Does anyone know about using a LLC for form 1's or transfers? I am getting ready to send in a form 1 but I'm having second thoughts and thinking about using my LLC. Any comments?
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Suppressors Using a LLC for a SBR
- Thread starter Helidriver
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Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
I have 2 SBRs and 4 suppressors through my LLC. Kind of regret doing it because I will have to go through the whole mess again if I decide to dissolve the LLC. It's not a big deal to keep the LLC but in hindsight I should have just done them as an individual.
I have 2 SBRs and 4 suppressors through my LLC. Kind of regret doing it because I will have to go through the whole mess again if I decide to dissolve the LLC. It's not a big deal to keep the LLC but in hindsight I should have just done them as an individual.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 427Cobra</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you can get the signatures always go that route, if not I would go the Trust route. </div></div>
Curious why you think that?
the trust would seem to have more flexibility as to who can use them. as opposed to you having to be there if it is personal.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 427Cobra</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you can get the signatures always go that route, if not I would go the Trust route. </div></div>
Curious why you think that?
the trust would seem to have more flexibility as to who can use them. as opposed to you having to be there if it is personal.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chiller</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 427Cobra</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you can get the signatures always go that route, if not I would go the Trust route. </div></div>
Curious why you think that?
the trust would seem to have more flexibility as to who can use them. as opposed to you having to be there if it is personal. </div></div>
Another inquiring mind wants to know.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Chiller</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 427Cobra</div><div class="ubbcode-body">If you can get the signatures always go that route, if not I would go the Trust route. </div></div>
Curious why you think that?
the trust would seem to have more flexibility as to who can use them. as opposed to you having to be there if it is personal. </div></div>
Another inquiring mind wants to know.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
I was considering a SBR I too would like to know from people who have done a trust or LLC which one is the easier route.
I was considering a SBR I too would like to know from people who have done a trust or LLC which one is the easier route.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
The trust is simple. You just need understand the legal aspects of owning a NFA item. Get quicken trust and be sure that every one of the people you name are able to own a NFA item it should be ok. Have an attorney look it over before you submit it.
The trust is simple. You just need understand the legal aspects of owning a NFA item. Get quicken trust and be sure that every one of the people you name are able to own a NFA item it should be ok. Have an attorney look it over before you submit it.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
Setting up a trust is much easier. I can get my CLEO to sign, but with the trust I have less to do. I used Quicken Willmaker and haven't had a problem.
Setting up a trust is much easier. I can get my CLEO to sign, but with the trust I have less to do. I used Quicken Willmaker and haven't had a problem.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 300zero</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Setting up a trust is much easier. I can get my CLEO to sign, but with the trust I have less to do. I used Quicken Willmaker and haven't had a problem. </div></div>
same here. its an easier way to go.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 300zero</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Setting up a trust is much easier. I can get my CLEO to sign, but with the trust I have less to do. I used Quicken Willmaker and haven't had a problem. </div></div>
same here. its an easier way to go.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
I'm purchasing a receiver set for a sbr build in the near future. When I fill out the 4473 I obviously don't have the tax stamp for a sbr yet, so would I list the barrel length as 16" even though I plan on installing a 10.5"? After getting the receivers transferred to me in this manner, I then have to fill out a form 4 for the tax stamp..am I taking an extra step here? Plan on going the trust route..
I'm purchasing a receiver set for a sbr build in the near future. When I fill out the 4473 I obviously don't have the tax stamp for a sbr yet, so would I list the barrel length as 16" even though I plan on installing a 10.5"? After getting the receivers transferred to me in this manner, I then have to fill out a form 4 for the tax stamp..am I taking an extra step here? Plan on going the trust route..
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
It's easier for .gov to bequest a item from a corp or trust. More so with laws enacted against organized crime (and how we got here in the first place). The item is a secondary asset to the entity itself. Not specifically to any individual.
One advantage is transferrel when you die, assuming status quo.
I agree with 427Cobra.
It's easier for .gov to bequest a item from a corp or trust. More so with laws enacted against organized crime (and how we got here in the first place). The item is a secondary asset to the entity itself. Not specifically to any individual.
