TT Diamond sneaky pull-weight increase..?

[CK1.0]

This is not a basher thread, love the TT Diamond... everyone should enjoy the YOLO only a top-shelf trigger can provide (be poor somewhere else).

That said... TT Diamond single-stage, ~3800rds on it. When I installed it I set it at ~8-9 ounces (via cheapo-style Wheeler trigger-pull gauge), and haven't touched it since. But, while going over my rig trying to find excuses as to why I suck at shooting more than usual lately, I discovered the pull had increased to ~15-16 ounces.

Que da fuk?

No worries, a few clicks lefty loosey, and all is right in the world again, but has anyone else heard of this..? Should I pull the sucker and blow it out? More than that? Will I eventually run out of clicks? What say you sniper Illuminati?

 

[Huskydriver]

16 oz causes you to miss?

Very common for trigger set screws to back out if not secured with something over time like a dab of clear nail polish

 

[CK1.0]

Yes.

And I'm not sure I've ever heard of having to do that with a TT, I guess it's possible, but I don't think TT mentions them needing that in their instructions that I didn't read.

 

[Huskydriver]

I don't think any mfg calls that out in their instructions but alot of people who compete do this.....

Super low strength thread locker of your choice works with a needle or liquid wax or nail polish. Put a drop on the end and insert it on the thread wall on top of the set screws

 

[CK1.0]

It makes total sense, I think I may try that. TT says to keep the set screw "at least three clicks" tight, there's nothing in there about using thread locker... but it jives. The Diamonds go so low that I've still got plenty of clicks of engagement, so it's not that, and I figured the "click" is what kept it from walking, but I guess it can use a little help.

I'd just rather not chance to get gunk into nice trigger clockwork if it's not necessary.

More than anything I'm just curious if other guys have seen this before (while being lazy and hoping to avoid having to pull the BA to blow it out correctly, have to re-zero, etc).

 

[whatsupdoc]

• Your triggers pull weight should not change suddenly. A sudden change in pull weight is a sign that something is not right, and your firearm may not be safe. Stop using your trigger and contact TriggerTech Support ([email protected]) 1-888-795-1485.
• Your triggers pull weight may change slightly over the triggers lifetime as the parts wear in. Any change should be gradual and not in excess of 6oz or 15% (whichever is less). A change in excess of this is a sign that something is not right, and your firearm may not be safe. Stop using your trigger and contact TriggerTech Support ([email protected]) .

Damaged Trigger Policy

We have gone to great lengths to design the most reliable and dependable triggers on the market and we are constantly striving to improve the safety and performance of all TriggerTech products. However, TriggerTech Triggers are precision mechanical devices and they can be damaged. Here are some...

triggertech.com

 

[srt-4_uk]

16 oz causes you to miss?

Very common for trigger set screws to back out if not secured with something over time like a dab of clear nail polish

In this case the trigger getting heavier means the set screws are tightening with enough force to overcome a click detent backed by a spring.

 

[Huskydriver]

In this case the trigger getting heavier means the set screws are tightening with enough force to overcome a click detent backed by a spring.

Either way you don't want the set screw moving am I right? Reset it to where it needs to be and lock it down

 

[spife7980]

I’ve always assumed it’s just parts mating better, it was only rough high points and now they’ve worn in a smidge and it’s contacting more surface area and thus dragging more.
I’ve never put a guage on mine but I feel have noticed something similar. They feel heavier later. Probably are.

 

[neeltburn]

I have had a timney get heavier during a match to the point that the bolt lift also got heavier. have you noticed a change in your bolt lift? If so I would give TT a call and let the check out the trigger. (Timney sent me a new trigger) That said I do use clear nail polish on my set screws for a low strength loctite. Other wise I would reset and test it.

 

[CK1.0]

I have had a timney get heavier during a match to the point that the bolt lift also got heavier. have you noticed a change in your bolt lift? If so I would give TT a call and let the check out the trigger. (Timney sent me a new trigger) That said I do use clear nail polish on my set screws for a low strength loctite. Other wise I would reset and test it.

