Who really ranges stuff?

[Yippeekiay]

Been looking for a set of bino's with precise ranging capabilities for a while now and have only come up with 3 or 4 viable options.(1) Vortex R/T (2) Leupold Mk4 w/ TMR (3) Valdada BG/A TRX (New) and (4)Probably not, but Steiners.
I'm still going to buy a pair and would like some input if anyone has had experience with any or, especially, all of these.
The thing is I can't help but get the feeling that ranging with anything other than LRF's is going by the wayside.
What say you?

 

[J.Boyette]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

No not at all.

The reticle in bino's is not for ranging, its for spotting indirect first, and rifle fire second.

The key is, when you use buddy supported positions bino's with a reticle help alot.

now the real question is, why dos no manufacture make image stabilizing bino's with a reticle?

That is the ticket!!!!

John

 

[Yippeekiay]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

But they can still be utilized for ranging, Yes? Specifically the ones listed with .5 to 1 mil increments. Reason I ask is I'd get some really funny looks walking around town ranging stuff through a rifle scope, mounted or not. Plus, being part birder I really appreciate multipurpose optics.
It seems to be a trend for optics companies to peruse forums like these and actually incorporate some of the ideas. IS bino's w/ a reticle sounds like something a bigger company like Fuji or Nikon could try. Not sure about Leupold's capabilities in that area. Would be pretty damn cool though.

 

[ranger1183]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

what's wrong with using the Bushnell Fusion 1600 ARC 10X42?

Fusion 1600 ARC LRF Rangefinding Binocular - XTR coatings - Bak-4 prisms with PC-3 phase corrective coating - Rainguard HD - Waterproof - Vivid Display Technology - 10-1600 yard range - Angle Range Compensation - Bow & Rifle Modes - 31 ounces - Hinged body

 

[Yippeekiay]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

what's wrong with using the Bushnell Fusion 1600 ARC 10X42?

Absolutely nothing. I've got a Bushnell 1500 and use it every chance I get. The point I was trying to make is that it seems possible that LRF's are making mechanical/analog ranging an almost pointless skill somewhat akin to juggling and the like. Not saying that it's a bad thing either because precision means everything in this game. Just a thought.

 

[brutus895]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

I agree with the OP. I've wondered the same thing myself many times. Why range with a reticle when LRFs are so plentiful and getting cheaper/better all the time?

One advantage that comes to mind is that you can't always get a correct reading with the LRFs if line of sight is not totally clear. The laser will bounce off the first thing in comes in contact with, like brush, and give an incorrect reading. Ranging with a reticle can still be done even if the view is somewhat obstructed.

I'm curious what the pros think...

 

[Tigerbikes]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

Not a pro by any stretch but IMHO being able to range with a reticle is as fundamental as being able to do multiplication and long division.

Sure, I use a calculator most of the time. But what if you don't have one or the one you have breaks?

 

[Yippeekiay]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

I think I get as much satisfaction ranging a target (correctly) as when I hear the bullet hitting steel. Course I still need all the practice I can get at both.

 

[Longshot38]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Yippeekiay</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The thing is I can't help but get the feeling that ranging with anything other than LRF's is going by the wayside.</div></div>

This is all a question of being a complete rifleman. Yes LRF are preferred in most cases for speed and accuracy. However one needs to remember LRF are electronic devices, thus batteries fail, circuity breaks, and lasers can be detected. Thus being able to accuracy range a target with a range finding reticle is without a doubt one of the most important skills for a rifleman to learn.

 

[rcnpthfndr]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Longshot38</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Yippeekiay</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The thing is I can't help but get the feeling that ranging with anything other than LRF's is going by the wayside.</div></div>

This is all a question of being a complete rifleman. Yes LRF are preferred in most cases for speed and accuracy. However one needs to remember LRF are electronic devices, thus batteries fail, circuity breaks, and lasers can be detected. Thus being able to accuracy range a target with a range finding reticle is without a doubt one of the most important skills for a rifleman to learn. </div></div>

+1 i was going to say something similar. its a perishable skill and there are times where the transition from scope to LRF to Scope and pull the trigger cant happen in the urban environment. i am not saying i/we didnt use LRF's, but i ensured my guys could do the basic ranging and knew target dimensions, just like shooting irons. It was reinforced when we set up our range cards, had them Mil everything, then came back through and confirmed with a LRF.

for the tactical shooter, unless the event prohibits LRF use then sure ranging targets is going to the wayside. It would be fun to watch a COF where the shooters were restricted equipment, and time and had to range their targets. kind of like a gunnery or stress shoot dragging a SKEDCO from hell.

 

[Yippeekiay]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

So does the army supply the LRF's or do you guys have to buy your own. I know they got a few in the system but I wouldn't think they'd have enough to go around.

 

[hiddenmongoose]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

dont get me wrong , lrfs like any other electronic device can fail and a tactical shooter should be able to mil his target but.. you need an accurate extensive list of objects dimensions , you need a lot of practice in milling targets.unless your putting in the pracice milling ranges is messy at best . the percentage error you will have will often put you outside the kill/hit zone of your target with a 308. couple that with targets that are not allways an exact dimension (as in nature/real life) and it can become hard to get first round hits. that said with practice you can get good. my 2 cents ymmv

 

[Mustafa]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rcnpthfndr</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It would be fun to watch a COF where the shooters were restricted equipment, and time and had to range their targets. kind of like a gunnery or stress shoot dragging a SKEDCO from hell.</div></div>

Shoot at Rifle's Only some time! Jacob either doesn't allow the use of LRF or he'll do something squirelly to make your LRF not be able to get accurate data. Time limit, then two shots to get a hit for points. The only data you are given is the size of the target!

 

[1911fan]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: rcnpthfndr</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> It would be fun to watch a COF where the shooters were restricted equipment, and time and had to range their targets.</div></div>

More common at 'tacticool' matches than you would think. Last one I went to had targets out to 1340 yards, no LRF allowed, though they did give us several minutes to range. It was across a canyon and uphill too. I was pretty tickled that my first shot had good elevation and was half a minute right (downwind) and then I hit it three out of four, IIRC. With a .308.

1911fan

 

[rcnpthfndr]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Yippeekiay</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So does the army supply the LRF's or do you guys have to buy your own. I know they got a few in the system but I wouldn't think they'd have enough to go around. </div></div>

we had plenty civillian ones through the RFI program. For mil hardware we had GVS-5's and MELIOS/CVAM systems more than enough systems to go around.

 

[edward r homeyer]

Re: Who really ranges stuff?

we have PLRFs, Vipers, Storms and RULRs. I have a set of bushnell fusion 1600. and I still mil every target if I have the chance. With 15 plus power scopes and horus reticles subtended into .2 mils. Milling is a viable back up to a lrf.