I just heard a little while ago that someone was shut down cause they didn't have a type 7 and was truing up factory actions. Anyone else heard anything on this? They are saying to modify a action that its required.
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Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lumpy grits</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Details maybe would help........
Respectfully,
LG </div></div>
Yes details, An 01 should be sufficient.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: lumpy grits</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Details maybe would help........
Respectfully,
LG </div></div>
Yes details, An 01 should be sufficient.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
Whats going on is a law that is in the ATF rule books thats saying if a smith purchases a action with intent to modify it, that is manufacturing. Maybe if a customer is bringing it in to get changed it might be ok but from what i hear its becoming tougher as well.
Whats going on is a law that is in the ATF rule books thats saying if a smith purchases a action with intent to modify it, that is manufacturing. Maybe if a customer is bringing it in to get changed it might be ok but from what i hear its becoming tougher as well.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Whats going on is a law that is in the ATF rule books thats saying if a smith purchases a action with intent to modify it, that is manufacturing. Maybe if a customer is bringing it in to get changed it might be ok but from what i <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="color: #FF0000">hear</span></span> its becoming tougher as well. </div></div>
Stick with what you read.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Whats going on is a law that is in the ATF rule books thats saying if a smith purchases a action with intent to modify it, that is manufacturing. Maybe if a customer is bringing it in to get changed it might be ok but from what i <span style="font-weight: bold"><span style="color: #FF0000">hear</span></span> its becoming tougher as well. </div></div>
Stick with what you read.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
My understanding of the law (as explained by the inspecting agent), from when my dad kept an 07, was that he needed the 07 instead of the 01 because he was buying actions and rifles for the exact purpose of stripping them down, truing them and then rebuilding in different calibers. This is considered "re-manufacturing" and hence "manufacturing" so the ATF told him that he needed the 07, so he had to change his application.
Last I remember the 07 was actually half the price of an 01 too.
My understanding of the law (as explained by the inspecting agent), from when my dad kept an 07, was that he needed the 07 instead of the 01 because he was buying actions and rifles for the exact purpose of stripping them down, truing them and then rebuilding in different calibers. This is considered "re-manufacturing" and hence "manufacturing" so the ATF told him that he needed the 07, so he had to change his application.
Last I remember the 07 was actually half the price of an 01 too.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
I dont know what the cost of a 07 in other states is but here its a little shy of 2k a year....
I dont know what the cost of a 07 in other states is but here its a little shy of 2k a year....
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dont know what the cost of a 07 in other states is but here its a little shy of 2k a year.... </div></div>
$150 per 3 years plus ITAR.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dont know what the cost of a 07 in other states is but here its a little shy of 2k a year.... </div></div>
$150 per 3 years plus ITAR.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dont know what the cost of a 07 in other states is but here its a little shy of 2k a year.... </div></div>
$150 per 3 years plus ITAR.
</div></div>
We are getting sooooooooooo ripped off!!!
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dont know what the cost of a 07 in other states is but here its a little shy of 2k a year.... </div></div>
$150 per 3 years plus ITAR.
</div></div>
We are getting sooooooooooo ripped off!!!
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dont know what the cost of a 07 in other states is but here its a little shy of 2k a year.... </div></div>
$150 per 3 years plus ITAR.
</div></div>
We are getting sooooooooooo ripped off!!! </div></div>
Or you're confused again.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dont know what the cost of a 07 in other states is but here its a little shy of 2k a year.... </div></div>
$150 per 3 years plus ITAR.
</div></div>
We are getting sooooooooooo ripped off!!! </div></div>
Or you're confused again.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dont know what the cost of a 07 in other states is but here its a little shy of 2k a year.... </div></div>
i didn't know the state had anything to do with the FEDERAL firearms manufacture license fee.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dont know what the cost of a 07 in other states is but here its a little shy of 2k a year.... </div></div>
i didn't know the state had anything to do with the FEDERAL firearms manufacture license fee.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
haha ya I figured you were being sarcastic but you know some people believe everything that is read on the net.
haha ya I figured you were being sarcastic but you know some people believe everything that is read on the net.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
Yea im not confused at all. The license part is going up to 2250 per year. The license is 150 just for the manufactoring part, But now if you want to be able to ship them you need the Dept of state Defense license which is over 2k now. They are starting to really enforce it now.
