Rifle Scopes Zero Compromise Mpct2 vs Mpct1 reticles after 2 months use

[Dthomas3523]

So, been getting a lot of questions over the two reticles. I’ve used the mpct1 in several matchs and have also used the mpct2 in a couple matches.

I typically prefer a simple reticle (skmr1, h2cmr, mpct1) type as I dial unless absolutely necessary and I really like the open FOV to spot misses or not draw my eye to some other part of the reticle I don’t want at the time.

Mpct1 is is about the perfect non tree reticle for me personally. I’ve found I like the .035 size dots and crosshairs thickness (figures this out before zcomp was available). I also prefer the way the .4 and .6 hash marks extend above the main stadia and the .2 and .8 are below only. It also has .2 on the vertical. This was my only complaint with the skmr1, no .2 on vertical.

Reticles like the skmr3 and h59 (apples to oranges I know) have solid lines and look cluttered to me personally as well and blocking splash at times. Especially when shooting 22lr or a 6mm past 1k.

So, for these reasons I’ve mainly used non tree reticles.

The Mpct2 reticle is the reticle that has changed my mind. Since the tree doesn’t begin until 2 mils, you really don’t notice the tree unless you are looking for it.

My eye is focused towards the center of the reticle (or a bit left or right depending on wind) when I dial and the tree never comes close to being there.

In the past, when people would say “better to have it and not need it” when discussing trees, I personally would rather have not had it because it gets in my way. The mpct2 tree stays out of the way, and now I agree, I’d rather have it there.

Here’s a few pics of different tree reticles so you can see how the mpct2 is less obtrusive.

Bottom line, I’ll be using mpct2 exclusively in the future.

(Note, other reticles such as ebr2c and mr4 have dots in tree which are also not obtrusive, but mpct2 seems to be the least obtrusive in the “high end” market).

 

[CSTactical]

Thanks for the update @Dthomas3523 !

 

[Moose]

Thanks for the info on the reticles.I chose the mpct2 for my ZC 4X20 pre order.

 

[gebhardt02]

@Dthomas3523 We appreciate your feedback, thank you! Glad you like the reticle.

 

[bjay]

Im becoming center dot reticle hoe! And when holding over with some trees or horus you will definitely lose that center dot...thats what i like about mpct2 every mil hold is set with a dot...

 

[sleeplz]

Your experience has matched mine is so many ways, but you're able to communicate it better than I have in the past. Thanks for the update on your experience.

 

[BigJimFish]

The Mpct2 reticle is the reticle that has changed my mind. Since the tree doesn’t begin until 2 mils, you really don’t notice the tree unless you are looking for it.

It is interesting that you mention this. When I was analyzing their designs I also noticed that lack of tree in the first 2 mils.

Similarly to you, I have been split on Christmas tree designs for exactly the same splash reason. Where I live in Ohio, splashes are not huge dust plumes, they are little mud chunks. You can easily miss them or imprecisely identify just exactly where they were. A tree reticle can cause this, I have experienced it often. For most reticles the tree is not a case of I would rather have it and not need it but rather a weighing of the benefits of the extended drop range or quick compensation in a pinch vs better ability to see splash. The MPCT2 does remove some of the upsides of a tree, but it also eliminates virtually all the downside.

I'm glad to see I wasn't totally off my rocker in my thinking when I looked over their diagram.

Now, if I could just figure out why they used like 4 different division and marking schemes for the hashes.

 

[Dthomas3523]

It is interesting that you mention this. When I was analyzing their designs I also noticed that lack of tree in the first 2 mils.

Similarly to you, I have been split on Christmas tree designs for exactly the same splash reason. Where I live in Ohio, splashes are not huge dust plumes, they are little mud chunks. You can easily miss them or imprecisely identify just exactly where they were. A tree reticle can cause this, I have experienced it often. For most reticles the tree is not a case of I would rather have it and not need it but rather a weighing of the benefits of the extended drop range or quick compensation in a pinch vs better ability to see splash. The MPCT2 does remove some of the upsides of a tree, but it also eliminates virtually all the downside.

I'm glad to see I wasn't totally off my rocker in my thinking when I looked over their diagram.

Now, if I could just figure out why they used like 4 different division and marking schemes for the hashes.

