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Rifle Scopes Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
- Thread starter jimmykm21
- Start date
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
I'd avoid ballistic reticles at all cost. They are only accurate in one atmosphere with one load. I don't know about you, but I don't always shoot one load through the life of a scope. And the atmosphere doesn't always agree with what my scope wants, either.
I own both Conquest scopes and NF scopes. Glass seems to be a wash. The Zeiss is brighter, but the resolution seems better on the NF.
The NF is a much more solid scope and much more durable.
I'd highly recommend getting a milrad-based or MOA-based reticle, match knobs to whichever choice you go with, and properly learn to use it.
I'd avoid ballistic reticles at all cost. They are only accurate in one atmosphere with one load. I don't know about you, but I don't always shoot one load through the life of a scope. And the atmosphere doesn't always agree with what my scope wants, either.
I own both Conquest scopes and NF scopes. Glass seems to be a wash. The Zeiss is brighter, but the resolution seems better on the NF.
The NF is a much more solid scope and much more durable.
I'd highly recommend getting a milrad-based or MOA-based reticle, match knobs to whichever choice you go with, and properly learn to use it.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
I would go with a standard moa or mil reticle such as the NP R1 or 2 if you want to work in moa, or the mlr if you want to work in mil. Unless you have real world data to plug into the nightforce ballistic calculator on nightforce's site. Yes they have a category for handloaded ammo as well as factory loads. I personaly would want to chrono my rifle before hand, choosing the proper velocity reticle can be tricky. Change any factor (velocity, temp, altitude, etc) and the reticle yardage marks will change. Not to mention changing power will change the substensions also. So while the velocity line might match up solid for some distances, you still might have to dial in adjustments for other distances depending on how far the reticle is off.
If you know your dope moa/mil reticles can be used to hold over/under.
I would definitely call nightforce before choosing the proper reticle.
The above is just my opinion. I'd like to see what other shooters out there think as well.
I would go with a standard moa or mil reticle such as the NP R1 or 2 if you want to work in moa, or the mlr if you want to work in mil. Unless you have real world data to plug into the nightforce ballistic calculator on nightforce's site. Yes they have a category for handloaded ammo as well as factory loads. I personaly would want to chrono my rifle before hand, choosing the proper velocity reticle can be tricky. Change any factor (velocity, temp, altitude, etc) and the reticle yardage marks will change. Not to mention changing power will change the substensions also. So while the velocity line might match up solid for some distances, you still might have to dial in adjustments for other distances depending on how far the reticle is off.
If you know your dope moa/mil reticles can be used to hold over/under.
I would definitely call nightforce before choosing the proper reticle.
The above is just my opinion. I'd like to see what other shooters out there think as well.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
+1 on the NP R1 or R2. The Velocity reticle is good if you're only shooting your own hand loads. Spoken from the mouths of Nightforce reps and Eurooptics reps while I was in the market looking to buy one.
+1 on the NP R1 or R2. The Velocity reticle is good if you're only shooting your own hand loads. Spoken from the mouths of Nightforce reps and Eurooptics reps while I was in the market looking to buy one.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
I'm in the same boat myself. I have a Zeiss 6.5-20x50 with target turrets. I'm wanting to get a new hunting rifle, and wanted to look at a scope with a similar ballistic reticle.
If there was a FFP ballistic reticle, I think it would be worthwhile. I don't want to always have to have my scope on the highest magnification to use the reticle.
I think a standard plex reticle and you make the adjustments, or a MOA or MIL hash reticle that's FFP.
I'm in the same boat myself. I have a Zeiss 6.5-20x50 with target turrets. I'm wanting to get a new hunting rifle, and wanted to look at a scope with a similar ballistic reticle.
If there was a FFP ballistic reticle, I think it would be worthwhile. I don't want to always have to have my scope on the highest magnification to use the reticle.
I think a standard plex reticle and you make the adjustments, or a MOA or MIL hash reticle that's FFP.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultraman550</div><div class="ubbcode-body">+1 on the NP R1 or R2. The Velocity reticle is good if you're only shooting your own hand loads. Spoken from the mouths of Nightforce reps and Eurooptics reps while I was in the market looking to buy one. </div></div>
Entirely untrue. Might have been a breakdown in communication.
The Velocity Reticle Calculator is designed to provide information on both custom and factory loads.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultraman550</div><div class="ubbcode-body">+1 on the NP R1 or R2. The Velocity reticle is good if you're only shooting your own hand loads. Spoken from the mouths of Nightforce reps and Eurooptics reps while I was in the market looking to buy one. </div></div>
Entirely untrue. Might have been a breakdown in communication.