Yea im not confused at all. The license part is going up to 2250 per year. The license is 150 just for the manufactoring part, But now if you want to be able to ship them you need the Dept of state Defense license which is over 2k now. They are starting to really enforce it now.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yea im not confused at all. The license part is going up to 2250 per year. The license is 150 just for the manufactoring part, But now if you want to be able to ship them you need the Dept of state Defense license which is over 2k now. They are starting to really enforce it now. </div></div>
Jackson should lock you in a closet with a mop.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yea im not confused at all. The license part is going up to 2250 per year. The license is 150 just for the manufactoring part, But now if you want to be able to ship them you need the Dept of state Defense license which is over 2k now. They are starting to really enforce it now. </div></div>
Jackson should lock you in a closet with a mop.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
I find it interesting to hear about what is required in different countries.
here in Germany you have to have a Waffenherstellungslizens ( weapns manufacturing permit) to do any modifications or repairs, so anything more than fitting a new butt pad or mounting a scope requires a manufacturers license.
This you can only get if you have the nessecary qualifications. i.e. you are trained to the level of Meister (Master) as a gunsmith/riflesmith. If you only have a time served apprenticeship and not the meister title you cannot run your own business or get your own manufacturing license. You can however work for some one who has one.
if you are trained to the level of meister in another engineering disciplin, it is possible to take further exams to re trade and gain the nessecary.
Depending onwhich level you train too its possible to get a manufacturing license for your own use, you are then only able to do your own gunsmithing.
We also have a Waffenhandelslizens, which is a dealers permit, you may buy and sell.
Some one who has a master riflesmiths qualification automaticaly recieves the dealers license when he /she applies for the manufacturers license.
My manufacturing license cost me 1300 € but thats a one time fee. (they just tax the hell out of us there after)
In some other EU countries, GB for instance, you can get a dealers license and there after you can deal or manufacture irrelevant of qualifications.
So much for a unified europe eh.
wonder how it is in other countries ?
Pete
I find it interesting to hear about what is required in different countries.
here in Germany you have to have a Waffenherstellungslizens ( weapns manufacturing permit) to do any modifications or repairs, so anything more than fitting a new butt pad or mounting a scope requires a manufacturers license.
This you can only get if you have the nessecary qualifications. i.e. you are trained to the level of Meister (Master) as a gunsmith/riflesmith. If you only have a time served apprenticeship and not the meister title you cannot run your own business or get your own manufacturing license. You can however work for some one who has one.
if you are trained to the level of meister in another engineering disciplin, it is possible to take further exams to re trade and gain the nessecary.
Depending onwhich level you train too its possible to get a manufacturing license for your own use, you are then only able to do your own gunsmithing.
We also have a Waffenhandelslizens, which is a dealers permit, you may buy and sell.
Some one who has a master riflesmiths qualification automaticaly recieves the dealers license when he /she applies for the manufacturers license.
My manufacturing license cost me 1300 € but thats a one time fee. (they just tax the hell out of us there after)
In some other EU countries, GB for instance, you can get a dealers license and there after you can deal or manufacture irrelevant of qualifications.
So much for a unified europe eh.
wonder how it is in other countries ?