I was also wondering this.

After basically designing the perfect reticle for me (basically a skmr3 with .2 throughout), I noticed the perceived FOV with the mpct2 tree is larger.

I have no math to back it up, but the way they designed the tree seems less cluttered to my eye.

Here is a pic of a reticle I designed. My idea was to keep all the hashes consistent throughout the reticle.

After having the mpct2, I can see how for whatever reason, it seems like I can see much more with the mpct2 design than my own.

 

[Dthomas3523]

The only thing I would have personally like to have seen with the mpct2 is the first mil on main windage to be the same as the rest of the windage. I don’t need the .5 and like the way the rest is set up past 1 mil.

I’m sure customer feedback (and I’m betting some issue with it being too close to skmr design) had something to do with that.

 

[TB47]

Good info. I was planning on the MMCT1, but now rethinking that choice. Seems like you can't go wrong with either choice.

 

[Glassaholic]

I did not catch that before when looking at the MPCT2 - that it starts at 2 mil instead of 1 mil like most every other tree out there, I can see how that would be a benefit for sure. I still like the dots of the MR4 better for the tree area instead of the solid lines the MPCT2 has, but experience trumps theory in how a reticle will actually look/work in real world situations. Thank you for sharing.

 

[Glassaholic]

DT, that is cool that you designed your own reticle that ended up being very similar to the MPCT2, as Bjay mentions so many center dots can get lost, would love to see another small circle around the center dot especially for quick shot situations, our eyes natural zoom in on concentric circles and this reticle I put together a few years ago - would love to see the small circle to help identify center when that dot gets lost. Based on your thoughts on the MPCT2 I think I would eliminate the 1 mil tree horizontal similarly.

 

[Dthomas3523]

DT, that is cool that you designed your own reticle that ended up being very similar to the MPCT2, as Bjay mentions so many center dots can get lost, would love to see another small circle around the center dot especially for quick shot situations, our eyes natural zoom in on concentric circles and this reticle I put together a few years ago - would love to see the small circle to help identify center when that dot gets lost. Based on your thoughts on the MPCT2 I think I would eliminate the 1 mil tree horizontal similarly.
View attachment 7057449

View attachment 7057450

I like this a lot. Have you sent this out or shopped it around to manufactures?

 

[Steel head]

I really like the clean 1st mill concept.

 

[Glassaholic]

I like this a lot. Have you sent this out or shopped it around to manufactures?

Thanks. I've tried a few, even spoke with ZCO early on, but most have their own ideas and competent reticle designers. I don't have the weight within the industry as someone like @koshkin does, I think ILya did get someone to use a reticle he designed and right now I can't remember who. I've spoken with Athlon and Tract and both showed initial interest but faded away, maybe I should talk with Horus, I know they tend to lean toward the "busier is better" approach, but with their connections to the military something more simplified might be nice, not sure if Finn Accuracy would have any interest either. I'm making a few more mods based on your comments and Bjay's and will post in a short while.

 

[BigJimFish]

Thanks. I've tried a few, even spoke with ZCO early on, but most have their own ideas and competent reticle designers. I don't have the weight within the industry as someone like @koshkin does, I think ILya did get someone to use a reticle he designed and right now I can't remember who. I've spoken with Athlon and Tract and both showed initial interest but faded away, maybe I should talk with Horus, I know they tend to lean toward the "busier is better" approach, but with their connections to the military something more simplified might be nice, not sure if Finn Accuracy would have any interest either. I'm making a few more mods based on your comments and Bjay's and will post in a short while.

If memory serves, ILya did the reticle in the HiLux CMR8F. He is doing a bunch now for Meopta's Optika 6 line. I'm pretty interested to see those designs when they come out.

 

[SAMR]

Thanks for the feedback, I think it only confirms that mpct2 is the reticle that I would go with on a ZCO.

 

[koshkin]

If memory serves, ILya did the reticle in the HiLux CMR8F. He is doing a bunch now for Meopta's Optika 6 line. I'm pretty interested to see those designs when they come out.

CMR8 reticle turned out a little busier than I wanted, but weirdly it works OK. There were some limitations there that I do not have with some more current scope designs.

I have designed a few more out there including some for the upcoming Meopta scopes.

ILya