The Velocity Reticle Calculator is designed to provide information on both custom and factory loads.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
out of the two reticles, nightforce is more intuitive. with both systems, you have to know what load your going to be using and stick with it, but once you get your load developed, and get a reticle match, it works beautifully. as Chris said, you have to have the scope on the calibrated power, but that is the case with any reticle in sfp, be it a velocity or mildot. i really like that your zero cross hair is still in the middle, for instance, with the zeiss rapid z1000, your zero is at 500, which is a little weird and if your not on the calibrated power, it can mess you up, just one little quirk.
what caliber are you shooting?
out of the two reticles, nightforce is more intuitive. with both systems, you have to know what load your going to be using and stick with it, but once you get your load developed, and get a reticle match, it works beautifully. as Chris said, you have to have the scope on the calibrated power, but that is the case with any reticle in sfp, be it a velocity or mildot. i really like that your zero cross hair is still in the middle, for instance, with the zeiss rapid z1000, your zero is at 500, which is a little weird and if your not on the calibrated power, it can mess you up, just one little quirk.
what caliber are you shooting?
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultraman550</div><div class="ubbcode-body">+1 on the NP R1 or R2. The Velocity reticle is good if you're only shooting your own hand loads. Spoken from the mouths of Nightforce reps and Eurooptics reps while I was in the market looking to buy one. </div></div>
i've used it with factory loads with success, it just has to be consistent.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultraman550</div><div class="ubbcode-body">+1 on the NP R1 or R2. The Velocity reticle is good if you're only shooting your own hand loads. Spoken from the mouths of Nightforce reps and Eurooptics reps while I was in the market looking to buy one. </div></div>
i've used it with factory loads with success, it just has to be consistent.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
It really doesn't matter, you can set it for factory ammo, but does that account for barrel differences in individual guns? NOPE!
Velocity reticles/ballistic reticles are just a good guess. They are not for precision shooting.
It really doesn't matter, you can set it for factory ammo, but does that account for barrel differences in individual guns? NOPE!
Velocity reticles/ballistic reticles are just a good guess. They are not for precision shooting.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: at4rxj</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm in the same boat myself. I have a Zeiss 6.5-20x50 with target turrets. I'm wanting to get a new hunting rifle, and wanted to look at a scope with a similar ballistic reticle.
If there was a FFP ballistic reticle, I think it would be worthwhile. I don't want to always have to have my scope on the highest magnification to use the reticle.
I think a standard plex reticle and you make the adjustments, or a MOA or MIL hash reticle that's FFP.
</div></div>
using ffp on a ballistic reticle makes you get very specific. that in itself can cause issues and can limit you, for instance, if you back off the magnification slightly on a ballistic reticle in sfp, the subtensions change, this can be good and bad, the good is you can have a more flexable system.
for instance, on the velocity 600 scopes, on 10x your good from 200-600 yards, you make a quick adjustment and the subtensions change, you can also be lined up from 700-1000, you just have to spend time with it and it's important to get the right one for your caliber.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: at4rxj</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm in the same boat myself. I have a Zeiss 6.5-20x50 with target turrets. I'm wanting to get a new hunting rifle, and wanted to look at a scope with a similar ballistic reticle.
If there was a FFP ballistic reticle, I think it would be worthwhile. I don't want to always have to have my scope on the highest magnification to use the reticle.
I think a standard plex reticle and you make the adjustments, or a MOA or MIL hash reticle that's FFP.
</div></div>
using ffp on a ballistic reticle makes you get very specific. that in itself can cause issues and can limit you, for instance, if you back off the magnification slightly on a ballistic reticle in sfp, the subtensions change, this can be good and bad, the good is you can have a more flexable system.
for instance, on the velocity 600 scopes, on 10x your good from 200-600 yards, you make a quick adjustment and the subtensions change, you can also be lined up from 700-1000, you just have to spend time with it and it's important to get the right one for your caliber.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tylerw02</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It really doesn't matter, you can set it for factory ammo, but does that account for barrel differences in individual guns? NOPE!
Velocity reticles/ballistic reticles are just a good guess. They are not for precision shooting. </div></div>
it's debatable, but you can guarantee good enough accuracy for hunting, and if you get it right, you can be really precise with the reticle.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: tylerw02</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It really doesn't matter, you can set it for factory ammo, but does that account for barrel differences in individual guns? NOPE!
Velocity reticles/ballistic reticles are just a good guess. They are not for precision shooting. </div></div>
it's debatable, but you can guarantee good enough accuracy for hunting, and if you get it right, you can be really precise with the reticle.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ikickhippies</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultraman550</div><div class="ubbcode-body">+1 on the NP R1 or R2. The Velocity reticle is good if you're only shooting your own hand loads. Spoken from the mouths of Nightforce reps and Eurooptics reps while I was in the market looking to buy one. </div></div>
Entirely untrue. Might have been a breakdown in communication.