Pete
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yea im not confused at all. The license part is going up to 2250 per year. The license is 150 just for the manufactoring part, But now if you want to be able to ship them you need the Dept of state Defense license which is over 2k now. They are starting to really enforce it now. </div></div>
i heard that the itar registration fee is required whether or not you are shipping out of the country. i heard it on al gore's internet so it may or may not be 100% true. that is a state department deal and has absolutely nothing to do with the atf.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yea im not confused at all. The license part is going up to 2250 per year. The license is 150 just for the manufactoring part, But now if you want to be able to ship them you need the Dept of state Defense license which is over 2k now. They are starting to really enforce it now. </div></div>
i heard that the itar registration fee is required whether or not you are shipping out of the country. i heard it on al gore's internet so it may or may not be 100% true. that is a state department deal and has absolutely nothing to do with the atf.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 300sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yea im not confused at all. The license part is going up to 2250 per year. The license is 150 just for the manufactoring part, But now if you want to be able to ship them you need the Dept of state Defense license which is over 2k now. They are starting to really enforce it now. </div></div>
i heard that the itar registration fee is required whether or not you are shipping out of the country. i heard it on al gore's internet so it may or may not be 100% true. that is a state department deal and has absolutely nothing to do with the atf. </div></div>
ITAR is due whether you make scopes, slings, or rifles. As you mentioned its independent of FFL fees.
An FFL still costs $150/3 years, 01 or 07. I assume Lawton isn't a 09, 10, 11 FFL or else Bobby would be telling us about his $3000 FFL.
His original post is about the policy change requiring dealers and smiths to have an 07 when making changes to a firearms prior to the sale. The policy change is two years old at least.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 300sniper</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Yea im not confused at all. The license part is going up to 2250 per year. The license is 150 just for the manufactoring part, But now if you want to be able to ship them you need the Dept of state Defense license which is over 2k now. They are starting to really enforce it now. </div></div>
i heard that the itar registration fee is required whether or not you are shipping out of the country. i heard it on al gore's internet so it may or may not be 100% true. that is a state department deal and has absolutely nothing to do with the atf. </div></div>
ITAR is due whether you make scopes, slings, or rifles. As you mentioned its independent of FFL fees.
An FFL still costs $150/3 years, 01 or 07. I assume Lawton isn't a 09, 10, 11 FFL or else Bobby would be telling us about his $3000 FFL.
His original post is about the policy change requiring dealers and smiths to have an 07 when making changes to a firearms prior to the sale. The policy change is two years old at least.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone.
Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he <span style="font-weight: bold">did</span> over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone. </div></div>
Depends on what he's doing with them. The 50 mark is usually in relation to Excise Tax. Which is also completely independent of FFL and ITAR.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he <span style="font-weight: bold">did</span> over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone. </div></div>
Depends on what he's doing with them. The 50 mark is usually in relation to Excise Tax. Which is also completely independent of FFL and ITAR.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone.</div></div>
If he is building rifles to resell he needs an 07 regardless of how many he makes.
DD
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone.</div></div>
If he is building rifles to resell he needs an 07 regardless of how many he makes.
DD
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone. </div></div>
You need a Type 07 FFL if you manufacture as a business. If you manufacture more than 50 firearms per year then you need to pay FAET (Firearms and Ammunition Excise Tax) on the guns.
Last year ATF issued new rules on what constitutes "manufacturing" of firearms. Number 14 (refinishing) was repealed earlier this year; the rest remain in effect.
Below are examples of operations performed on firearms and guidance as to whether or not such operations would be considered manufacturing under the Gun Control Act (GCA).