One advantage is transferrel when you die, assuming status quo.
I agree with 427Cobra.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Powder Burns</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm purchasing a receiver set for a sbr build in the near future. When I fill out the 4473 I obviously don't have the tax stamp for a sbr yet, so would I list the barrel length as 16" even though I plan on installing a 10.5"? After getting the receivers transferred to me in this manner, I then have to fill out a form 4 for the tax stamp..am I taking an extra step here? Plan on going the trust route.. </div></div>
The 4473 is to transfer the receiver to you so you don't need to put any barrel lenght on that form. There is no place for that anyway. You fill out a Form 1 not a Form 4. You put on the Form 1 the barrel lenght that you intended to put on your receiver.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Powder Burns</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm purchasing a receiver set for a sbr build in the near future. When I fill out the 4473 I obviously don't have the tax stamp for a sbr yet, so would I list the barrel length as 16" even though I plan on installing a 10.5"? After getting the receivers transferred to me in this manner, I then have to fill out a form 4 for the tax stamp..am I taking an extra step here? Plan on going the trust route.. </div></div>
The 4473 is to transfer the receiver to you so you don't need to put any barrel lenght on that form. There is no place for that anyway. You fill out a Form 1 not a Form 4. You put on the Form 1 the barrel lenght that you intended to put on your receiver.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
I can get signatures but have to wait days sometimes to get the Cleo to sign, then You have to get fingerprints done. Then photos. Trust I fill out and put in the mail the same day. Why would you not want to do the trust? Curious also.
I can get signatures but have to wait days sometimes to get the Cleo to sign, then You have to get fingerprints done. Then photos. Trust I fill out and put in the mail the same day. Why would you not want to do the trust? Curious also.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
Trust is great; set it up have an attorney look it over as there are certain things that must be in it for NFA, get it notorized and your done.
LLC is easy also, but you have to pay your yearly fees, and keep up to date on your taxes, some states require large ones others required nominal $25.00 ones. If it lapses, "Oh no Pinky," trouble could ensue. I would recomend looking at both options and decide which is better in the long haul for you.
Welcome to the world of silence [crickets chirping], you will never go back.
Trust is great; set it up have an attorney look it over as there are certain things that must be in it for NFA, get it notorized and your done.
LLC is easy also, but you have to pay your yearly fees, and keep up to date on your taxes, some states require large ones others required nominal $25.00 ones. If it lapses, "Oh no Pinky," trouble could ensue. I would recomend looking at both options and decide which is better in the long haul for you.
Welcome to the world of silence [crickets chirping], you will never go back.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
IMHO items like MGs that up in value its better to do the indivual route, you die, a trust becomes irrevocable, that person dies, the item becomes the ATFs, I use this logic for the rest of my C3 toys, I can get the sigs, they cost me nothing, so theats the way to go for me.
IMHO items like MGs that up in value its better to do the indivual route, you die, a trust becomes irrevocable, that person dies, the item becomes the ATFs, I use this logic for the rest of my C3 toys, I can get the sigs, they cost me nothing, so theats the way to go for me.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
That would not be correct.
Whereas I would agree with you, for some, the individual registration trumps the LLC or Trust, what you have described as a high point of failure is, in fact, a Trust's greatest strength...survivability in the case of death. Trusts are constructed exactly for this purpose, they (Trusts) transcend the life of the Settlor and Trustees. Upon the death of the Settlor, the remaining Trustees have the "assets" distributed to them in a highly structured manner.
Think of it this way, in Trust, the Settlor has already given up his/her direct ownership and individual registration to the Trust entity. Their death is material only as a catalyst for registration to the next assigned Trustee(s) collectively. Interestingly, that can include minors as the Trust can compensate with major Trustees acting in concert until the minor comes of age. A revocable trust is just that, revocable, the Trustee are charged with the reconstitution of the Trust by the election of additional Trustees ad infinitum.
This is not legal advice. I am not a lawyer. I employ both Trust and direct signature. This is a deep and broad subject and should be approached in a sober and serious manner.
