Ok. Looking at building a 2nd rifle and thought I had settled on the 6.5PRC until I looked at 30 calibers. Three have my interest in a big way. This gun will be for an elk hunt out west, shooting at range, and want it to give to my son when time comes. He’s not a big hunter but loves shooting targets. The 30PRC, 30 Nosler, and 300 Norma Magnum. I am pretty sure that the NM is top of food chain with these three and PRC would be at the bottom, but all things considered from reloading, factory ammo choices, recoil, hunting, barrel life, among other factors which would be the best all around rifle for hunting from 100yd shots out to 7-800+ yards. And then just the point of range shooting. Right now I know all brass and ammo are expensive, barrels will be burnt on all three eventually, and the recoil is a priority also. Being that I’m looking at a rifle in the 9-11 pound area with scope. I will be running a muzzle brake though so I’m hoping that will help tame the beast. Thanks
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Which 30 caliber for a 2nd custom build
- Thread starter tilman2141
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Ammo and component availability.....300WM. Good to go.
300 PRC. Recoil goes up pretty significantly with and 300nm.
Figured with a 225 grain bullet at published reloading speed a 300PRC at 2850 generates 28.72 # of recoil energy.
300 NM with a 225 at 2950 generates 34.58# of recoil energy. All in a 12 pound rifle. That's the same as a 375 H&H.
Figured with a 225 grain bullet at published reloading speed a 300PRC at 2850 generates 28.72 # of recoil energy.
300 NM with a 225 at 2950 generates 34.58# of recoil energy. All in a 12 pound rifle. That's the same as a 375 H&H.
A good muzzle brake can make the recoil of most any caliber quite managable.
With proper technique and learning how to ride recoil, your son should be able to handle 300wm without a muzzle device. Especially with a md.
Plus, the 300wm gets decent barrel life as well.
With proper technique and learning how to ride recoil, your son should be able to handle 300wm without a muzzle device. Especially with a md.
Plus, the 300wm gets decent barrel life as well.
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30 Nosler gets my vote. Or, look into building a .300 Ackley Improved Magnum (.300 Weatherby on steroids).
First one I’m having built is a 27 Nosler on a defiance deviant hunter action with HCA carbon fiber barrel bedded in an AG Compiste Alpine hunter stock, with either a trigger tech special trigger or a Bix’n Andy, zero delta rings and Schmidt &Bender 4-16x50. Dan Pedersen out of Prescott Az. is doing the build.
Honestly...... I would even recommend a .308 but I realize it isn't very popular anymore. Just my opinion
I'm partial to having similar weapons of different caliber set up exactly the same... Take the blueprint you have for #1 and have the same thing built in 300WM for #2... Just an opinion
That is without.
I hunt with a win m70 featherweight in 300wsm. It's about as much recoil as I like to shoot, and i have shot a bunch of 375 H&H. Light weight rifles in high velocity cartridges tend to have snappy recoil.
300 prc is just 300wm corrected in my opinion. Not any faster than a properly throated 300wm just a better case design and set up.
I have a 300 Norma, the rifle is 22 pounds and without a brake it pushes pretty hard. With a sidewinder brake it is a pussy cat, but the muzzle blast is tremendous, you don’t want to be to the side of the rifle. 300 win mag with 200 grain bullets is manageable without a brake for hunting.
I have a 308 and a 300wm so though I would go with 300nm. I have brass,primers and powder now the wait for the barrel...
I have a semi custom Bergara in 300wm, specifically for elk and all around hunter. Weight is about 10lbs ish with a custom brake and recoil is minimal. Broke it in with 60rds in one range session without issue or regret the next day.
I’m recoil sensitive and rarely shoot anything larger than 308 anymore.
I had probably one of the first 338lapuas Surgeon Rifles made back in the day. I think to parent case to 300NM is 338L but I could be wrong. I don’t wish that recoil and ammo costs on anyone.
300wm gets my vote or 308win.
I’m recoil sensitive and rarely shoot anything larger than 308 anymore.
I had probably one of the first 338lapuas Surgeon Rifles made back in the day. I think to parent case to 300NM is 338L but I could be wrong. I don’t wish that recoil and ammo costs on anyone.
300wm gets my vote or 308win.
I have a 308, 300WM, and 300 RUM. The WM is a match chamber, so it can seat out and run the same as a PRC. Any more powder would be wasted for the stated purpose IMHO. You could also get away with a 30-06 if custom throated, but my choice (now that ADG is making brass) would probably be a 300 WSM on a Medium action or a Tikka. ~2840's with a 215 Berger or a little faster with a Badlands 205.