Generally, a person should obtain a license as a manufacturer of firearms if the person: 1) is performing operations that create firearms or alter firearms (in the case of alterations, the work is not being performed at the request of customers, rather the person who is altering the firearms is purchasing them, making the changes, and then reselling them); 2) is performing the operations as a regular course of business or trade; and 3) is performing the operations for the purpose of sale or distribution of the firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">1. A company produces a quantity of firearm frames or receivers for sale to customers who will assemble firearms.</span>
The company is engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">2. A company produces frames or receivers for another company that assembles and sells the firearms.</span>
Both companies are engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms, and each should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">3. A company provides frames to a subcontractor company that performs machining operations on the frames and returns the frames to the original company that assembles and sells the completed firearms.</span>
Both companies are engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as manufacturers of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">4. A company produces barrels for firearms and sells the barrels to another company that assembles and sells complete firearms.</span>
Because barrels are not firearms, the company that manufactures the barrels is not a manufacturer of firearms. The company that assembles and sells the firearms should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">5. A company receives firearm frames from individual customers, attaches stocks and barrels, and returns the firearms to the customers for the customers' personal use.</span>
The operations performed on the firearms were not for the purpose of sale or distribution. The company should be licensed as a dealer or gunsmith, not as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">6. A company acquires one receiver, assembles one firearm, and sells the firearm.</span>
The company is not manufacturing firearms as a regular course of trade or business and is not engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms. This company does not need to be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">7. An individual acquires frames or receivers and assembles firearms for his or her personal use, not for sale or distribution.</span>
The individual is not manufacturing firearms for sale or distribution and is not required to be a licensed manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">8. A gunsmith regularly buys military-type firearms, Mausers, etc., and “sporterizes” them for resale.</span>
The gunsmith is in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">9. A gunsmith buys semiautomatic pistols and modifies the slides to accept a new style of sights. The sights are not usually sold with these firearms and do not attach to the existing mounting openings. The gunsmith offers these firearms for sale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">10. A gunsmith buys government model pistols and installs “drop-in” precision trigger parts or other “drop-in parts” for the purpose of resale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, as the gunsmith is purchasing the firearms, modifying the firearms, and selling them. The gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">11. A gunsmith buys surplus military rifles, bends the bolts to accept a scope, and then drills the receivers for a scope base. The gunsmith offers these firearms for sale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">12. A gunsmith buys surplus military rifles or pistols and removes the stocks, adds new stocks or pistol grips, cleans the firearms, then sends the firearms to a separate contractor for bluing. These firearms are then sold to the public.</span>
This would be considered manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">13. A company purchases surplus firearms, cleans the firearms, then offers them for sale to the public.</span>
The company does not need to be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">14. A company produces firearms or firearm receivers and sends the firearm/receivers out for colorizing (bluing, camouflaging, phosphating, or plating) and/or heat treating. Do the companies performing the colorization and/or heat treating need to be licensed as manufacturers, and are the companies required to place their markings on the firearm?</span>
ATF has determined that both colorization and heat treating of firearms are manufacturing processes. The companies performing the processes are required to be licensed as manufacturers. If the companies providing colorization and/or heat treating have not received variances to adopt the original manufacturer’s markings, they would be required to place their own markings on any firearm on which they perform the manufacturing process of colorization and/or heat treating.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone. </div></div>
You need a Type 07 FFL if you manufacture as a business. If you manufacture more than 50 firearms per year then you need to pay FAET (Firearms and Ammunition Excise Tax) on the guns.
Last year ATF issued new rules on what constitutes "manufacturing" of firearms. Number 14 (refinishing) was repealed earlier this year; the rest remain in effect.
Below are examples of operations performed on firearms and guidance as to whether or not such operations would be considered manufacturing under the Gun Control Act (GCA).
