What is your wind philosophy?

[ChrisWay]

There are about as many ways of choosing your wind hold as there are shooters, however I’m really curious about peoples fundamental elements that guide the decision.
For example, do you measure speed with a device? Measure angle with a technique? I would call this wind math. Another side is a felt or observed visual call with mirage angle, trees rustling, then a decision.. I would call this intuitive.
I’m not saying people don’t do both! I believe that most probably do both to a certain extent. I’m mostly curious about the ratios you utilize and if there are other ways you chose to offset your hold as a result of wind to raise hit probability.
Let’s hear what you do!

 

[Palehorse68]

Following

 

[Hecouldgoalltheway]

Shoot suppressed, that way they won't run away too fast when you miss the first shot.

 

[MadDuner]

I don't have a strategy or philosophy for wind.
That's probably why I miss so often.

So yeah, I'm going to pay attention now.

 

[LuvDog]

Aim for the middle and hope wind doesn't have too much effect

 

[OREGUN]

Ask the last guy who shot what he did.

 

[OREGUN]

I measure angle and speed with the kestrel. Make distance/ratio changes on the fly if I have time. Watch for changes in mirage, feel for changes on my face and watch impacts to hopefully see coming shifts. And try to get as much wind on the plate as I can to make up for my own miscalculations.

 

[MK20]

I am almost always shooting in the mountains so my situation is far different than yours, Chris.

Wind at the shooter is not determinative.

I measure wind by feel (10 years of professional training at this) and then try to see in 3D in my mind the wind patterns between me and the target.

As this is usually across a valley or two it takes some doing and practice.

 

[diggler1833]

"Intuitive" only here.

Not that devices aren't great. However, my shooting is frequently done at animals, so I practice how I "hunt". This is also why I limit myself to 400 yards, because frequently the normal indicators of wind velocity aren't there when you are trying to tag a deer, coyote, or equivalent across an open pasture or hay meadow. Sometimes you get some mirage assistance, but you can't count on anything other than watching the vegetation and observing what you feel.

I have found that on what I would consider a 'blown wind call', that I am about 1 MOA off to 750 (my 99% of the time range limit on my ranch). 1 MOA at 400 keeps me in the vitals of a deer, and close enough on coyotes that they don't make it out of the pasture before dying. 1 MOA at 600 would be problematic. My last practice at 603 I boogered up reading the wind and ended up almost a full MOA off. That would have cost me a wounded animal (and why I limit myself to 400).

I also rarely hunt in winds over about 10-12 MPH here, but they are the most switchy I've ever seen.

Testing my cold bore/cold shooter shot is what I enjoy most in my practicing. Some days I'll set up targets off the side of the house, and just periodically walk out throughout the course of the day to fire a single shot at a single dot on steel to see if my wind reading abilities were on point.

YMMV, and I don't compete in any discipline.

 

[MK20]

Where I hunt the times I see game are almost always at the time of day when the wind is near dead anyway and if it is moving it is a nice, steady and consistent wind field.

So it makes it easy. I would feel safe out to 600m with a 308 at the right time of day.

 

[beetroot]

No device although if I see someone with a Kestrel I’ll ask what they are reading to test my wind reading ability.
99% of the time the wind is different down range anyway so I’ve not felt the need to buy a Kestrel.

I usually just assume 6mph of wind if it’s light, 10mph if it’s a stronger wind.
Seems to do well enough if I can read the terrain right but often I find there are weird terrain features that I can’t see that mess me about.

 

[Mike Casselton]

I shoot at JTAC here in Florida.

On the 2k range, the first 200 yards are protected by 20' berms on the east and west sides.
The berms cause false wind readings in regards to velocity and direction.
Lots of people use the kestrel to get a wind reading, but unless it's a 12:00 or 6:00 wind, their data will be flawed.
In fact, the 12/6 wind data is also wrong because the berms cause a tunneling effect. This tunneling speeds up the air flow and causes people to get the speed and usually the direction incorrect.

For me and most of my shooting friends, we rely on the flags and careful assessment of visible mirage, small trees and grasses.

For shooting at the mile or 2k, there's a large pocket to the NW where there are no trees. This pocket causes a swirling effect. It makes for some interesting conditions when the wind direction varies almost 180°.

Then there's the creek at 1400 yards...


So, in answer to your question, it's mostly intuitive wind reading and local knowledge.

 

[TheOtherAndrew]

I swear this is the last time ill do it!

Wind Call - RAGS/10A

6mph Gun# values Multiply value most resembling actual wind speed and angle by range to target and you have your wind solution!

www.snipershide.com

Past 1000yds though Im still just guessing really, ready for a quick solid follow up shot.

And mountain shots Ive never done but I imagine is like throw out the entire text book cuz like you said how do you decide which is the strong current which is the weak one, what ratio of the total wind call do you designate this section as etc etc.? Hence why my next 'adventure' is guna be somewhere with mountain shooting!

 

[Baron23]

Ah....ferverently pray "please dear lord, don't let the wind blow"? LOL

 

[Palehorse68]

I shoot at JTAC here in Florida.

