I hope its okay to post this in this section, if not feel free to move or delete. I need a cheap single stage press or two, let me know what ya got!
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WTB: Cheap single stage press
- Thread starter G and R
- Start date
Re: WTB: Cheap single stage press
They don't come any less expensive than Lee's little "Reloader" press. And they are quite guod too, and far stronger than it would appear!
Of course, for 10 to 15 times the Reloader's price you could have a Co-Ax!
They don't come any less expensive than Lee's little "Reloader" press. And they are quite guod too, and far stronger than it would appear!
Of course, for 10 to 15 times the Reloader's price you could have a Co-Ax!
Re: WTB: Cheap single stage press
Nothing's cheaper than a Lee. Designed for cheap construction employing cheap materials to support a cheap sales price. Utility or value doesn't enter into the picture. Cheap.
Nothing's cheaper than a Lee. Designed for cheap construction employing cheap materials to support a cheap sales price. Utility or value doesn't enter into the picture. Cheap.
Re: WTB: Cheap single stage press
Lee Classic Cast. You can pay more but until you get up to a Forster Co-Ax or Redding T-7 you wont get more press.
Lee Classic Cast. You can pay more but until you get up to a Forster Co-Ax or Redding T-7 you wont get more press.
Re: WTB: Cheap single stage press
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's a ridiculous opinion. Have you ever even used one?</div></div>
I have. And AFAIK, there really is nothing cheaper than a Lee. I haven't put my hands on one, but I understand the Classic Cast is a miles ahead of Lee's other offerings.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That's a ridiculous opinion. Have you ever even used one?</div></div>
I have. And AFAIK, there really is nothing cheaper than a Lee. I haven't put my hands on one, but I understand the Classic Cast is a miles ahead of Lee's other offerings.
Re: WTB: Cheap single stage press
"That's a ridiculous opinion.?"
It is indeed. Lee's alum alloy presses are inexpensive, yes. Designed to be easy to make on automated precision CNC tooling, yes. High value, YES. But, "cheap"? NO! Airplanes, missles, car and outboard motor blocks, a lot of our guns and almost all scope tubes are also made of alum alloy and I hear no one saying they are just "cheap pot metal." Nonsense!
A few years ago I got a dial indicator and magnetic base for machening work. I soon checked the head/die spring of my much praised, "STRONG!" RCBS Rock Chucker II when FL sizing some 30-06 cases. Spring was an easy .003"; not a lot but sure more than I had expected. Then, just for comparing, I did the same test on the two little "cheap" Lee "Reloader" "C" frame presses I use for de- and re- priming because my RC makes such a mess dealing with primers. Same dies, same box of fired cases; the .001" reading dial indicator barely moved, not enough to read but it was well under a half thousanth!
Am I saying I proved the tiny Reloaders are stronger than the RC II? Certainly not, that would be foolish and I am not a foolish man. But it did prove that within their strength limits even the smallest Lee presses ARE more rigid than my highly touted RC. AND they are more than sufficently strong for normal uses, I have resized a few .338s in one of them, so...??
Seems those who slime Lee presses do it as a knee-jerk reaction they just can't help but NONE I know of have any actual, measureable justification for it.
And I KNOW that if I had to replace my old RC II tomorrow it would be with a Lee Classic Cast, it's the superiour press in every way!
"That's a ridiculous opinion.?"
It is indeed. Lee's alum alloy presses are inexpensive, yes. Designed to be easy to make on automated precision CNC tooling, yes. High value, YES. But, "cheap"? NO! Airplanes, missles, car and outboard motor blocks, a lot of our guns and almost all scope tubes are also made of alum alloy and I hear no one saying they are just "cheap pot metal." Nonsense!
A few years ago I got a dial indicator and magnetic base for machening work. I soon checked the head/die spring of my much praised, "STRONG!" RCBS Rock Chucker II when FL sizing some 30-06 cases. Spring was an easy .003"; not a lot but sure more than I had expected. Then, just for comparing, I did the same test on the two little "cheap" Lee "Reloader" "C" frame presses I use for de- and re- priming because my RC makes such a mess dealing with primers. Same dies, same box of fired cases; the .001" reading dial indicator barely moved, not enough to read but it was well under a half thousanth!
Am I saying I proved the tiny Reloaders are stronger than the RC II? Certainly not, that would be foolish and I am not a foolish man. But it did prove that within their strength limits even the smallest Lee presses ARE more rigid than my highly touted RC. AND they are more than sufficently strong for normal uses, I have resized a few .338s in one of them, so...??
Seems those who slime Lee presses do it as a knee-jerk reaction they just can't help but NONE I know of have any actual, measureable justification for it.
And I KNOW that if I had to replace my old RC II tomorrow it would be with a Lee Classic Cast, it's the superiour press in every way!
