2025 PRS Rimfire Finale

Birddog6424

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  • Apr 25, 2014
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    Boise, Idaho
    I've been a Match Director in the PRS since 2015. Have had a Pro Series Qualifier for the last five years. And finally managed to land a Finale.

    Myself and my buddy will be hosting the 2025 PRS Rimfire Finale. We're pretty excited about it!

    In 2024 we'll also be hosting one of the 4 Rimfire Qualifiers for the US Team for the world championships.

    Looking forward to having a lot of fun with it.

    Would also love to hear feedback from you guys on the things you love and hate about rimfire PRS or NRL matches.
     
    Parma Rod & Gun Club in Parma Idaho. It's 40 minutes west of Boise. Easy access from the airport. Lots of hotels and amenities within 30 minutes of the range.

    There's an effort to move the rimfire/centerfire Finales to a slightly earlier time frame. The current October and November schedule eliminates a lot of clubs in the northern part of the country due to weather concerns. So hopefully by 2025 we'll be looking at September'ish.

    The centerfire Finale is in South Central Idaho between Boise and Twin Falls for 2024, and rimfire will be in Missouri.
     
    Pros:
    Getting the course of fire in advance
    Some time to zero beforehand
    Movers are fun.
    Different colored targets at different stages so you know you going for the right ones on a crowded field.

    Cons:
    Swinging/hanging ladders are not my friend. Shooting from the bottom inside of a tire is physically awkward.
    No dial stages (but it's realistically a decent challenge)
    Anything where target transitions are say 135 degrees or more is a pain to spot for.
     
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    Pros:
    Getting matchbook NLT check-in
    Zero range @ 50 & 100
    Don't make it too easy. Some misses are good. That way, if you bomb a stage, you aren't out of the running. I dropped three shots in a match once and finished 7th.
    Ensure targets are clearly marked with signs or colored ribbon. Sucks to have side by side stages with the same shapes and similar distances.
    I like movement and creativity. The less prone, the better.
    I like spinners, movers, and stages that make me either haul ass or hold

    Cons:
    Mulligans: Shoot it as is, if you mess up, too bad. Learn from it and move on.
    Games of chance. I don't want a dice roll or playing card forcing me to hit 10 hard shots while my buddy hits 10 pie plates @ 50. This doesn't prove who the best shot is, games of chance only show who is lucky.
     
    I hate the following in a match:
    Overly complicated stage rules
    Stupidly difficult shooting positions the are basically luck based whether you can see the target or not.
    Gimicky stages that end up having some degree of luck rather than just skill.
    ELR targets in a match, 200yards is more than enough.

    You can set a difficult match without needing to resort to stupid stage rules and ridiculous props.
    Fast stage times, decision making under time pressure and positional shooting (unsupported prone, sitting kneeling (and a little bit of standing even)) tends to really seperate the good shooters from the rest.
     
    Pros:
    Getting the course of fire in advance
    Some time to zero beforehand
    Movers are fun.
    Different colored targets at different stages so you know you going for the right ones on a crowded field.

    Cons:
    Swinging/hanging ladders are not my friend. Shooting from the bottom inside of a tire is physically awkward.
    No dial stages (but it's realistically a decent challenge)
    Anything where target transitions are say 135 degrees or more is a pain to spot for.

    Definitely agree with this.

    Swinging, swaying carnival ride stages have no place in a Precision rifle match.

    We are very much about traditional PRS. Nothing tricky or fancy, just give the shooter a fair opportunity to hit their targets.

    It definitely will NOT be a meatball match. I can't stand that. Our Pro Series Qualifier usually has the top 5 shooters between 80 to 85% hit ratio. Thats my goal every year. We are traditionally one of the most difficult matches in the country. Last year was the first time a winner broke 90%. We had no wind all weekend. Dead frickin calm 🥲

    I break down and analyze my COF after every match. I've done that for 7 years. I want to know what works, what doesn't, and what the average impact ratio is going to be for every stage. I don't intentionally mix hard and easy stages together. Every stage is a challenge.

    Based on a few of these feedback posts, I think you guys are going to like our match. We are pretty lockstep with what you're saying.

    Thanks for the feedback!!
     
    I don't generally feel strongly about most match setup/logistics options, but I do have a few preferences, some of which have already been shared.

    Things I appreciate:
    1) Ample time to zero (with "line is hot" and "line is cold for safety brief" times advertised in advance), and access to zero board(s) throughout the match. Ideally these are spaced every 4-5 stages so you don't have to take the Oregon Trail to get to/from the board to fix a problem; I do understand if this isn't feasible.
    2) Dope confirmation targets at or beyond the farthest target distance. Not everyone has an opportunity to validate trajectory at 300+ in advance.
    3) No paint on targets. Everyone gets a more consistent experience, versus the first shooter on a KYL getting a perfect wind call from the first impact on white paint.
    4) Not hugely important to me, but I do appreciate when the props and positions dictate gear, rather than the CoF having explicit restrictions. Not terribly hard to make a stage where tripod rear is a guaranteed disaster, for instance.
    5) It seems silly, but I'd rather pay an extra $15-30 in my match fee for a solid lunch, rather than a 6" Jimmy John's sandwich with chips and a pickle.
    6) Solid props with small targets.