Now that you mention it... I said "dang this shit is smooth" to myself the first few times I cocked it and dry-fired after resetting it to where I had it. This is with an Origin (with the same ~3800rds on it) which has always had a bolt-lift as nice or nicer than anything else, but yep, it got a bit lighter/better after the adjustment for sure, I noticed it.

I'm going to give them a call Monday and get their thoughts...

 

[neeltburn]

Now that you mention it... I said "dang this shit is smooth" to myself the first few times I cocked it and dry-fired after resetting it to where I had it. This is with an Origin (with the same ~3800rds on it) which has always had a bolt-lift as nice or nicer than anything else, but yep, it got a bit lighter/better after the adjustment for sure, I noticed it.

I'm going to give them a call Monday and get their thoughts...

Yeah, I would give them a call.

 

[CK1.0]

FWIW, to update the thread, I talked to Triggertech and they said the trigger getting heavier is more than likely just due to debris having worked its way into the closed trigger housing. They told me to pull it and blow it out with brake cleaner and compressed air (which I did).

I put the rig back together and hit the range today, and voila, I can shoot groups again (printed a ~.3" 5 shot at 100, all rounds touching)!

Thing is, I think I'm going to give them another call... since, I didn't have to make any more adjustments after giving it my attention, and I figured the trigger would have gotten lighter if I had truly blown any problem-causing debris out?

Chronologically, I had set it at 8-9oz initially, then when I realized it was heavier and up over a pound, I loosened/lightened it 3-4 clicks to get it back down to 8-9ozs again... but after blowing it out I would've figured it'd drop down a bit (say maybe ~6oz range or so) and then would need me to add 3-4 clicks to bring it back to 8-9oz... but that's not what happened, so I wonder if they'll have an explanation?

...and oh yeah, that brake cleaner easily took the "void if removed" sticker off the front of the trigger housing, hopefully that wasn't some dirty trick to void my warranty so they don't have to help me out anymore lol!

 

[RobertB]

I wpu

FWIW, to update the thread, I talked to Triggertech and they said the trigger getting heavier is more than likely just due to debris having worked its way into the closed trigger housing. They told me to pull it and blow it out with brake cleaner and compressed air (which I did).

I put the rig back together and hit the range today, and voila, I can shoot groups again (printed a ~.3" 5 shot at 100, all rounds touching)!

Thing is, I think I'm going to give them another call... since, I didn't have to make any more adjustments after giving it my attention, and I figured the trigger would have gotten lighter if I had truly blown any problem-causing debris out?

Chronologically, I had set it at 8-9oz initially, then when I realized it was heavier and up over a pound, I loosened/lightened it 3-4 clicks to get it back down to 8-9ozs again... but after blowing it out I would've figured it'd drop down a bit (say maybe ~6oz range or so) and then would need me to add 3-4 clicks to bring it back to 8-9oz... but that's not what happened, so I wonder if they'll have an explanation?

...and oh yeah, that brake cleaner easily took the "void if removed" sticker off the front of the trigger housing, hopefully that wasn't some dirty trick to void my warranty so they don't have to help me out anymore lol

I wouldn’t think so. The crew at TT are second to none! Great people with an amazing product!

 

[neeltburn]

FWIW, to update the thread, I talked to Triggertech and they said the trigger getting heavier is more than likely just due to debris having worked its way into the closed trigger housing. They told me to pull it and blow it out with brake cleaner and compressed air (which I did).

I put the rig back together and hit the range today, and voila, I can shoot groups again (printed a ~.3" 5 shot at 100, all rounds touching)!

Thing is, I think I'm going to give them another call... since, I didn't have to make any more adjustments after giving it my attention, and I figured the trigger would have gotten lighter if I had truly blown any problem-causing debris out?

Chronologically, I had set it at 8-9oz initially, then when I realized it was heavier and up over a pound, I loosened/lightened it 3-4 clicks to get it back down to 8-9ozs again... but after blowing it out I would've figured it'd drop down a bit (say maybe ~6oz range or so) and then would need me to add 3-4 clicks to bring it back to 8-9oz... but that's not what happened, so I wonder if they'll have an explanation?