Re: WTB: Cheap single stage press
I have loaded on a Lee for years, probably in excess of 50k rounds. Is it the best? Nope. Utility and value? Sure as hell. I recently got a Dillon 650 but will continue to load the 7 rifle calibers I load for on my Lee. It turns out great ammo.
I have loaded on a Lee for years, probably in excess of 50k rounds. Is it the best? Nope. Utility and value? Sure as hell. I recently got a Dillon 650 but will continue to load the 7 rifle calibers I load for on my Lee. It turns out great ammo.
Re: WTB: Cheap single stage press
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EddieNFL</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have. And AFAIK, there really is nothing cheaper than a Lee. I haven't put my hands on one, but I understand the Classic Cast is miles ahead of Lee's other offerings. </div></div>
I have. I had a Lee Classic Cast given to me when MidWay had them for $60. I put another $40 with it and paid another $20 in shipping cost to exchange it for my Redding Boss. I've never looked back. Would you like to hear how the Boss is so tightly fitted that it makes a faint <span style="font-style: italic">whirring</span> sound as the primer cut on the ram passes through the bore?
I doubt that most people really understand the function of Lee products in the marketplace. The following dissertation is from a posting of mine on another forum, which I'll, again, repeat here.
<span style="font-style: italic">In the marketing world, it has been recognized that there are a finite number of strategies. One is that of the low-cost producer. Every aspect of the business must be guided toward minimal cost to the consumer. Production, materials, labor, design and service must all be compromised to varying extents to satisfy that customer. The occasional saving grace comes with innovation in design and production efficiency/economy. Characteristic of the low-cost strategy is that there is only one producer that succeeds; the low margin makes it too unprofitable for all but the most cost efficient to survive. Richard Lee dominates in the reloading market, and no others can gain entry to the price conscious segment's wallets as long as he maintains minimal profit.
Lee has succeeded through design with three products. His Collet Die and Perfect Powder Measure are duplicated by no others. His AutoPrime's basic design is copied by K&M and Sinclair, both producers of upscale products that don't compete in Lee's market. If Lee were to upgrade his AutoPrime, Collet Die and PPM, accompanied by a commensurate price increase, he would lose his own segment.
The compromises in Lee's products are acceptable only to those who find his price attractive, with the exception of the three designs discussed. Those looking for service and robust products keep the other manufacturers in business. </span>
There are two other Lee products of which I typically speak kindly, the powder dippers and the primer-pocket cleaner. Both of these are essentially generic products that Lee markets successfully through price competition. Competing primer-pocket cleaners offer enhancements like handles or sharpened surfaces to differentiate them, justifying higher prices. The dippers, as far as I know, have no competition, completely dominating the market for that product. No one can make them cheaper than Lee, or, at least, finds it beneficial to their business to do so.
The man asked for cheap, and I offered accolades. Enter the critics.
Frankly, if I were in the market for a lightweight, inexpensive press, I'd opt for the RCBS Partner. And if I were in the market for a small but more substantial press, I'd again choose what I already have.
It's about function, not price.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: EddieNFL</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have. And AFAIK, there really is nothing cheaper than a Lee. I haven't put my hands on one, but I understand the Classic Cast is miles ahead of Lee's other offerings. </div></div>
I have. I had a Lee Classic Cast given to me when MidWay had them for $60. I put another $40 with it and paid another $20 in shipping cost to exchange it for my Redding Boss. I've never looked back. Would you like to hear how the Boss is so tightly fitted that it makes a faint <span style="font-style: italic">whirring</span> sound as the primer cut on the ram passes through the bore?
I doubt that most people really understand the function of Lee products in the marketplace. The following dissertation is from a posting of mine on another forum, which I'll, again, repeat here.
<span style="font-style: italic">In the marketing world, it has been recognized that there are a finite number of strategies. One is that of the low-cost producer. Every aspect of the business must be guided toward minimal cost to the consumer. Production, materials, labor, design and service must all be compromised to varying extents to satisfy that customer. The occasional saving grace comes with innovation in design and production efficiency/economy. Characteristic of the low-cost strategy is that there is only one producer that succeeds; the low margin makes it too unprofitable for all but the most cost efficient to survive. Richard Lee dominates in the reloading market, and no others can gain entry to the price conscious segment's wallets as long as he maintains minimal profit.
Lee has succeeded through design with three products. His Collet Die and Perfect Powder Measure are duplicated by no others. His AutoPrime's basic design is copied by K&M and Sinclair, both producers of upscale products that don't compete in Lee's market. If Lee were to upgrade his AutoPrime, Collet Die and PPM, accompanied by a commensurate price increase, he would lose his own segment.