On the 2k range, the first 200 yards are protected by 20' berms on the east and west sides.
The berms cause false wind readings in regards to velocity and direction.
Lots of people use the kestrel to get a wind reading, but unless it's a 12:00 or 6:00 wind, their data will be flawed.
In fact, the 12/6 wind data is also wrong because the berms cause a tunneling effect. This tunneling speeds up the air flow and causes people to get the speed and usually the direction incorrect.

For me and most of my shooting friends, we rely on the flags and careful assessment of visible mirage, small trees and grasses.

For shooting at the mile or 2k, there's a large pocket to the NW where there are no trees. This pocket causes a swirling effect. It makes for some interesting conditions when the wind direction varies almost 180°.

Then there's the creek at 1400 yards...


So, in answer to your question, it's mostly intuitive wind reading and local knowledge.

Tell Ben Brown that Boyer in Lancaster said hello. JTAC is a treasure.

 

[MadDuner]

I seldom see the wind blowing in the same direction between the end of my barrel and my target at 1k.... so it’s always a “best guess” on my part. Some days I’m close. Some days I’m not. Then there’s the swirling gusting conditions where I’m just wasting ammo and my time. But I still go!

 

[Mike Casselton]

I swear this is the last time ill do it!

Wind Call - RAGS/10A

6mph Gun# values Multiply value most resembling actual wind speed and angle by range to target and you have your wind solution!

www.snipershide.com

Past 1000yds though Im still just guessing really, ready for a quick solid follow up shot.

And mountain shots Ive never done but I imagine is like throw out the entire text book cuz like you said how do you decide which is the strong current which is the weak one, what ratio of the total wind call do you designate this section as etc etc.? Hence why my next 'adventure' is guna be somewhere with mountain shooting!

Don't forget crazy updraft conditions.
I love shooting out west and specifically, cross canyon shooting at chucks.

 

[High Desert duck]

I’m more on the intuitive side. Mirage, feel, and even splash if the target/conditions are right. Over 12-15 mph I’ll get the kestrel out ballistic solver out.

 

[todd]

"Hold left edge and send it."

I'll use the Kestrel at my location to get a general idea of average and high speed and direction, and get wind holds for those from the Kestrel. I'll put those on my arm board to give me options on the clock. I also pay attention on binos while folks before me are shooting and look for trends and check out mirage and what it's doing. I'll also look for the best indicator near the target in my FOV I can use on the clock for changes. Send the first one, measure DTC in the reticle, correct and we're off to the races.

 

[Yoteski]

I pretty much only shoot unknown distance field matches anymore. I think one of the handiest tools that's free is the "windy" app. Only bad thing is it depends upon having phone service. Anyhow, it's been pretty darn good at at least showing the prevailing wind direction and makes for a good educated guess at mph also. I'll check with a Kestrel also, and see if things are jiving with what I'm seeing. After that, it's all about seeing my first shot and where it hits on the target if I hit, or the miss and how far it was off. I immediately go to my wind chart and try to assign a mph off the real data. I'll then run that wind mph until I see or feel conditions change just changing for target direction etc.

 

[RAWHDE]

There are about as many ways of choosing your wind hold as there are shooters, however I’m really curious about peoples fundamental elements that guide the decision.
For example, do you measure speed with a device? Measure angle with a technique? I would call this wind math. Another side is a felt or observed visual call with mirage angle, trees rustling, then a decision.. I would call this intuitive.
I’m not saying people don’t do both! I believe that most probably do both to a certain extent. I’m mostly curious about the ratios you utilize and if there are other ways you chose to offset your hold as a result of wind to raise hit probability.
Let’s hear what you do!
View attachment 8202241

Ideally, what I would like to do, is have the ability to rely on as little tech as possible (no tripods, no relying on iPhone and ballistics apps in field, not a million different bags, etc)…just a man and his rifle. If I had only my rifle, can I hit the target at ranges out to 1,000yds.
Target acquisition, range target, calculate wind by using environmental surroundings and experience, dial/hold, impact target…all in 1 minute or less. Too much to ask?

 

[isofahunter]

I start by watching Old Glory along my route to where I am shooting. Gives an idea of direction and speed and I am thinking about wind before I get the rifle out. On station check Avia Weather for nearest airport or Windy for what is being reported. Then like @MK20 said look over the terrain and imagine the wind flow. I have a large draw that runs from 8 to 2 across the firing line and depending on the FFP there can be an angle to consider. What the wind can do to a bullet under the right conditions still astounds me. When clearing the range we had 3 fires burning and I spent some time watching the smoke and it was amazing to see smoke moving in 3 different directions and elevations over the firing line depending on small changes in wind direction and how it interacted with the terrain.
Then of course where the bullet lands is the final arbiter of what is the wind doing.

 

[Waco Kid]

Ideally, what I would like to do, is have the ability to rely on as little tech as possible (no tripods, no relying on iPhone and ballistics apps in field, not a million different bags, etc)…just a man and his rifle. If I had only my rifle, can I hit the target at ranges out to 1,000yds.
Target acquisition, range target, calculate wind by using environmental surroundings and experience, dial/hold, impact target…all in 1 minute or less. Too much to ask?