...and oh yeah, that brake cleaner easily took the "void if removed" sticker off the front of the trigger housing, hopefully that wasn't some dirty trick to void my warranty so they don't have to help me out anymore lol!

Great news. FWIW I use Zippo brand lighter fluid to clean my triggers and also blow them out with compressed air. That said if TT said to use break clean I would guess they know since its their product. Hopefully your back to where it needs to be. Bolt lift staying the same now?

 

[CK1.0]

I wpu


I wouldn’t think so. The crew at TT are second to none! Great people with an amazing product!

That was just sarcasm lol... the dude I spoke to was super cool.

 

[whatsupdoc]

Anyone open the case and clean it?

 

[CK1.0]

Great news. FWIW I use Zippo brand lighter fluid to clean my triggers and also blow them out with compressed air. That said if TT said to use break clean I would guess they know since its their product. Hopefully your back to where it needs to be. Bolt lift staying the same now?

Lol the dude at TT said Zippo lighter fluid or brake cleaner. The bolt lift is awesome, light as can be, and it seems like it's fixed.

I just want to see what TT says? I figure there's a chance it may drop in pull-weight at some point if there is still some debris trapped in there that finally clears... and then it'll probably need me to add a few clicks, but I'd rather that not happen in the middle of a match or something so I figure it's worth giving them a shout...

Man, it was really fun to shoot an 8-9oz trigger again! (Strangely, shooting the heavier trigger for a while might have been good practice that I wouldn't have done otherwise.)

 

[CK1.0]

Anyone open the case and clean it?

That's a no-no, no bueno. The dude I spoke with at TT specifically said don't do that.

 

[CK1.0]

Sadly, reporting back to share that my trigger doesn't seem to be 100% fixed.

I've put ~200rds downrange since I turned the trigger's adjustment screw counter-clockwise 4-5 clicks to bring the weight down from ~1lb back to ~8-9ozs (where I like it), and then after speaking with TT CS and on their advice, blew out the trigger really good with brake cleaner.

While the trigger mostly performs as normal, yielding the correct as-set ~8-9oz pull on average most of the time, I still seem to be getting intermittent pulls that are heavier than normal/average now and again... which is starting to become frustrating. I've been having instances while practicing where out of nowhere I've had ugly/nasty feeling trigger-breaks occur on some shots... and it kind of fucks up the whole vibe mentally/concentration-wise and throws me off, leaving me wondering and questioning after bad shots whether it was the trigger acting up or just on me..?

I plan to call TT CS again in the next few days and see what they say... but as it stands, I've already started losing confidence in this particular trigger unit and think something isn't right with it. I'm also getting tired of having to pull the BA and then burn rounds re-zeroing after putting the rig back together, so I'm hoping they'll just send me a new unit so I can swap it out and send my current one back to the mothership for an autopsy... we'll see.

 

[neeltburn]

Sadly, reporting back to share that my trigger doesn't seem to be 100% fixed.

I've put ~200rds downrange since I turned the trigger's adjustment screw counter-clockwise 4-5 clicks to bring the weight down from ~1lb back to ~8-9ozs (where I like it), and then after speaking with TT CS and on their advice, blew out the trigger really good with brake cleaner.

While the trigger mostly performs as normal, yielding the correct as-set ~8-9oz pull on average most of the time, I still seem to be getting intermittent pulls that are heavier than normal/average now and again... which is starting to become frustrating. I've been having instances while practicing where out of nowhere I've had ugly/nasty feeling trigger-breaks occur on some shots... and it kind of fucks up the whole vibe mentally/concentration-wise and throws me off, leaving me wondering and questioning after bad shots whether it was the trigger acting up or just on me..?

I plan to call TT CS again in the next few days and see what they say... but as it stands, I've already started losing confidence in this particular trigger unit and think something isn't right with it. I'm also getting tired of having to pull the BA and then burn rounds re-zeroing after putting the rig back together, so I'm hoping they'll just send me a new unit so I can swap it out and send my current one back to the mothership for an autopsy... we'll see.