Note: Quicken Trusts are flawed and under review by the BATF en mass. Take all the advise given prior, use an NFA competent attorney.
That would not be correct.
Whereas I would agree with you, for some, the individual registration trumps the LLC or Trust, what you have described as a high point of failure is, in fact, a Trust's greatest strength...survivability in the case of death. Trusts are constructed exactly for this purpose, they (Trusts) transcend the life of the Settlor and Trustees. Upon the death of the Settlor, the remaining Trustees have the "assets" distributed to them in a highly structured manner.
Think of it this way, in Trust, the Settlor has already given up his/her direct ownership and individual registration to the Trust entity. Their death is material only as a catalyst for registration to the next assigned Trustee(s) collectively. Interestingly, that can include minors as the Trust can compensate with major Trustees acting in concert until the minor comes of age. A revocable trust is just that, revocable, the Trustee are charged with the reconstitution of the Trust by the election of additional Trustees ad infinitum.
This is not legal advice. I am not a lawyer. I employ both Trust and direct signature. This is a deep and broad subject and should be approached in a sober and serious manner.
Note: Quicken Trusts are flawed and under review by the BATF en mass. Take all the advise given prior, use an NFA competent attorney.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Witch Doctor</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
LLC is easy also, but you have to pay your yearly fees, and keep up to date on your taxes, some states require large ones others required nominal $25.00 ones. If it lapses, "Oh no Pinky," trouble could ensue. I would recomend looking at both options and decide which is better in the long haul for you.
Welcome to the world of silence [crickets chirping], you will never go back.
</div></div>
Other states, like mine, require a one time fee for the LLC and that's it.....
really depends on your state and what works better for you
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Witch Doctor</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
LLC is easy also, but you have to pay your yearly fees, and keep up to date on your taxes, some states require large ones others required nominal $25.00 ones. If it lapses, "Oh no Pinky," trouble could ensue. I would recomend looking at both options and decide which is better in the long haul for you.
Welcome to the world of silence [crickets chirping], you will never go back.
</div></div>
Other states, like mine, require a one time fee for the LLC and that's it.....
really depends on your state and what works better for you
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
As a side note to RT51, just because an examiner issues a stamp for a Trust does not make it legal. Some folks in Florida found that out the hard way. In all the cases I read about, the Trusts were developed on Quicken and were missing some key things for NFA. The defense was that they were approved by the BATFE, so they must have been legal. Downside here is that you are violating Federal Law without knowing it, believing your protected by the Trust. The BATFE stated that the examiners were not responsible to validate the legality of the Trust, only the that the paperwork for the stamp was in order. I cannot stress enough the use of an attorney when setting up your Trust if you go that route.
As a side note to RT51, just because an examiner issues a stamp for a Trust does not make it legal. Some folks in Florida found that out the hard way. In all the cases I read about, the Trusts were developed on Quicken and were missing some key things for NFA. The defense was that they were approved by the BATFE, so they must have been legal. Downside here is that you are violating Federal Law without knowing it, believing your protected by the Trust. The BATFE stated that the examiners were not responsible to validate the legality of the Trust, only the that the paperwork for the stamp was in order. I cannot stress enough the use of an attorney when setting up your Trust if you go that route.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
LLC route here. No waiting for signatures, fingerprints etc.
I file it yearly with my taxes and pay nothing since that "business" earns nothing.
LLC route here. No waiting for signatures, fingerprints etc.
I file it yearly with my taxes and pay nothing since that "business" earns nothing.
Re: Using a LLC for a SBR
Not sure whose from where but I set up a trust with a lawyer in Houston named Sean Cody- Involves several people in my family so we all get to play and no CLEO sign off to deal with.
Document is 41 pages long!
http://www.texasnfatrust.com/prod01.htm
Not sure whose from where but I set up a trust with a lawyer in Houston named Sean Cody- Involves several people in my family so we all get to play and no CLEO sign off to deal with.
Document is 41 pages long!
http://www.texasnfatrust.com/prod01.htm