This is what I attempt to do, doesn’t always work out for me as I’m still pretty new to all this. I like learning how to do things the hard way as opposed to using all the gadgets from the start. I’ve had reasonably good luck just using wind brackets and swag’ing the speed and direction based on environmental clues, then correct from my missed shots. Probably use more ammo this way but feel like I actually accomplished something when I get it right.

 

[RAWHDE]

This is what I attempt to do, doesn’t always work out for me as I’m still pretty new to all this. I like learning how to do things the hard way as opposed to using all the gadgets from the start. I’ve had reasonably good luck just using wind brackets and swag’ing the speed and direction based on environmental clues, then correct from my missed shots. Probably use more ammo this way but feel like I actually accomplished something when I get it right.

I’ve started going outside, looking around and guessing the wind, then checking it using gadget. Guessed between 6-10mph today at work and it ended up being 7mph average with a max of 11.6mph. I guess practicing this stuff actually starts to pay off

 

[TX_Dan]

Intuitive. I will have my head in my spotting scope for a while watching the mirage and look for a dominant condition. I hardly shoot anywhere other than KD ranges these days and I have lots of notes in my data books from service rifle days. Also had some good coaches along the way that were able to teach this voodoo.

 

[kthomas]

I rely on both math based/wind readings and intuitive.

I use my Kestrel to understand what the wind is doing - being mindful I'm taking a measurement at my specific location. This is the baseline for which I build off of, going to the intuitive side.

From there I will have a look and see what's going on down range. Is there geographic features that will block the wind? Amplify the wind? What's happening around the max ordinance elevation? What's happening at the target? Is the wind gusting? What is the vegetation telling me? Mirage? What is the debris from impacts doing?

I'll combine all of that and create a bracket, giving me firing solutions for a "low" and "high" wind speed scenarios that seem applicable based on my measurements and observations. I'll be mindful of what the wind is doing when I'm behind the rifle - feeling/hearing it, signs from vegetation or other landscape tells, and ultimately seeing what the bullet does downrange and the resulting splatter/debris.

 

[Raffy]

My personal philosophy is this- Don't pee into the wind. If you do, plan to get wet.

 

[Superjet]

Miss, cuss, re-engage

 

[TheOtherAndrew]

I’m mostly curious about the ratios you utilize and if there are other ways you chose to offset your hold as a result of wind to raise hit probability.

I did not catch this part until now. Good question.

 

[TheOtherAndrew]

can you provide an example of 'ratios utilized' - do you mean on an initial wind call for 1 shot (so more about how close to reality your measurements actually are (speed/angle/misc)) or are you referring to an already known wind but converting it to target #2, 3 etc.? As we should all know (centerfire/small) past ~800yd is where things start getting exponential not linear. Inside of that if youre at 700 using 1.2mrad wind and follow up is at 400 its probably just as easy as [(700/1.2) = (400/x)] --> 480 = 700x --> 0.7 and because shorter distance it track even more linearly so I may either subtract .1 (0.6 center) or favor on plate but edge. There are plenty of mini math tricks to make this simpler or one could write it down but as a philosophy...

My major question isn't about transitioning the numbers mid stage or 'flow math' - it's about getting a 1st call wind that is within a targets width off each edge (or better). But that doesn't always work either if ground is soft/wet (yeah)

So the stage I got absolutely stumped on there was say 20-25wind hilltop to hilltop so valleys magnifying et al.... targets are visible but under trees on another hill so the ground doesn't get sun and the shadow created is impossible to see any splash. Note I did not have a spotter so that added problems. How would you handle that specifically @ChrisWay ?? I just stopped shooting and took the L on that stage. (~750-900yds can't recall exactly)

Id tell myself now that duh - 1 point better than 4 misses.... so take 3 to find the wind call and make ur hit. IDK if I like that answer though because you'd never do that in reality (I don't think, y'all correct me). Its also extremely difficult to implement mid stage cuz how do u know its a messy wind call until you shoot 1 and have no clue what happened, and at that point transitioning to finding an entirely new area that will show splash say u get the splash in scope follow thru, now you gotta convert for whatever angle change you used and again hope it all pans out.
-----------
me on that stage

 

[Aftermath]

Let’s hear what you do!

Given the time, I get a Kestrel reading. I look at the vegetation or wind flags and compare that to what I am able to observe along the bullets proposed path, do some mental vector math and make an educated guess. I try to get real still and clear my mind of anything but being still enough to make a clean shot. Focus on breathing and, eventually, start the process of moving my trigger finger.
BOOM!!
The target takes a hit, نْ شَاءَ ٱللّٰهُ‎

 

[M4orturnate]

I measure angle and speed with the kestrel. Make distance/ratio changes on the fly if I have time. Watch for changes in mirage, feel for changes on my face and watch impacts to hopefully see coming shifts. And try to get as much wind on the plate as I can to make up for my own miscalculations.

Same. If its a troop line or long range stage ill write a high and low bracket. Wind under 5 mph i just trust my own judgement to get on plate and correct as needed

 

[TheOtherAndrew]

Could throw a smoke grenade downrange first lol