Generally, a person should obtain a license as a manufacturer of firearms if the person: 1) is performing operations that create firearms or alter firearms (in the case of alterations, the work is not being performed at the request of customers, rather the person who is altering the firearms is purchasing them, making the changes, and then reselling them); 2) is performing the operations as a regular course of business or trade; and 3) is performing the operations for the purpose of sale or distribution of the firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">1. A company produces a quantity of firearm frames or receivers for sale to customers who will assemble firearms.</span>
The company is engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">2. A company produces frames or receivers for another company that assembles and sells the firearms.</span>
Both companies are engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms, and each should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">3. A company provides frames to a subcontractor company that performs machining operations on the frames and returns the frames to the original company that assembles and sells the completed firearms.</span>
Both companies are engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as manufacturers of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">4. A company produces barrels for firearms and sells the barrels to another company that assembles and sells complete firearms.</span>
Because barrels are not firearms, the company that manufactures the barrels is not a manufacturer of firearms. The company that assembles and sells the firearms should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">5. A company receives firearm frames from individual customers, attaches stocks and barrels, and returns the firearms to the customers for the customers' personal use.</span>
The operations performed on the firearms were not for the purpose of sale or distribution. The company should be licensed as a dealer or gunsmith, not as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">6. A company acquires one receiver, assembles one firearm, and sells the firearm.</span>
The company is not manufacturing firearms as a regular course of trade or business and is not engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms. This company does not need to be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">7. An individual acquires frames or receivers and assembles firearms for his or her personal use, not for sale or distribution.</span>
The individual is not manufacturing firearms for sale or distribution and is not required to be a licensed manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">8. A gunsmith regularly buys military-type firearms, Mausers, etc., and “sporterizes” them for resale.</span>
The gunsmith is in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">9. A gunsmith buys semiautomatic pistols and modifies the slides to accept a new style of sights. The sights are not usually sold with these firearms and do not attach to the existing mounting openings. The gunsmith offers these firearms for sale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">10. A gunsmith buys government model pistols and installs “drop-in” precision trigger parts or other “drop-in parts” for the purpose of resale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, as the gunsmith is purchasing the firearms, modifying the firearms, and selling them. The gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">11. A gunsmith buys surplus military rifles, bends the bolts to accept a scope, and then drills the receivers for a scope base. The gunsmith offers these firearms for sale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">12. A gunsmith buys surplus military rifles or pistols and removes the stocks, adds new stocks or pistol grips, cleans the firearms, then sends the firearms to a separate contractor for bluing. These firearms are then sold to the public.</span>
This would be considered manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">13. A company purchases surplus firearms, cleans the firearms, then offers them for sale to the public.</span>
The company does not need to be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">14. A company produces firearms or firearm receivers and sends the firearm/receivers out for colorizing (bluing, camouflaging, phosphating, or plating) and/or heat treating. Do the companies performing the colorization and/or heat treating need to be licensed as manufacturers, and are the companies required to place their markings on the firearm?</span>
ATF has determined that both colorization and heat treating of firearms are manufacturing processes. The companies performing the processes are required to be licensed as manufacturers. If the companies providing colorization and/or heat treating have not received variances to adopt the original manufacturer’s markings, they would be required to place their own markings on any firearm on which they perform the manufacturing process of colorization and/or heat treating.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone.</div></div>
If he is building rifles to resell he needs an 07 regardless of how many he makes.
DD </div></div>
Yes correct. If you are making guns for yourself you can make as many as you want. But they can never be sold or givin away, only willed by death.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone.</div></div>
If he is building rifles to resell he needs an 07 regardless of how many he makes.
DD </div></div>
Yes correct. If you are making guns for yourself you can make as many as you want. But they can never be sold or givin away, only willed by death.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bcr229</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone. </div></div>
You need a Type 07 FFL if you manufacture as a business. If you manufacture more than 50 firearms per year then you need to pay FAET (Firearms and Ammunition Excise Tax) on the guns.
Last year ATF issued new rules on what constitutes "manufacturing" of firearms. Number 14 (refinishing) was repealed earlier this year; the rest remain in effect.
Below are examples of operations performed on firearms and guidance as to whether or not such operations would be considered manufacturing under the Gun Control Act (GCA).
