Vertical stringers

[mattr25]

So I picked up some Ruag Swiss p the other day and wanted to see how it shot before ordering more. Had 1 1/2” group at 100 yards, .625 at 200 yards, 2” at 300 yards snd 3” at 400 yards. I noticed the rifle seemed to shoot higher as it heated up. I haven’t noticed this with reloads that I normally shoot. The rifle is a Rem 700 in a Manners T4a that is bedded 20” 1:12 twist. I don’t have a chrono but doing some reverse math in my ballistics calculator it roughly 2475 FPS. My setup is a front rest and a pretty firm rabbit ear rear bag. It’s been a while since I shot other than hunting so I’m trying to workout the rust in my fundamentals. Is this likely a difference in MV or is it mor related to shooting form or setup? Any tips are appreciated.

Edit: Just realized I might be in the wrong section so feel free to move it or let me know if I need to do it.

 

[Jef-in-AZ]

Do you know what order the hits were? How firm of a hold are you using on the rifle? What kind of material and filler are the front and rear bags made of?

 

[mattr25]

Do you know what order the hits were? How firm of a hold are you using on the rifle? What kind of material and filler are the front and rear bags made of?

The front is a Caldwell Rock adjustable rest and the rear is a pretty firm rabbit ear leather bag with a flat bottom. The 400 yard target was bottom, middle and then top. The rifle is full floated and I kept checking it after each shot to make sure it still had clearance all the way to the receiver. I hold pretty good shoulder pressure. I’ve really been trying to improve my form as I’d like to get back into some competitions.

 

[briang7511]

Do you what bullet is used in this type of ammo? it is possible that your gun does not like this brand. This is also assuming everything with your rifle is perfect. rings and base are not loose etc.

 

[mattr25]

Do you what bullet is used in this type of ammo? it is possible that your gun does not like this brand. This is also assuming everything with your rifle is perfect. rings and base are not loose etc.

This is the only info I have on the bullet. The scope base and rings are tight.

 

[Jef-in-AZ]

The front is a Caldwell Rock adjustable rest and the rear is a pretty firm rabbit ear leather bag with a flat bottom. The 400 yard target was bottom, middle and then top. The rifle is full floated and I kept checking it after each shot to make sure it still had clearance all the way to the receiver. I hold pretty good shoulder pressure. I’ve really been trying to improve my form as I’d like to get back into some competitions.

Use a small amount of talc or corn starch on the bags. Make sure the rifle can slide easily on them. The texture on the Manners stocks will tend to keep them from moving consistently in the bags. Especially if you have much down force on the rear of the stock. I had a leather front bag get wet and it was grabbing a stock enough that the entire 20# rest would lift the front two feet off the bench.

 

[Marty1975]

My guess is form and its only a guess, sure has happened to me more than I care to admit. If things are right with your rifle and mounts as they appear to be, could be velocity differences, but I doubt that is the cause here mostly because your groups are basically the same at 3&4 hundred yards. Some of my rifles are more or less impacted by how tight the strong hand hold is and also how much pressure you use to bring the gun into your shoulder from shot to shot. Consistency. One rifle in particular is very picky. I also use a front rest setup and rear bag like yours, but I saw the same thing using a bipod and squeeze bag on the toe from the bench. It dosent take much pressure on either to get optimum results and it is probably easier to be consistent with less squeeze/pull. Consistency in pretty much everything you can think of is key. Dry fire helps a bunch, especially with trigger control. Trigger time, live fire, was the only cure I found. Been thinking of getting a .22 trainer but to me nothing beats the real thing - what you are going to use for competitions or when SHTF day comes. Hope this helps.

