCBS Ultrasonic cleaner from them back in May. Item was in stock when I ordered it. After it didn't ship I called Natchez and they said a wholesale order came in and they were out of stock. They said I could place a back order and I asked if I was guaranteed to get it when it came in and was told no that if another wholesale order came in it would still take precedence. Most other places set aside your ordered items even if they can't ship them right away.

I ended up ordering from Midway USA and had no issues.

 

[MNtadpole]

I ordered an RCBS Ultrasonic cleaner from them back in May. Item was in stock when I ordered it. After it didn't ship I called Natchez and they said a wholesale order came in and they were out of stock. They said I could place a back order and I asked if I was guaranteed to get it when it came in and was told no that if another wholesale order came in it would still take precedence. Most other places set aside your ordered items even if they can't ship them right away.

I ended up ordering from Midway USA and had no issues.

Wow, I guess it sucks to be us little guys ordering from them when that happens. I would have done the same thing you did!

 

[HemiPowrd]

Wow, I guess it sucks to be us little guys ordering from them when that happens. I would have done the same thing you did!

Yep, lesson learned! They won't be getting any of my future business.

 

[918v]

This might sound a little crazy, but knowing that AR10 bumps the shoulder when chambering a round from the mag, why not make a couple dummy rounds using what you got, and cycle them through the rifle.
My AR bumps the shoulder .004” from the mag and .006” if I just let the bolt slam shut on a chambered case.

Try it.

 

[MNtadpole]

This might sound a little crazy, but knowing that AR10 bumps the shoulder when chambering a round from the mag, why not make a couple dummy rounds using what you got, and cycle them through the rifle.
My AR bumps the shoulder .004” from the mag and .006” if I just let the bolt slam shut on a chambered case.

Try it.

That sounds like an excellent idea 918v! Thank you for that idea, I didn't even think of that. I know that my rifle's recoil string is quite stout, so I could believe that there might be some of that occurring. If you don't mind me asking, what does you're AR10's brass fire form to and what are you full-length resizing to?

 

[918v]

I’ll tell you when I get home. I can’t remember off the top of my head.

I have a Mega Maten with a Noveske match barrel and an Armalite bolt. I was bumping my shoulders .004” from their fired length for what I thought would be needed to have reliable functioning. A few months ago I got into a debate with some folks which resulted in a chambering test which revealed that the damm bolt bumps the shoulder. Another guy with a Knights Armament rifle did not see any shoulder bumping going on, though. So you should test it for yourself.

 

[6mmRemM600]

Flyright stated what I was thinking with a friends experience to draw upon. This is almost certainly a die incompatibility issue. Looking at Dillion's website, I'd invest in a set of Redding dies or RCBS dies.

 

[918v]

1.636” fire formed, sized down to 1.632” (this is in 308) in my sizing die, then bumped down to 1.628” during chambering. So I was unknowingly shooting ammo with .008” clearance.

 

[secm]

Hey All,

This is my first posting here, so there's that! Cutting to the chase, I just recently purchased a Daniel Defense DD5v5 chambered in 6.5 CM, and added what I thought tot be the appropriate equipment to go ahead and reload for this new to me caliber. Long story short, I just now tried to resize my 1.563" headspace (as measured with a Hornady headspace comparator) fire formed brass, but my dies were unable to adjust the headspace back. I was hoping to bump it back at least .003". I have successfully loaded many 5.56 for my AR-15, so I can't imagine making a huge fudging error to cause such a problem, but here I am.

Here's the following equipment that I was trying to resize my 6.5 CM brass with:
-Dillon 550C press
-Dillon 6.5CM caliber change set
-Lee Full-Length Sizing Die from their "Ultimate 4-Die 6.5 CM Kit" https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1011184659?pid=677881
-A batch of once fired mixed headstamped 6.5 CM brass.

Here's a picture of the specific die I was using:
View attachment 7363654


Here's a picture where I stopped after bottoming out the die in my press with no luck. I even removed the lock rings:
View attachment 7363658

Personally I feel like I must have made a mistake on the dies or something. This was my first time using a Lee brand dies. I only have experience with with .223 Dillon dies. Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

Go with Forster full length, great product.