Generally, a person should obtain a license as a manufacturer of firearms if the person: 1) is performing operations that create firearms or alter firearms (in the case of alterations, the work is not being performed at the request of customers, rather the person who is altering the firearms is purchasing them, making the changes, and then reselling them); 2) is performing the operations as a regular course of business or trade; and 3) is performing the operations for the purpose of sale or distribution of the firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">1. A company produces a quantity of firearm frames or receivers for sale to customers who will assemble firearms.</span>
The company is engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">2. A company produces frames or receivers for another company that assembles and sells the firearms.</span>
Both companies are engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms, and each should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">3. A company provides frames to a subcontractor company that performs machining operations on the frames and returns the frames to the original company that assembles and sells the completed firearms.</span>
Both companies are engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as manufacturers of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">4. A company produces barrels for firearms and sells the barrels to another company that assembles and sells complete firearms.</span>
Because barrels are not firearms, the company that manufactures the barrels is not a manufacturer of firearms. The company that assembles and sells the firearms should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">5. A company receives firearm frames from individual customers, attaches stocks and barrels, and returns the firearms to the customers for the customers' personal use.</span>
The operations performed on the firearms were not for the purpose of sale or distribution. The company should be licensed as a dealer or gunsmith, not as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">6. A company acquires one receiver, assembles one firearm, and sells the firearm.</span>
The company is not manufacturing firearms as a regular course of trade or business and is not engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms. This company does not need to be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">7. An individual acquires frames or receivers and assembles firearms for his or her personal use, not for sale or distribution.</span>
The individual is not manufacturing firearms for sale or distribution and is not required to be a licensed manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">8. A gunsmith regularly buys military-type firearms, Mausers, etc., and “sporterizes” them for resale.</span>
The gunsmith is in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">9. A gunsmith buys semiautomatic pistols and modifies the slides to accept a new style of sights. The sights are not usually sold with these firearms and do not attach to the existing mounting openings. The gunsmith offers these firearms for sale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">10. A gunsmith buys government model pistols and installs “drop-in” precision trigger parts or other “drop-in parts” for the purpose of resale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, as the gunsmith is purchasing the firearms, modifying the firearms, and selling them. The gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">11. A gunsmith buys surplus military rifles, bends the bolts to accept a scope, and then drills the receivers for a scope base. The gunsmith offers these firearms for sale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">12. A gunsmith buys surplus military rifles or pistols and removes the stocks, adds new stocks or pistol grips, cleans the firearms, then sends the firearms to a separate contractor for bluing. These firearms are then sold to the public.</span>
This would be considered manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">13. A company purchases surplus firearms, cleans the firearms, then offers them for sale to the public.</span>
The company does not need to be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">14. A company produces firearms or firearm receivers and sends the firearm/receivers out for colorizing (bluing, camouflaging, phosphating, or plating) and/or heat treating. Do the companies performing the colorization and/or heat treating need to be licensed as manufacturers, and are the companies required to place their markings on the firearm?</span>
ATF has determined that both colorization and heat treating of firearms are manufacturing processes. The companies performing the processes are required to be licensed as manufacturers. If the companies providing colorization and/or heat treating have not received variances to adopt the original manufacturer’s markings, they would be required to place their own markings on any firearm on which they perform the manufacturing process of colorization and/or heat treating.
</div></div>
Now that clears a few things up.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bcr229</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone. </div></div>
You need a Type 07 FFL if you manufacture as a business. If you manufacture more than 50 firearms per year then you need to pay FAET (Firearms and Ammunition Excise Tax) on the guns.
Last year ATF issued new rules on what constitutes "manufacturing" of firearms. Number 14 (refinishing) was repealed earlier this year; the rest remain in effect.
Below are examples of operations performed on firearms and guidance as to whether or not such operations would be considered manufacturing under the Gun Control Act (GCA).