 

[mattr25]

My guess is form and its only a guess, sure has happened to me more than I care to admit. If things are right with your rifle and mounts as they appear to be, could be velocity differences, but I doubt that is the cause here mostly because your groups are basically the same at 3&4 hundred yards. Some of my rifles are more or less impacted by how tight the strong hand hold is and also how much pressure you use to bring the gun into your shoulder from shot to shot. Consistency. One rifle in particular is very picky. I also use a front rest setup and rear bag like yours, but I saw the same thing using a bipod and squeeze bag on the toe from the bench. It dosent take much pressure on either to get optimum results and it is probably easier to be consistent with less squeeze/pull. Consistency in pretty much everything you can think of is key. Dry fire helps a bunch, especially with trigger control. Trigger time, live fire, was the only cure I found. Been thinking of getting a .22 trainer but to me nothing beats the real thing - what you are going to use for competitions or when SHTF day comes. Hope this helps.

Definitely helpful. I’ve been dry firing some and have completely changed my shooting form. I used to shoot with a loose grip from the pocket but have moved to a firmer grip and shoot from the clavicle area. My left to right group has gotten better for sure. I figure the vertical stringing is coming from recoil management and will just take more practice. All the groups are under 1 moa do it’s not bad at all. But if I can get the form down I should be able to tighten it up. I’m planning to take a precision rifle course at some point. I also am going to try a rear squeeze bag. I’ve got to check with my range and make sure I can shoot prone. We’ve got 2 off site 1000 yard ranges we can for sure but they only have a 1000 yard berm.

 

[Marty1975]

MO

Definitely helpful. I’ve been dry firing some and have completely changed my shooting form. I used to shoot with a loose grip from the pocket but have moved to a firmer grip and shoot from the clavicle area. My left to right group has gotten better for sure. I figure the vertical stringing is coming from recoil management and will just take more practice. All the groups are under 1 moa do it’s not bad at all. But if I can get the form down I should be able to tighten it up. I’m planning to take a precision rifle course at some point. I also am going to try a rear squeeze bag. I’ve got to check with my range and make sure I can shoot prone. We’ve got 2 off site 1000 yard ranges we can for sure but they only have a 1000 yard berm.

Definitely helpful. I’ve been dry firing some and have completely changed my shooting form. I used to shoot with a loose grip from the pocket but have moved to a firmer grip and shoot from the clavicle area. My left to right group has gotten better for sure. I figure the vertical stringing is coming from recoil management and will just take more practice. All the groups are under 1 moa do it’s not bad at all. But if I can get the form down I should be able to tighten it up. I’m planning to take a precision rifle course at some point. I also am going to try a rear squeeze bag. I’ve got to check with my range and make sure I can shoot prone. We’ve got 2 off site 1000 yard ranges we can for sure but they only have a 1000 yard berm.

MOA is very good. Yeah, you r probably right on recoil management. Thats the pull into your shoulder. And not moving your shooting hand/finger after the shot and keeping your eyes open. I still have never seen any bullet trace though ive read where some have. I do see the white puff of the muzzle blast a nano second before recoil pulls or pushes the field of view away. Took me 3 years and a couple barrels to get the consistency I wanted. Goal being for that first cold bore shot within your average group zone or as they say a “hit”. You will enjoy 1k. Its a hoot to squeeze off a shot, get back on target to see the impact (on steel) then after about a second and a half ya can hear the “crack”. Or see dirt fly up on a miss, then all ya hear is a few choice words. Next is firing a follow up too hit while the plate is still moving. This is where a brake helps a bunch. Im fortunate to be able to practice on our own place here. Nearest range is a 90 minute drive, one way, for a 1k shot. Just started competitive but with the virus only went once last year, n thats at 600 yards at a range a bit closer to home. Shooting benchrest competition is much more demanding than hitting a steel target though. So far im not close to winning. But its still fun. Good luck, stick with it.

 

[mattr25]

MO

I’m going to continue dry fire drill. I do have a little bastard brake on it and that’s helped spotting my shots. I’ve shot 1000 yard match once. I shot it with the same gun minus the brake and with a Zeiss 4-12x44 with a whole bunch of shims! Also had the factory hogue stock. Talk about vertical stringers!!! I was within 1 moa roughly on windage but was probably 4 moa on elevation. I then went to a Vortex pst 6-24x50 ffp with the MOA reticle and then sorta quit shooting for a while. I would love to go shoot some competitions with varying distances.