The compromises in Lee's products are acceptable only to those who find his price attractive, with the exception of the three designs discussed. Those looking for service and robust products keep the other manufacturers in business. </span>
There are two other Lee products of which I typically speak kindly, the powder dippers and the primer-pocket cleaner. Both of these are essentially generic products that Lee markets successfully through price competition. Competing primer-pocket cleaners offer enhancements like handles or sharpened surfaces to differentiate them, justifying higher prices. The dippers, as far as I know, have no competition, completely dominating the market for that product. No one can make them cheaper than Lee, or, at least, finds it beneficial to their business to do so.
The man asked for cheap, and I offered accolades. Enter the critics.
Frankly, if I were in the market for a lightweight, inexpensive press, I'd opt for the RCBS Partner. And if I were in the market for a small but more substantial press, I'd again choose what I already have.
It's about function, not price.
Re: WTB: Cheap, Single-Stage Press
Actually, I believe this is what the OP wants:
www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=postlist&Board=24&page=1
Actually, I believe this is what the OP wants:
www.snipershide.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=postlist&Board=24&page=1
Re: WTB: Cheap, Single-Stage Press
Lee's are the cheapest you'll find and the quality is okay. You can always upgrade later if you decide to continue reloading. It's a good way to go if you are just starting out.
Lee's are the cheapest you'll find and the quality is okay. You can always upgrade later if you decide to continue reloading. It's a good way to go if you are just starting out.
Re: WTB: Cheap, Single-Stage Press
guys, I wasn't asking for a pissing match...I need another press and thought it would get more attention here.
guys, I wasn't asking for a pissing match...I need another press and thought it would get more attention here.
Re: WTB: Cheap, Single-Stage Press
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Glock_and_roll</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Guys, I wasn't asking for a pissing match... </div></div>
A pissing contest is needed periodically to wash the tint off of rose-colored glasses.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Glock_and_roll</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Guys, I wasn't asking for a pissing match... </div></div>
A pissing contest is needed periodically to wash the tint off of rose-colored glasses.
Re: WTB: Cheap, Single-Stage Press
The Lee Challenger is cheap and the Anniversary Kit is an excellent way to get started.
It does have it's drawbacks. I managed to bust the linkage on mine. Lee offered to replace it with the original parts free of charge, or upgrade to the heavy steel linkage for a couple bucks. I upgraded the linkage and dropped it on the shelf as a backup. I now use a Classic Cast I got from another member here.
The Lee Classic Cast will work very well. It's much heavier than the Challenger and it on par with the Rockchucker I looked at.
Lee makes a good product. They are designed to be inexpensive, that doesn't always mean "cheap". If you want to pay more, you can. You just don't have to.
The Lee Challenger is cheap and the Anniversary Kit is an excellent way to get started.
It does have it's drawbacks. I managed to bust the linkage on mine. Lee offered to replace it with the original parts free of charge, or upgrade to the heavy steel linkage for a couple bucks. I upgraded the linkage and dropped it on the shelf as a backup. I now use a Classic Cast I got from another member here.
The Lee Classic Cast will work very well. It's much heavier than the Challenger and it on par with the Rockchucker I looked at.
Lee makes a good product. They are designed to be inexpensive, that doesn't always mean "cheap". If you want to pay more, you can. You just don't have to.
Re: WTB: Cheap, Single-Stage Press
"Frankly, if I were in the market for a lightweight, inexpensive press, I'd opt for the RCBS Partner."
I'll bite. Gut feeings aside, in what way is the aluminum Partner from RCBS superiour to an aluminum press from Lee?
(And, I just have to ask, is RCBS getting the Partners made in China now, as they do the Rock Chuckers and some of their other reloading tools? And, is "made in China" magically okay if it's painted green?)
"Frankly, if I were in the market for a lightweight, inexpensive press, I'd opt for the RCBS Partner."
I'll bite. Gut feeings aside, in what way is the aluminum Partner from RCBS superiour to an aluminum press from Lee?
(And, I just have to ask, is RCBS getting the Partners made in China now, as they do the Rock Chuckers and some of their other reloading tools? And, is "made in China" magically okay if it's painted green?)
Re: WTB: Cheap, Single-Stage Press
go red go Lee.been useing one for 10 years know.and its given me a lot of bug hole groups.for me its a great press to start out on.and when the time comes to get a nice press if you choose to do so.and if you do you can use the little red press for deprimeing or what ever you want to do with it.all mine does now is to deprime.this way I can feel the case better when resizeing and not feel the primer being pushed out.so go with your gut feeling and buy what YOU want.
go red go Lee.been useing one for 10 years know.and its given me a lot of bug hole groups.for me its a great press to start out on.and when the time comes to get a nice press if you choose to do so.and if you do you can use the little red press for deprimeing or what ever you want to do with it.all mine does now is to deprime.this way I can feel the case better when resizeing and not feel the primer being pushed out.so go with your gut feeling and buy what YOU want.