Generally, a person should obtain a license as a manufacturer of firearms if the person: 1) is performing operations that create firearms or alter firearms (in the case of alterations, the work is not being performed at the request of customers, rather the person who is altering the firearms is purchasing them, making the changes, and then reselling them); 2) is performing the operations as a regular course of business or trade; and 3) is performing the operations for the purpose of sale or distribution of the firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">1. A company produces a quantity of firearm frames or receivers for sale to customers who will assemble firearms.</span>
The company is engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">2. A company produces frames or receivers for another company that assembles and sells the firearms.</span>
Both companies are engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms, and each should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">3. A company provides frames to a subcontractor company that performs machining operations on the frames and returns the frames to the original company that assembles and sells the completed firearms.</span>
Both companies are engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as manufacturers of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">4. A company produces barrels for firearms and sells the barrels to another company that assembles and sells complete firearms.</span>
Because barrels are not firearms, the company that manufactures the barrels is not a manufacturer of firearms. The company that assembles and sells the firearms should be licensed as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">5. A company receives firearm frames from individual customers, attaches stocks and barrels, and returns the firearms to the customers for the customers' personal use.</span>
The operations performed on the firearms were not for the purpose of sale or distribution. The company should be licensed as a dealer or gunsmith, not as a manufacturer of firearms.
<span style="font-weight: bold">6. A company acquires one receiver, assembles one firearm, and sells the firearm.</span>
The company is not manufacturing firearms as a regular course of trade or business and is not engaged in the business of manufacturing firearms. This company does not need to be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">7. An individual acquires frames or receivers and assembles firearms for his or her personal use, not for sale or distribution.</span>
The individual is not manufacturing firearms for sale or distribution and is not required to be a licensed manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">8. A gunsmith regularly buys military-type firearms, Mausers, etc., and “sporterizes” them for resale.</span>
The gunsmith is in the business of manufacturing firearms and should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">9. A gunsmith buys semiautomatic pistols and modifies the slides to accept a new style of sights. The sights are not usually sold with these firearms and do not attach to the existing mounting openings. The gunsmith offers these firearms for sale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">10. A gunsmith buys government model pistols and installs “drop-in” precision trigger parts or other “drop-in parts” for the purpose of resale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, as the gunsmith is purchasing the firearms, modifying the firearms, and selling them. The gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">11. A gunsmith buys surplus military rifles, bends the bolts to accept a scope, and then drills the receivers for a scope base. The gunsmith offers these firearms for sale.</span>
This would be considered the manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">12. A gunsmith buys surplus military rifles or pistols and removes the stocks, adds new stocks or pistol grips, cleans the firearms, then sends the firearms to a separate contractor for bluing. These firearms are then sold to the public.</span>
This would be considered manufacturing of firearms, and the gunsmith should be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">13. A company purchases surplus firearms, cleans the firearms, then offers them for sale to the public.</span>
The company does not need to be licensed as a manufacturer.
<span style="font-weight: bold">14. A company produces firearms or firearm receivers and sends the firearm/receivers out for colorizing (bluing, camouflaging, phosphating, or plating) and/or heat treating. Do the companies performing the colorization and/or heat treating need to be licensed as manufacturers, and are the companies required to place their markings on the firearm?</span>
ATF has determined that both colorization and heat treating of firearms are manufacturing processes. The companies performing the processes are required to be licensed as manufacturers. If the companies providing colorization and/or heat treating have not received variances to adopt the original manufacturer’s markings, they would be required to place their own markings on any firearm on which they perform the manufacturing process of colorization and/or heat treating.
</div></div>
Now that clears a few things up.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone.</div></div>
If he is building rifles to resell he needs an 07 regardless of how many he makes.
DD </div></div>
Yes correct. If you are making guns for yourself you can make as many as you want. But they can never be sold or givin away, only willed by death.
</div></div>
Please take your most back ordered barrel and hit yourself in the head.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone.</div></div>
If he is building rifles to resell he needs an 07 regardless of how many he makes.
DD </div></div>
Yes correct. If you are making guns for yourself you can make as many as you want. But they can never be sold or givin away, only willed by death.
</div></div>
Please take your most back ordered barrel and hit yourself in the head.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
Been looking at and reading this thread. The 50 gun deal is this, if you manufacture 50 or more firearms in a year, the excise tax is due on all of those manufactured from #1 on. If you manufacture 49 firearms or less in a year, no excise tax is due. If your assembling customers parts ie; barrels, receivers, stocks etc, you're not manufacturing. If you, the gunsmith, provide the receiver, barrel, stock etc; your manufacturing a firearm.