    Things I'd rather not see:
    1) "Luck" stages, as described above.
    2) "Meatball" matches, as described above.
    3) Really unstable props. These are something I'm personally working on though.
    4) Props that don't work for certain common setups; the one that comes to mind is shooting off the seat of a folding chair through the gap in the back. Many chassis and scope height combos mean you can't run a bag and see your target.
    5) This one's pretty minor, but shooting positions that degrade over the course of the day. It's not too uncommon to see a prone stage in the dirt that creates a basin where shooter after shooter places their bipods, so later shooters need more bipod.

    Appreciate you asking for feedback and ideas, and I look forward to reading more input from the community!
     
    I don't generally feel strongly about most match setup/logistics options, but I do have a few preferences, some of which have already been shared.

    Things I appreciate:
    1) Ample time to zero (with "line is hot" and "line is cold for safety brief" times advertised in advance), and access to zero board(s) throughout the match. Ideally these are spaced every 4-5 stages so you don't have to take the Oregon Trail to get to/from the board to fix a problem; I do understand if this isn't feasible.
    2) Dope confirmation targets at or beyond the farthest target distance. Not everyone has an opportunity to validate trajectory at 300+ in advance.
    3) No paint on targets. Everyone gets a more consistent experience, versus the first shooter on a KYL getting a perfect wind call from the first impact on white paint.
    4) Not hugely important to me, but I do appreciate when the props and positions dictate gear, rather than the CoF having explicit restrictions. Not terribly hard to make a stage where tripod rear is a guaranteed disaster, for instance.
    5) It seems silly, but I'd rather pay an extra $15-30 in my match fee for a solid lunch, rather than a 6" Jimmy John's sandwich with chips and a pickle.
    6) Solid props with small targets.

    Things I'd rather not see:
    1) "Luck" stages, as described above.
    2) "Meatball" matches, as described above.
    3) Really unstable props. These are something I'm personally working on though.
    4) Props that don't work for certain common setups; the one that comes to mind is shooting off the seat of a folding chair through the gap in the back. Many chassis and scope height combos mean you can't run a bag and see your target.
    5) This one's pretty minor, but shooting positions that degrade over the course of the day. It's not too uncommon to see a prone stage in the dirt that creates a basin where shooter after shooter places their bipods, so later shooters need more bipod.

    Appreciate you asking for feedback and ideas, and I look forward to reading more input from the community!

    Great points. I'll address a few of them.

    We have a bunch of paper at 50 and 100 yards for zero'ing on Friday, and the zero line will be open Saturday morning for late arrivals. We also have steel in increments out to 300 yards for dope confirmation. That stays out throughout the match. Matt and Greg have asked that we have no match target greater than 250 yards. We've had a lot of long targets in club matches, and they're fun, but I agree that 250 is a fair distance for the Finale.

    Our props are solid. Not absolutely motionless, but we never use stuff designed to move. It's gimmicky. And dice roll/luck stages don't promote fair play. We don't believe in equipment restrictions. We'll lay out a stage description and shooters can interpret how they want to shoot it on their own. I'm not a fan of saying what you can or can't use.

    We have a great kitchen on site, we traditionally shut down the match and bring everyone in for a hot meal on Saturday. Usually cheeseburger, fries, chips, cookies or snacks, and water or sodas. We have club members who run our kitchen and cook everything up fresh. We do this every year in our Pro Series match and it's quite popular. Shooters enjoy the break and talking about the match while leaning back and enjoying a meal. I've never been a fan of trying to eat a sandwich on my lap while still being involved in the match.

    Paint on targets is always something we waffle back and forth on. We paint most targets, and everyone starts with fresh painted targets, unless we identify a target that clearly offers an advantage, painted versus unpainted.

    Great feedback, thank you.
     
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    I like stages that are set up like scenarios. Like you start shooting from a vehicle at a target(s)....say a rabbit. That rabbit should be to scale with a real one. Then you move to a position like the pickup bed and shoot from the roof at p-dog targets out in the field. It's like your telling a story in a way.

    Hate it if the stage simulates shooting a scenario I would never do in real life. Like shoot from a loose wobbly barb wire fence for support when the fence post is right there for example. Or some asinine object that had to be created just so you could say you shot from an asinine object.... that is lame. I'm never going to encounter a swing set in the real world and then choose to shoot off it.