I shot a match years ago. It was raining that Saturday morning. One of the stages had a low spot at the firing line. A tarp had been placed down so that we could shoot without having to lie in the mud, but the tarp began to collect water. The gentleman beside me was shooting a 300wsm with an aggressive brake. Each time he fired, a wave of water would come across me. It was literally like lying in the surf on a beach and trying to engage targets. It was very insightful. Never happened to me again.
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I've got rifles on 2 of the 3 cartridges.
No flies in any of them, they will handle anything you care to shoot at as long as you do your part.
My 300WM with 215 Bergers have stacked o'pile of dead animals from near and far.
The 300PRC is still a newbie-ish being only 2 season old but with factory 212 ELDX it is impressive but with 230 Hybrid handloads it just THUMPS.
Then the rifle in the flock 300NM, still working with the 245 EOL but damn that thing flies!
Now the short of it, if NO reloading is in mind, then the 300WM has the edge in shear options from light to heavy loads (doesn't mean all options are available to purchase) BUT it still has more flexibility to reload than the other 2 options.
The 30N has only Nosler supported factory ammo and some on the "custom" loaded ammo from Unknown, Hendershot, etc.
While the 300NM has even less available factory ammo; IT does have one advantage IF you can find it. Federal Ammo loads it with the 215 Berger.
In a lighter-weight hunting rifle and the current crop of available muzzle brakes have no fear that it will be easy enough to shoot with enough practice and form.
No flies in any of them, they will handle anything you care to shoot at as long as you do your part.
My 300WM with 215 Bergers have stacked o'pile of dead animals from near and far.
The 300PRC is still a newbie-ish being only 2 season old but with factory 212 ELDX it is impressive but with 230 Hybrid handloads it just THUMPS.
Then the rifle in the flock 300NM, still working with the 245 EOL but damn that thing flies!
Now the short of it, if NO reloading is in mind, then the 300WM has the edge in shear options from light to heavy loads (doesn't mean all options are available to purchase) BUT it still has more flexibility to reload than the other 2 options.
The 30N has only Nosler supported factory ammo and some on the "custom" loaded ammo from Unknown, Hendershot, etc.
While the 300NM has even less available factory ammo; IT does have one advantage IF you can find it. Federal Ammo loads it with the 215 Berger.
In a lighter-weight hunting rifle and the current crop of available muzzle brakes have no fear that it will be easy enough to shoot with enough practice and form.
Well after talking to West Texas Ordnance and Joel at Terminus I decided on 300 PRC. So now just to get it built. Last thing I’m needing is a solid muzzle brake
- Nov 3, 2010
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300 PRC. It is simply better than WM. Most people cite ammo and component availability as the only reason to stick with WM. I would argue that doesn’t hold water like it did. Go to Midway, Mile High or even your local sporting goods and see how often a good heavy, high BC bullet PRC is in stock relative to a low BC WM. Call any respectable gunsmith and ask what their top calibers are. I would bet 300 WM isn’t in the top 5 anymore.
I believe that over a long period of time PRC will replace WM in popularity. It already has in new gun sales. Think of PRC as 6.5 creed 10 years ago.
I believe that over a long period of time PRC will replace WM in popularity. It already has in new gun sales. Think of PRC as 6.5 creed 10 years ago.
After 308 I chose 30 Nosler over 300 Win Mag. New age design for higher BC bullets in factory chambering.
I also chose it over 300 PRC to avoid CIP length stock, action and DBM.
300 PRC is prolly the longest round I’ve ever seen in a “normal” or common man gun. I’m not talking 338 Lapua or 50 cal.
Sure ever had a preference. This is why I chose what I did.
I also chose it over 300 PRC to avoid CIP length stock, action and DBM.
300 PRC is prolly the longest round I’ve ever seen in a “normal” or common man gun. I’m not talking 338 Lapua or 50 cal.
Sure ever had a preference. This is why I chose what I did.
I’m looking at Hawkins M5 bottom metal with hunter mag and an AG Composite chalk branch stock.
Hawkins LA is 3.770 internal length.
SAAMI Spec COAL
30 Nosler 3.340” max
300 PRC 3.700” max
AICS LA mags are 3.625” COAL
AICS LA CIP mags are 3.760” COAL from what I have read. Others can comment/confirm.
Hawkins should be fine for 300 PRC.
I would confirm your action is cut for CIP. My Big Horn TL3 was not nor as my Manner LA mini-chassis.
CIP is more common now than 3-5 years ago. I would just confirm as 300 PRC is best suited for CIP length set-up.
SAAMI Spec COAL
30 Nosler 3.340” max
300 PRC 3.700” max
AICS LA mags are 3.625” COAL
AICS LA CIP mags are 3.760” COAL from what I have read. Others can comment/confirm.
Hawkins should be fine for 300 PRC.
