Suppressors Form 1 Complete - Check out my Project

V

vvillium3

Sergeant
Full Member
Minuteman
Apr 19, 2010
225
1
43
Stevensville, MI
#1
Hello All,

About a year and a half ago, I set out to make a supressor for my 18" AR. After joining over at silencer talk and gathering info, I started designing. I figured it was best to follow an existing well made design. Found a perfect cross section cut of an actual AAC M4-2000. Vectorized the .jpeg and came up with a solid design from there. Here are a couple of details of the project.

The legal side:

I did the simple Nolo Trust way. Wasn't too happy with this direction, but sometimes my projects don't turn out as well as I plan. So I figured I'd get in cheap just in case anything went sideways. I filed last July, and received my stamp with only one hick-up along the way (stupid ATF) in January. Super simple and glad I went this way for now.

CAD:

I will post my 3d cad data of the entire assembly on my Grabcad.com page. For now, since I have only shot 50 rounds through the supressor. I want to get a good couple uses out of it before I put this up. Just to make sure everything I planned on works okay. Don't want to put anything out there that doesn't work for you all.

Baffles:

Material - 17-4PH 0.06" sheet metal ordered from mcmaster.com

I figured if the first suppressor works out, I am going to make a couple more Form 1's for my other guns. With this in mind, I wanted to make a stamp press to make as many as I wanted with little effort. I ended up making two sets of dies. One was a fluted cone design just like the AAC and the other a half sphere design. While the fluted cone turned out well, it thinned out a little to much for me at the tip. So I stuck with the half sphere. Apparently this worked great, because I am satisfied with the cans performance.

I have placed the stamp press design on my Grabcad page. Feel free to download and distibute. It works great, and is a great way to make a ton of baffles quickly

vvillium3, United States - GrabCAD







more to come in next post......
 
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#2
Tube:

Material - 17-4PH (2" dia) machined to 1.625" OD ordered through Alro steel

Initially I was going to use an outer tube, with inner tube spacers. After initally ordering seamless tubing, I couldn't stand to have this thing blow up on me because of a stupid weldline. So I man'd up and turned the tube out of a solid bar. Basically the tube is one big pocket without the need of an end cap. Also, intead of using spacers, I did a little math and figured multiple steps down the tube to hold the baffles in the forward position.

All of the baffles are welded from the outside through 8 0.06" holes. Unfortunatly I didn't take a piture of this before it was welded. However, once I post the CAD data it will become apparent how this was done. You may be able to see some of the steps in the pictures.





Welding:

My cousin is a laser welder at a nearby shop. He super skilled and has been in the business for long time. He did a great job, and amazed how well the baffles are welded in there. He gave me his sign of approval, and said that these baffles are in there to stay. Famous last words right?

Muzzle Adaptor:

Material - 17-4PH from the 2" bar stock above

As with everything else, I took the designs from AAC (sorry AAC). 0.281" dia through to brake hole. Pretty self expainitory, here are the pics



Fixture:

Material - 4140

Just made a really quick fixture to turn the outside of the baffles



Through Hole:

EDM wired the welded assembly at a straight 0.300" through. Didn't want to push it on the first build.

Conclusion:

Really happy with how this project turned out. All of the machining turned out as I expected and the welding even better. Only wish it was a little lighter, maybe Inconel will be my next project. I'll post some pictures of the final product once I get it engraved and put more rounds downrange. Also promise to put up the 3d models. Let me know what you guys think.

Thanks for looking.
Jason
 
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#3
I designed and prototyped some of the big manufacturers current production models, and I'll say you have a really outstanding piece of equipment there. I just did a form 1 qd can that attaches to an A2 flashider. I guess I better post it now. Seriously, again, that is great. I do my 5.56/223 cans at a 0.272 bore, and it is noticeably quieter, obviously. But you can now shoot 6.5 and 6.8 through yours.
One thing that will make a domed baffle slightly quieter is tiny ridges/grooves on the face of the baffles. Once again, I'm impressed, props brother. If you ever do another one, I have a baffle design that's pretty stellar that I'll send you drawings of.
 
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#4
Delta4-3 said:
I designed and prototyped some of the big manufacturers current production models, and I'll say you have a really outstanding piece of equipment there. I just did a form 1 qd can that attaches to an A2 flashider. I guess I better post it now. Seriously, again, that is great. I do my 5.56/223 cans at a 0.272 bore, and it is noticeably quieter, obviously. But you can now shoot 6.5 and 6.8 through yours.
One thing that will make a domed baffle slightly quieter is tiny ridges/grooves on the face of the baffles. Once again, I'm impressed, props brother. If you ever do another one, I have a baffle design that's pretty stellar that I'll send you drawings of.
Click to expand...

Thanks Delta for the kind words. Will have to hit you up on my next build, appreciate the offer. I was a little afraid to go too tight on the bore for a .223. Now that I have cmm'd the whole welded assebly and see the minimal runout that I have, I will make it tighter next time.

Jason
 
#5
It's built stout enough I wouldn't be scared to throw it on a 22" .243 or .260. I think by having some clearance there you have made yourself a VERY versatile can!
 
#6
Actually, if the baffles are over 0.050" or thereabouts I'd run it on the above mentioned calibers in much shorter barrels and not loose any sleep over it. Killer work, that is, says I.
 
#7
I wish I could be your apprentice... outstanding work. Your QD brake looks like you took AAC's design and used TBAC's 30-BA conical shoulder instead of the cheesy 51 tooth detent design.

Again, outstanding work. Truly a work of art...
 