Been looking at and reading this thread. The 50 gun deal is this, if you manufacture 50 or more firearms in a year, the excise tax is due on all of those manufactured from #1 on. If you manufacture 49 firearms or less in a year, no excise tax is due. If your assembling customers parts ie; barrels, receivers, stocks etc, you're not manufacturing. If you, the gunsmith, provide the receiver, barrel, stock etc; your manufacturing a firearm.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
With a 7 license are you still required to pay the ITAR fees?
With a 7 license are you still required to pay the ITAR fees?
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone.</div></div>
If he is building rifles to resell he needs an 07 regardless of how many he makes.
DD </div></div>
Yes correct. If you are making guns for yourself you can make as many as you want. But they can never be sold or givin away, only willed by death.
</div></div>
Please take your most back ordered barrel and hit yourself in the head.
</div></div>
Your clarity is without bounds......
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DebosDave</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: montana</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Talking about this with a friend a few weeks ago. He said it seemed that if he did over 50 or so rifles a year he needed the 07?????
That sound familiar to anyone.</div></div>
If he is building rifles to resell he needs an 07 regardless of how many he makes.
DD </div></div>
Yes correct. If you are making guns for yourself you can make as many as you want. But they can never be sold or givin away, only willed by death.
</div></div>
Please take your most back ordered barrel and hit yourself in the head.
</div></div>
Your clarity is without bounds......
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 7mmAM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">With a 7 license are you still required to pay the ITAR fees? </div></div>
Yes we are.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 7mmAM</div><div class="ubbcode-body">With a 7 license are you still required to pay the ITAR fees? </div></div>
Yes we are.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
Just some friendly advise....
Nothing is a "gray" area with the ATF. Its either black or white. Get it in writing or pretend you never spoke to them because im willing to bet they will forget they spoke to you.
If you have a 07 license you are manufacturer whether you do it or not.
Just some friendly advise....
Nothing is a "gray" area with the ATF. Its either black or white. Get it in writing or pretend you never spoke to them because im willing to bet they will forget they spoke to you.
If you have a 07 license you are manufacturer whether you do it or not.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Your clarity is without bounds...... </div></div>
Reread my first post in this thread, it would help decrease the size of the hole you're standing in.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Your clarity is without bounds...... </div></div>
Reread my first post in this thread, it would help decrease the size of the hole you're standing in.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Your clarity is without bounds...... </div></div>
Reread my first post in this thread, it would help decrease the size of the hole you're standing in.
</div></div>
Understood 858. Its good of you to point out that some things are not correct.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 858</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NotAGuru</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Your clarity is without bounds...... </div></div>
Reread my first post in this thread, it would help decrease the size of the hole you're standing in.
</div></div>
Understood 858. Its good of you to point out that some things are not correct.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 19Scout77</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
NotAGuru said:
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">858...who peed in your Wheaties? </div></div>
No one. I hold Bobby to a higher standard than the average internet user who typically posts this nonsense. I think its fair that since he holds the Lawton name and is representing Lawton Machine here on the Hide to actually understand what he is posting. Normally he posts very insightful and knowledgeable info...this thread is the polar opposite.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: jasonk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">858...who peed in your Wheaties? </div></div>
No one. I hold Bobby to a higher standard than the average internet user who typically posts this nonsense. I think its fair that since he holds the Lawton name and is representing Lawton Machine here on the Hide to actually understand what he is posting. Normally he posts very insightful and knowledgeable info...this thread is the polar opposite.
Re: Type 7 license to modify actions?
Well 858. I started this thread because i was looking for some insight. Not that this effected me directly in any way just something i wanted to discuss with other people on here. Sorry for my stupid post i will refrain myself from now on.....
Well 858. I started this thread because i was looking for some insight. Not that this effected me directly in any way just something i wanted to discuss with other people on here. Sorry for my stupid post i will refrain myself from now on.....