 

[rottenruger]

Hey All,

This is my first posting here, so there's that! Cutting to the chase, I just recently purchased a Daniel Defense DD5v5 chambered in 6.5 CM, and added what I thought tot be the appropriate equipment to go ahead and reload for this new to me caliber. Long story short, I just now tried to resize my 1.563" headspace (as measured with a Hornady headspace comparator) fire formed brass, but my dies were unable to adjust the headspace back. I was hoping to bump it back at least .003". I have successfully loaded many 5.56 for my AR-15, so I can't imagine making a huge fudging error to cause such a problem, but here I am.

Here's the following equipment that I was trying to resize my 6.5 CM brass with:
-Dillon 550C press
-Dillon 6.5CM caliber change set
-Lee Full-Length Sizing Die from their "Ultimate 4-Die 6.5 CM Kit" https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1011184659?pid=677881
-A batch of once fired mixed headstamped 6.5 CM brass.

Here's a picture of the specific die I was using:
View attachment 7363654


Here's a picture where I stopped after bottoming out the die in my press with no luck. I even removed the lock rings:
View attachment 7363658

Personally I feel like I must have made a mistake on the dies or something. This was my first time using a Lee brand dies. I only have experience with with .223 Dillon dies. Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!

I made some "Steampunk" 6.5 rounds, still don't know how, but they pressed down with two accordion folds around the neck........looked great and different........but would take a 338 lapua if that to chamber into, they're so deformed. I really should put a picture up, will have to learn how. These cases are impressive! And NO, I'm not trying to put them into ANY rifle.

 

[MNtadpole]

I’ll tell you when I get home. I can’t remember off the top of my head.

I have a Mega Maten with a Noveske match barrel and an Armalite bolt. I was bumping my shoulders .004” from their fired length for what I thought would be needed to have reliable functioning. A few months ago I got into a debate with some folks which resulted in a chambering test which revealed that the damm bolt bumps the shoulder. Another guy with a Knights Armament rifle did not see any shoulder bumping going on, though. So you should test it for yourself.

Well you have officially sparked my curiosity. With that being said, I will test it out and see what the results are with the DD5v5 rifle. I'll get back to you with the results. This will of course happen once I order and receive a new die set.

 

[MNtadpole]

Flyright stated what I was thinking with a friends experience to draw upon. This is almost certainly a die incompatibility issue. Looking at Dillion's website, I'd invest in a set of Redding dies or RCBS dies.

I'm with you on this one.

 

[rottenruger]

I consider rifle shooting to be a science/sport, and rifle cartridge reloading to be a multi-faceted science.

That given, and also given that YOU ALL see the VAST variety of factors and idiosynchrasies that affect reloading and shooting.......

It makes me BARF to see how the Left is ALWAYS quoting the accuracy of science. What unmitigated bullsht drivel.

That's all, folks.

 

[Deleted member 10043]

A friend of mine went down this road when he bought a new 550 press and wanted to continue using his Lee dies. They are too short to use in the 550 or 650. I suppose one could put the lock ring on the underside of the shell plate but I'd just get a different set of dies. I've had some of my sizing dies shortened .002-.003 to avoid excessive cam over on my XL650. Although, Dillon says excessive cam won't hurt the press, it is not very smooth in my opinion. I know those that run their Dillons with a ton of cam over to achieve proper bump but I never liked it and the fix was easy.

Well, there you have it.

 

[Caterpillardoc]

I use a Dillon 550 to load 6.5 Creedmoor AR10 also 6 and 6.5 Creedmoor bolt guns. Dies thread deeper in a Dillion 550 head than in my RCBS Rockchucker, which leaves less thread above for the lock nut. I was originally using a standard RCBS two die set and switched to Redding bushing dies. Both have worked without issues in the 550.

 

[bru]

I have several Lee die sets for pistol caliber and find the same problem - the dies are made short and I guess they fit most things fine but not a Dillon 650 or Super 1050 with thick die plates. You have to put the lock nuts on the bottom of the sizing die for sure. I also hate their lock nuts with the o-ring as there is too much play and they COME LOOSE ! So I always buy the split type lock nuts that screw together and clamp down onto the threads. This way you can remove the die for whatever reason and not have to reset it. Make sure you have a wrench that will fit the nut flats and access cuz sometimes space is limited.

In the future if you have a problem using a product - Call The Manufacturer. They know their products and are all happy to help you.

 

[MNtadpole]

Thanks everyone for the awesome input. You all are a valuable resource for sure! I'm still waiting on my Redding National Match 6.5CM dies to ship from Natchez....ugh. Apparently, they are four days behind on shipping all ordered products.