#9
So did you end up making the fluted cones as the die in the first pic shows or did you use the dones as pictured? I'd like to build two exact cans one with domes and one with comes to see which meters better but as slow as the ATF is now my grand kids would have to test it.
outstanding desgine by the way and fantastic machine work , having built several 223 cans i can say yours is way over built but thats a good thing
 
#10
JJones75 said:
So did you end up making the fluted cones as the die in the first pic shows or did you use the dones as pictured? I'd like to build two exact cans one with domes and one with comes to see which meters better but as slow as the ATF is now my grand kids would have to test it.
outstanding desgine by the way and fantastic machine work , having built several 223 cans i can say yours is way over built but thats a good thing
Click to expand...

I went with the domed baffles because the cone series of stamps stretched out the metal too much. I spoke with a stamping guy and now have a better direction to get the cones stamped out. Haven't sat down and figured & modeled it up yet though. Would be interested in the performance difference.

Thanks,
Jason
 
#11
Nice looking design. Did you consider using a series of spacer sleeves to hold the baffles in place, using a threaded end cap to hold the "stack in place?

In theory, this would allow for dis assembly for cleaning or baffle replacement.
 
#12
Deadshot2 said:
Nice looking design. Did you consider using a series of spacer sleeves to hold the baffles in place, using a threaded end cap to hold the "stack in place?

In theory, this would allow for dis assembly for cleaning or baffle replacement.
Click to expand...

My plan was to use spacers initially. Didn't want to use the out of round, sub par material. So I went with the solid design as shown above. By eliminating the spacers, the can is much lighter and just as strong.

There is no need to dissassemble a centerfire can as it doesn't need constant cleaning like a .22 rimfire. From my reading, there are many ways to get the carbon out via solutions or ultasonic cleaning. Also, you are not allowed to replace baffles per the Form 1 rules. I'm sure it'd be nice to trial different layouts, but It's best to keep things inside the law. Hell, aparently we're lucky to even make these.
 
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#14
Had a chance to clean-up the rest of the welds this morning and hit it with some 220 grit. Also, engraved it with a CNC. It's officially legal and ready for the coating. Took a couple quick pics of the final product, thought I'd share:









Jason
 
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#18
Ranb said:
How much does it weigh?

Ranb
Click to expand...

Ranb,

I weighed it with my trigger scale. Comes in right at 19.5 ounces. It's in line with the estimate unigraphics gives without the muzzle break. Would like to figure out how much inconel would help on the weight.

Thank you all for your kind words. Hope to help others out here looking into building their own.
 
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#19
Okay guys, thanks for the positive feedback. On to the next project......

null_zps1c21b1d4.jpg
 
#22
Delta4-3 said:
I kinda want to follow you around like a little puppy.
Click to expand...

Delta,

Haha, you're more than welcome if you're ever in southwest Michigan! Hopefully this one won't take as long as the supressor did. That six month wait is brutal. You mentioned that you built a form 1, what are the specs on it? Pics?

For everyone else that's never owned a AICS, this is the chassis underneath the skins. Surprisingly really simple once the CAD is done. Lots of milling left to lighten it up and detail though. Didn't go with the square tubing route as the AICS, but that's for a reason. Might have something up my sleeve after this chassis is done.......

Jason
 
#23
Im actually building a chasis system right now too, lol. You want me to start my own thread, or put em here? I don't want to take away from yours if you don't want the extra traffic here.
 
#25
Beautiful work. I have built a Rimfire and a 308 can on Form 1's. They both function well but my work is nowhere near your quality.

I was surprised how much more pleasant it is to shoot my 308 with a can. I was expecting the noise reduction, but cutting out the muzzle blast is what's really nice. My rifle doesn't have much in the way of recoil as it is, but with the can it's a real pussycat.

I wonder how many guys here have built suppressors. Maybe we need a Form 1 picture thread?
 
#26
alemonkey said:
Beautiful work. I have built a Rimfire and a 308 can on Form 1's. They both function well but my work is nowhere near your quality.

I was surprised how much more pleasant it is to shoot my 308 with a can. I was expecting the noise reduction, but cutting out the muzzle blast is what's really nice. My rifle doesn't have much in the way of recoil as it is, but with the can it's a real pussycat.

I wonder how many guys here have built suppressors. Maybe we need a Form 1 picture thread?
Click to expand...

Monkey,

That's a good idea. Start up a thread, and make sure everyone posts only complete builds. I bet there a ton out there like on silencer talk, but hardly anybody posts anything. Be interested to see the response.

Btw, I'm with you on the recoil reduction. My AR is like shooting a .22 now with the can on. The bad thing about is, is that you can see all your form mistakes through the scope now!

Jason
 
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#29
rancilio said:
Brilliant and beautiful. How does it function?
Click to expand...

Thanks rancilio & jonaddis, appreciate the kind words.

It functions really well in my book and the accuracy is the same as before. However, I have only heard a couple cans in my life so I don't have a lot to compare to. It's great shooting without earmuffs! I'd compare it to shooting a .22lr. As delta pointed out, it'd probably be a little quieter if I went with a better baffle design and a tighter through hole

Finally got a switchblock on my AR now, and it's a great set-up. Highly recommend one of these to anyone that has a detachable can. Also, while I'm thinking about it. The fine threads on the break/adaptor works great and don't loosen up if hand tight. Was worried about the can coming loose after a lot of firing. Then again, I'm not dumping a mag through it. More of a SPR set-up.

Another note on the switchblock is that the gun is actually louder with the gas switched off. I guess I expected it to be quiter without the action cycling and all of the gas going out the muzzle.

Now it's time to make a can for my .308 bolt action

Jason
 
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