Sounds like the trigger needs to go back to TT for T&E. At best it isn't staying consistent for you, at worst it could fail completely. You did mention that your action has a lot of rounds on it. Have you ever replaced the firing pin spring on it? Or have you ever disassembled the bolt and cleaned it?

 

[CK1.0]

Sounds like the trigger needs to go back to TT for T&E. At best it isn't staying consistent for you, at worst it could fail completely. You did mention that your action has a lot of rounds on it. Have you ever replaced the firing pin spring on it? Or have you ever disassembled the bolt and cleaned it?

IDK, but I'd guess there's some sort of debris that's floating around inside the enclosed trigger cartridge? That seems like the simpilist conclusion and I think maybe all it it needs is to be taken apart, cleaned, and then put back together.

That said, I once ruined a pretty cool OG Seiko Monster opening the case when I shouldn't have lol... so if that's what it needs, it's going to have to go back to TT.

I've never changed the firing pin spring on my bolt/action, but I do take it apart and clean it every ~2-3 barrel cleanings (I don't let it get too dirty). I haven't had any issues with light strikes or anything like that so that wasn't really something I was looking at, but I'll keep that in mind. The spring has ~4000rds on it now, and probably the same or more in dry-fire/cycles on it... which honestly, IDK, yeah, might be time for a new one, but IDK?

 

[iceng]

Loose debris inside the trigger. I'd bet on that as I've seen it before.

It had really fine moon-dust particles in it, this your trigger weight went up. You sprayed it and blew it out, which dislodged most of it, and got it out, however it's still most likely got a few bits of unwanted crud in it.

Try cleaning it again, and also get onto TT about it.

Clean your bolt. Disassemble it, and the cocking piece / bolt shroud area. Spring will require attention at 5k, so strip and full deep clean. Should be good to go. Keep TT in the loop.

 

[CK1.0]

Ok, to update the thread:

TT CS are awesome, no issues whatsoever with them providing me a new trigger, good on them all around.

...and @Zermatt Arms are awesome too, Ray shipped me a fresh firing pin spring the same day he answered my email asking if it might be time for a new one (his answer: probably not a bad idea).

BTW/FWIW as an aside, the Origin SA never ceases to impress, I could/can afford any action out there and I'm glad I chose the Origin every time I use it, and not just "for the money". It shouldn't have been a surprise that changing the firing pin spring was a breeze and didn't require any special tools (beyond a block with a hole in it).

Honestly, I don't think the firing pin spring had anything to do with my trigger turning wonky and yielding inconsistent pulls... and I hadn't had any light strike issues at all. That said, I figured since I was putting in a brand new trigger anyway and would be re-zeroing, "freshening up" the whole fire control wasn't a bad idea. I was leaning towards saying "fuck it" and leaving the old spring in, but, what the hell...

I'd heard of guys saying that a worn-out firing pin spring could be the cause of random flyers and such and that serious F-class/Benchrest dudes would change them out regularly. But honestly, a lot of those same dudes believe and put stock in a whole list of things that I now know is BS lol... so I thought that the action would act the same, fresh spring or not.

Doh!

Yep, you can see by the length of the old spring (top) vs the new/fresh spring (bottom) that the older one had taken a set (which usually means it's lost some power). After changing it out I felt the difference right away just dry-firing... the new spring is much louder and snaps home with more authority (I can feel it through the cheek weld). Thanks to @iceng for mentioning the FPS, not sure what it'll fix, but now it's fixed.

So, will the fresh spring make a difference? IDK, I'll see I guess... but thanks to TT CS and Zermatt CS I now have to go back to not being able to blame the gun.

 

[iceng]

Glad it worked out for you. It's just the small things which make a difference. Pins, springs, grease, Loctite, and good ol' customer service.

 

[neeltburn]

Glad you got it sorted out. I don't think it was a bad idea to swap the firing pin spring. I just did the same on a Sav 10 that has a boat load of rounds on it. I noticed better and more. consistent trigger pull as well.