The Velocity Reticle Calculator is designed to provide information on both custom and factory loads. </div></div>
Great...I really liked the Velocity reticle. Is this available for the iPhone?
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ikickhippies</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultraman550</div><div class="ubbcode-body">+1 on the NP R1 or R2. The Velocity reticle is good if you're only shooting your own hand loads. Spoken from the mouths of Nightforce reps and Eurooptics reps while I was in the market looking to buy one. </div></div>
Entirely untrue. Might have been a breakdown in communication.
The Velocity Reticle Calculator is designed to provide information on both custom and factory loads. </div></div>
Great...I really liked the Velocity reticle. Is this available for the iPhone?
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultraman550</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Great...I really liked the Velocity reticle. Is this available for the iPhone? </div></div>
It is not set up as an app but it will work through the browser on your iPhone.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultraman550</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Great...I really liked the Velocity reticle. Is this available for the iPhone? </div></div>
It is not set up as an app but it will work through the browser on your iPhone.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
I had a Zeiss Conquest with the rapid Z reticle. It was just about worthless in my opinion. I guess if it was strictly for one gun and one ammo, you can dial it in, but why not just use some sort of mil dot reticle? It would be way more versitile.
I had a Zeiss Conquest with the rapid Z reticle. It was just about worthless in my opinion. I guess if it was strictly for one gun and one ammo, you can dial it in, but why not just use some sort of mil dot reticle? It would be way more versitile.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
I also apply ballistic reticles [especially tree-style reticles due to a more direct windage reference] for hunting and have used them with a lot of success out to 600-700 yds. [on a 6" coyote-sized tgt.]. They do have a lot of flexibility in a SFP system, which is exactly what i want. They can almost always be applied at a magnification [calcd. and/or tested] that provides for the highest degree of accurate intuitive use, but for my uses i always apply them at the optic's highest power so i have a sort of subtension "zero stop," if u will, that i know is as precise as possible. Here's an example of the Varmint Hunter's reticle in a 4.5-14x Leup. that's cald. [and tested] for the 117 DTAC at ~2550 out of a 243WSSM SS/Broughton 8T barrel-
...and the dope for that subtension vs. trajectory in std. conditions here in Pueblo, CO--
...range/vertical/windage. U may notice that windage is about 1/2 as calibrated due to the high BC of that bullet.
Got a buddy who is a die-hard dialer, but has used his ballistic reticle [VH again] for every long-range coyote shot he's made except one.
I also apply ballistic reticles [especially tree-style reticles due to a more direct windage reference] for hunting and have used them with a lot of success out to 600-700 yds. [on a 6" coyote-sized tgt.]. They do have a lot of flexibility in a SFP system, which is exactly what i want. They can almost always be applied at a magnification [calcd. and/or tested] that provides for the highest degree of accurate intuitive use, but for my uses i always apply them at the optic's highest power so i have a sort of subtension "zero stop," if u will, that i know is as precise as possible. Here's an example of the Varmint Hunter's reticle in a 4.5-14x Leup. that's cald. [and tested] for the 117 DTAC at ~2550 out of a 243WSSM SS/Broughton 8T barrel-
...and the dope for that subtension vs. trajectory in std. conditions here in Pueblo, CO--
...range/vertical/windage. U may notice that windage is about 1/2 as calibrated due to the high BC of that bullet.
Got a buddy who is a die-hard dialer, but has used his ballistic reticle [VH again] for every long-range coyote shot he's made except one.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
As for the NF vs. Zeiss--just look at the subtensions of each at the optic's highest power and see which one matches the closest to your trajectory, if this parameter of optics selection is important to you.
Now if you're just target shooting, i prefer to dial vertical and use reticle for windage, and only rarely use a ballistic reticle for inanimate tgts.
As for the NF vs. Zeiss--just look at the subtensions of each at the optic's highest power and see which one matches the closest to your trajectory, if this parameter of optics selection is important to you.
Now if you're just target shooting, i prefer to dial vertical and use reticle for windage, and only rarely use a ballistic reticle for inanimate tgts.
Re: Zeiss Rapid Z or Nightforce Velocity reticles
The Rapid-Z is a great example of using holdovers to make multiple quick hits at varied ranges - much faster than turning turrets while standing up.
Any Rapid-Z scope can be had with target turrets as well, best of both worlds.
The Rapid-Z is a great example of using holdovers to make multiple quick hits at varied ranges - much faster than turning turrets while standing up.
Any Rapid-Z scope can be had with target turrets as well, best of both worlds.
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