    Speaking of props....

    Why are we so keen to shoot from simulated rooftops? And why is it so fucking easy to assend one? Every rooftop I ever wanted to shoot from needed a ladder, or a staircase, or fuck.....an elevator to get to. You wanna be Lee Harvey Oswald? It should kinda suck to pull off right? Why is it nobody simulates a window frame...or shooting from back in a room? Or getting the fuck away after shooting 10rnds with your rig/gear when it's super easy to move and also be safe/empty....earning your tie breaker points based on how much time was left when you made your escape at the finish line.

    Obviously not every stage has to be a visual and logistical feast to the senses or a death march to complete. But many events are located in remote places with unique terrain or structures. Use them to your advantage. Your location got a junkyard of old cars/scrap or a pile of boulders....great. Use it. Fuck shooting from basic car tires, buckets, or whatever 2 cent barricade you got there. Put just a smidge more effort in it.

    Make stages fun and interesting. Often some stages aren't fun or challenging. They just are there. Like the stage was clearly designed to be a place holder between stage 5 and stage 7 because they just had to use up that space. Instead of a lame stage 6....maybe make stages 5 and 7 into a 20rnd stage each instead of a 10 and absorb some of that dead space in between with some movement for a pleasant change. Movement doesn't have to be a marathon....just a means to burn up time to add stress. And guess what...you get a little more shooting there too.

    If I wanted to lay all day in a flat open field and poke at plates....I'd just go to the range and set up my own steel. I come to matches to test skills, run plausible shooting scenarios, and socialize with fellow competitors.

    NRL22 is boring because it's more or less a entry level bland cookie cutter format devoid of much creativity. Its become a victim of its own success....formating to simple area ranges, simple obstacles, and simple targets of a fixed count. The stages are rarely anything that resembles a scenario per se'. The X matches are much better using creativity in that regard.

    I think the entire rimfire match community should be banding together and working on targetry. Using their creativity to come up some really interesting/fun targetry. Things like the snake charmer that was invented a few years back for example. Or implementing multiple items like using a spinner in conjunction with a smaller hostage plate placed behind it. Movers are obviously great but expensive. Custom cut plates in various shapes is good. Targets that are reactive is great. We should be working to expand that further. I've thought of using things like railroad tie chunks (because rimfire can't shoot through them) to obscure plates. Imagine a spinner with all of it entirely hidden except the top plate. The hidden bottom plate has angles mounted to it that exposes other targets only once the upper plate has been hit enough. I'm talking really outside the box thinking here. It doesn't have to be expensive or hard for target makers to produce compared to a mover. Or the plates can be basic but how we implement them gets looked at.
     
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    I have just started helping my MD with running our monthly NRL22 matches and have been trying my hand at making bonus stages. Reading through these comments was enlightening on how i want to help our matches be run. This past month I introduced an unstable platform stage based on things i had seen online. I was surprised to see how many people were not a fan, interesting to read more of that here. One question i did have is whats a meatball match?
     
    I have just started helping my MD with running our monthly NRL22 matches and have been trying my hand at making bonus stages. Reading through these comments was enlightening on how i want to help our matches be run. This past month I introduced an unstable platform stage based on things i had seen online. I was surprised to see how many people were not a fan, interesting to read more of that here. One question i did have is whats a meatball match?

    A meatball match is a very easy match.

    When it's easy, everyone scores high and they get a great score for the season long PRS points match. Or in the case of a Finale, there is too little separation between shooters. The top guys only drop single digits in shots, and bunches of folks are piled on top of each other in scoring. Two dropped shots can make you lose five places because everyone is stacked up.

    Difficult matches challenge the field and better seperate the winners.
     
    Finishing the PRS Rimfire finale last weekend, clearly labeled targets are a must. The same size placard should be used throughout the match. And a piece of flagging tape hung from a tree or t post on each stage would be very good.

    And have clearly marked areas for where rifles are to be grounded.
     
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    Great points. I'll address a few of them.


    Paint on targets is always something we waffle back and forth on. We paint most targets, and everyone starts with fresh painted targets, unless we identify a target that clearly offers an advantage, painted versus unpainted.

    Great feedback, thank you.

    We put painted target numbers near the targets. So in the match book or practiscore it will say "engage targets 1,2,3,4,5..."
    Most importantly none of the target numbers repeat. So if we put up 50 targets for 10 stages they will all be individual.

    This eliminates not only a lot of shooter confusion but also spotter confusion.
     
    I haven't been to the Parma Rod and Gun Club in quite some time but they used to host the MGM Iron Man 3-gun competition and MD's have traditionally been very creative out there, Like shooting a handgun while descending a zip line creative. I may have to drive out and check out some of the PRS matches soon.

    Is the tower still up for the zip line?