What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

[Angstrom]

I was doing some thinking about a few gun related things, and it brought me to a question.

Can anybody tell me the exact and proper name for the type of camo that McMillan put on those commemorative M40A1 rifles they made a while back?

http://www.mcmfamily.com/mcmillan-rifles-commemorative-rifle.php

Bonus points if you can elaborate further on the history or background of said camo. (i.e. what year did the USMC start using this camo on this rifle? etc, etc.)

Thanks, friends!

 

[Turk]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

Forest Camo, I think it started around 1985.

 

[Angstrom]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

This is frustrating.
I keep looking around, but all I'm finding is stuff like the M81 Woodland camo, or the ‘Delta’ ERDL pattern (70's right?).
Nothing that looks exactly like the "blotch" camo painted on those stocks.
When I search for "forest camo" or USMC forest camo", nothing really looks like the camo on those stocks, except for when I find pictures of thos actual stocks.

Is the camo on that stock just supposed to be <span style="font-style: italic">"compatible"</span> with the M81 pattern?

I understand that the concept of painting a rifle to look exactly like the uniforms it is being issued with is a fairly new phenomenon (and still not really something that is actually done), but you see that blotchy M40A1 style of camo on pretty much all of them once they decided to do more than just smear the color on, and it looks uniform in and of itself.


You see where I'm going with this?

 

[Turk]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

That's what they wanted and that's what they got! If you're looking for it to make sense....don't! Btw you can pm Dick Davis at Mcmillian; he's on here and he's been around since the inception of that stock. Maybe he can give you more insight.

 

[i_rep]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

Corrected

 

[Turk]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: i_rep</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Actually its Woodland. Forest is much version of the colors. </div></div>
Look here and let me know if you still think it's Woodland? Woodland has black in it just like the uniform.
http://www.mcmfamily.com/mcmillan-stocks-finishes.php#camo

 

[i_rep]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

All these years I have ordered them as spec woodland, yet they show up correct.


So I stand corrected. My Commemrotive does say Forest in the fine print. I own one of the 20.

 

[Turk]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

You have one of those and .....You need to do the "walk of shame"!

 

[i_rep]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

guess so....Got four of them stocks.

 

[sandwarrior]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: i_rep</div><div class="ubbcode-body">guess so....Got four of them stocks.</div></div>

Woodland never had black as a main color. Only a border between colors, if there was one. We wore "Woodland" cammies when I first got to the Ranger BN, just like the Marines (but we wore nametags on ours). On the uniforms there were no borders (which would be black). But, various pieces of equipment we had that were painted cammie, had borders, and that was still called "Woodland". Two or three different OD greens and a medium tan. With or w/out black borders on the colors.

We switched to standard jungle fatigues when the rest of the Army went to the BDU's(ca., Oct 1, 1982), which were "Woodland" pattern at that time as well. But, turned greyish when you washed them.

This was all 1981-1985.

 

[Angstrom]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Turk</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's what they wanted and that's what they got! If you're looking for it to make sense....don't! Btw you can pm Dick Davis at Mcmillian; he's on here and he's been around since the inception of that stock. Maybe he can give you more insight.</div></div>
Thanks.
Is his user name "Dick Davis" or does he go by something else?

 

[Angstrom]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

I sent him a PM and asked if he would look in on this thread and clear up some of the confusion.

Now we play the waiting game...

 

[Guest]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

The pattern is forest, not woodland.

http://www.mcmfamily.com/mcmillan-stocks-finishes.php#camo

The original pattern was referred to as "smear", and it was changed to the blothcy type later on.

I had a few Platoon Sgts that were 8541s, and they always frowned on the use of black cammie paint or anything else, saying, "Noting in nature is black". I suspect the woodland color scheme was developed without the black that is included in McMillan's woodland pattern with that in mind.

Despite the fact that those guys never saw a zebra or tiger, they still had an influence on my choice of stock color:

 

[i_rep]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

What is it your trying to have cleared up?

Click on YOUR OWN LINK...at the bottom next to the rifle where it says CLICK HERE...click on that...it opens up a full spec page ....scroll down to where it describes the stock and read the first sentence.

Answers your question completely.

 

[Dick D]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

The camo pattern on the USMC stocks is and always has been what we call "Forest Camo". First couple of years we made these for the corps ( 1975 thru about 1978 or so)the color concentrates we used to color the gel-coats were a dye type color. They produced a sort of translucent gel-coat that did not have a lot of "hide" to it. They let a lot of the cloth show thru and because of the way they were made there was a lot of smearing and movement inside the mold when the stock shells were pressurized. You now call these the early smear pattern.
In the late 70's or so much better ground pigment color concentrates became available. These had a lot of mineral pigment ground into them and produced a more opaque gel-coat that had more intense color and did not let the cloth show thru near as bad. Also we learned to let the gel-coat set in the mold until it became a bit tacky before all the epoxy wetted fiberglass cloth was placed in the mold. This way the color sploches did not smear as bad when pressurized and gave us a more distinct pattern. The last 300 or 400 M40Al stocks were made like this and look just like the current Forest Camo stocks.
The answer to your next question is "no". The old translucent dye type color concentrates have not been available for 30 years or so and we have absolutely no interest in trying to make a see-thru smeared type finish like the early M40A1's. Customers would not accept that type of finish these days. They were what they were, a product of their time and the technology available at that time but their time is long over. They are unique and should stay that way.

 

[Angstrom]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: i_rep</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What is it your trying to have cleared up?

Click on YOUR OWN LINK...at the bottom next to the rifle where it says CLICK HERE...click on that...it opens up a full spec page ....scroll down to where it describes the stock and read the first sentence.

Answers your question completely.
</div></div>
Did you see my post where I said <span style="font-weight: bold">"When I search for "forest camo" or USMC forest camo", nothing really looks like the camo on those stocks, except for when I find pictures of those actual stocks."</span>?

That's why I was getting a little confused because I wasn't sure if the pattern and colors on the stock were meant to be an <span style="font-style: italic">exact</span> match to another existing camo, or simply <span style="font-style: italic">compatible</span> with it.

Fortunately, I asked this question on The Hide where there are actually people like Dick Davis himself who where actually there. You just can't beat that kind of first-hand information!
Thanks again Mr. Davis.

 

[Action Guy]

Re: What camo did McMillan put on those M40A1's?

Dick,

I actually prefered the smeared stocks to the later version. Not for any other reason than it was what my platoon had most of when I got there (2/7). Nostalgia, I guess. Usually they all got painted anyway.

Thanks for the info, though. Just confirms what I remembered.