Re: WTB: Cheap, Single-Stage Press
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fuzzball</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> in what way is the aluminum Partner from RCBS superiour to an aluminum press from Lee? </div></div>
1. The press's design is not driven to cheap production
2. If I got one that wasn't square, I could expect RCBS to replace it
3. There's a good resale market for the model
Lee has two customers: those who can't pay more, and those who won't pay more.
For those who can't pay more, you are fortunate that it's available, at least until your circumstances improve.
For those who won't pay more, don't tell me that I should be using the stuff because you're using it.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Fuzzball</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> in what way is the aluminum Partner from RCBS superiour to an aluminum press from Lee? </div></div>
1. The press's design is not driven to cheap production
2. If I got one that wasn't square, I could expect RCBS to replace it
3. There's a good resale market for the model
Lee has two customers: those who can't pay more, and those who won't pay more.
For those who can't pay more, you are fortunate that it's available, at least until your circumstances improve.
For those who won't pay more, don't tell me that I should be using the stuff because you're using it.
Re: WTB: Cheap, Single-Stage Press
"1. The press's design is not driven to cheap production"
Okay, I'm not sure how that can be but okay, so it costs more. Is there a value in that?
"2. If I got one that wasn't square, I could expect RCBS to replace it"
You mean, one might NOT be square and you assume Lee would not replace a non-aligned press? I doubt that for either press!
"3. There's a good resale market for the model"
If you skim eBay you will find a good market for most reloading stuff, often selling used for more than the same thing new, no matter the brand. ??
"Lee has two customers: those who can't pay more, and those who won't pay more. For those who can't pay more, you are fortunate that is available, at least until your circumstances improve."
Well, it's a free county (so far) and that's your opinion. Others have different opinions, so....?
"For those who won't pay more, don't tell me that I should be using the stuff because you're using it."
You may benefit from using at least some of it but certainly not because anyone else uses it. Some of Lee's stuff is the best of its type, at any price.
I've been reloading for a long time, used a lot of stuff, still have a lot of tool brands in my loading room. While there are some trivial user feature differences between brands the value of those differences is taste and opinion, not fact.
I've used and measured the results from enough dies by all makers to know (1) ammo is made on the inside and (2) there is as much average difference between the inside of dies of the same brand as there is between brands. Meaning, on average and on target, there is no provable difference between the dies of any makers EXCEPT/ONLY the expensive Comp/BR dies from Redding and Forster. And there isn't a whole lot of effective difference even between them and more common designs.
"1. The press's design is not driven to cheap production"
Okay, I'm not sure how that can be but okay, so it costs more. Is there a value in that?
"2. If I got one that wasn't square, I could expect RCBS to replace it"
You mean, one might NOT be square and you assume Lee would not replace a non-aligned press? I doubt that for either press!
"3. There's a good resale market for the model"
If you skim eBay you will find a good market for most reloading stuff, often selling used for more than the same thing new, no matter the brand. ??
"Lee has two customers: those who can't pay more, and those who won't pay more. For those who can't pay more, you are fortunate that is available, at least until your circumstances improve."
Well, it's a free county (so far) and that's your opinion. Others have different opinions, so....?
"For those who won't pay more, don't tell me that I should be using the stuff because you're using it."
You may benefit from using at least some of it but certainly not because anyone else uses it. Some of Lee's stuff is the best of its type, at any price.
I've been reloading for a long time, used a lot of stuff, still have a lot of tool brands in my loading room. While there are some trivial user feature differences between brands the value of those differences is taste and opinion, not fact.
I've used and measured the results from enough dies by all makers to know (1) ammo is made on the inside and (2) there is as much average difference between the inside of dies of the same brand as there is between brands. Meaning, on average and on target, there is no provable difference between the dies of any makers EXCEPT/ONLY the expensive Comp/BR dies from Redding and Forster. And there isn't a whole lot of effective difference even between them and more common designs.
Re: WTB: Cheap single stage press
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Glock_and_roll</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I hope its okay to post this in this section.... </div></div>
Have you formed an opinion?
Your thread has gotten really high ratings. Have you had any responses to your request?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Glock_and_roll</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I hope its okay to post this in this section.... </div></div>
Have you formed an opinion?
Your thread has gotten really high ratings. Have you had any responses to your request?
Re: WTB: Cheap single stage press
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some of Lee's stuff is the best of its type, at any price.</div></div>
I'm always looking for better gear. Could you provide a list? IMO the factory crimp die for straight walled cases is the best made (is it offered by another company?).
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Some of Lee's stuff is the best of its type, at any price.</div></div>
I'm always looking for better gear. Could you provide a list? IMO the factory crimp die for straight walled cases is the best made (is it offered by another company?).
Re: WTB: Cheap single stage press
Did I mention that I like the dippers and the primer-pocket tool? No moving parts.
Did I mention that I like the dippers and the primer-pocket tool? No moving parts.
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