I would confirm your action is cut for CIP. My Big Horn TL3 was not nor as my Manner LA mini-chassis.
CIP is more common now than 3-5 years ago. I would just confirm as 300 PRC is best suited for CIP length set-up.
Nosler needs to be run long to get the benefits (capacity) of the case over a PRC. At 3.34 you'd probably be better off with a WM. That said, it also speaks to the versatility of the chambering, as long as your barrel/projectiles can tolerate jump, you can run it like a hot 30-06 or like a PRC improved. Pretty sure the Nosler is a shortened RUM, no? Full monty RUM is even more versatile, given same barrel/projectile considerations.
I had a custom reamer made. Running the 210 and 215 hunter VLD in AICS LA magazine. Nosler was designed for longer heavier bullets but custom 300 WM would be as capable or maybe slightly better. Wasnt really a factor for me. I wanted a 30 cal magnum with no belt and newer design.
Yes PRC is stouter. Slight trade off. I went middle of the road.
Yes PRC is stouter. Slight trade off. I went middle of the road.
I agree with all saying 300 wm. But one thing I would say is….when you talk about shooting 7-800 yards, I hope you are talking about at the range, not hunting elk. I personally feel keeping it under 500 yards (more like 350 for me) is ethical hunting. Especially on elk. I’ve hit them at 150 yards with my 338 wm and had them still go 50 yards. They are tough animals and deserve a clean kill.
Range yes. I don’t feel comfortable shooting past 500 either when hunting
how much more will the Sherman give me over the PRC.
Very little, you can get 150 fps, but would likely be running much more pressure than is safe. I run a Sherman 6.5 Max, and they are not magic. I love the cartridge, but it is max ~68 grains of N570, not 75. If you are after a hot 30, go with Norma, Norma Improved, a necked down Lapua or Lapua Imp, or if you want to stay on a normal boltface, RUM. Norma would be shortest COAL, and when improved, can run close to a RUM, also with a shorter barrel.
Do yourself a favor and walk into a few gun stores and look at what ammo is on the shelf for the calibers you are considering. If you cant find ammo and or brass you should draw a line through that caliber choice and move on to the next possible choice. I really see no reason to reinvent the wheel so look hard at the Tikka rifles before you drop two or three times the money in something else. Mountain guns get heavy and I would rather pack my Tikka than my Rem R5 and would only take the GAPrecision if I had a donkey to carry it. But your mileage may vary. If you simply want something nicer than the Tikka look at the Sako S20.
Glad you were able to settle on a caliber! That’s always a tough one. Now on the action, I have both a Defiance Tenacity and a Terminus Apollo. I like them both, but for me, I’d give the slight edge to the Terminus. I like the 60 degree throw more than I thought I would.
I would echo 300 Win Mag (unless you reload), but it appears you have made your choice.
I would absolutely agree with the poster above about a Tikka T3. You could start with that, change the trigger to a Timney to get the ability to operate the bolt on safe, and if you insist, upgrade the stock to a McMillan.
Be less than half the cost of a custom, and you probably wouldn't notice a difference in accuracy.
I would absolutely agree with the poster above about a Tikka T3. You could start with that, change the trigger to a Timney to get the ability to operate the bolt on safe, and if you insist, upgrade the stock to a McMillan.
Be less than half the cost of a custom, and you probably wouldn't notice a difference in accuracy.
I also feel the 300 Win mag is a first choice. I have two to my son and he shot a nice Bull in AD with my Rem700BDL with 180 grain bullets. All the new stuff is just that and not much more. You'll always be able to find ammo for the 300win mag.
Knowing what I know now. 7mm08 Remington packs a punch and is highly overlooked for great accuracy. Also a 260 Remington is written up in Berger reloading manual as having 90% the energy that a 300 Winchester Magnum does at 1000 yards.
^7-08 and 260 have, say, ~45 grain max usable capacity, while 300 WM has, say, ~80. They do not compare at all in any ballistic challenge, unless you purposefully handicap the WM to lose.
Probably 50-100 fps….maybe a bit more. When comparing Sherman numbers, don’t forget Rich is often developing in 28” barrels, but many of us want to hunt in 20-26” barrels including brake. Makes a difference.
Before you buy the Norma, look at it in Quickload. I think you will be surprised. If a 28 or 30 Sherman Magnum is using US869, N570 and RE50, what slower powder will the Norma run?
Totally agree. Sherman’s run best on mono’s. Great thing is, long Bergers and Hammers are what are available. Also, Rich has brass fo4 most of his rounds regularly on the site.
It is a pretty decent choice in these tough times. They are not magic, nor are the velocities….just a little more, a little better chamber design and a little better case to reamer to die match.
